Westminster Hall

Tuesday 10th November 2026

(began 4 hours, 52 minutes ago)

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11:30
None Portrait Speaker 1
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2 or 3. .
11:30
11:30
None Portrait Speaker 3
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I beg to move that. This house has considered the matter of antisocial behavior. Can I first of all, thank you, Mr. Butler. It's a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, and I would like to refer members to my register of interests. But can I start by thanking colleagues from across the House who helped to make this debate possible, especially the member for Bermondsey and Old Southwark, who also chairs the all party parliamentary group on antisocial behaviour. I would like to also thank colleagues from resolve, who work with victims, housing providers, councils and police to help address this very issue.

 Can I also thank students which have attended this debate, students from French students to see how democracy works. But can I say that I was driven to secure this debate primarily because of the people I represent residents of Birmingham, Perry Barr, who are all proud to call our area home. For all its charms, it also suffers from issues that successive governments have failed to address. Among the worst of those issues is antisocial behaviour things like street drinking, begging, threatening behaviour, fly tipping, criminal damage, noise nuisance, vandalism. For many, this is part of everyday life. Only a small minority of people commit these acts, but everyone feels their effects and the facts back that up.

 Resolve estimates that more than 5 million incidents of anti-social behaviour occur in this country every year. Even worse, this is only an estimate because the overwhelming majority of people who experience don't even report it. According to the Home Office's own statistics, up to 93% of incidents go unreported. That is because passed, of course.
11:31
11:32
None Portrait Speaker 3
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I thank the honourable member. I will come on to that point, but that is part and parcel of exactly why this problem occurs. People feel desensitised in reporting matters because very little is ever done and the problem's only getting worse. In a survey conducted by resolve this year, 63% of respondents who encountered anti-social behaviour in the past three years never reported it to anybody. Last year, the figure stood at 56%. Even worse, of those who experienced it first hand, 28% said it made them feel unsafe locally, 15% considered moving home because of it, and 6% actually did move home.

 Antisocial behaviour is happening in broad daylight, and too many people have so little confidence in the system that they no longer see the point in asking for help. Some would rather move out and start afresh than rely on local authorities and agencies to help them out, and that is where we are failing. Victims are being asked to place their faith in a broken system where agencies dodge responsibility. Access to justice is slow and the quality of support for victims is unfortunately a postcode lottery. I will welcome stronger powers to tackle persistent offending. The Crime and Policing Act of 2026 introduced respect orders, tougher penalties for breaches of certain notices and wider powers to tackle reoccurring disorder.

 But new powers, on paper alone do not make our streets safer. Local agencies need the resources to enforce those powers and give victims confidence that reporting will lead to action. Luckily, solutions do exist across the country. Frontline professionals are already delivering results in challenging circumstances. Resolve, for example, which comprises of many of those expert voices, has put forward six recommendations that this government must take seriously. And we must start by putting victims at the heart heart of our response. They deserve consistent support and the reassurance that someone, somebody, is taking responsibility for their case. Too often, police forces, councils and housing providers hold different pieces of information about the same individual or incident, but struggle to coordinate their response.

 A single national agreement would enable these agencies to work together more effectively, identifying patterns of behaviour and intervene earlier. We must also address the unacceptable delays in our civil justice system. Victims of persistent nuisance and intimidation are often too often left waiting months, sometimes for years, for civil proceedings to conclude. The creation of a dedicated housing court would streamline these cases, reduce delays and ensure that justice is delivered before further harm is done. But none of these measures will succeed unless we make it easier for people to report what they see on their streets. That means creating a simple, standardised reporting system, allowing victims to report anonymously and to access help with cases.

 Also, we cannot afford to simply wait for disruptive behaviour to emerge before taking action. That is why we need greater investment in early intervention measures aimed in supporting vulnerable individuals. Engaging young people and addressing the underlying underlying causes of antisocial behaviour. And we need to direct sustained funding for community safety partnerships. These organisations understand the challenges facing their neighbourhoods and bring together agencies best placed to resolve them. But they cannot deliver long term solutions without proper support. These are practical reforms that would make an enormous difference. But alongside those, we must also look at the bigger picture and put an end to the austerity that causes people to lose pride in the places they call home.

 Youth clubs, sports facilities, community spaces and mental health services must be protected and seen for the essential services that they are, rather than optional extras. I will.
11:36
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11:38
None Portrait Speaker 3
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Wholeheartedly agree with my honourable member. And just by way of example, 70% of the police forces up and down this country are operating with numbers equivalent to what they were in 2010. And there are those areas which are not getting their fair share, such as West Midlands, such as his constituency. And of course, we need those numbers enough in order to make that tangible impact. As I say, Labour have left the West Midlands Police Force £43 million short every year, meaning that we could now lose another 80 officers. Unless we reserve reverse this trend, our police forces will be forced to prioritise more serious crime, leaving anti-social behaviour as an afterthought.

 There will also be local calls cause of anti-social behaviour unique to each area that need rooting out. In Birmingham, one such cause is obvious. Supported exempt accommodation. Birmingham houses 33,000 vulnerable people from across the country, with a fifth of the city's units units placed in my constituency and we must not stigmatise those who need care and we must offer them a place to rebuild their lives. But in my constituency, residents have repeatedly raised concerns about anti-social behaviour associated with poorly managed , exempt accommodation, sometimes even violence and property damage. When providers fail to properly support and supervise their residents.

 These problems play out in surrounding streets and leave neighbourhoods to suffer the consequences. The character of our streets is being actively degraded by poorly run, exempt accommodation. Yet the government has done nothing to tackle the root cause. Local Labour councillors can blame the city council all they like, but they did nothing when they were in charge six months ago. And why? Because they know it's on the government to end this crisis. The Supported Housing Regulatory Oversight Act, which promised us the powers to finally control the numbers of exempt properties in our city, was passed in 2023.

 But for over two years, this Labour government has done nothing but delay them. And now the government is saying we won't even get these powers until autumn of next year. We also need the resources to crack down on rogue providers and support tenants. That is why we have had the FCA pilot scheme, a unit that recovered millions in overpaid housing benefit and completed thousands of anti-social behaviour investigations. They were making a real, tangible difference. And what did this government do? They cut off its funding six months ago without urgent assistance. Supported exempt accommodation would only continue to drive anti-social behaviour in our streets.

 The government knows it. Yet they continue to turn a blind eye. And it's actually absurd that instead of supporting the FCA pilot scheme, I understand that this government is instead seeking a public inquiry into supported accommodation, which is likely to cost millions of pounds. And I say it's absurd because everyone knows what the problem is. You don't need a public inquiry to understand the issue. What needs to happen is the implementation of the legislation that has already been passed, and we all know what's going to happen. They're going to use this inquiry as an excuse to delay when they already know what the solution is.

 And I will be launching a petition with colleagues today for the residents of Birmingham demanding that this government implements this legislation rather than sitting on a shelf gathering dust. And I hope the minister may be able to tell us today that it won't be necessary, but I fear I will give him.
11:42
11:42
None Portrait Speaker 3
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I thank the Right Honourable member for his intervention. A very eloquent and persuasive as always. I wholeheartedly agree. Police are being forced to prioritise more serious crime because of the lack of resources and ultimately, if we don't resource the agencies properly with a proper strategic plan, then matters will only get worse. As I say, I hope the minister may be able to tell us today that that petition won't be necessary, that this piece of legislation that has already been passed will be enacted, and the city councils up and down this country are given the powers they need.

 But I but I fear that it's unlikely. Can I conclude, chair, perhaps most of all, we need to change the way we treat antisocial behaviour and appreciate the. Antisocial behaviour is not low level crime. Antisocial behaviour is destructive, not in the same way as a violent or serious crime, but in the ways it makes people and places feel unsafe. In many cases, they don't count as criminal offences. But let there be no doubt these are crimes against the community that drain the morale out of our residents. So I sincerely ask the minister to commit to delivering Resolve's recommendations, the six recommendations, and perhaps to meet both with myself and resolve, so we can discuss how to properly address the scourge of antisocial behaviour once and for all, and ensure that victims voices can be heard.

 People deserve the right to feel safe in the places they call home, and it's this government's responsibility to make that happen. Thank you chair.
11:44
11:44
None Portrait Speaker 8
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Good morning. Mr.. It's a pleasure to have you in the chair today. And my thank you to the honourable member for Birmingham, Perry Barr, for bringing this debate to Westminster Hall. Now, across Alloa and Grangemouth, there is an understandable frustration with antisocial behaviour that negatively impacts communal spaces, neighbourhood communities and public transport and what so many of my constituents rightly feel is a sense of injustice, that the perpetrators have been allowed to act in the manner that they have, with little to no consequences. My constituents have been let down, but let me be clear the fault for this does not lie with our overstretched police officers.

 Police Scotland has been savagely cut by years of sustained SNP government underfunding, which naturally leads to increases in issues like antisocial behaviour. In giving evidence to Holyrood's criminal justice committee, the Scottish Police Authority admits that policing is under severe strain and that public trust and confidence in the service is decreasing. The police authority said that they would continue to make the case to the SNP government for strategic investment, and aim to show the devastating consequences of flat cash, because let us be under no illusion if the force's settlement remains unchanged in cash terms, then jobs will be lost.

 Even though the SNP promised that officer figures would remain above 17,234. The quarterly figures show that there were 16,322 full time equivalent officers. On the 30th of June 2026. Officer numbers in Scotland are at their lowest level since June 2024. Now those SNP cuts are hollowing out Police Scotland, drastically reducing community policing across the country. Visible local police are essential in stopping crime, reducing antisocial behaviour and improving overall community safety. After two decades of SNP government, whether it be health care, education, local councils, our fire service or Police Scotland, the SNP have relentlessly cut vital public services and it leaves our communities far, far from safety.
11:47
None Portrait Speaker 2
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Iain Duncan Smith.
11:47
None Portrait Speaker 9
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Miss Butler, it's always a pleasure to serve with you and under you. So I welcome you to your role. Can I just say, if you've only got two minutes. I want to make one particular point. I think antisocial behaviour is arguably the most serious crime that the public see, because most of the time they don't see all the the really detailed murders and things like that. They're not on their streets. The thing that's on their street is the behaviour of others to wreck the quality of their life. And that means essentially shoplifting, for example, has to be taken far more seriously by police because it disrupts and destroys pretty much all of the lives of those who want to go on to the streets.

 It destroys the likelihood of us keeping high streets and being able to give a proper service to the public. We had the same problem in Chingford and Woodford Green, but there are things that can be done. We will all, of course, blame the police for not being there and for the troubles they have and the bigger policies. I want to centre, though, on what happens locally in the in my constituency. We focused on the main high street station road that has been literally torn apart by shoplifters. These are not ad hoc individuals just turning up because they're short of a bit of cash.

 Many of these are gang related. They are organised crime. Boots, for example, gets raided endlessly because they can get thousands of pounds worth of goods off the shelves and walk out with nobody interrupting them. And so the point I would make is that we call together all of those bigger stores who bring people onto the high street, discovered they weren't reporting the crime to the police, and the police said they didn't know it was going on. We forced them to do just that. We then said the deal is that police must be on the street and arresting people immediately.

They commit this crime. What we actually saw was that crime began to fall on the high street, because we had played a particular part in it, getting cameras up, doing facial recognition. And I simply say to all of us here today, there is more that we can actually do to put pressure on the police and the shops and others to do more about anti-social behaviour. It is a terrible crime. It destroys lives, it destroys the hopes of people, and we now must put pressure on government to rectify that.
11:49
11:49
None Portrait Speaker 10
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And I thank the honourable member for securing this debate. Since being elected to represent Ealing Southall, I've spent much of my time campaigning for two things more police on our streets and more powers for the police to take action against anti-social behaviour. So I'm delighted the government is investing in neighbourhood policing, with an additional £262 million for London, but there is no point in having more police on the streets if they do not have the powers they need to act in Ealing, Southall, we've seen officers arrest people who are then out again the next day.

 All too often the police are just moving people from West Ealing to Southall. That's why I've long championed Labour's new respect orders. These give police the power to take action against persistent offenders, with those who breach the orders facing up to two years in prison or unlimited fines. It is a significant change. Instead of moving people from one end of the town centre to the other, the police can take action against persistent offenders and I was delighted to welcome the Minister to Southall just a few weeks ago to launch these new powers, and I'll be checking with the police about who they've put on a respect order over the next few weeks.

 There is more to do, however. I'm campaigning for a dedicated town centre policing team for Southall. Other town centres have one we don't because of an anomaly with how they deal with crime and anti-social behaviour data, and I've asked the Met Police to look at this again. I'm also campaigning to get the shutters pulled up on Southall police station. They're pulled down for ten years and that does not send the right message locally. Finally, Madam Chair, we need to look again how we support recovering drug users. We put them on the methadone programme, which means they have to come in and out of town centres almost every day to collect prescriptions, do urine tests and go to pharmacies.

 There's a new drug, buvidal. It costs more money, but we should look at the impact on town centres. You don't have to go in and out as often. Madam chair, tackling anti-social behaviour is not just about moving people from one end of the town centre to the other. We need to bring in these new respect orders that the government has championed. It's what people in Ealing Southall deserve and it's what I will continue campaigning for.
11:51
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11:52
None Portrait Speaker 12
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To step up.
11:52
None Portrait Speaker 11
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But I wanted to focus my remarks on town centres and the need to have civic pride and facilities that people want to go to and that they enjoy being in. The story of the Martlet Shopping Centre redevelopment in Burgess Hill is too long to cover in the next minute and a half or so, but because there are derelict buildings, despite the best endeavours of successive councils over many years, on Saturday afternoon I walked across the town centre with one of my children and they pointed out that there were smashed windows and when we walked back she told me that the smashed window was then open and we looked up and we could see masked youths on this shuttered building that used to have a Lidl supermarket in it.

 That level of neglect for facilities is bad for communities. It is bad for the people of Burgess Hill. Burgess Hill has done everything it can to try and get its town centre redeveloped. But because of failed levelling up fund bids under the last government because it is not eligible for Pride in Place funding. As far as we can tell, that money hasn't been forthcoming. We are very hopeful that a joint venture bringing together public and private sector money may actually get the town centre redevelopment off the ground, but as it stands, morale is low for people who live in Burgess Hill.

 The town council has done what it can by bringing the park centre back into into use, providing youth facilities and the Burgess Hill creative community have taken up an empty unit in the town centre, in the shopping centre , where people can come together and do a variety of good creative projects. People want it to be a town centre that works, so I would say that obviously the policing presence is really important, but actually without getting the skeleton right of buildings and civic pride, that work that people love and they want to go to, you are going to attract the wrong kind of people, a handful of people that want to make life a misery for the vast majority of law abiding citizens who are there for their town, who are there to support their community.

 Thank you.
11:54
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11:56
None Portrait Speaker 13
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I thank the honourable member for his intervention and he's absolutely right. We do have to show them that these interventions are working least because because it adds to the data as to how much policing is needed in the area. And if people don't report these things and they don't feel that they're results, nothing can really move forward. Now, I welcome this government's commitment to neighbourhood policing. The government says it met its first target in January this year, but my constituents are not seeing or feeling that police presence on their streets in a meaningful way. For example, when the corner shop next door to my constituency office was robbed at knifepoint, our officers were properly deployed to arrest pensioners in central London, holding up signs.

 I would like my constituents to feel the effect of what proper community policing is that this government pledged, with delivery of real neighbourhood policing, officers, sped up in places like Brixton, where the problems are long standing and well documented. But I'd also like to see my local council, Lambeth, properly funded, to tackle the addiction and homelessness crisis we face, we must get to the root of the matter. We need to see a holistic approach to anti-social behaviour because we simply cannot police our way out of this problem. I also truly believe that a difference can be made with a standing, multi-agency group that brings together the police, the council, health services, housing and outreach teams so that people are talking to each other and not working in silos.

An issue that I see time and time again, different bodies trying to tackle this problem, but no one actually talking to each other. It isn't working and it's only exasperating my constituents concerns of not being properly listened to and being made to feel that they're going over the same roundabouts. Clapham and Brixton Hill should be a place where everyone feels safe, and my constituents are asking to be listened to and to see change. And as someone who is called the area their home for my entire life, I am to.
11:58
None Portrait Speaker 14
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Hear, hear.
11:58
11:58
None Portrait Speaker 15
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Thank you. Mr.. My inbox is flooded with correspondence from concerned constituents, writing to me about a string of issues related to anti-social behaviour across Keighley and Ilkley. Masked people in balaclavas, riding e-bikes on pavements, quad bikes, doing donuts on public spaces, deliberately loud cars racing through the centre of Keighley and along the bypass. A group of teenagers has made Keighley bus station somewhere people now want to avoid laughing. Gas canisters, those nitrous oxide canisters being used by those illegally driving under the influence of alcohol, of the laughing gas and then being thrown out of the window.

 And people are seeing this every single day and having a negative consequence on our area. It's not a it should not continue. And areas like Dalton Mills justice is not prevailing. In 22, 100 firefighters attended an arson attack. £15 million of damage was caused , £130,000 of impact to local businesses and lives were put at risk. But yet the perpetrator got a suspended prison sentence, a slap on the wrist only giving the green light for further attacks like this to take place. No deterrent at all, one of my constituents has put to me. I rarely, if any, see any form of authority addressing any of these issues that I have mentioned.

 Which brings me on to the point to do with the government's narrative of increasing the police numbers for neighbourhood policing to 13,000, because police officers are putting to me that this is not new recruits that are coming into their force. This is simply reshuffling the deck chairs between police officers that are already doing a good job elsewhere within the local police force, and then simply being reallocated to doing police neighbourhood work. So I'd like to ask the minister, could she tell me how many additional new recruits that we have seen to our police neighbourhood teams, how many specifically to West Yorkshire, and what analysis is the government doing where there has been allocation of police officers from their teams?

 That has had a negative impact elsewhere within those police forces?
12:00
12:00
None Portrait Speaker 14
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Thank you very much.
12:00
None Portrait Speaker 16
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Your chair. Antisocial behaviour is a recurring concern for residents in my constituency. I raised this in June of last year, and since then I've continued to hear from constituents about the effect it's having in our town centres and public places. A crime that isn't reported, investigated or follow up can quickly become a crime that is repeated. So the response to antisocial behaviour should be measured not just by the number of incidents recorded, but by whether people feel confident in reporting and whether they see action. Two young men from Hednesford spoke to me about groups gathering in town centres and parks, and how intimidating that can feel.

When I welcomed pupils from Kingsmead School to Parliament, they raised concerns about phone thefts involving e-scooters. Cannock Chase District Council has used public spaces protection orders to address persistent problems, including rising antisocial use of vehicles and e-scooters and street drinking. There's a positive example of the Link retail park in Cannock, which Staffordshire Police identified as a hotspot for car meets racing and excessive noise. Officers issued warning letters to drivers identified through CCTV and they held targeted patrols at peak times. PCSOs also removed stickers that were advertising the meets. That led to a significant reduction in complaints.

 However, this had to be a nuanced response because for years before these issues arose, there had been respectful and well managed car meets a reminder that appropriate use of public spaces should be supported as we target anti-social behaviour. But partnership working does not remove the need for visible neighbourhood policing. I welcome Staffordshire Police the announcement that we have 53 additional officers, but the force also changed PCSo shift patterns in June to half of them now finish at seven and half at nine, and that's led to concerns amongst my constituents over whether PCSOs will be available when anti-social behaviour is happening.

 The Neighbourhood Policing guarantee should be judged not only by the number of officers recruited, but whether communities see a consistent and effective police presence. I won't, in the interest of time, I hope the minister can speak about whether the Home Office will look at the impact of changing shift patterns on neighbourhood policing, in particular, how we can ensure that the guarantee delivers visible, accessible policing in town centres and residential areas during those hours when anti-social behaviour is most likely to occur.
12:02
None Portrait Speaker 14
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Thank you.
12:02
None Portrait Speaker 2
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Lee Anderson.
12:02
None Portrait Speaker 14
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Thank you, Mr. Clark, to serve under your chair, and I would like to thank the honourable member for Perry Barr for securing this debate. And thank you, students, as well, for coming in here today to witness this. And I suspect that they could come back in ten years time, and we'll still be debating antisocial behaviour because nothing ever gets done in this place. So but antisocial behaviour destroys families. It destroys communities and it destroys ultimately the country. Now, just a few years ago, I went to Singapore and I'm sure the minister was on a similar flight to Singapore about four years ago with the Home Affairs Select Committee.

And one thing I noticed in Singapore was there was no graffiti, there was no anti-social behaviour, there was no crime. And I'll tell you what else I didn't see. I didn't see a police car or a police officer all week. Does anybody know why? Is because the consequences of anti-social behaviour in Singapore are a little bit more severe than in this country. But I'll take you to my town centre. Suttoninashfield. It's full of yobs, it's full of drunkards, it's full of people on drugs. And the police do turn up, but they do absolutely nothing because they think it's a waste of time.

They move them on. Then they come back the following day. Now, one of my solutions for the minister is if these jobs keep returning and they're living on state benefits, then just stop the benefits. It's the same with social housing. People in some of my council estates are creating all sorts of problems for their neighbours. Now, if they're living in social housing and living a life on benefits, in causing problems in my community, then why don't we just kick them out of social housing? Stop. The benefits have some real repercussions. A lot of my residents think it's a waste of time reporting it to the police and the council, especially when my local council.

 You've probably seen it in the news recently. Ashfield District Council has been run by criminals. Criminals like councillor Tom Hollis, who's got a string of convictions, including lots of anti-social behaviour under his belt. So the solutions are simple stop the benefits, these people that are causing problems in our town centre if they live in social housing, kick them out of the houses. It's really, really simple stuff, Minister.
12:04
12:04
None Portrait Speaker 17
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Sir, with you in the chair. So I thank the honourable member for Birmingham, Perry Barr, for securing this important debate. Now, one of the difficulties we face when discussing anti-social behaviour is that too often we underestimate how serious it is. A group of young people gathering outside a shop, shouting in the street late at night or repeatedly causing disturbances in a neighbourhood. Now that might seem like a minor incident, perhaps dismissed as young people simply being young people. But in my constituency, the former Moreton Hall prep school in Bury St Edmunds, we saw how serious these situations become for the school, which stood empty since 2020, is the site of vandalism and fires.

 Last July, an arson attack at the building resulted in about 100 people being evacuated from their neighbouring houses. Now, what might begin as young people gathering around an abandoned building can become something far more dangerous for those involved and for the wider community and for residents living nearby. That is not a minor matter. Now, persistent anti-social behaviour erodes the very sense of security that makes a community feel like home. Now I work on the Home Affairs Select Committee, and I've seen just how important the renewed focus on neighbourhood policing is. Yeah, this is a real opportunity to change how we approach anti-social behaviour.

 Neighbourhood policing is about rebuilding relationships between the police and the communities that they serve. It's about having officers who know their neighbourhoods, who recognise the warning signs, who intervene before relatively minor incidents become something far more serious. And it gives residents confidence that when they report anti-social behaviour, somebody listens. So let's move away from the idea that anti-social behaviour is somehow inevitable. It is not inevitable and certainly isn't something that communities should simply put up with. With effective neighbourhood policing and a willingness to take this concern seriously, I'm sure we can make a real difference.
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12:08
None Portrait Speaker 18
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I certainly do, and addressing the street drinking and e-scooter misuse as well is also one of those things. The introduction of new respect orders, as an example, provides further powers for both police and local councils to take action against persistent offenders, and that's something I would encourage and welcome. And whilst enforcement is essential, we must also work to understand what causes it. Because that's the that's the real the real issue for adults involved in anti-social behaviour, mental health, drug misuse are cited as the key drivers. But for children and young people who tend to be the main source of anti-social behaviour, been found that unstable home environments, lack of education, peer pressure are also significant contributors.

 Uniquely in Northern Ireland, we must recognise that there remains a continuing threat posed by paramilitary groups which can exploit vulnerable young people, accelerate antisocial behaviors and we must do more to support parents in their responsibilities, ensuring that they know where their children are, particularly during the evenings, and are able to encourage their children to take responsibility for their actions. Can I commend the churches in my constituency of Strangford? What they do, they have the youth groups, they have the the youth clubs, and they try to encourage young people to come in. They try to keep them off the streets at all possible, but also make a play.

 Madam chair, for street pastors, they're very active in my constituency. They are active right through the constituency. They do great work. They reach out and they help young people. And no one can ignore the impact that they have. And Newton Ards and may continue. They, of course, have experienced some of that anti-social behaviour over the summer. The . These incidents have a lasting impact on the wider community. Residents feel less confident about going out, fearing intimidation or harassment. Parents with young children are increasingly reluctant to use local parks, while others avoid walking because they don't feel safe.

 In conclusion, Madam Chair, the publishing of the Live in Fear because of the behaviour of a minority. So when it comes to the increasing powers of enforcement, given the success of some of these powers in England and Wales, I asked the Minister, always very responsive and I thank her for that. I thank the Minister for her energy and response. Can I also ask the minister to engage with the Northern Ireland Assembly and the Minister for Policing and Justice and the PSNI? We can defeat anti-social behaviour if we do it together.

 Thank you.
12:10
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12:11
None Portrait Speaker 10
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Is there a.
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None Portrait Speaker 20
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Yeah.
12:12
None Portrait Speaker 21
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I agree with her that we need to look at the sale of these bikes much more closely. Conversion kits can be used, and that can turn an ordinary pedal bike into something more powerful. Can also be ordered online for less than £300, so complete machines are sold on the basis that they are being used on private land. When everyone knows where they actually end up, and young people over to buy them with very little standing in their way. Now, I do welcome the steps that the government has already taken to strengthen legislation in this area.

 However, there are two things I would ask the Minister to consider. The Department for Business and Trade, the former Department for Business Trade committed to responding to its product safety consultation within 12 weeks of it closing in June this year. That deadline has now passed by some two months. Will the minister press colleagues to publish the response without further delay and make the case from the Home Office that restricting the sale of conversion kits would ease the burden on our police? The second is enforcement. At the moment, there is no consistent national approach and results vary but vary a great deal from one force to the next.

 Where it has worked, it's been well planned and properly resourced. In London, the met has target hotspots using intelligence tested bikes at the roadside with rolling roads and put officers on e-bikes of their own. It has seized more than 2500 illegal bikes this year, and phone theft in the West End has nearly halved. To that end. I would be grateful if the minister could say whether the government will look at a national framework for enforcement based, based on the best practice evidence and push for it to be properly funded so that my constituents in Gillingham and Rainham can see the same results on their high streets.
12:13
None Portrait Speaker 20
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Thank you.
12:13
None Portrait Speaker 2
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Alison Hume.
12:13
None Portrait Speaker 20
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Thank you, Miss Barbara. It's a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. Tackling antisocial behaviour is vital to restoring pride in our communities. But for too many people in Scarborough, pride in where they live has been replaced by anxiety, frustration and fear. Increasingly, antisocial behaviour is concentrated around a small number of premises in the town centre, which provide emergency temporary accommodation. The impact on nearby residents and businesses has been profound. One constituent, Brian Witty, told me. It's making my life a complete misery. My cameras are going off all night with people mooching about drinking, taking drugs, alcohol and fighting.

 I can't have my grandchildren over because of the foul language and cannabis use. Another constituent, Rachel, said incidents are taking place every single day on the streets surrounding these properties, not just sporadically. We can't use our garden anymore. We can't even leave our windows open because of the noise and the smell. Another accommodation provider saw guests request refunds after experiencing sustained disruption during their stay. Since raising these concerns with the operators of these sites, including a company called Home More, I'm pleased to say that meaningful improvements such as 24 hour on site security have been made and whilst the challenges remain, these measures have begun to make a positive difference.

 To be clear, I don't oppose emergency accommodation being located in Scarborough, but we are seeing an overconcentration in one town in a large county. 103 people recently placed in emergency accommodation across North Yorkshire, 58 were in Scarborough. So we don't want we don't mind taking our share. But does the Minister agree with me that while vulnerable people deserve safe accommodation, the communities that host it deserve fairness to.
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12:16
None Portrait Speaker 24
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Thank you. Mr..
12:16
None Portrait Speaker 25
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For years, the story of Bonfire Night in Niddrie and Craigmillar has been of disorder. And in 2023, 62 officers were injured when fireworks were fired at police. And heartbreakingly, they caused the death from stress of a baby red panda at Edinburgh Zoo. Yet after this, local people and police decided that they shouldn't. Families shouldn't have to be afraid on the 5th of November and they launch an incredible operation. Thankfully, last Thursday, Niddrie was quiet. First and foremost, I want to thank the police, local PPS Graham, Caroline and the local team, but also police officers who came up from England to help patrol, which shows the value of cross UK solidarity for our communities.

 I also want to thank Jeannie Robertson Fraser and Donna Ruth from Sandy's community centre, Kirsty Haig from Edinburgh Food Social and Cheryl O'Neill and Suzanne Douglas from places for people Hayes Hub. The good news in Niddrie is remarkable because it is unusual. Policing in Musselburgh is a disgrace. Almost daily emails are in my inbox from constituents reporting intimidation, harassment, supermarket theft and restaurants smashed up. I have launched petitions, hosted coffee mornings, work with the police and written countless letters to Scottish ministers. Yet precious little has been done. Our police do amazing work but they are let down by the SNP .

Despite being Scottish Scotland's Capital E division, which covers Edinburgh, has only 20 officers per 10,000 people, a third below the Scottish average. The SNP love to make comparisons to England and Wales when it suits them, but will. The English average is 24 officers per 10,000 people. In Musselburgh it's only 16. It is inexplicable to me that the Scottish Government can have had an extra £18 billion from this Labour government, yet none of it makes its way to front line policing. My constituents are paying the price. It is not rocket science to solve antisocial behaviour.

 We just need more police.
12:18
None Portrait Speaker 2
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Rachael Maskell.
12:18
None Portrait Speaker 26
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Thank you. It's a pleasure to see you in the chair. There were 3707 cases of reported anti-social behaviour in York over the last year. That's out of 14,500 reported offences. Shoplifting comes in around 1700. It's a serious issue in my constituents as my community organizing in the community has shown over the summer, young people using e-bikes, as we've heard, shoplifting and groups of young people just gathering with nothing to do. I can attest today that we need to not just talk about the issue and what we do to address it, but prevention, and that is where I want to focus the government's government ministers attention to.

 We know that our youth services were decimated in 2011, and we are paying a heavy price for that today. Capture cash strapped local authorities are struggling to be able to meet their statutory responsibilities, let alone provide these essential services on top. And as we have seen, we know that if we put the investment in early, we can see incredible results. York Youth Partnership is working multi-agency to be able to address the issues young people today are facing. We are getting youth hopes from the DWP and government are putting money into bringing people into a different space after offending.

But I want prevention to be at the heart. When I talk to the police, they say it's a job for the local authority. When I talk to the local authority, they say it's somebody else's work too, but we need to put the investment in. I want to see our local authority having the opportunity to work with the police on reformulating all of these services, because we know whether the DWP, whether falling out of education or indeed causing antisocial behaviour on our streets, these young people are the same young people and therefore we need a formulation which will bring all of those young people into a productive space and to give them the opportunities that they should have for the future.
12:20
None Portrait Speaker 2
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Yeah. Our team.
12:20
None Portrait Speaker 23
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Thank you, Miss Butler. It's a pleasure to serve under your chair. And can I also thank the honourable member for Perry Barr for securing this debate? Anti-Social behaviour is one of the most significant issues that I often see in my inbox. And one of the areas in my constituency that is impacted by this is spon end in Sherburn. Now, this is truly heartbreaking because there's so much to look forward to in Sherburn. The area is going through significant regeneration. We've got the city centre south development that has regenerated 250 affordable homes, North Mill Park, North Mill under Park and the opening of River Sherbourne, which showcases the heritage and the beauty of that area.

 It is also home to a charity called Langerhans, which provides which last year provided over 1 million meals to the most vulnerable people across our country. Now, sadly, all of this is overshadowed by anti-social behaviour. Recently, I held a coffee afternoon with residents in the area and I also visited one of the local schools and what I heard was truly shocking drug dealers targeting vulnerable people near schools, people passing out and defecating on the streets, e-scooters and e-bikes driving recklessly, and a particular incident where a man who was under the influence walked into one of my local primary schools during pick up time, and all the kids could see it.

 Now, following this incident, I did hold a round table with aid with Change, Grow Live, Coventry Council, the West Midlands Police and Coventry and Warwickshire Integrated Board to address this, and I understand two arrests have been made by the police. However, there is so much left for us to do, so I just want to ask the Minister three clear questions. What support is being provided to schools to ensure that they have an allocated police contact in case incidents like this happen? Secondly, is the minister considering expanding respect orders outside of high streets and city centres to more hidden areas like Spondon in my constituency?

 And finally, when will my constituents start to feel the impact of investment in local policing on their streets?
12:22
None Portrait Speaker 13
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Thank you.
12:22
None Portrait Speaker 24
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Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to on the back of three pledges, one of which was to work to revitalize our towns, a key aspect of which is tackling the issues of anti-social behaviour in Saint Austell. And whilst Cornwall has a lower crime rate than the national average, around 405 incidents were recorded in Saint Austell the past year, which makes it the second most common category and underlies why ASB remains such a priority for residents. Saint Austell ranks fifth among the nine towns in its area for recorded crime, but the town centre faces a challenge of perception, as well as the reality of those ASB incidents, so often relating to drugs and alcohol.

 I'd firstly like to commend the work of Safer Cornwall of Cornwall Council's ASB team. It's rough sleeping team and the Saint Austell Police. The summer blitz that took place last year delivered 4500 hours of police foot patrols across the focus areas, including Saint Austell, and 590 arrests for retail crime and 79 for street crime. In August, police and partners delivered the full service closures of two addresses in the area. But there is much more to do, and it's been clear throughout the community conversations that I've had the past few months that we need to tackle the upstream causes of anti-social behaviour as well.

 On youth services. Enforcement alone cannot give young people something to do and somewhere to go. The government's published its National Youth Strategy, the first time in over a decade, backed by over £500 million of investment, and Cornwall secured 1.5 million for two young futures hubs. Ramping up drug and alcohol funding is vital. It was slashed under previous governments by over half in real terms, and I want to be candid that whilst we need to take a humanitarian approach, we must also take a firm approach, which is why we need to be sensible and strategic about the provision of supported accommodation and have those tough conversations with Cornwall Council, who I was very pleased to see , take a more review of this approach in recent years.

 I'd like to ask the Minister if you can come back to Saint Austell in your current role and bring with you the full might of government behind my pledge for Saint Hostel.
12:24
12:24
None Portrait Speaker 27
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Thank you.
12:24
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12:25
None Portrait Speaker 21
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So I brought the residents, the council and the police and other services together in meeting my office. We agreed a plan of action. The perpetrators were dealt with and importantly, the problem has not returned. But why did it take so much effort? Why should residents have to reach the end of their tether before agencies sit down together and sort things out and chair? This isn't an isolated problem. As others have noted across ports, we are also seeing growing concerns of antisocial use of electric bikes and e-scooters. Residents are worried about vehicles being ridden and the speeds they are riding at their use in criminality, putting pedestrians and other road users at risk.

 I warmly welcome the government's action on a named neighbourhood police officers and strengthening the powers to seize and crush these vehicles being used anti-socially without first a warning. But we need to use these powers consistently, and we need to bring a public campaign on the use of e-bikes and scooters, scooters legally and illegally to stop their purchases in the first place. And that brings me to respect orders. I welcome their introduction. They give police councils and social landlords additional tools to tackle persistent local offenders, including restricting access to particular areas and requiring individuals to change their behaviour.

 But powers are only useful if they are used. The minister previously told the House that police in Hemel Hempstead had identified 30 potential cases ready for the introduction of respect orders, and we now have seen the first orders granted in Gloucestershire. Chair, that is action. But can the Minister tell me how many applications have been made and how many grants have been granted by Hampshire and Isle of Wight Constabulary? And what practical support is being given to ensure our local police and councils make full use of their powers? Because, chair, ultimately this is about people being able to sleep peacefully, feel safe when walking down the streets and having confidence that when they report anti-social behaviour, somebody will do something about it.

 It is not a case where our residents must shout louder than the perpetrators before someone listens, and new powers must mean action. Safer streets and communities, not simply strong words.
12:27
12:27
None Portrait Speaker 29
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Thank you, Miss Butler. It's a genuine pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. And I thank the honourable member for Perry Barr for raising this debate. Recently, I held one of my regular coffee mornings in Sycamore and Stafford, and residents raised a wide range of issues. But a common theme emerged from the discussion, which was that people wanted to see more visible policing in their communities. They wanted to know that their concerns would be taken seriously, and that officers really understood the area that they served. The same came out during the Independent Business Roundtable in Stafford town centre.

 Business owners spoke passionately about the contribution they make to the high street, but also talked about the negative effect that ASB is having in our town centre. Favourites like Webb, Lucas and Stub optometrists have had an automatic lock fitted on their door now to ensure their staff are safe, and also Salter Street toys and models are reconsidering how they run their business. They told me that often the thing that makes the most visible difference, the most difference, is a visible police presence with PCSOs regularly around, and we know that neighbourhood policing has faced considerable cuts over many years.

 Communities have felt the loss of that local presence, and that's why I welcome the renewed focus on neighbourhood policing under this Labour government. But one thing that struck me from my conversation with residents is they're not just simply asking for more police or tougher enforcement. They want us to address the underlying causes of these problems. An issue we had this summer in Stafford was sadly some anti-social behaviour involving young people in the town centre. I'm a former youth worker and I'm aware that often people reach for young people when it's ASB and I don't. I don't like those two always being conflated.

But it was true that there were issues around there. And the issue is that in Stafford, we face the third worst cuts to the youth service in the country. There was decisions made by conservative administrations prior to our involvement, but my residents know that to turn things around in the long term, we must consider how we create opportunities and strengthen those communities that young people are growing up in. And that's why I'm campaigning for a youth centre in Stafford, like the one my honourable friend has got coming to Saint Austell and Newquay.
12:29
12:29
12:29
12:30
12:30
12:30
12:31
12:32
12:32
12:33
12:33
None Portrait Speaker 30
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I thank my hon. Friend for her intervention, and I commend her comments to the Minister. Now, many instances of anti-social behaviour are difficult to. They made difficult to police by confusing legal frameworks. E-bikes have been mentioned in this debate already. They are a common complaint in towns and city centres up and down the country, including in my constituency, Cheltenham. Public concern is growing over the dangerous misuse of illegally modified high speed e-bikes on pavements and in pedestrianised areas like the high Street in Cheltenham and the promenade. This is a particular concern to older people and parents with young children, but it certainly can alarm anyone and I speak from personal experience.

 This is in itself anti-social behaviour, but the suspicion is that these e-bikes are being regularly used by drugs, gangs and in county lines. The current legal framework for e-bikes is confusing, it is outdated and it is rarely enforced. High power conversion kits and illegal bikes, as mentioned by the member for Gillingham and Rainham. They are readily available online with almost no regulatory oversight. This would be a good starting point for ministers wanting to introduce measures to tackle anti-social behaviour. We must tackle illegal e-bikes, which includes giving police forces updated training to spot and intercept and to confiscate them.

 So will ministers look at how these proposals might tackle anti-social behaviour? We must also recognise that a huge quantity of serious crime has moved online, as sir Mark warned last week. The latest strategic assessment from the National Crime Agency warned that rapid technological change is the primary driver in serious organised crime, with the threat set to increase. This change is diverting resources away from frontline policing, producing poorer outcomes for victims of other crime, including antisocial behaviour. A dedicated online crime agency will ensure that online crime is treated with the seriousness that it merits, and it would free up officers time to focus on neighbourhood crime, including antisocial behaviour.

 This online crime agency would be funded by a new online crime levy on the big tech and AI companies, whose platforms enable the very most serious crimes. The crimes that sir Mark warned about last week child sexual abuse, fraud and money laundering. This would stop neighbourhood police from being dragged off their streets to deal with these forms of online crime that they are not trained, in many cases to deal with. Just last week, sir Mark warned that the police risk heading for failure if reforms do not empower officers to keep up with modern criminals operating online, so will ministers.

 Consider the proposals that I've set out in the Lib Dems have set out before to establish an online crime agency to improve community response on our streets. Now the government has made some positive steps towards some of these measures through its neighbourhood police guarantee, but the proof will be in its delivery, especially given the upcoming police reform legislation. These reforms must be got right with a proper focus on community policing, or they risk placing communities at greater risk and harming public confidence in the system. If merging forces means officers become more distant from the communities they serve and less able to respond to local crimes, the government will be making a serious mistake.

 Worryingly, the agenda being set by the Home Office seems to run counter to the devolution direction being set by the Prime Minister, particularly when we're talking about the number of boundaries that will be set and accountability to regional mayors. So when will we find out how police reform fits in with the Prime Minister's flagship agenda? Thank you.
12:37
12:37
None Portrait Speaker 24
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Thank you very much.
12:37
None Portrait Speaker 32
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Mr. Butler was a pleasure to serve with you in the chair, and I congratulate the member, the honourable member for Birmingham, Perry Barr, on securing this important debate and all 17 honourable, Right Honourable, honourable members who have taken part in this debate from all parts of the United Kingdom. We all recognise the descriptions and anecdotes heard today. Antisocial behaviour is a widespread issue. We all face the noise from fireworks, the glance over the shoulder on the walk home and the quiet bus journeys spent trying not to attract attention. For victims and witnesses alike, it inspires nothing but stress and fear.

 It stops pensioners walking to the shops, bus drivers from feeling safe in their cabs , and families feeling secure in their own homes as the dark nights creep in. It erodes people's confidence in their communities and this government's ability to protect them. Miss Butler, the latest crime survey for England and Wales, estimates that that 41.4% of people experienced or witnessed antisocial behaviour last year, up from 36.7% the year before. Behind those figures are real people who need to see real change, not simply another promise. The government, I am sure, will point to the Crime and Policing Act, much of which we supported, and to the respect orders introduced last month.

 A number of honourable and right Honourable members have made mention of this, but legislation is only the starting point. The test is whether people will notice any reduction in the chaos on in their streets. I am not confident that change that that change will be felt. We all want reassurances that the government has this problem in hand, but the reported cases of antisocial behaviour continue to rise. And with police officer numbers falling, people rightly question how the government will use the Act's new antisocial behaviour data powers to help force to help force those targets that are already stretched resources more effectively.

 Miss Butler, how will the government's effect change without the officers to enforce it? Police numbers have been in decline since this government took office. At the same time, the government has facilitated the early release of prisoners. The Conservative Party has committed to 10,000 more police officers and 200,000 additional hot spot patrols. Because we recognise that respect orders alone mean something can only mean something. If there are officers trained and ready to use them.

 Happily gave way.
12:40
12:40
None Portrait Speaker 32
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My right hon. Friend makes an excellent point. I think the police do an amazing job. They are working certainly in my constituency and as hard as they possibly can to keep communities and residents as safe as they possibly can. But as he highlights, my friend, my right hon. Friend highlights morale is is a big concern. They are far too stretched. They are dealing in dealing with very stressful situations and worry about doing the best they can. And in rural communities like my own, similar to my honourable gentleman's friend, they are covering a huge area that just compounds the stress.

 I do think we need that universality in terms of standards and support, to ensure that police officers are able to do the job we expect from them. We need new officers because without them, the behaviour we are seeing, the antisocial behaviour we are seeing will continue to escalate. One form of antisocial behaviour which which we have not really heard much about today, but it does concern many people. Is cannabis smoking? In England and Wales, drug use and dealing are among the most commonly experienced or witnessed forms of antisocial behaviour. It is often just shrugged off as being harmless.

 Yet a King's College London review of 63 studies, involving more than 265,000 people, found that cannabis users were more likely to commit violence and to fall victim to it. Users were around twice as likely to have committed a violent act. That is why the Conservative Party has called for police intervention when someone is seen smoking cannabis in public. A formal caution or immediate intermediate justice for the first offence, and then a prosecution before a magistrate for a second, public drug use cannot be tolerated.

 I will give way to my honourable friend.
12:42
12:42
None Portrait Speaker 32
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The honourable member makes an excellent point. I think it is much more prevalent. Both. I'm certainly much more aware of it when you walk down the street. But in terms of the complaints, I will come on to this later. I am increasingly getting more and more complaints from constituents who are experiencing experiencing in the home setting because they are smelling it from neighbouring properties, whether it's neighbouring flats or neighbouring houses. I want to come on to that a little bit later. Turning to Scotland, as I said, we have heard from a number of fellow Scots today about the problems that we are facing in Scotland.

 It's disappointing, I should say, that there are no SNP MPs in the chamber today to talk about the antisocial behaviour, which I am sure many of their constituents are also experiencing. Policing and prosecution is clearly devolved, but my constituents in the Scottish Borders feel the problem of antisocial behaviour to. A 2024 World Health Organization study found that 15 year old boys in Scotland had the highest rate of cannabis use among the 44 countries that were examined, and that, frankly, should shame us all. Since 2016, police in Scotland have been able to issue a recorded police warning for cannabis possession instead of reporting it to the Procurator Fiscal.

 In 2021, that was extended to all drugs, including class A. Now, the Crown insists that this is not decriminalization, but that is not how it smells to any of my constituents sitting in the living rooms or playing with their children in their gardens. Hardly a week goes by without residents contacting me about cannabis smoke filling their homes from their neighbours, families with young children, older people and those recovering from illness at home. They report it to the police and their housing associations, but they have come to expect that nothing will be done because they know that the Crown Office is unlikely to prosecute.

 Whatever the legal technicalities, for those residents, that feels like effective decriminalisation, a law not enforced is not a law at all. People are losing faith that anyone will stand up for them. With a new Lord advocate in Scotland in post since June, now is the time to review this approach so that the police and housing associations have the backing they need to act. Yet under the SNP, as we heard from the honourable member for Alloway in Grangemouth, Police Scotland has fewer officers than it had when it was created in 2013. In a rural area like mine, that means that officers are often expected to travel miles to deal with incidents.

 So will the minister join myself and the other Scottish members who have spoken in this debate, to press the Scottish Government to take a stronger approach to drug use in residential areas and to ensure that rural communities have the officers, the police officers that they need. The other point that I just wanted to touch on, and this was a point that my hon. Friend the member for Keighley and Ilkley raised, is antisocial behaviour in train and bus stations. This week, Borders Buses wrote to me about antisocial behaviour taking place in the Galashiels Transport Interchange, which is the gateway to the borders Railway.

 It gives a very useful worked example for what is happening in many bus stations and train stations across the country. Border buses operates across all of Scotland, including in Glasgow, yet face some of their worst antisocial behaviour in the Scottish Borders timetable. Leaflets have been set on fire, their customer service hub has been closed and their customer service adviser has had to be moved to another floor of the building for their own safety as the nights draw in. They are asking for a regular , visible security presence and they have warned that if things do not improve, they may have to consider withdrawing from the transport interchange altogether.

 Now, for many people in the borders who do not drive, that would be a devastating loss. This is the true cost of antisocial behaviour. It is robbing communities of the services that people depend on. Border buses staff at the interchange are crucial to local transport links. The Scottish Government's new measures to tackle antisocial behaviour on buses do not include incidents at the transport hub, the bus station. Transport at the train station itself. It is also important to recognise that this is a point that the member for Strangford made is also important to recognise that many of these incidents involve older people with mental health difficulties, who have fallen through the gaps in social care rather than young people.

 So will the Minister join me in thanking border bus, buses, drivers and their staff for their dedication and support for for great and join me in asking for stronger support and protection for those working in bus and train stations like those working in the Galashiels Transport Interchange. Miss Butler, there is no simple solution to antisocial behaviour, but without enforcement we risk it simply becoming accepted. Our constituents are not asking for much. They want to feel safe in their homes and on their streets and streets. And they want to know that when they report something, something will happen.

The government is not delivering that yet, and it is our job to make sure that they do. Thank you Minister.
12:48
None Portrait Speaker 3
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Thank you, Mr. Butler. It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship today. And can I congratulate the honourable member for Birmingham, Perry Barr, for securing this debate. I think the number of members who are here today reflects how important this issue is to all of our constituents in an ever more dangerous world, with many things for our constituents to be worrying about. Antisocial behaviour sits at the core of what makes them feel unsafe, and therefore has to be at the core of any government's response. I was the shadow policing minister when we were in opposition, and I embarked on an anti-social behaviour tour at that point to to understand why the then government called it low level, when actually it was so pernicious across so many of our neighbourhoods.

 And we committed in opposition to act. And we have done that in government. I am proud of the changes that we have introduced. Now I will have constituents, like everyone else here, who will say, we have not gone far enough, we have not seen the results. We need to go further and faster and do more. And I wholeheartedly agree. But there are some good changes that we have introduced that are starting to bear fruit. So first, the shift of our police from behind desks into our neighbourhoods is a deliberate policy that we have. We think that there should be more police on our streets.

 So as well as funding new officers to become to go into our neighbourhood roles, we are also encouraging the 12,000 officers who currently sit behind desks to think about whether they can be deployed into more front facing roles. We believe that that is the right thing to do, and we have changed the funding structures so that police chiefs can make those decisions as well. That is starting to bear fruit with nearly 4000 more police in our neighbourhoods. And the fruit of that will take time. But of course, back when Labour was last in power, in 2010, when we left government, before the coalition government came in and introduced austerity, and the cuts to our police and the public were more satisfied with policing than they have ever been in that in that 2010 period.

And I think that was in large part to do with neighbourhood policing that people saw. I will give way. Yes, Minister.
12:50
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12:54
None Portrait Speaker 3
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Can I thank her for that intervention? She will know that Lord Ken MacDonald has done a review for the Home Secretary on protest more widely, and the issue of intimidation in protest is very pertinent to the review that he's done. And we will be publishing our response to that soon. It's also the case that there are police forces where there are spots where face coverings are banned, balaclavas are banned in that area, which is also another approach that some areas are taking and that I welcome. So there are a raft of other changes that we have introduced that I won't list through the measures in the Police and Crime Act that are designed explicitly to target anti-social behaviour.

We are also going to gather more data because one of the issues with anti-social behaviour, as we know, is that we don't really quite understand, because some of it is reported to local authorities, some to the police. We don't quite understand the nature of the problem. So we are we are gathering that together. Lots of members talked about the trouble we are having across, I think, so many communities with e-bikes and e-scooters, and we have had this debate numerous times. We have changed the law so that the police can seize them without having to give notice, which is important.

 But we are looking at what else can we do with this problem, and I recognise it is a problem. I'm going to be having a series of roundtables. I'm talking to MPs about what some of those challenges are and what some of the solutions are. Some of them sit within other departments, whether it's DBT, although it's not called that anymore, and DFT, but some of it sits within the Home Office. And so we are looking at how we can have a collective approach to that challenge. Some members talked about shoplifting and persistent offenders. It is the case that about 8% of prolific offenders are responsible for about 50% of crime, and we are looking at, and will soon be able to announce some work on prolific offenders.

In particular, many members talked about the underlying problems for some of this anti-social behaviour. And when you look at prolific offenders, often there is drug addiction, there is homelessness, there are there are challenges that we need to collectively face. So we are looking at how do we target that cohort in a similar way to the support that is going into tackling our rough sleeping cohort that the Prime Minister is so keen to champion? So not just thinking about housing, but thinking about what are the other support that those people need. And we're trying to take that approach here as well.

 Prevention was mentioned by many people and I think is really important. It plays a part in our respect orders. It plays a part in our prolific offenders work. And I think the wider government work around youth work and other support, mental health support. All of these things are absolutely core. A lot of anti-social behaviour comes from people who are not perhaps getting the support that they would otherwise have had ten, 15 years ago. So we do need to look at that side of things. It's incredibly important. I think I shouldn't because actually I need to give the honourable member the opportunity to respond.

 Can I just end by saying anti-social behaviour is not low level? It is awful. I see it in my community. We are absolutely committed to tackling it. We have introduced a raft of measures. We need to go further. I want to carry on this conversation and see what else we can do, but I think all the honourable members here today know it is a top priority for our constituents, and we should act appropriately to.
12:58
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13:01
None Portrait Speaker 33
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Thank you, Miss Butler. It's a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, and I am pleased to move the motion that this House has considered National highways traffic management policies on the M5 in Somerset. I am grateful for this opportunity to raise an issue that sits at the heart of daily life for my constituents in Bridgwater and communities across Somerset. The M5 is Somerset's principal north south highway. It connects communities, supports local businesses, facilitates tourism and enables the flow of goods throughout the South West. It is indispensable. While the M5 operates smoothly, most of the time it is suffering from increased disruption.

 It is now being closed more frequently than previously, and those closures are for greater lengths of time. In the two and a half years that I have represented Bridgwater, the repeated closures of the M5 have become one of the most common issues raised with me by constituents. Somerset has unique geography which presents challenges not found in many other places. The Somerset Levels contain a network of rivers and watercourses which constrain opportunities for new strategic road infrastructure. Unlike other motorway corridors, there are few realistic alternatives. When the M5 becomes blocked, a closure that might possibly be manageable, manageable somewhere else can have profound consequences here.

 This is particularly evident between junctions 22 and junctions 24, where if the M5 is closed, north south traffic is diverted onto the A38. This goes from Highbridge in the north through Bridgwater to North Petherton in the south of my constituency. Now, the A38 was never designed to accommodate motorway volumes of traffic. What begins as an incident affecting one stretch of motorway rapidly escalates into a problem affecting entire towns and villages. Traffic backs up every minor road, causing gridlock and residents in Highbridge, Bridgwater, North Petherton and the surrounding villages know only too well what that looks like.

 Unfortunately, the evidence suggests that this is a recurring and worsening problem. Analysis of motorway performance shows that the northbound section of the M5 between junctions 23 and 24 recorded at least one hour of traffic moving below 30mph on 42 days in 2023. This rose to 45 days in 2024 and 47 days in 2025. This means that by 2025, serious congestion occurred on one day in every eight. Equally concerning is the frequency of closures themselves. Data covering the period from January 25th to August 26th records 24 full closures of the M5 between junctions 20 and 25.

 In June of this year alone, there were four such closures. A road that carries such strategic importance simply cannot sustain repeated disruption on this scale without significant economic and social consequences. I'm happy to give way.
13:05
13:05
None Portrait Speaker 33
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Well, I'm grateful to the honourable member for Strangford in making that point, and I will come on to taking a more nuanced approach across the network later in my speech. Delays and diversions affect workers attempting to reach their employment, parents collecting children, businesses dependent on deliveries, patients travelling to urgent medical appointments and emergency services attempting to move across the county. Miss Butler, I want to share a letter I received from my constituent, Miss Halliday, who has given me permission to share her own personal and distressing experience with these delays, she writes. The last time the motorway was shut, I was stuck for three hours in the car.

 This may sound trivial, but I am disabled and have health issues including having to be close by toilets. I also have a disabled son who is non-verbal, autistic and who cannot comprehend why we are stuck in the car for long periods and a few times he has wet himself. My daughter has also had countless late nights at college over the last year or so, which is very stressful. Altogether, this has had a major effect on my stress levels and mental health over the last two years. As I write this email once again, the M5 is shut, causing horrendous traffic in town.

 My son rides the special education bus from school, and the driver has just phoned me to say she has no idea when she will make it to school to collect my son. He is now stuck in school for the time being, as it would be pointless to go and collect him as I would be stuck in the same traffic and wouldn't make it any sooner. Update my son returned home over two hours late tonight. It is because of receiving emails such as these that I have asked for this debate. I ask the minister is he confident the national highways are doing everything possible to minimise disruption on the M5?

 Our scheduled closures being planned in the best way, our policies in place to minimise the number of accidents. Has the government given consideration to variable speed limits, such as exist on the M5 around Bristol? Many of my constituents have commented on the poor driving skills of some motorway users. Has the Minister any plans to monitor and improve the situation? And when an accident does occur, we need to consider the harm caused to those communities affected by motorway closures. Over recent years, central reservations on many motorways have been replaced with continuous concrete safety barriers. Those barriers have important safety benefits and am not advocating reversing that decision.

 However, those same barriers have reduced the flexibility available to operators when responding to major incidents. Traditional contraflow arrangements are often more difficult to implement than they once were, so I asked the minister if he will consider whether a more locally tailored approach is required for Somerset. One option that my constituents have asked to be considered is the installation of strategically located crossover points within central reservations, with gates that could be opened by the emergency services as routine maintenance and upgrade programmes are undertaken. These crossing points would allow control contraflow operations during major incidents, enabling traffic to bypass closures and remain on the strategic road network rather than being diverted onto local roads.

 Miss Butler, I'm not pretending that such a proposal would eliminate the effects of serious incidents, nor it would remove the need to prioritise personal safety. But it would provide highway authorities and emergency services with an additional operating tool, helping maintain traffic flow while reducing the pressure placed on communities such as Bridgwater and North Petherton. More broadly, I urge the government to examine whether current traffic management policies adequately reflect local circumstances. I want to underline that neither I nor my constituents underestimate the challenges faced by the emergency services, national highways or those responsible for managing serious incidents.

 Public safety must always come first. Where collisions occur, where lives are at risk, or where vulnerable individuals require assistance, every appropriate resource should be deployed. Those who work to ensure the safety of all who use our infrastructure should be commended for their work. But recognizing those realities does not prevent us from asking whether the current system is striking. The right balance between the safety and the interests of communities that depend upon the motorway. When the effects of motorway closure are so keenly felt by the community at large, there needs to be a more proportionate approach to managing people in crisis.

 Emergency services should balance their duty to those in crisis, to those who suffer when the motorway is closed and their primary duty should be to reopen the motorway as soon as possible. To facilitate this, a wider review of guidance and protocol as to how the emergency service conduct intervention is necessary. Miss Butler. My constituents are suffering from gridlock caused by the increasing number of closures of the M5. I asked the minister, on behalf of my constituents to look carefully at the problems we face in Somerset. Please, Minister, work with National Highways and the emergency services to minimise motorway closures and the harm that causes to our community.

 Thank you.
13:12
13:12
None Portrait Speaker 24
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Thank you, Mr. Butler. It's a pleasure to see you in the chair this afternoon. And can I start by congratulating the honourable member for securing this debate on this topic, which has very clearly explained, as a matter of particular interest to his constituents. And actually, of course, this is a concern across the country because we all hate it when our journeys on the motorway network are disrupted for whatever reason that might be. For most users, this is nothing worse than unexpected motorway closure or long delays resulting from roadworks. In my own constituency, I can leave my house and within 30s I can tell whether the motorway has been closed or there's an accident on there just by the volume of traffic on our local network, because whether it's an accident or roadworks, it causes frustration and inconvenience, whether it's strict restrictions that need to be in place for safety reasons or road closures that mean lengthy diversions.

 Any other unplanned incidents can also cause major delays and disruptions on the network. Therefore, have every sympathy for those who are regular users of the M5 in Somerset and indeed those in the surrounding area who have been inconvenienced by a series of planned roadworks in their part of the country, as well as, of course, the serious incidents that the honourable member referred to. And he referred, I think, to his constituent, Miss Halliday, and I think really brought out the human consequences of of those delays. And I have sympathy with her and everyone else who has been affected.

 But as the honourable member said, there is, of course, a trade off here as our motorway network is beginning to show signs of age as we all are, it does need to show that there is more work that that is required to make sure that it remains in a good and importantly, a safe condition. That is why the Road Investment Strategy, published in March of this year, included an unprecedented £8.4 billion of investment in renewing many of the assets on our motorways and trunk roads over the next five years. Of course, these assets include many bridges and tunnels, some of which are approaching the end of their design life.

 But it also includes a lot of features like drainage systems and safety barriers, which the honourable member referred to, which play an important role in keeping the network as safe as possible. Our investment also sees a huge amount of resurfacing of the network to give a smoother and safer journeys, including by replacing large stretches of concrete road surfaces. So we would say there's no denying that this work needs to be done to ensure that we have that network, which is fit for the future. But the challenge, of course, is the honourable member is an articulated is to do it in a way which causes the least disruption for road users.

And he asked whether we are doing everything we can to ensure that disruption to his constituents and indeed to all road users is minimised and he will be interested to know. We have set national highways targets in the road investment strategy to reduce delays on the network, including from roadworks, and to produce an action plan setting out the steps it will take to deliver improvements. The key target we have set is for National Highways to demonstrate that it has done all it reasonably can to reduce delays on the strategic road network, which I think is essentially what we all would hope that National Highways were doing.

 And we would hope that the average delay performance is no worse at the end of that five year period than it is at the start. And although that might not seem particularly ambitious, when you look in the context of the additional amount of resurfacing and renewal projects that are being delivered over the next five years, it is actually of itself quite a stretching target. We've also set a target to ensure that 97.5% of the network is free from traffic restrictions owing to roadworks, and that at least 88% of motorway incidents are cleared within one hour.

 We have also instructed National Highways to publish a customer and delay action plan, and to deliver the actions that are set out in it, as well as to report on progress annually. We are expecting this to be published before the end of March next year. The Office of Rail and Road, as the regulator, will hold National Highways to account for its performance in meeting these targets. But returning to the honourable member's constituency, as he knows, there has been a programme of work underway for some time to upgrade the drainage systems and replace the safety barriers in the central reservations between junctions 20 and 20, 22 and 24 of the M5.

 He's mentioned the question of more flexibility on the barriers, but that's that's a that's a matter I'll take away and write to him , if that's okay. I understand the point he's making, but there are obviously other safety considerations that we have to take into account, but I will endeavour to get him a proper response on that. National highways has attempted to reduce disruption caused by this particular programme of work at the moment by, for example, using overnight closures and lane restrictions rather than full day motorway closures, which, as the honourable member has explained, would cause huge disruption to his constituents.

 There is a need for proper engagement with local stakeholders when roadworks are going to lead to delays and diversions and, and this is a topic that my ministerial colleagues and I have raised regularly with national highways . In recent months, National highways has learned lessons from its handling of the major Lune Gorge renewal scheme in Cumbria, where some local stakeholders felt that not enough was done to involve them in discussions about the likely impacts on them and about options to mitigate those impacts. So I am determined to ensure that when National Highways undertakes major renewal programmes of this sort in future, it does work with local stakeholders and agrees a plan of action.

 It must do all it can to ensure that most affected have a clear understanding of when closures or restrictions will be in place. And obviously we cannot remove disruption and delay entirely, but we want to all be clear and confident that national highways have done absolutely everything they can to minimise that. But in respect of the M5, understand that national highways do have regular dialogue with those likely to be affected by the planned roadworks, and I know the honourable member has himself met with National Highways. They've also discussed with Somerset County Council how best to ensure that diversions, including on the A38, are carefully planned on and well signposted.

 There is also going to be some works in the not too distant future on junction 22 A, where this new Gigafactory will be put in place, and we will obviously be acutely aware that that will be a quite a disruption in introducing a new junction to the road network at junction 22 A, and work has not started yet on the new access road, but I will ask National Highways to ensure that any further disruption to users on the M5 is minimised. I am sure the member will be welcoming this investment in constituency and the long term benefits that will arise from that new junction.

 Decisions on when to close and reopen motorways following incidents such as those of attempts to take one's own life, which I understand have been some of the incidents that have affected the M5 are matters for the emergency services to determine when to safely reopen. It's usually the police that can be occasionally the fire and rescue services. But I know the honourable member has asked about whether there is anything that can be done in terms of protocol for those decisions. Clearly that's outside this department's remit, but I commit to him, to writing to the Home Office to ask ask them to talk to the relevant services about whether there is anything different they can do in respect of that, it is important to say that when someone has been killed or seriously injured, and when the police have responded to someone in crisis, it is really important that they take the lead about when decisions are taken about opening the network again.

 National highways, as the honourable member would expect, do work closely with the police when these incidents arise and they identify any damage to assets and ensure that the trained personnel, equipment and materials are available to undertake repairs as soon as the scene is released, and as the honourable member would expect, National Highways meets regularly with the senior roads policing officers from Avon and Somerset Police to review incidents and to adjust their operational approach. And I understand there are some more meetings planned between the police and national highways to look at whether there is more that can be done to reduce the impact of closures.

 But to conclude, I am grateful to the honourable member for securing this debate. I agree that roadworks and other activities and incidents on our motorways and trunk roads need to be managed in a way that causes as little disruption as possible to road users. I encourage the honourable member to continue to engage with national highways on the local impacts of the closures. The M5 in Somerset and officials from National Highways will have heard his comments today and I will reflect on what he said this afternoon, endeavoured to combat him on some of the points that he's raised today.

 Thank you.
13:21
This debate has concluded
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