Home Affairs Committee
Tuesday 15th September 2026
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16:28
16:28
16:28
16:28
Speaker 1
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Speaker 1
Oh, well look, I mean, I hope so. I think it's it's a highly adaptive environment and things change very quickly. So as you can see already you've had a displacement of activity by the gangs from beaches in the north of France. They're moving westerly. You know, we've seen people try to have launches from Belgium as well. So I think that that change that we're seeing from the gangs is in response to the new environment from law enforcement.
So we can expect them to keep trying to adapt. And unfortunately, these are highly adaptable, entrepreneurial people. And so they will change. And we've got to keep pace with any changes that they're making in their operating model with how we're going after them with law enforcement. So as I say, it's a very welcome decrease that we've seen and a very significant decrease that we've seen, particularly over the summer. But but we're not complacent.
We know, we know we need to go further. And the one thing I'm definitely watching with an eagle eye is what displacement activity is occurring, how the gangs are adapting. And I'm trying to make sure, particularly with our partners in France, that we are adapting just as quickly to their change in posture as we have to the previous operating model.
So we can expect them to keep trying to adapt. And unfortunately, these are highly adaptable, entrepreneurial people. And so they will change. And we've got to keep pace with any changes that they're making in their operating model with how we're going after them with law enforcement. So as I say, it's a very welcome decrease that we've seen and a very significant decrease that we've seen, particularly over the summer. But but we're not complacent.
We know, we know we need to go further. And the one thing I'm definitely watching with an eagle eye is what displacement activity is occurring, how the gangs are adapting. And I'm trying to make sure, particularly with our partners in France, that we are adapting just as quickly to their change in posture as we have to the previous operating model.
16:29
16:30
Speaker 1
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Speaker 1
I don't think there's a. No, I don't think we've reached a limit. I think we can and will continue to go further. So was it last week or the week before? Just last week I was signing an agreement with my Belgian counterpart that's on law enforcement cooperation. Who knows our key, our key priority there is organised immigration crime. We've already had good work with the Belgians. A number of arrests made, people brought to justice and disruption of the trade there as their model, as the model of the gangs changes.
We need to change alongside it. So I don't think that we're we're at a limit of what can be achieved with law enforcement alone, I think. I think we made excellent progress this year and we can go further.
We need to change alongside it. So I don't think that we're we're at a limit of what can be achieved with law enforcement alone, I think. I think we made excellent progress this year and we can go further.
16:30
16:31
Speaker 1
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Speaker 1
Yeah, I mean, look, I think the the I mean, firstly, the move to the larger boats, I mean, there's placing people in even more danger than they're in getting on just one of the regular sized boats simply because, I mean, I've seen these things. They're very, very flimsy and very, very dangerous. And there have been incidents where 1 or 2 of them have nearly caught fire close to the French beaches. I mean, you know, real potential risk of significant loss of life.
And we know, obviously people continue to die in the channel. It doesn't make news as it used to, but it happens. And it's a reality that we obviously want to eliminate. And we want people not to be putting themselves in danger in this way. I think the change of tactics from displacing further west in France, trying to get into Belgium using different sized boats, it's all because there is real disruption happening. You know, boats are being seized, engines are being seized, the organised immigration and criminals are being brought to justice in different parts of Europe, and other countries are taking a new posture.
Germany has changed its law, having worked closely with us so that they can go after these people more effectively, particularly where things are held in warehouses. And so as as that is having an impact, of course, they're looking to change the way they do things as well. But just as we've gone after them in their current operating model, we'll do that for any changes they make as well.
And we know, obviously people continue to die in the channel. It doesn't make news as it used to, but it happens. And it's a reality that we obviously want to eliminate. And we want people not to be putting themselves in danger in this way. I think the change of tactics from displacing further west in France, trying to get into Belgium using different sized boats, it's all because there is real disruption happening. You know, boats are being seized, engines are being seized, the organised immigration and criminals are being brought to justice in different parts of Europe, and other countries are taking a new posture.
Germany has changed its law, having worked closely with us so that they can go after these people more effectively, particularly where things are held in warehouses. And so as as that is having an impact, of course, they're looking to change the way they do things as well. But just as we've gone after them in their current operating model, we'll do that for any changes they make as well.
16:32
Margaret Mullane
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Margaret Mullane
16:32
Speaker 1
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Speaker 1
Well, the the first thing I would say is we've obviously I signed a new agreement with the French for three years, which is a total of 662 million. It's a three year deal. It is a lot of money. It's more than we were paying before. But what we're paying for and what the New Deal does, that the previous deal didn't give us the flexibility to do is to pay for the things that we know are making a difference.
So we know the law enforcement tactics that make a difference on the ground. And now we are able to direct our funding towards that law enforcement response. So that's the, you know, the riot police being available. That's the uplift in French law enforcement officers boots on the ground. That is the thing that we paid more money for. And we know that is effective. We know that that is part of the reason why the numbers are coming down.
So, look, I what I would say to you is I know I know that given history and all of that, there's obviously lots of commentary about the relationship with the French, but these things are always a partnership. And, you know, it's important that they see this as a shared challenge, not just a problem for the Brits. When the boats arrive, we've got the problem. They haven't, you know, they've put a lot of effort into delivering on the deal that we have agreed.
They've recruited the additional law enforcement. Those boots are on the ground. And they also change their posture on maritime tactics. And they are now using maritime tactics. That's a big thing for the French to have changed in their system. And and it has helped as well. And it's constrained the operating environment for the gangs. So I'm very pleased with the cooperation that we have.
I'm pleased that the new agreement gives us flexibility, so that we will pay for the things that work and not fund things that aren't making a difference to crossings. And I think the combination of those two things puts us in the strongest possible position going forward.
So we know the law enforcement tactics that make a difference on the ground. And now we are able to direct our funding towards that law enforcement response. So that's the, you know, the riot police being available. That's the uplift in French law enforcement officers boots on the ground. That is the thing that we paid more money for. And we know that is effective. We know that that is part of the reason why the numbers are coming down.
So, look, I what I would say to you is I know I know that given history and all of that, there's obviously lots of commentary about the relationship with the French, but these things are always a partnership. And, you know, it's important that they see this as a shared challenge, not just a problem for the Brits. When the boats arrive, we've got the problem. They haven't, you know, they've put a lot of effort into delivering on the deal that we have agreed.
They've recruited the additional law enforcement. Those boots are on the ground. And they also change their posture on maritime tactics. And they are now using maritime tactics. That's a big thing for the French to have changed in their system. And and it has helped as well. And it's constrained the operating environment for the gangs. So I'm very pleased with the cooperation that we have.
I'm pleased that the new agreement gives us flexibility, so that we will pay for the things that work and not fund things that aren't making a difference to crossings. And I think the combination of those two things puts us in the strongest possible position going forward.