Wera Hobhouse debates involving the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy during the 2019 Parliament

Workers (Predictable Terms and Conditions) Bill

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Kevin Hollinrake Portrait The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (Kevin Hollinrake)
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I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Blackpool South (Scott Benton) for proposing this important Bill, and I thank all hon. Members who have spoken on this subject. I am pleased to say that the Government support the Bill and are committed to ensuring that the UK is the best place in the world to start and scale a business—a phrase hon. Members will hear a lot more, after the Business Secretary’s recent speech from Davos about scale-up Britain, which is music to my ears. To do that, we need a strong and flexible labour market that supports participation and economic growth.

I would like to take a little time to talk about the Bill before addressing some points raised by hon. Members on both sides of the House. It is good to see cross-party support, for the third time today. Unlike the shadow Minister, we believe that zero-hours contracts are an important part of the UK’s flexible labour market, both for employers that do not have a constant demand for staff and for individuals who need to balance work around other commitments such as childcare and study. Around 1 million individuals are on zero-hours contracts—around 3% of the UK workforce.

The Government are keen to ensure that everybody can enjoy the benefits of flexible working. We are determined to tackle unfair working practices, such as the issue of one-sided flexibility where workers have to be available to their employer, with no guarantee of work. Employers may schedule or cancel shifts with little notice, leading to insecurity of work and income. I declare my interest, because my daughters are in a similar situation—one is of school age and works at the local pub, and that has happened to her. To be fair, a zero-hours contract works for her to provide flexibility from her side, too.

We recognise that receiving unpredictable and varying levels of income each month can make it difficult for some workers to meet the cost of rent, mortgage and household bills, especially during a cost of living crisis. My hon. Friend’s Bill will allow workers to request more predictable working arrangements, addressing the issue of one-sided flexibility, while ensuring that workers are able to continue working on a zero-hours contract or another form of non-guaranteed hours or temporary contract, if that is the type of arrangement that works best for them.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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Does the Minister agree that it is important that employers feel that there is loyalty to their companies and loyalty to the work that the employee is doing? It should very much be a win-win.

Kevin Hollinrake Portrait Kevin Hollinrake
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I agree entirely. That is what modern employers are looking for. One of the biggest pressures that employers are facing is recruiting and retaining people. This is another measure where people can demonstrate that the workplace is fairer and more flexible, which should attract more people back into it.

The Bill will allow individuals and businesses to strike the right balance between flexibility and job security. Workers will be empowered and encouraged to start conversations with their employers about their work patterns, with the confidence that starting such a conversation will not result in detriment. We expect that employers will benefit from the new right, too—the point that the hon. Member for Bath made—through improved worker satisfaction and productivity. By allowing employers to retain skilled staff as workers, those workers will not have to look for a new role in order to secure a working pattern that meets their needs.

Facilitating higher productivity, both through this measure and the other five private Members’ Bills that we are supporting, will help to drive higher employment, wages and economic growth. As my hon. Friend the Member for Blackpool South has explained, the right will function in a similar way to the existing right to request flexible working. An employer will be able to refuse a request for more predictable working patterns on specific statutory grounds similar to those established for flexible working. We know how important it is to balance new workers’ rights with the impact on businesses, and those grounds will ensure that employers do not experience disproportionate burdens.

The Government consulted in 2018 on the right to request a more predictable contract, and the vast majority of respondents agreed with the creation of a right to request a more predictable working pattern.

British Steel: Negotiations

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Thursday 2nd February 2023

(1 year, 1 month ago)

Commons Chamber
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Urgent Questions are proposed each morning by backbench MPs, and up to two may be selected each day by the Speaker. Chosen Urgent Questions are announced 30 minutes before Parliament sits each day.

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Nusrat Ghani Portrait Ms Ghani
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“Ransom” is not my word, but it is an interesting way to explain what is going on. Of course, my hon. Friend the Member for Scunthorpe is the leading champion of steel across the industry. I was at a Westminster Hall debate last week, and I pointed out that I cannot turn around any corridor without her cornering me on steel. That is why the sector is so well represented in the UK and why we have put together support that has been valued at over £1.5 billion of grants to help it decarbonise, with £800 million to cover energy costs.

Negotiations are ongoing. My officials will be speaking to British Steel and Jingye today. It was interesting to hear what meetings took place yesterday. When we are talking about hundreds of millions of pounds of support for a firm, while it is in negotiations with Government, for it to have this sort of conversation is not the way that we tend to do business in the UK.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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Steel is vital to help us move to net zero by, for example, extending our railways or building net zero homes, but the industry is also a major contributor to carbon emissions, and we know that the industry will only survive long term if it becomes sustainable. The Government recently gave the green light to the Cumbria coalmine, supposedly to support the steel industry. How does that sit with the Government’s claim that they are supporting the steel industry to go green?

Nusrat Ghani Portrait Ms Ghani
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I fear that the hon. Member would rather have coal imported and not worry about the cost or the emissions impact of that. The Secretary of State’s decision on the Cumbrian coalmine was made following a comprehensive planning inquiry that heard from over 40 different witnesses and considered matters such as demand for coking coal, climate change and the impact on the local economy. What is really important is that we have a resilient UK steel sector, and I will never apologise for that.

Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Bill

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. I have been told many times that when we are on Report, we should not make general speeches but refer to amendments. Can you make a judgment on whether what is being said is appropriate?

Roger Gale Portrait Mr Deputy Speaker (Sir Roger Gale)
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I have already exercised that judgment. If I thought that the hon. Gentleman was out of order, I would have ruled him out of order.

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It is shocking that the report by the Regulatory Policy Committee gave the Government’s impact assessment of this Bill an overall red rating, meaning that the impact assessment is not fit for purpose because it has made no attempt to quantify the impacts of the individual pieces of legislation being sunsetted and no commitment has been made to do this later in the process. This Bill is an incredibly damaging piece of legislation that poses an enormous threat to many of the rights on which we rely. I urge Members to support the amendments that would remove the worst aspects of it, but ultimately I call on the Government to withdraw it.
Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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I rise to speak in support of amendments 21 and 36. Losing environmental protections was a major concern for all of us who opposed Brexit. The majority of my Bath constituents and I feared that Brexit would prove a colossal mistake. At the time, our fears were branded as scaremongering, yet this Conservative Government are clearly prepared to let environmental protections fall on the bonfire of regulations. The sheer volume of retained EU law instruments means that there is now a huge danger that many will fall automatically if they are not amended or identified in time.

This is reckless lawmaking, legislating with hammer blows instead of following the evidence. The December deadline is totally unnecessary. It is clearly unrealistic to replace all this legislation by the end of the year. There are currently only three full-time equivalent staff working on retained EU law in DEFRA. How can the Government expect them to cope with this enormous workload, and what is the rush? I have heard many Conservative Members today saying, “We don’t want to be subjected to laws made in the EU.” May I gently remind them that these laws were our laws? They became our laws by which we lived our lives for decades. Pulling them from under our feet without a transparent process to replace them is the most undemocratic proposal I can think of.

Amendment 21 would exempt certain environmental protections from the sunset clause. Nature provides a better chance of mitigating the worst impacts of climate change. Protecting ecosystems that regulate the climate or contain critical carbon stores must be prioritised alongside cutting emissions. This is not just about the EU; it is about a Government not caring about net zero. It is crucial that these protections are not allowed to fall needlessly to prove an ideological point. Amendment 21 would at least protect legislation such as the National Emission Ceilings Regulations 2018. These regulations require the Secretary of State to prepare an annual inventory of emissions and air pollutants, which are killers. It is about our health. The Government are frustrating every step towards a healthier planet and healthier people.

Amendment 36 would require the Government to publish a list of every piece of legislation that is being revoked under the sunset clause and to allow parliamentary oversight of that process. If the Conservatives believe in parliamentary democracy, what could possibly be preventing them from supporting this amendment?

There is huge public interest in our environmental laws. I have received hundreds of emails about this Bill from my Bath constituents, but I feel my constituents are being ignored. Amendment 36 would also provide much-needed clarity on the legislation that will be affected. Many clauses in this Bill will make settled areas of law uncertain and contested. How can we meet our net zero targets if we do not even know what environmental legislation will be standing this time next year?

There will be no coming back and no next time if we miss our net zero targets. For that reason alone, it is important to support amendment 36. Shamefully, our Government are satisfied to leave environmental protections to chance. They are intent on getting Brexit done without any idea of the cost to current and future generations.

Nigel Evans Portrait Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)
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We have two more Back-Bench contributions, and then we will move on to the wind-ups. I advise Members who have taken part in the debate to make their way to the Chamber.

Energy Security

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Tuesday 29th November 2022

(1 year, 4 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Grant Shapps Portrait Grant Shapps
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My hon. Friend and neighbour is absolutely right. Critical minerals are so important in securing the entire supply chain. Earlier I mentioned green lithium up in Teesside, which is part of that supply chain. The UK can have the first green lithium production in Europe because of Brexit and our ability, for example, to use more flexible rules that the Europeans cannot access at the moment to produce it, so that is a very good win. He is right about the strategy, and we have a strategy for the most important critical minerals.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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On energy efficiency, will the Government introduce an inspection scheme for all rented accommodation to stop landlords from letting out properties that do not meet energy efficiency minimums?

Grant Shapps Portrait Grant Shapps
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Private landlords are already under an obligation to ensure that their properties reach certain standards. However, as the hon. Member may well know, the Government are consulting on raising that standard in line with the improvements that we would expect over a period of time, and we have already signalled that that would be likely to be to an EPC rating of C.

COP27

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Monday 21st November 2022

(1 year, 4 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Nusrat Ghani Portrait Ms Ghani
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My hon. Friend makes a valid point. We often focus on what we are delivering in the UK, and that is important, but we make an argument that other European countries are somehow constantly cleaner and greener. His point is a valid one. That is why global negotiations and global collaborations matter. We must shine a light not only on countries far from home, but on countries closer to home, such as those in Europe, which unfortunately are not leading the way as much as we are.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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I add my thanks to the previous COP President and his team. I must also say that other countries being bad is no excuse for being complacent in this country. It is estimated that in eight years’ time the costs associated with loss and damage will range from £290 billion to £580 billion. Those are huge sums, but they are dwarfed by the billions in subsidies that the fuel industry receives on top of its vast profits. When will the Government stop their subsidies to the fuel industry and set out their plan to phase out fossil fuels in this country? The Minister has not answered that question yet.

Nusrat Ghani Portrait Ms Ghani
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I have indeed answered that question and focused on the fact that we are aiming to reach net zero. We have to ensure that we have a mix of energy, and we have to phase out at a pace that means that we have a certain level of resilience and access to fuel and energy. We cannot just switch off the tap today and assume someone is going to step in tomorrow.

Fracking: Local Consent

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Tuesday 15th November 2022

(1 year, 4 months ago)

Westminster Hall
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Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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It is a pleasure to serve with you in the Chair, Mr Paisley. I echo the words of the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) about my hon. Friend the Member for North Shropshire (Helen Morgan) being such a powerful advocate for her local communities in North Shropshire. I thank her for bringing this crucial and serious debate to the Chamber today.

When the disastrous and short-lived previous Government announced that they would lift the moratorium on fracking, they never gave a single thought to our local communities. They provided no answer to how they would get local consent. Many people, including many MPs, were outraged that fracking would be forced upon them once again. I echo my hon. Friend’s observation that it is disappointing that there are not more Conservative Back Benchers here to voice their discontent about the U-turn that the Government made only a month ago, and to make their disappointment and outrage known to the Government so that they will never dare to bring back any such proposals. We can never rest until fracking is banned.

Fracked fuel is a fossil fuel. Fracking flies in the face of our net zero commitment. The Government’s own experts said that seismic activity caused by hydraulic fracking was not safe. Fracking has been linked to multiple health defects. It is disgraceful that the Government even considered lifting the ban and putting the population at risk.

I would like to set the record straight. When the former Business Secretary, the right hon. Member for North East Somerset (Mr Rees-Mogg), so grandly declared that his local community would welcome fracking, that was not so. There was a petition going round Bath and North East Somerset asking for a ban on fracking. Let us put the record straight: local communities in Bath and North East Somerset did not welcome fracking.

The Government’s flirtation with fracking proves their unserious approach to climate change and the environment. I am afraid that will not change under the new Prime Minister. When he was Chancellor, the Prime Minister introduced a windfall tax incentivising firms to invest in fossil fuel extraction. As Prime Minister, he had to be dragged to COP27. Those are not the actions of someone who will treat the climate emergency with the urgency it demands.

Investing heavily in renewables is clearly the answer to the UK’s energy crisis. However, securing local consent is vital, even for popular solutions such as renewables. Local communities must be brought on board for the net zero transition; after all, they are the ones who will have to bear a lot of the costs, host new infrastructure in their neighbourhoods, and alter their routines and behaviours. Without that, there is a risk that people will not welcome or accept the necessary changes. The consequences of that would make our progress to net zero much lengthier, more costly and more contested. It would be less inclusive, equitable and environmentally sustainable.

Local consent is what we Liberal Democrats always ask for. The most successful net zero projects have local consent. Where possible, should projects not be undertaken by local people with a stake in them? Local communities are best placed to provide detailed knowledge of their local area. They have expert understanding of how their area functions and what their communities value.

The Government must remove the shackles from local authorities and give them the powers and funding they need as partners in reaching net zero. In Bath and North East Somerset, domestic and business solar capacity has doubled since our council declared a climate emergency in 2019. These local initiatives should be encouraged by the Government but, instead, they are being restricted by hollowed-out local authority budgets and our planning laws.

Community energy projects must also be encouraged. They allow people to purchase clean electricity directly from a local supply company or co-operative. That ensures that every pound spent on powering our homes or cars is recycled back into the local community. Energy projects should be carried by our local communities, and they are the ones who need to provide consent, whatever the solutions. Community energy is one of the few tried and tested means of engaging people in energy systems. In my constituency, Bath and West Community Energy has installed enough renewable energy to power nearly 4,500 homes. I take this opportunity—it is a good opportunity, because we are talking about local consent and local energy provision—to ask the Minister again whether he will back the Local Electricity Bill, which is supported by more than half of MPs across the House.

Achieving local consent is crucial if we are serious about meeting our net zero targets. Gaining local consent for fracking was never going to happen. However, local communities passionately support renewable projects. They just need the Government to empower them to deliver those projects—and we need a Government that finally bans fracked fuel, which flies in the face of our net zero commitments.

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Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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Does the hon. Lady agree that we must continue to put pressure on the Government to end fracking once and for all or it might come back under the next Government—and who knows when that will come along?

Kerry McCarthy Portrait Kerry McCarthy
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Exactly. Because it is not clear why the last Prime Minister felt obliged to lift the ban on fracking, despite all the arguments against it, we will always have that scintilla of doubt that it has not completely gone away. There was no logic to her decision, so—who knows?—perhaps equally illogical decisions will be made in the future. The current Prime Minister has not embraced the moratorium on fracking out of any green credentials of his own. It is clearly an issue of party management. It is very sensible to reverse the U-turn and go back to the 2019 manifesto, but during the summer leadership election, he actively supported the return of fracking in areas where there was local support.

The Prime Minister also came out against solar power. I do not suppose the Minister is in a position to reply, but I am trying to find out through parliamentary questions whether there has been a change to the mooted policy of the previous Administration—we almost need names for each of the Administrations, because it gets confusing talking about the former this and former that—to bring other, less fertile agricultural land into the “best and most versatile land” category, meaning a ban on solar on that reclassified land. Having talked to the National Farmers Union and other farmers, I hope that that policy has now been reversed. Obviously, we do not want the entire countryside to be covered with solar panels, but we do want to see them in the right places. Solar can also be mixed with farming, as farmers can grow things under solar panels in some cases. I would like to think that there is now, under this Administration, more support for solar on our farmland.

I would say that the policy on onshore wind is still unclear, but actually, when the Prime Minister was pressed on it at Prime Minister’s questions, it seemed clear that the ban remains. Considering that there were plans to allow fracking, I cannot see why onshore wind would be seen as less attractive than that. As I said, the moratorium on fracking was a 2019 manifesto commitment. The problem is that there is nothing to stop the Secretary of State taking unilateral action to lift the moratorium without any oversight or scrutiny from the House or input from local communities.

Our energy policy should be decided by what is best to bring down energy bills, what is best for our energy security and environment and, of course, whether there is public consent. In all those cases, it is clear that fracking should not be on the table. Labour has been clear that we want a full, permanent ban on fracking, and we want it now. It is unlikely, but, if the Minister was able to commit to a ban, I am sure that he would make not just those present but a lot of his Back Benchers happy.

In the debate on bringing back fracking, it was difficult to work out what the then Business Secretary, the right hon. Member for North East Somerset—or, indeed, a number of other Ministers—meant when he said that the Government would allow fracking only if there was “local consent”. Lots of Government Back Benchers pressed him during that debate on what exactly that meant and it has come up on other occasions in the Chamber. Particularly worryingly, it almost seemed as though it was not really about asking people whether they consented; it was not a local referendum or actually going into a community and asking people if they support fracking. There was quite a lot of talk about compensation being offered, and it almost sounded as though the plan was to buy off local people, and perhaps the council that would issue planning permission, rather than speaking to individuals who would be affected. That would clearly be unacceptable. If we were going back to lifting the ban and allowing fracking—there are so many double negatives in this debate; we are going round in circles with all the U-turns—what does the Minister envisage asking for local consent to look like?

Kerry McCarthy Portrait Kerry McCarthy
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That is the case, is it not? It seems like a futile exercise—I do not think there is any community in the country that actually wants fracking to happen—but the hon. Gentleman is quite right that the energy companies, which have a vested interest in fracking, cannot be in charge of such an exercise, because it would be skewed.

If fracking was treated in the same way as this Government have treated onshore wind, which is a genuinely popular and clean source of energy, a single local objection could be enough to sink proposals. It is very easy to stop onshore wind, although, as we know, the Government currently have a policy not to proceed with it anyway.

No matter how the Government try to bend the definition of local consent, the reality is that fracking is deeply unpopular. The Government’s own polling showed that only 17% of people support fracking, and I suspect that most of them do not want it in their backyard. I think there was a Conservative Minister in the Lords who talked about how fracking was not suitable for the south but suggested that it would be welcomed up in the “desolate” north. I suspect some of those 17% want fracking somewhere, but not where they live.

From the polling on other energy sources, 74% support new onshore wind, yet the Government are sticking with the ban on it. Some 75% oppose the Government’s banning solar panels on farmland, but, as I have said, the current Prime Minister still seems very negative on both of those proposals. My point is that this Government’s energy policy appears to be inherently biased towards fossil fuels. The Minister looked slightly shocked at that, but the Government have just issued 100 new oil and gas licences: if that is not bias towards fossil fuels, I do not know what is. Between a ban on onshore wind, lots of scepticism about solar, issuing licences for oil and gas exploration, and at one point trying to bring back fracking, I think it is very clear where the bias lies.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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Is this not also a sign that the Government are entirely behind the curve? When fracking was mooted a decade ago as a transition fuel, it might have been something that could be considered, because the legislation at the time was aiming only for 80% renewable energy by 2050. Since 2018, we have known that we need to get to 100%, so transition fuels are a complete nonsense. Does the hon. Lady agree?

Kerry McCarthy Portrait Kerry McCarthy
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I absolutely do agree. Fracking is certainly not greener and, as well as all the other reasons why we oppose it, it is not a cheaper source of energy, either.

The Minister for Climate, the right hon. Member for Beverley and Holderness, tried to gaslight the British public with his recent claim that fracking is green. He has also tried to say that oil and gas exploration in the North sea is green because the alternative is importing it, so we would have the extra costs of importing from elsewhere. Clearly, the green alternative is renewables. I would ask the Minister for Climate why, if he was right to say that fracking is a green option, it is opposed by so many of his colleagues, including the right hon. Member for Reading West (Alok Sharma), who was the President of COP26, and the right hon. Member for Kingswood (Chris Skidmore), who is conducting the net zero review. Extracting fossil fuels will never be green, and I hope that the Minister who is here today will make that clear when he replies to the debate.

Right now, there is immense pressure at COP27 to secure genuinely ambitious agreements to leave fossil fuels in the ground for good. Sending a clear message about our commitment to net zero and the move away from fossil fuels is vital, but the Government have been sending out such mixed signals—as has been said, the Prime Minister was not even going to go to COP, and had to be dragged there. That sends a terrible message about our global leadership. If our climate commitments are called into question, how can we expect other people to step up to the plate? It is time to end any doubts about the UK’s commitment to climate action. Listening to communities and implementing a permanent ban on fracking, and bringing back onshore wind and solar, would be a good start.

George Freeman Portrait The Minister of State, Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy (George Freeman)
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It is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Paisley, in the absence of the Minister for Climate, my right hon. Friend the Member for Beverley and Holderness (Graham Stuart), who is dealing with these very issues at COP27 today. I congratulate the hon. Member for North Shropshire (Helen Morgan); she is a very exciting new Member of Parliament, and she has done well today in bringing this issue to the attention of the House.

As somebody who was as concerned as everyone else here that the very short-lived Administration that took office in September flirted with the idea of lifting the 2019 Conservative moratorium on fracking, I am delighted to say that that policy has very clearly been reversed by the Prime Minister. To say that this horse has bolted is to liken Shergar to a beach pony; the issue is well and truly put to bed. I will deal with the points that hon. Members have made, but it gives me great pleasure to make it very clear that this Prime Minister, the Cabinet, the Secretary of State, and the Minister for Climate—in fact, this whole Government—have returned to our position in the 2019 manifesto, which was an effective moratorium on fracking.

Furthermore—this may go some way towards answering the point made by the hon. Member for Bristol East (Kerry McCarthy)—Ministers are taking a presumption against issuing any further hydraulic fracking consents. I accept that for a month or two, all sorts of horses were running wild around the beach, but the position is absolutely clear. For those listening, and for the 18,000 people who signed the petition, let me be very clear: the Government are not about to open up the UK fracking market. We are back to the position that we set out in 2019.

I thank those who have spoken today. It is a great pleasure to see the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon); I know I am in the right room when I see him here, assiduous as ever. I also thank the hon. Members for East Londonderry (Mr Campbell), for Bath (Wera Hobhouse) and for Bristol East. I will deal with the points that have been made and with the broader context in which we need to view this issue. I will say something about the energy supply market, something about gas and something about local consent. Members have raised some important points about the role and the mechanisms of local consent in these sectors, in relation not only to gas but to all critical national infrastructure and other renewables.

Let me start by setting the scene. As someone who has been in this House for 12 years and has been watching it for about 30, I think it is fair to say—I can see that colleagues around the House feel the same way—that, as a country, for decades we have rather taken energy for granted. Until about 15 years ago we presumed it was something that would always be there, very cheaply, at the flick of a switch, and we did not have to worry too much about it. That position has changed, rather belatedly but dramatically, in the last 15 years. I pay tribute to the last climate change Minister in the Labour Government before 2010, who started a profound acceleration of our leadership on net zero. I am proud that the Conservative-Liberal Democrat coalition between 2010 and 2015, and then the Conservative Government, have taken that forward. Our leadership on net zero has come on leaps and bounds.

The scale of that success bears repeating. Since 1990, we have managed to grow the economy by about 40% and the net zero sector by around 70%. We have managed to demonstrate that it is possible to have green growth. There has been extraordinary progress. I accept, as I think everyone does, that as a country we were late to this. However, low-carbon electricity now gives us around half of our total generation, we have installed 99% of our solar capacity since 2010, the onshore wind industry is already generating over 14 GW and is happily accepted around the country—onshore wind is cheap—and we have put £30 billion of domestic investment into the green industrial revolution. Those are figures that, even 15 years ago, one might have been surprised to see. This country is genuinely leading in making the big transitional investments to move to net zero.

Of course, in the last 18 months, the pandemic and the appalling situation in Ukraine have triggered a cost of living crisis and, in particular, a cost of energy crisis globally. That has reminded us of the importance of having resilient supply chains and ensuring that we are not vulnerable to hostile actors internationally, or to supply chains in which we can be held to ransom.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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The Minister talks about the UK’s leadership in renewables, which is positive. Should there not be a Government ambition to be an exporter of renewable energy, since we have so many opportunities to share that with Europe? Is that not a brilliant opportunity when we are talking about global Britain and its leadership in renewables?

George Freeman Portrait George Freeman
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The hon. Lady makes an excellent point. Indeed, that is why the former Prime Minister, my right hon. Friend the Member for Uxbridge and South Ruislip (Boris Johnson), used to refer to the southern North sea as the Saudi Arabia of wind energy. That is precisely our ambition. First, we need to ensure that we can meet our own domestic energy market needs.

The hon. Member for Bath makes a crucial point for me very well, which is that we are in a global market and global energy demand over the next 20, 30 and 40 years will rise. It is not just a question of moving our existing energy demands to renewable supplies, vital though that is; it is also about developing the renewables of the future and contributing globally. As Minister for science, research, technology and innovation, I can say that we are investing heavily in small nuclear, in fusion, in marine and in geothermal, because we see a huge opportunity for the UK to be in the vanguard of the renewables and clean energies of tomorrow.

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George Freeman Portrait George Freeman
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The hon. Member makes an important point, which I personally agree with and the Government are sensitive to. Again, our constituents would think it perverse if, at the very time when our exposure to international food supply and agricultural supply chains has been exacerbated by the war in Ukraine and the pandemic, we were then to decide to take out of productive capacity huge areas of agricultural land. Agriculture is a great British industry and the agritech sector is developing net zero technologies that allow us to do clean and green agriculture. We do not want to undermine that industry.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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The Minister is being generous in giving way. Is it not time that we busted some urban myths about solar panels and where they go? Most of the time they go on land that is not suitable for agricultural use other than, for example, sheep grazing. Is there not a myth about where we are putting these solar farms?

George Freeman Portrait George Freeman
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I am not sure it is a myth; it is a mixed bag. There are areas where solar has been deployed very effectively, with happy sheep grazing around it and very little reduction in the productive capacity of land. I do not want to stray beyond my brief—I am not the Minister with responsibility for energy—but equally there are in my part of the world, in the east of England, proposals for huge, industrial-scale solar on good productive farmland. In the spirit of the question from the hon. Member for Strangford, I think a lot of people are worried about those proposals.

Carer’s Leave Bill

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Friday 21st October 2022

(1 year, 5 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Wendy Chamberlain Portrait Wendy Chamberlain
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I thank the hon. Member for his contribution. Yes, we need to be flexible—that is important —because there is such a range of caring. It is also important, however, that we align that with other existing legislation, as that will make this easier and less burdensome for employers and employees to understand. I do not want the Bill to become law but then people do not utilise it, because they are not aware of it.

I met the Minister and officials to discuss the Bill and to ensure that it is the best we can get it before becoming law. That means that, in some areas, it does not potentially do everything that I would want it to do, if it were down to just me. For a start, my instincts would be to want the rights to be implemented immediately through primary legislation. That is not possible, which means I am trusting the Government to act in good faith in supporting the Bill, and I expect them to bring in the proposed regulations at the earliest possible opportunity. I will be here to make sure that they do.

The Bill does not go as far as Liberal Democrat policy would go. We would like there to be more time and for that to be paid, but I accept that this is a journey and that this is a vital first step in getting these rights on to the statute book now. There is nothing on the statute book that recognises leave for caring.

It is estimated that 2.3 million carers—that is a conservative estimate—cannot wait for the perfect policy to be put in place. They need these rights as soon as possible. According to the 2011 census, there are at least 3,000 carers in my North East Fife constituency. I spent summer recess meeting many of them. I have been told time and again that, although the Bill will not make their lives easy, because caring is challenging, it will help just a little bit to keep some of the plates spinning.

I learned a lot this summer about the vast variety of caring experiences that people have. Karen cares for her 91-year-old mother. She drives from Cupar in North East Fife to Annan every weekend to be with her mother—I assure the House that that is a long way; hon. Members should look it up on a map following the debate—to make sure that she is stocked up and to deal with any household tasks that need doing. Her mum is fiercely independent and wants to remain in her own home. She makes and manages her appointments and, despite the 125-mile distance between her and her mother, she is a carer and needs her employer’s support to make things work.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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Is it not true that family members often do what they do out of love and that, in many ways, they find it difficult to come forward and claim the financial support they need for the hours they put in looking after their loved ones?

Wendy Chamberlain Portrait Wendy Chamberlain
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I agree. During my conversations I find that carers are using annual leave and emergency unpaid leave, when they need to, in order to undertake caring responsibilities, and that sadly—as I will mention later—they are forced out of the workplace because they cannot manage to balance their responsibilities.

I also met the Fife carers support group in St Andrews, a group who call themselves, and I hope the House will forgive my language, the CRAP carers—that stands for compassionate, resourceful and patient. One lady was caring for her grown-up son, who is coping with severe mental health challenges, two were caring for terminally ill parents, and parents and partners with dementia were being cared for. All were doing so with huge amounts of grit and compassion, and indeed humour—as the name they have chosen shows.

I came away from meeting that group feeling not only uplifted by their love for their family members, but angry because a number of them expressed guilt—guilt that so much of their time is spent dealing with the administration of caring, rather than feeling that they can give their loved ones the care that they need. That care admin includes negotiating with their employers.

I will bring to the House’s attention the experience of one of my constituents in particular. Amanda works full time as well as providing increasing care to her mum and dad. Her dad has chronic obstructive pulmonary disease and her mum, having been forgetful for a few years, is showing clear signs of dementia. Many of us will recognise that path: forgetfulness followed by confusion; denial followed by anger; and frustration as managing day-to-day life slips away. For Amanda, that means setting up appointments and speaking to carers and medical professionals. It means popping in as often as she can to do the shopping, to keep her dad company, to make sure her mum is okay and to be there after nurses leave to manage her mum’s confusion and sometimes even distress.

That is all relatively new and, so far, Amanda’s employer has been supportive. She has taken some last-minute holidays and she has been able to take the odd day off, but she is worried about what comes next. Her mum is not going to get any better. Will her employer stay supportive? What happens if she gets a new manager? Something that struck me in the earlier debate today is that sometimes it is not just about employers, but about managers and line managers, and ensuring that they have the correct information to take the correct decisions.

Ban on Fracking for Shale Gas Bill

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Wednesday 19th October 2022

(1 year, 5 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Mark Menzies Portrait Mark Menzies
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I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention, and the point she makes is a powerful one that stands on its own.

In his letter, the Secretary of State has confirmed that the Government will launch a consultation next month to assess how local consent is to be gauged and has committed to put this vote to the House—I welcome that. I also welcome the fact that he has agreed today to ensure that there is, in effect, a local veto—or whatever words people wish to use for it—and that the voices of the people in Fylde will be listened to in a fair, transparent and independent way. I thank him for listening to them. It is not up to the fracking companies to determine whether local consent exists; an independent, transparent alternative to that must be found, and I thank those on the Treasury Bench for agreeing to it. May I also make it clear that it is important that the local planning process must remain in place and that we rule out any nationally significant infrastructure projects referral? If we are committed to localism, I can think of no more important issue than the one before the House today.

Ultimately, I am able to vote for the amendment because I believe that the people of Fylde share my conviction that the answer from our communities is no to fracking, and when they say no to fracking, I expect the Government to deliver and to hear that no does mean no.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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Does the hon. Gentleman agree that this is about not only seismic activity and local consent, but climate change, and that the Government should listen to the Climate Change Committee and produce a report about the climate impact of fracking?

Mark Menzies Portrait Mark Menzies
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The hon. Lady makes an important point.

On energy security, let me say that there is nobody more committed to it than myself; we manufacture all the nuclear fuel for the UK in my constituency, at Westinghouse. But in order to make up the shortfall of the amount of gas we import, we will be looking at drilling somewhere in the region of 6,000 to 10,000 wells. The quantities we are talking about are astronomical and the timescales involved mean we are not going to get gas into the network any time in the next two years. There is no infrastructure to get the gas from these wells into the grid. The alternative is building gas-fired power stations to turn this into electricity and feed it in through wires, but again the timescales involved simply do not exist. So the energy security argument, important though it is, does not even stack up in the timescales the Government are talking about.

In conclusion, I welcome the fair, transparent and meaningful consultation that both the Prime Minister and the Secretary of State have committed to today. That gives the people of Fylde the opportunity to reject fracking and, more importantly, to have their voice heard.

--- Later in debate ---
Craig Mackinlay Portrait Craig Mackinlay (South Thanet) (Con)
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We often wonder why we in this House are not taken very seriously. I will tell Members why. We are in the depths of an energy crisis. We have shown ourselves—Europe as a whole—to be too reliant on a dictator who has been conducting an illegal war, and the problems have come home to roost. Here we are speaking about trying to ban a source of domestic energy while we are short of it, and we wonder why people out there think that we are stark staring mad.

Of course, today’s debate is not about fracking—it is not about fracking at all—but about taking control of the Order Paper. We have seen that before during the height of the Brexit wars. My dear friend the right hon. Member for Leeds Central (Hilary Benn) was part of that. I am really sorry that the right hon. Member for Doncaster North (Edward Miliband) is not in his place. I did try to intervene on him, but he did not show me the courtesy of taking my intervention. If he had been in his place, I would have shown him that courtesy now.

There are a couple of things that need to be said. It has been said here that fracking will make no difference to the price of gas. I do not know about anybody else in this House, but when I did O-level economics, the first week—no, probably the first lesson—taught me that if we put more supply of something into a system, the price tends to come down. Further than that, even if Labour’s economics are true and the price will not change, would one rather spend tens of billions of pounds per year on foreign imported liquefied natural gas, even at a high price, or spend that money at home? That is a very clear decision.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Craig Mackinlay Portrait Craig Mackinlay
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No, I will not give way; I do not have time today, and others have not done it for me— [Interruption.] Oh—yes, if the hon. Lady will please intervene, it gives me another minute.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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Has the hon. Gentleman not listened to his own colleague, the hon. Member for Fylde (Mark Menzies), saying that it would take at least two years to get any fracking going, or to his other colleague, the right hon. Member for Spelthorne (Kwasi Kwarteng), who said just a few weeks ago when he was still Business Secretary that no amount of fracked fuel in this country would make a difference to the global gas market, because the quantities are too small?

Craig Mackinlay Portrait Craig Mackinlay
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I thank the hon. Lady from the Liberal Democrats for that point. I remember a former leader of the Liberal Democrats saying, about 12 years ago, “What is the point in nuclear?” because it would take 11 or 12 years to get it on stream. I think that 10, 11 or 12 years on from 2010 would be about now, and that would have been quite useful. Of course, it will take time to get fracked gas out of the ground. The best time to have done it was a few years ago; the second-best time to think about it is now.

I refer hon. Members to a House of Commons Library report dated 14 January this year, called “The energy price crunch”. As ever, House of Commons Library reports are excellent, and this one was very clear. Table 4.2 shows a very easy chart, which I will describe to hon. Members. It shows the output of UK-produced gas from the North sea, which peaked around 2004, when we were net exporters of gas. Since that time, we have been using only about 75% of that peak usage, and that may be for many reasons. We may have better-insulated houses, and that is to the good. I feel pretty sure that one of the main reasons is that any energy-intensive business has simply offshored somewhere else, but let us put that aside.

What has happened, very distinctly, is that we are now only producing one third of what we did at peak. We are using 25% less, but we are producing only one third of what we once did. Where do people think that gap is being filled from? That gap is being filled from international resources. There are three countries alone, forgetting Norway: £64 billion we have spent over the past 10 years on importing LNG from Russia, Qatar and the United States.

Surely it must be better to have those tens of thousands of jobs at home, as well as the many billions in investment and the profits and tax revenues—remember those? They are pretty helpful; they pay for things such as the NHS, or perhaps the insulation that we would all very much support. What would also be quite useful is balance of payments, because we have always run a pretty bad show on that. But if CO2 is your thing—it is certainly my thing—why are we importing LNG and emitting 5 million tonnes of extra CO2 just in the process of importing it, rather than doing it domestically?

This debate is a valid one—it is happening for other reasons, which we are all very aware of, as shown by Labour—but I support fracking. Let us give it a go. There is no Government money involved; it is all private.

--- Later in debate ---
Maria Caulfield Portrait Maria Caulfield (Lewes) (Con)
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Let me be clear for my constituents: I do not support fracking and will not vote for it in the future. My constituents’ concerns are clear. My hon. Friend the Member for North Dorset (Simon Hoare) was right that the Secretary of State gave a commitment that local residents would have a veto over any plans for fracking. I am encouraged by that. The moratorium will therefore stay in Sussex, because I am pretty confident that my residents would not support fracking.

I echo the concerns raised on planning. We see on a daily basis refusals for planning being overturned by the planning inspector. I want reassurance from the Minister that that will not happen in cases involving fracking. This may be an opportunity to look at the role of the planning inspector overall as well as how we can respect wishes locally on fracking.

Let us also be clear that the motion is to agree on the date when there will be a vote on a Bill to ban fracking. The vote today is not on banning fracking. I am amazed at the sheer brass neck of the Opposition, who often criticise the Government for rushing through legislation by having all stages on one day, and yet that is exactly what they propose. They often say, “These issues are too important,” “Too many colleagues want to speak,” and, “There is not enough time to debate amendments,” and yet their motion is for all stages of a Bill in one day. Is that an indication of the Government-in-waiting who they claim to be?

I pointed out to the shadow Secretary of State his hypocrisy: when he was Labour leader, he said to the Labour party conference that there was a role for fracking. However, that bears no resemblance to the brass neck of the Liberal Democrats, who as usual said one thing when they were in government and, now that they are in opposition, say another.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse
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Will the hon. Member give way?

Maria Caulfield Portrait Maria Caulfield
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I will not; there is not enough time. When the leader of the Liberal Democrats, the right hon. Member for Kingston and Surbiton (Ed Davey), was Energy Secretary, not only did he lift restrictions on fracking, but he voted against a ban on fracking in 2015. As my hon. Friend the Member for Ashfield (Lee Anderson) said, he was quoted in 2013 as saying:

“There is an awful lot of nonsense talked about fracking. I love shale gas—it is much cleaner than coal and we need more gas. I hope we get loads of it”.

I will say the same thing to my constituents today and tomorrow: I will not support fracking, whether I am a Government Minister or a Back Bencher. I hope that when the matter does come to the Floor of the House, and I will not support fracking when it does, my constituents will see that I stand by every word I say.

Shale Gas Extraction

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Thursday 22nd September 2022

(1 year, 6 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Jacob Rees-Mogg Portrait Mr Rees-Mogg
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The thing we are lacking at the moment, most acutely, is affordable gas. Gas is the fuel that provides electricity at the margins, so when the wind is not blowing and demand is high, it is gas that provides the marginal unit of electricity. Gas is therefore fundamentally important to our energy security.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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The present Chancellor said only a few months ago that “No amount of shale gas” extracted across rural England would lower energy prices, and indeed, that private companies would not sell their shale gas to UK customers at a cost lower than the market price. Ruining our countryside—in Sussex, East Surrey and around Bath—is not the answer. Why in his first week in office has the Secretary of the State ended the moratorium on fracking but not lifted the de facto moratorium on onshore wind?

Jacob Rees-Mogg Portrait Mr Rees-Mogg
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We need to get as much energy as possible. Fracking does not ruin the countryside; fracking sites are actually surprisingly small for what they do. We have been expanding offshore wind dramatically—that has been a very big component—and we are continuing with increasing renewables, but we still need the base supply that can be brought on when there is a surge in demand, and that is dependent on gas.

Energy Update

Wera Hobhouse Excerpts
Monday 5th September 2022

(1 year, 6 months ago)

Commons Chamber
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Greg Hands Portrait Greg Hands
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Let us be absolutely clear: the new Prime Minister has said that there will be announcements very shortly on the support that will be there. The hon. Gentleman throws his hands up in the air, but he was first elected, if I am not mistaken, under the last Labour Government. When it comes to acting quickly, it took that Labour Government more than 10 years to reverse their policy on nuclear energy, so perhaps he might like to reflect on how quickly Governments can move, and see that this Government have moved incredibly fast to react to changing circumstances on both energy prices and energy supply.

Wera Hobhouse Portrait Wera Hobhouse (Bath) (LD)
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To continue the theme, small businesses will be among the worst hit by the soaring energy bills. Bath Aqua Glass is one of many businesses in my constituency that have told me their energy bill will go up 10 times—not 10%, but 10 times. The company’s bill will go from £14,000 to £130,000. The whole energy sector is completely out of control. We Liberal Democrats have called for emergency covid-style support for small businesses. What are the Government doing, not just in the short term to support small businesses, but in the long term to fix the broken energy sector?

Greg Hands Portrait Greg Hands
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I have already said that this is a priority for the new Prime Minister, and I would expect there to be announcements shortly on what is being done. Businesses are the core of our concern here in relation to energy prices. There is of course no energy price cap for businesses, and we recognise the challenges that businesses—particularly small and medium-sized enterprises that do not qualify as energy-intensive industries but nevertheless use a lot of energy—face at this time. That is exactly the sort of thing the Government are actively looking at.