Live Debate: Treasury Committee - 8th Jul 2026

Think you know Labour? 🏆 Play the Labour Face Game for your chance to win £150. Limited time only!

Treasury Committee

Wednesday 8th July 2026

(began 2 months, 1 week ago)

Watch Live
Skip to latest contribution
This debate has concluded

13:07

Speaker 1

-

Order, order!Welcome to the Treasury Select Committee on Wednesday, the 8th of July, 2026. Today, I'm delighted to welcome colleagues from our sister Committee, the Defence Select Committee, to question ministers from His Majesty's Treasury and the Ministry of Defence. And specifically we have Lucy Rigby, who is the Chief Secretary to the Treasury and a former former member of this committee, so she knows what to expect. Luke Pollard is the minister for defence Readiness and Industry at the Ministry of Defence, and they're joined by officials from their departments.

Conrad Smith, who's the director general for public spending and the co-head of the government finance function at His Majesty's Treasury, and Anene Blackmore, who's the director general for finance at the Ministry of Defence. So it's about money and procurement and capability today. So we're looking forward to short, sharp answers from our witnesses on this hot day. So can I start?Um, I'll start with if I can, with you, Minister. Minister Pollard, it was widely trailed in the run up to the Defence Investment Plan, that there was a £28 million gap in the budget, and you've got a £15 billion increase.

Is there a gap between the funding that you've got and what you wanted to deliver in the defence investment plan?

13:09

Speaker 2

-

Although I don't recognise those precise figures, what we have been doing in this process is taking the equipment plan that we inherited from the last government, the unfunded elements of that, which added up to a larger total, even though there was no money attached to them, and then matching those down to the recommendations of the Strategic Defence Review, that got us to a figure roughly around the £15 billion mark. And then in parallel, it wasn't just the totality of the increase in defence spending. It was also elements around the Ardell Siedle mix and also how we can spend that on readiness.

In the earlier years, rather than having increased defence spending in later years when there's a need for investment in the early years.

13:09

Speaker 1

-

Okay, so what was the gap then between what you initially asked for and what you've got?I know you're talking about the profiling now, and we'll come to the Del Ardell. A bit later. But what was the gap between what you actually asked for and what you wanted?

13:09

Speaker 2

-

So I wasn't involved with those precise discussions because they were held by the former Secretary of State and the Treasury. So that might be one that I could usefully hand over to Lucy to be able to. Chief Secretary, to be able to answer that.

13:10

Speaker 1

-

13:10

Speaker 3

-

Um on specifically. Sorry. On the front loading of the Delta.

13:10

Speaker 1

-

Was that. No no no no. What was what was the gap between what the Defence investment plan needed and what it got. If it's not 28 billion what's the what's the difference.

13:10

Speaker 3

-

I see. Well so as Mr. Pollard referred to, I think um. The £28 billion figure that you referred to is not something that we recognise. And my understanding is that whilst I wasn't in post at the time, that was never a formal ask that was made, um of the, of the, of the Treasury. Um obviously there are £15 billion additional funding in, in the dip, but um I think the right way to look at this is additional funding right across the piece, which is over the four years.

13:11

Speaker 1

-

Yes. But that's, that's not quite the question. So there's what the defence, what the Ministry of Defence and the whole defence review, the work done by Lord Robertson and colleagues determined was needed the capability and then the money that was available is, do you recognise there's a gap between the capability requirement or request from the Mod and the money that was being available from the Treasury?

13:11

Speaker 3

-

I think I'd have to repeat that. There was never a formal ask um of that.

13:11

Speaker 1

-

We know how government works. A lot of negotiation goes on. Was there a figure higher than what you eventually provided?

13:12

Speaker 3

-

There was my understanding there was a, as you know, a long period of negotiation. And the figure of the £15 billion, which is in the dip is the figure that was um, alighted upon clearly by the, the Prime Minister, the Chancellor and the Secretary of State for defence, uh, funding. All of the capability, which is detailed in this document. But as I as I said, I think. It's key to make clear that the £15 billion additional in the dip is just is part of the entirety of the £300 billion over four years.

This debate has concluded

Return to start of debate - Return to top of page