Civil Service Pensions

Ben Lake Excerpts

Monday 6th July 2026 Commons Chamber

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am grateful to all the public servants in my hon. Friend’s constituency and indeed across the country, who frankly deserve better. On past retirement quotations and past retirement dates, and on the actionable bereavement cases, as I indicated a moment ago, Capita’s working assumption is that they will be cleared during the rest of this month and next month. Collectively we must hold them to account for that.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

One of my constituents submitted a request for their pension just over a year before their proposed retirement date, but is still waiting—sadly, it is little wonder that the June date has been missed. My constituents will thank the Minister for explaining the significant resource that the Government have allocated to eradicating this backlog, but, in advance of the August deadline, what additional resource in terms of staffing or funding is Capita allocating to the task?

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

The hon. Gentleman makes a very good point. I stand ready to continue with the surge resource; I have very frequent updates on that, and I give consideration to what additional resource might be required from me. However, he is absolutely right that we must not neglect the resource or prioritisation that Capita itself is giving to this. It is hugely important that it sticks to its word.

MPs’ Second Jobs: Prohibition

Ben Lake Excerpts

Wednesday 1st July 2026 Westminster Hall

[Richard Burgon]

I thank my hon. Friend for her important point. The details of the Bill could be debated and amended in the House and at Committee stage, if it were taken forward, as I invite the next Prime Minister to do. I was trying to make the point that, if someone needs to do a handful of hours per year to remain on a professional register, I would have no objection. Perhaps the Bill can be enhanced and improved, including by my hon. Friend, if it progresses further. Beyond the limited exceptions that I have outlined, the practice of second jobs should end.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

I thank the hon. Member for securing this debate and for the way that he has outlined the issue at hand. I also commend him on the Bill that he brought forward. Does he agree that in the interim, as the Bill progressed through Parliament, there other steps that we could be take, such as changing Standing Orders and the code of conduct, and particularly in political parties? My own party has prohibited MPs from taking any other occupation.

[Richard Burgon]

The hon. Member has come forward with a very good idea. Of course, a party could change its own rules and expectations in that regard, but to fully clean up politics, I think that this should be passed by Parliament. This issue is going through the Modernisation Committee at the moment, and the discussions taking place there are very important.

Some will say that my restrictions are too tough. They are tough, but trust in politics has been damaged over many years, and rebuilding that trust requires bold action. That is what the public want. Parliament must show that it understands that the rot runs deep and cannot be tackled with half measures. There should be no more reviews or excuses; action is needed. I hope that the next Prime Minister will help to clean up politics and defend our democracy, starting by ending the ludicrous gravy train of MPs’ second jobs, which quite rightly turns the public’s stomachs.

Infected Blood Compensation Scheme

Ben Lake Excerpts

Thursday 18th June 2026 Commons Chamber

[Pete Wishart (Perth and Kinross-shire) (SNP)]

I whole- heartedly congratulate the hon. Member for Eltham and Chislehurst (Clive Efford) on the customarily forthright and direct way in which he opened the debate. I agree with all the points he made; he would expect that of me, as his loyal deputy on the all-party parliamentary group. It is great that we have heard so many solid and significant contributions today.

Once we are a couple of hours into a debate, we start to get a feeling for how it is going, the emerging themes and the sense of direction. We all acknowledge and appreciate the huge progress that has been made. When I started out on this campaign more than 20 years ago, I would never have believed that we could get to this point, at which payments are being made to those impacted and those affected.

The Minister is starting to hear that the same issues are emerging. Constituents are experiencing the same complications and difficulties, and the same representations are being made. I will not touch on those, because so many have been raised, but I might just reinforce some of the points made. The Minister is beginning to hear a chorus of things that need to be addressed—and addressed they must be. We are on the cusp of having something of which we can be proud—of this House having addressed one of the biggest scandals that we have ever experienced in parliamentary life. We took control of it; we handled it; we got a report and an inquiry; and we got billions of pounds of compensation. We have the opportunity to pay that compensation right now, and I hope that the Government grab it.

I pay tribute to IBCA for the work that it has done. It is amazing that we have put together the infrastructure and a support scheme as quickly as we have. IBCA has done remarkable work in such a short time. It is starting to deliver, and I think we are all immensely pleased and proud that this House has collectively been able to construct it, and to make sure that it is functional and works. I have visited IBCA on a couple of occasions, and I have met the staff and discussed many of these issues with them. I recognise their sheer dedication to the work that they are pursuing, in the best interests of everybody whom they serve; and their commitment, as an arm’s length body.

It is amazing that we have got here, but it was not always like this. I remember what happened back in the early 2000s. I am looking at the chair of the APPG, my friend the hon. Member for Eltham and Chislehurst, and he will remember this, too. We were fobbed off, disregarded and lied to when we took up the cases of our constituents. They presented to us at our various surgeries with these unexplained difficulties and complications. They would say, “How did I get HIV?”, or “I’ve got hepatitis. I do not know how on earth this happened.” We would write to successive Ministers in the Department of Health, making representations, and asking for assistance or acknowledgement, only to be told that they were not interested, and that there was nothing to see here. They would say, “Move along. We are not prepared to take this up. Believe me, we are doing everything in our power, and there’s really nothing to acknowledge.” For years, we were fobbed off and disregarded, and for years, we fought on.

Over the years, I have got to know the campaigners. They came together with a common purpose, determined to get to the heart of the issue and to support each other. We call them the community, and we could not find a better community than the campaigners who have led this, been at the forefront, and refused to accept “No”. They are people with different lives from different backgrounds, but they all carry the burden of what happened to them. All of them are still here, fighting the good fight, determined to get justice for the whole community, and that whole community is the key thing today.

I was the APPG chair for all those years, and the community has some of the finest people I have ever encountered. I have seen lots of campaigns in this House, and I have seen how people approach these issues, how they take them forward, how they engage and how they access their Members of Parliament to make sure that things are done. It is the most fantastic campaign we have ever had. Unfortunately, I could not make the ceremony at St Paul’s, as I was recovering from an illness, but I know from friends, colleagues and campaigners who were there the importance to them of that ceremony, where they were recognised as a community for their work.

There have been high points, and we should acknowledge that. Few of us would have expected Theresa May to have made the announcement back in 2017 that there was to be a full inquiry. A lot of us were surprised that she chose Sir Brian Langstaff to lead it, and lead it he did. Like many people in this debate, I listened to lots of the evidence in the inquiry sessions, and I cheered along with the community when the report was produced. I was in this House when the report was launched, and the Government took full responsibility and said that there would be a full repayment scheme and that people would get what they should. Those were great days, met with real enthusiasm and euphoria by those who have campaigned.

There have been good days, but we have to address the biggest issue. It has been mentioned on several occasions, so I will not labour the point, but people have been waiting decades. Even at this point, the majority of these people are still waiting just to start their claim. That is not to receive compensation—we might think that we would be at that stage now—but just to get into the system. Even at this stage, only a relatively small number have been paid. People have mentioned that these are real people—people who are unwell and who know that time is not on their side. I do not know which Member mentioned it, but people are dying weekly because they are not having their situation attended to and their payments made.

Families still have no clarity about when their case will move forward. That is made worse by what is being asked of them. I have been surprised—I have listened carefully to colleagues who have raised this—that we see people being asked for evidence that in many cases simply does not exist. They have been asked for records from decades ago, such as proof of cohabitation between parents and children in the 1980s. Those things were probably never properly recorded in the first place, and if they had been, it may have been lost over time. That means that so many people are being delayed or sometimes shut out completely because they cannot meet requirements that are not realistic. In some cases, people run into a purely arbitrary administrative date, rather than when harm was actually suffered. Members have mentioned the bereaved families in whose cases support can stop at the point of death rather than reflecting the full impact of what has been lost.

Another theme that has developed—I think it was the right hon. Member for New Forest East (Sir Julian Lewis) who raised this in particular—is the growing concern about those with hepatitis C who were treated with interferon. That has to be addressed. Of all the issues that have started to emerge, that is the one that the community in general wants us to press as strongly and as directly as we can with the Minister. I hope that we get some satisfaction.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

I am grateful that my hon. Friend has reiterated that point, and I will do likewise. Many of my constituents who have been affected and infected by this scandal have asked me to emphasise the point that even the updated scheme does not properly recognise the long-term consequences of interferon treatment.

[Pete Wishart]

Interferon was introduced as almost like a chemotherapy drug back in the day, and some of its impacts and consequences have been similar to the side effects and impacts of chemotherapy. Physically and mentally, the effects are often severe and long-lasting. When the Minister is on his feet, perhaps he can explain a little more about what he intends to do with this group and this community. The Government have introduced a new level 2B to recognise some of these harms, and my understanding is that it provides a temporary uplift, but it seems to apply only in certain circumstances. What it does not seem to do—I have read about it carefully—is reflect the long-term reality for many. The argument appears to be that the higher category covers just about everything else when it comes to interferon treatment for hepatitis C, and that levels 3 and 4 already take interferon into account. My colleagues in Haemophilia Scotland asked for the evidence showing how that was factored in, and none was provided, so can the Minister tell us a more about that evidence in relation to levels 3 and 4?

A similar set of concerns relate to unethical research, as we have heard. The Government have expanded eligibility and increased awards. That is welcome in principle, because it means that people are recognised without having to jump over additional evidential hurdles, but there is still a lack of clarity as to whether the level of award properly reflects what actually happened to people. The issue seems to be the arbitrary 1985 cut-off date. Perhaps the Minister can provide clarity. Officials say that there is no evidence of unethical research beyond that point, but the inquiry itself referred to evidence beyond that date, and even up to the 1990s, of children being recruited without proper information or consent. Why did the Government arrive at 1985 as a cut-off date for eligibility for unethical research awards, given that there is evidence that unethical trials and research continued well into the 1990s?

There are also ongoing concerns about estate claims, because the structure of the payments could disadvantage those who died earlier, and about unpaid care over the years. That, again, has been reflected by several hon. Members.

A few people referred to some of the different schemes around the devolved nations. I am particularly proud of what we did in the Scottish Parliament, and the Minister will be aware of the bespoke schemes across the whole United Kingdom, not just in Scotland. The one that particularly worked in Scotland—I want the Minister’s response regarding what has happened to it—is the special category mechanism known as the severely affected category. This was open to people who had significant problems and issues; they could apply, and were given an increased payout and support. That has since been subsumed under the general supplementary scheme; that scheme is welcome, but this is disadvantageous compared with the superior scheme in Scotland. Those who were initially on that superior scheme have been kept on it, but those who wished to apply for it have to go through bigger hoops and hurdles to get there. We need to know that scheme will still be available and that it will be easier for people to apply to it, because we were particularly pleased about the way it operated in Scotland.

Let me turn finally to accountability. Throughout the decades, the Government repeatedly dismissed those asking questions and trying to achieve justice. The final report acknowledged that the infected and the affected were fed lies and lines, and that serious concerns were dismissed outright. We have to address this. We cannot leave it. We have to look at how we get round some of the things that were encountered. I remember the letters I got from various Government Ministers: “The Government do not accept that any wrongful practices were employed and do not consider that a public inquiry is justified.” I got that for years, every time I raised these issues on behalf of a constituent.

I listened carefully to the infected blood inquiry. The evidence I found most compelling was from a certain Andy Burnham, who was Health Minister at one point during that period—I believe he is in the news today for some other reason, not particularly related to this. I remember Andy Burnham candidly telling the inquiry that he now knew that the lines he had been given by senior officials in the civil service were wrong, and that he had sent lies to me and other Members who raised these issues in Parliament. That is what he said, in effect, in evidence to the inquiry. That is simply unacceptable.

The current Ministers are probably much better than their predecessors, and will look carefully at what comes across their desks, but this must not be allowed to happen again. That is why we need a statutory duty of candour on all public officials, including civil servants and senior civil servants. More than that, we need an independent compensation body to oversee all Government compensation schemes. Such a body would retain expertise and experience, would save time and money when schemes are set up, and would be capable of ramping up and down according to need. The Hillsborough law must be enacted without delay, introducing a duty of candour for everybody involved in public life. A national oversight mechanism should be established to monitor and scrutinise the implementation of recommendations from all public inquiries and hold the Government to account.

After all this, it is hard to believe that the first meeting I had about the issue was back in about 2004, with a lovely lady from Blairgowrie, in my old constituency. She came to see me in what could only be described as a hell of a state; she could not account for why she had HIV following a blood transfusion after a medical emergency. It was because of her that I started to get involved in all this, tried to find answers and tried to ensure that campaigners got justice. The name of that lady was Tricia Titheridge. After contracting HIV, she died in 2013, without seeing the huge progress that we have made. It is because of people like Tricia that we are all still here—still fighting to ensure that everybody is included and that there is a scheme that works for all our constituents. Looking at the Minister and knowing the qualities that he will bring to this job, I am pretty certain that he is going to be the man who delivers this for everybody, meets our concerns and looks at the difficulties we have presented today.

Infected Blood Compensation Scheme

Ben Lake Excerpts

Tuesday 14th April 2026 Commons Chamber

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I join the hon. Gentleman in paying tribute to Clive Smith for his excellent and continuing work on memorialisation in particular, for which I am very grateful.

The hon. Gentleman rightly raises the heinous activities that happened at Treloar’s school, which was a place that parents sent their children—vulnerable children—for protection, and then had this truly chilling medical experimentation that happened. We will ensure that things move as quickly as possible, but I also say to the hon. Gentleman that we must ensure that we learn the lessons of what happened there to ensure that something like that never happens again.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

I join others in paying tribute to the Minister for his work on this matter and on the Government’s response to Sir Brian Langstaff’s recommendations. I also thank him for his intention to ensure that the administrative burden placed on those infected and affected is limited as much as possible. With that in mind, can I ask him for clarification on the level 2B severity category and the increase for those who were infected when they were younger than 18? Will those new mechanisms be adjusted automatically for existing claims, or will claimants need to apply or work in another way to get those mechanisms applied to their cases?

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his remarks and for his support and that of his party, which has been helpful throughout this process. On existing claims where there has been a change, the objective is to make the process as easy as possible, because I do not want to go back to the situation where people are being asked repeatedly to produce different pieces of evidence. Where there is an impact on an existing claim, the intention is absolutely to make it as easy as it can be.

Middle East

Ben Lake Excerpts

Monday 13th April 2026 Commons Chamber

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

The Prime Minister was right to mention the untold economic damage that this crisis has already wrought on households and businesses across the country owing to increased fuel costs, but does he share my fear and that of the agricultural sector that the prolonged closure of the strait of Hormuz may also feed through to higher food inflation? May I ask him what measures the Government are considering to help mitigate the potential consequences of a prolonged closure of the strait?

[The Prime Minister]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for drawing attention to that issue. There will be consequential impacts beyond the immediate impact on energy, which is why we are monitoring and keeping under review the steps that we can take. However, I return to my opening point: the absolute focus must be on getting the strait reopened as quickly as possible, because all the time it is closed to free navigation the damage being done is being compounded, which is why it is so important that we work with our allies to that end.

Russian Influence on UK Politics and Democracy

Ben Lake Excerpts

Monday 9th February 2026 Westminster Hall

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairship, Mr Pritchard. I begin by congratulating the hon. Member for South Norfolk (Ben Goldsborough) on so eloquently detailing the importance and urgency of this matter. I also congratulate the petitioners on organising such an important petition. I speak as the Member of Parliament for Ceredigion Preseli, the constituency that—half an hour ago, at least—had secured the highest number of signatories.

As the hon. Member outlined, Wales is one of the areas that has secured the highest concentration of signatories across the entirety of the UK. It will come as no surprise to anybody who listened to his excellent speech that the reason for that interest and level of concern in Wales is the antics and treachery of the former leader of Reform UK in Wales, Mr Nathan Gill. As has been mentioned, he has been jailed for 10 and a half years for accepting Russian bribes to the tune of some £40,000 for making pro-Russian statements in the European Parliament and to the media. As I think everybody will agree, the man has committed treachery for £40,000, so we must ask serious questions about his integrity and that of his party, whose members I notice are absent from today’s debate.

I want to make two broad points. The first is to explain why it is so important that we waste no time in implementing measures in response to the findings of the review that the Government have rightly called for and initiated. I understand the review will report its findings in March. I plead with the Government Minister to ensure that the findings are acted on as soon as possible, so as to preserve the integrity of our democracy. Sadly, it might not be possible to bring about any legislative changes in time for the elections in Wales and other parts of the UK in May this year. Nevertheless, it is important that we do not waste any time so that further elections are not influenced in any way by the scourge of Russian interference.

I also ask the Minister that, as part of the review’s considerations, we look at the egregious loopholes in our current laws that the Russian state was able to exploit by funnelling money through to political actors and traitors in the UK for their own ends. I would like his reassurance that one particular device and mechanism being examined is the creation of Welsh limited partnerships. It is a subject that a whole host of investigative journalists have written about in some detail, and which I would very much like to hear the Government state that they are looking at. Such devices are created in Moscow in Russia and are then used to funnel money into our political discourse and political actors who try to interfere and influence our debates in malign ways that are very difficult for us to spot, or at least not very easy for the Electoral Commission and other authorities to act on effectively.

I will end by reflecting on why that is so important. The hon. Member for South Norfolk outlined the host of ways in which the Russian state is trying to target society and democracy in western countries and specifically in the UK. As the hon. Member for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland (Luke Myer) said in his intervention, we should not be so naive as to think that it is not happening here in the UK.

The strategic defence review of June last year concluded that we are under daily attack. When we talk about political interference, whether it is Russian, Iranian or Chinese for that matter, we should place that in the broader context of other hybrid warfare tactics, some of which the hon. Member for South Norfolk referred to. We need to consider that while those countries are perhaps flooding our social media feeds with disinformation generated by armies of bots, or trying directly to bribe some willing fools in our political environment, they are paving the way to undermining and corroding trust in political institutions and authorities such that we are even more vulnerable to the direct attacks they may launch, such as the terrible poisonings in Salisbury back in 2018, the arson attack back in 2024 or indeed the almost constant daily threat that these mysterious Russian research ships pose to our critical subsea infrastructure.

By allowing political interference to continue, we risk undermining the public’s trust in all our institutions and, indeed, in the very integrity of our politics.

[Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD)]

The hon. Member is making a good speech. The Russian ship he mentioned was off the coast of my constituency among others, which caused grave local concern. It strikes me that to defend our democracy, be it Welsh, Scottish or national, protections should be extended to local authorities, because a council such as the Highland council, which is responsible for this vast coastline, would have something to say and do on that front.

[Ben Lake]

I agree wholeheartedly with the hon. Member’s important intervention. Perhaps we in this country need to wake up to the nature of the threat: it is all-encompassing and comprehensive, so every single tier of government and of society needs to be engaged. Perhaps a national conversation about the seriousness of the threat should be initiated. The findings of the Government’s review may give us a good opportunity to trigger that national conversation. Once the review has issued its findings, we cannot waste any time in bringing forward the measures, whether legislative or budgetary, that need to be undertaken to protect the integrity of our democracy and tackle the scourge of Russian interference in our politics.

Oral Answers to Questions

Ben Lake Excerpts

Wednesday 21st January 2026 Commons Chamber

[Anna McMorrin]

I think we are all glued to “The Traitors” this season. With the exodus from the Tory Benches to Reform, it is hard not to believe that we are living through a real-life “Traitors”. I thank my hon. Friend for his question. Welsh and Gaelic were the first languages of their nations, and have a strong social, cultural and economic significance. As a Welsh speaker, I know just how important that is. The Government recognise the contribution that MG Alba makes to the lives of Gaelic speakers across Scotland and the UK. My hon. Friend will be aware of the BBC charter review launched in December; it will consider how the BBC can best support minority languages, including Gaelic.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

The Minister will be aware that Ofcom is consulting on a draft code of practice on the prominence of public service broadcasters on digital platforms. Does she agree that it is essential that S4C is included in any measures that come out of that consultation, so that it is given greater prominence on smart TVs and other digital platforms?

[Anna McMorrin]

The hon. Member raises a very important point—one that I regularly discuss with S4C and my colleagues in the Department for Culture, Media and Sport. It is fantastic news that last week, the BBC and S4C announced plans for a major new streaming partnership, giving greater prominence to S4C on iPlayer, but I know that there is more to do on this issue, and I will continue to work with my colleagues and broadcasters on this matter.

Infected Blood Inquiry: Government Response

Ben Lake Excerpts

Wednesday 14th May 2025 Commons Chamber

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for raising this—he speaks powerfully on behalf of his constituent. As I indicated in an earlier answer, just over £96 million has been paid out, but I will continue to use my ministerial office, as well as working to hold IBCA to account, to move from what has been IBCA’s test-and-learn phase into a different phase and start to really speed up these payments.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

I thank the Minister for all the work he is doing to lead on this matter and bring justice to all the victims, and indeed for his statement today. Is it his understanding that victims of the infected blood scandal should not be worse off in the transition from the interim payments to the new compensation scheme? I have spoken to one victim, a constituent, who seems to have been offered a compensation offer that is much, much reduced compared with the offer he previously received under the special category mechanism.

[Nick Thomas-Symonds]

The issue of how the special category mechanism is translated across into what is known as the health supplemental route in relation to infected people is something I discussed before the inquiry last week. As I am sure the hon. Gentleman will appreciate, I do not know the facts of the specific case he is talking about, but if he is willing to write to me with the two different figures and the way in which his constituent feels that he is worse off, I will be more than happy to look at it.

Trade Negotiations

Ben Lake Excerpts

Thursday 8th May 2025 Commons Chamber

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

I am grateful to the Minister for his confirmation that this deal will not in any way undermine the nation’s SPS rules and regulations, but I am sure that he will acknowledge that there will be a degree of nervousness among British and indeed Welsh farmers, especially beef farmers, for although the tariff rate quota agreed is modest compared with that agreed under the New Zealand and Australia trade deals, it does of course come as an addition, and farmers will be worried about the cumulative impact. I think the Minister has mentioned this, but will he confirm that the 13,000 tonnes represents the maximum tariff quota for beef that has been agreed, and has any tariff quota been agreed for lamb, pork and poultry?

[Mr Alexander]

Forgive me: I was shuffling through my papers and missed the hon. Gentleman’s final point, but I am happy to write to him. He is absolutely right, I can assure him, to recognise that compared to the tariff quotas agreed under the Australia deal, negotiated by the then Prime Minister, the former Member for Henley, there is much more proportionality—a much more modest increase—anticipated under the quota in the agreement reached today. I recognise his point that there are continuing challenges for farmers in the United Kingdom, and we will continue to seek to address those.

European Union: UK Membership

Ben Lake Excerpts

Monday 24th March 2025 Westminster Hall

[Liz Saville Roberts]

I absolutely agree. It is a priority for us as parliamentarians and for the Government to ensure that we do everything we can to widen the horizons for our young people and to give them the best opportunities.

According to polling data from YouGov, three quarters of 18 to 24-year-olds voted to stay in the European Union in 2016. There was a myth peddled at the time that they did not turn out to vote, but that is wrong: around 70% of registered young voters went to the polling booth. Nine years later, the next generation remains decisively opposed to Brexit, with 75% saying it was a mistake. As we look to the future, we must think seriously about the effect of the decision on young people who entered the workforce under its cloud, although many of them would not have been able to vote in 2016. What has “getting Brexit done” meant for them?

The UK no longer allows young people to take part in the Horizon Europe or Erasmus+ programmes, which is a huge loss to students the length and breadth of the UK. Those vital exchanges provided opportunities for young people to live and study in other countries, and their many benefits included improved language skills, cultural immersion and personal growth, leaving the sort of memories that stayed with somebody for ever.

[Ben Lake (Ceredigion Preseli) (PC)]

My right hon. Friend makes a very important point. University towns in communities such as mine benefited from those cultural exchanges, and visitors from the EU enriched many of our communities.

[Liz Saville Roberts]

The January poll by YouGov that I quoted earlier notes that everybody sees that tourism has been hit—by fewer people from the UK going to the EU as tourists and fewer people from the EU coming to the UK. In areas such as my hon. Friend’s in Ceredigion and mine in Gwynedd, tourism provides the chief employment in our economy, along with the universities.