Children and Social Work Bill [HL]
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park(7 years, 10 months ago)
Grand CommitteeRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Ramsbotham
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that comprehensive response and to the noble Baroness, Lady Bakewell, for her comments. I also support the comments of the noble Baroness, Lady Hughes of Stretford, which came from a different angle, as it were, from the rest of the group, but nevertheless were very meaningful. As I said in respect of Amendment 30, the importance of having speech, language and communication needs assessed and treated is that unless they are, the children who are the subject of this Bill will not be able to understand or engage in any of the changes the Bill proposes. As I said in that debate, when we in the all-party group conducted our review of the link between speech, language and communication needs and social disadvantage, we discovered tremendous inconsistency all over the country, both in the understanding of what was needed and in the training of the people who were responsible for doing the assessing. We discovered, for example, that in Northern Ireland, the social services and the health visitors worked together very closely, but in other places the two were not connected. As I mentioned, we discovered in Walsall that continuous training was done throughout the secondary school stage, but that was rare elsewhere in the United Kingdom. In talking about children previously in care, we are talking about the needs of people who have slipped through the net much earlier.
Therefore, I am very concerned that the Minister should suggest that these amendments are not necessary; I think they are. She mentioned the Communication Trust, which is a considerable partner in the all-party group that I have with worked very closely. There would be considerable merit in the Communication Trust, the Royal College of Speech and Language Therapists and the ministerial Bill team having a discussion before we come to Report, so that hopefully, the Government can decide that they can include such a provision in the Bill, rather than our proposing amendments such as this. Such a provision is very important to the Government’s achieving their aim. I know from talking to both organisations that they would be very happy to do that, and I suspect that a number of noble Lords would like to be involved in that discussion.
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
Before the noble Lord sits down, yes, we would be very happy to have an early discussion.
Children and Social Work Bill [HL]
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park(7 years, 10 months ago)
Grand CommitteeRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Lord Ramsbotham
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that reply, as I am to all those who have taken part in the debate on this group. I must admit that I am always nervous when I hear the phrase “comprehensive legislation is in place” because it reminds me that we are serving under what has been called the “management complex”. It may be all very well for people in Whitehall to lay things down and think that it is comprehensive, but a word that came up over and over again at Second Reading, as it is doing during Committee, is “consistency”. It is not a matter of laying stuff down; it is a matter of seeing that it is delivered consistently everywhere.
What worries me about much of this—about Section 22 and SEN and so on—is that it is all very well as seen from here but it will not be good enough unless it is reflected on the ground. I have taken note of what the Minister has said and I will come back on Report with some examples of inconsistency—that is, where it is not happening on the ground. It is very important that officials realise that rather than merely issue the instructions.
I am very pleased that the noble Lord, Lord Farmer, mentioned relationships. In young offender institutions where speech, language and communication therapists were introduced, the first thing that was noticed was an improvement in relationships. With that improvement, the whole atmosphere and the way that things were conducted in the institution improved. Somebody described it by saying that they were communicating with each other using the mouth rather than the fist. That was a pretty good basic description.
Had my noble friend Lord Northbourne been here, he would yet again express the concern he expressed to me that we hear an awful lot about corporate parenting but there is nothing about parenting skills themselves in this Bill. Those are hugely important, and at the basis of all the social work we are talking about. I am surprised that there is no mention of that in the Bill. I very much hope that may be rectified in government amendments that will install in the Bill some of the things the Government have assured us are in place. In the meantime, I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.
Children and Social Work Bill [HL]
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park(7 years, 10 months ago)
Grand CommitteeRead Full debate Read Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con)
I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, and the noble and learned Baroness, Lady Butler-Sloss, for these amendments —Amendment 9 regarding the unnecessary criminalisation of looked-after children and Amendments 14 and 28 concerning access to legal advice and representation for looked-after children. The first of the noble Lord’s amendments seeks to make it a requirement, linked to the principles, for local authorities and their relevant partners to prevent the unnecessary criminalisation of looked-after children. I understand why the amendment has been proposed and strongly agree that we must avoid children in care being unnecessarily criminalised. Local authorities should adopt a restorative approach wherever possible so that police intervention is viewed not as a first but a last resort. As noble Lords have said, children’s life chances can be badly affected by unnecessary involvement with the criminal justice system.
Existing guidance requires local authorities to have clear strategies in place to help protect and divert children from the justice system. As the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, said, in some areas the police, local authorities and children’s homes have worked very well together to ensure that restorative approaches are used wherever possible.
The framework of corporate parenting principles in the Bill already makes clear what it means for a local authority as a whole to act as a good parent. Good parents will not hesitate to safeguard their children from the risks of offending or involve the police unnecessarily. However, it is an important issue and we intend to cover it in the new statutory guidance that will underpin the principles. For instance, the guidance will stress the importance of co-operation and joint working between local authorities, the police, children’s homes and foster carers, and it will emphasise the importance of keeping a sense of proportion in relation to challenging behaviour.
The noble Lords, Lord Ramsbotham and Lord Warner, rightly raised a number of the very important issues highlighted by the Laming report. They will also be aware that Sir Martin Narey is currently carrying out a review of residential care which also looks at this issue in detail. In addition we have Charlie Taylor’s review of youth justice. All three of these reports and their findings will help and support us in developing guidance in this area and will give us a clear picture of other actions that we may need to take.
The noble Lord and the noble Baroness also proposed inserting a new corporate parenting principle to promote access to legal advice and representation for looked-after children. I agree that it is vital that we hear the voice of the child being cared for rather than simply treating them as part of an administrative process. Under the existing arrangements there are a number of adults who children in care can talk with and turn to. They include court-appointed guardians, their social worker and a named independent reviewing officer who will follow their case long term and can also advise the court.
Under the existing requirements, local authorities are required to make looked-after children aware of potential advocacy support to make representations or complaints, most significantly the advocacy services clause set out in Section 26A of the Children Act 1989, from which various pieces of guidance flow. An additional legislative clause is unlikely to impact further on either children’s or local authorities’ awareness. The associated statutory guidance will make clear that local authorities should consider how they can best listen to and hear from looked-after children and care leavers.
A number of noble Lords raised a range of issues relating to unaccompanied asylum-seeking children. The majority of these children will continue to receive support under the Children Act 1989 if they have a legal right to remain. Once that right is exhausted, they then get accommodation, subsistence and other social care support under the Immigration Act until they leave the UK. The Department for Education has been working closely with the Home Office to ensure that children receive appropriate support. However, in the light of the detailed points raised by noble Lords raised today, I would be very happy to arrange a further meeting to find out what has been happening. Given the depth of our discussions today, that would be better than me attempting to respond, not very well, to their points today.
I hope that on that basis the noble Lord will be happy to withdraw his amendment.
Lord Ramsbotham
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister, particularly for her closing remark because many noble Lords would welcome such a meeting. Although there has been mention of liaison between the Department for Education and the Home Office, it does not appear so in the legislation before us.
Once again I am very grateful to noble Lords who have spoken. As the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mackay, was speaking, I was reminded of an inquiry I conducted into the unlawful killing of Jimmy Mubenga, an Angolan asylum seeker who died on an aircraft. One of the witnesses who came before us was the Immigration Services Commissioner. She told us that one of her problems was trying to get some form of control over the people who were allegedly advising asylum seekers on their legal rights. She was looking for a job, as it were. She is an official; she is there. It seems to me that if anyone is going to get a grip on this, she will do so as someone already in the system with a responsibility to the asylum seekers who might be involved.
I absolutely agree that something needs to be done to co-ordinate all these activities. How the prevention is going to be done is probably by picking up good practice from somewhere and applying it to other places. I mentioned the work that has been done in Surrey, but it is not alone. As the noble Lord, Lord Warner, knows, there are many good things going on in various parts of the country that could be adapted with advantage. However, I have another concern over the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974. An extremely good report on this was produced by the Standing Committee for Youth Justice, which recommended that offenders should have their offending looked at at the age of 18 and that anything other than the most serious offence should be expunged so that they start with a clean slate. I have put forward a Private Member’s Bill and I hope to include that as priority number one.
I return to something the Minister said which gives me slight heebie-jeebies, which is that yet more statutory guidance is needed. I mentioned at Second Reading that there was concern over the number of Henry VIII clauses already in this Bill; we want to be very careful about adding yet more, not least in view of the remarks made previously by my noble and learned friend Lord Judge in the House. I hope that what comes out in the discussions that we will have between now and Report can lead to further consideration of these two very important issues and I look forward to taking part in them. In the meantime, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.
Northern Powerhouse: Early Years Attainment
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
The answer is extremely complex, but the most important thing is to ensure that all young people across the country are supported, and that is why we are focusing resources on the most disadvantaged through various programmes. There is a multitude of factors, such as deprivation and low academic achievement, meaning that families may not have been able to achieve over a number of years. That is why we are focused on helping vulnerable families and vulnerable children through a range of programmes and resources, targeting the finances where they are most needed.
Lord Ramsbotham (CB)
My Lords, when the assessment mentioned by the noble Baroness, Lady Massey, gives so much information about the development of a child at the age of five, why is the Welfare Reform and Work Bill delaying any such assessment until key stage 4?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
As I said, we will continue to ensure that we look at the development of young children from an early age. We are working with local authorities and charitable organisations on the ground to make sure that we provide the best resources that we can to vulnerable families. There are a number of very good projects going on in the north: a project in Durham is bringing agencies together to focus on children’s well-being; Wigan is one of eight local authorities piloting an integrated education and health review for two year-olds; and, through the vulnerable families programme, we are bringing local services together. So we are learning from practice on the ground to try to ensure that we target resources on the families who need them the most.
Schools: Exclusions
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
As I mentioned, one of the main initiatives is the troubled families programme. It originally helped 116,000 families, but it will be expanded over the course of this Parliament to help up to 400,000 families. Its aim is to bring together local authorities, police, housing, employment advisers, schools, health and children’s social services to deliver integrated, whole-family support. That is what needs to happen to make sure that families do not go through a continuing cycle of deprivation.
Lord Ramsbotham (CB)
My Lords, can the Minister tell the House what has happened to the zero exclusion project, which was introduced by the previous Secretary of State?
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I am afraid I will have to write to the noble Lord.
Prisoners: Imprisonment for Public Protection Sentences
Debate between Lord Ramsbotham and Baroness Evans of Bowes Park(8 years, 6 months ago)
Lords ChamberRead Full debate Read Hansard Text
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
I thank the noble and learned Lord for that comment. He is absolutely right—the Parole Board can ensure that these prisoners are released only when it determines that the risk has been reduced and they can be safely managed in the community. These are extremely complex cases, and we have to be mindful of ensuring that prisoners feel they are progressing, but, equally, that the public are kept safe.
Lord Ramsbotham (CB)
My Lords, can the Minister tell the House how recent the risk assessments are to which she referred? In my experience, some are very old and the prisoners have changed in the time since that assessment was made.
Baroness Evans of Bowes Park
The detailed analysis of the prisoners who fail to progress to open conditions post four or five tariff reviews happened very recently. That analysis has just finished, and the central team that undertook it is now passing on recommended actions and plans to the staff working with those prisoners. Progress will be kept under review. The next stage of the central team’s work is to review the larger group of IPPs who have had three negative post-tariff parole reviews. So this is ongoing work.