Oral Answers to Questions

David Warburton Excerpts

Monday 3rd December 2018 Commons Chamber

[Sajid Javid]

We work very closely with the Treasury. That is why the Chancellor has personally turned up to hear the hon. Gentleman’s question; the hon. Gentleman must have given him advance notice. He will have to wait for the police settlement, which is not too far off, but he should question why he voted against the police settlement last year.

[David Warburton (Somerton and Frome) (Con)]

The Children’s Commissioner estimates that at least 46,000 children in England have been targeted by drug gangs and coerced by intimidation, violence and criminal incentives into the so-called county lines system of selling drugs across the country. What work is being done by my right hon. Friend’s Department to address this appalling exploitation of children and young people?

[Victoria Atkins]

As my hon. Friend and other colleagues who work so closely on this will know, county lines are the dissemination of violence and drugs from our major urban centres into rural and coastal areas. Just one of the many pieces of work arising out of the serious violence strategy is the setting up of the national co-ordination centre, where law enforcement agencies work together to share intelligence and advice so that we get to the real criminals behind this practice, and also help to support the children who are being exploited.

Europol

David Warburton Excerpts

Monday 12th December 2016 General Committees

[David Warburton (Somerton and Frome) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Brady. Europol is at the forefront of the EU’s response to international crime and terrorism. As we know, it provides analytical and operational support to national law enforcement authorities in all 28 member states, enhancing their capacity to tackle cross-border security threats. The UK has participated in Europol since its creation in 1995. Although the coalition Government decided in 2014 to opt out of several EU police and criminal justice measures, they decided that the UK should remain part of Europol and opted back into the 2009 Council decision establishing Europol. They concluded that the UK’s continued participation in Europol would be more cost-effective than establishing a complex system of bilateral agreements and liaison networks with each member state and would enable the UK to maintain access to Europol’s cross-border data-sharing systems, analytical resources and expertise, and contribute to Europol’s forward-looking threat assessments, which set the agenda for EU action to combat serious organised crime and terrorism.

Despite that positive assessment of Europol, the coalition Government decided not to opt into the Commission’s proposed new Europol regulation in 2013. A new regulation is necessary as the Lisbon treaty requires Europol to be based on a regulation adopted jointly by the European Parliament. The Government feared that a strengthening of member states’ obligation to provide information to Europol and Europol’s right to request the initiation of a criminal investigation might undermine the operational independence of the police. The Government’s recommendation that the UK should not opt in was debated on the Floor of the House in July 2013. However, the Government made it clear that they wished to “remain part of Europol” and intended to

“play an active role in negotiations”.

The motion passed by the House stated that

“the UK should opt into the Regulation post-adoption, provided that Europol is not given the power to direct national law enforcement agencies to initiate investigations or share data that conflicts with national security.”—[Official Report, 15 July 2013; Vol. 566, c. 878-883.]

Following three years of negotiation, the new Europol regulation was adopted in May. This debate concerns the Government’s recommendation that the UK should opt in so it can participate fully in Europol when the regulation takes effect on 1 May next year. This is undoubtedly the most significant opt-in decision that the Government have taken since the referendum in June. If the Government’s decision not to opt into the Commission’s proposal in 2013 merited a debate on the Floor of the House, their decision to opt in now, shortly before they intend to trigger article 50 negotiations about the terms of the UK’s withdrawal from the EU, surely merits exposure and scrutiny in a debate on the Floor of the House. I therefore ask the Minister to explain why the Government have disregarded the European Scrutiny Committee’s clear recommendation that there should be such a debate.

The European Scrutiny Committee has asked the Minister to address several questions during this debate. Is he satisfied that the regulation contains sufficient safeguards to ensure the operational independence of the police? What impact will the jurisdiction of the European Court of Justice have on the ability of UK police forces to set their own operational priorities, and what views have UK law enforcement authorities expressed on the Government’s opt-in recommendation?

The European Scrutiny Committee also asks the Government to make clear the consequences of not opting in to the regulation. How great a risk is there that the UK will be ejected from Europol next May if it does not opt in before then? Will Denmark remain part of Europol, even though it cannot participate in the new regulation? Will the new regulation make it easier or harder for the UK to establish a close working relationship with Europol once it has left the EU?

The Secretary of State for Exiting the European Union told the House in October that the Government’s aim during Brexit negotiations would be

“to keep our justice and security arrangements at least as strong as they are.”—[Official Report, 10 October 2016; Vol. 615, c. 55.]

Does that mean that the Government will seek to preserve the access to Europol’s databases and analytical information once the UK has left the EU as it currently enjoys as a member and, if so, will that require a bespoke model of co-operation, beyond that envisaged in the regulation?

I thank the Minister for being here to answer those questions and I very much look forward to his response and to an informed and, I hope, lively debate.

[The Chair]

Before I call the Minister to make an opening statement, I remind the Committee that interventions are not permitted during the statement.

Oral Answers to Questions

David Warburton Excerpts

Monday 5th December 2016 Commons Chamber

[Sarah Newton]

I do not have the answer to hand at the moment, but this was the first week, with 21 forces engaged in Operation Sceptre. That had a hugely beneficial effect, in terms of not only the surrendering of weapons across the country but arrests across the country. It sent out an incredibly clear, firm message: we will not tolerate people carrying knives as they will use them harmfully on innocent citizens.

[David Warburton (Somerton and Frome) (Con)]

6. What steps her Department is taking to confiscate money from criminals; and what plans she has further to strengthen the asset recovery regime.

[Andrew Bingham (High Peak) (Con)]

9. What steps her Department is taking to confiscate money from criminals; and what plans she has further to strengthen the asset recovery regime.

[The Secretary of State for the Home Department (Amber Rudd)]

Since 2010, £1.2 billion of criminal assets have been recovered, and a further £3 billion have been frozen. The Serious Crime Act 2015 provided new powers, and the Criminal Finances Bill will further improve our capability, but there is more to be done. Next year we will publish a new asset recovery action plan, and the Cabinet Office will look at the UK’s response to economic crime more broadly. This will include looking at the effectiveness of our organisational framework and the capabilities, resources and powers available to the organisations that tackle economic crime.

[David Warburton]

I thank the Home Secretary for that. The Criminal Finances Bill contains many measures to combat illegal and immoral financial activity, but can my right hon. Friend confirm that the new law enforcement measures in relation to unexplained wealth orders will ensure not only that we can better combat illegal activity but that the principles of transparency will be upheld?

[Amber Rudd]

My hon. Friend raises a really important point. Unexplained wealth orders will send a powerful statement to those who wish to launder the proceeds of their crimes in the UK. They are an investigative power and so will be subject to the same court rules that apply to the existing civil recovery investigative powers.

Investigatory Powers Bill

David Warburton Excerpts

Tuesday 15th March 2016 Commons Chamber

[David Warburton (Somerton and Frome) (Con)]

Speaking as one of the few non-lawyers present, I must admit to having been moved by the powerful speech by the hon. Member for Belfast East (Gavin Robinson), who is no longer in his place, about attacks in his constituency.

We instinctively baulk at the idea of expanding the powers of the state in this area, but the question is not whether we should expand them; if we are to maintain the same level of security as technology develops, we have to expand our capabilities. I am pretty confident that no Government Member would be keen to extend the powers of the state as a philosophical end in itself. The question is how and to what degree we maintain the equilibrium with regard to technology as it keeps diversifying and threats as they keep growing.

I shared the unease of some colleagues on both sides of the House about the original Bill, but I am reassured by the Government’s reaction and the subsequent changes. The Bill now offers a far clearer commitment to privacy, and I welcome in particular the additional protection it offers journalists, the limits on powers over bulk personal datasets, and the time limit on the examination of personal information extracted from databases.

We must, however, decide where the line should be drawn. The appalling events in Paris last year show clearly that our intelligence services face an enormous challenge in securing the absolute safety of the public while using incomplete and fragmented information. Terrorism is the simplest form of barbarism, but it is being conducted through modern means. If police and intelligence services are to be effective, they must adapt to that modern landscape.

As we have heard, the judicial double lock is a valuable safeguard in providing a check on the powers of the Executive. The Bill provides unprecedented detail about what those powers are and how they are exercised and overseen.

However uneasy we may feel about internet connection records or thematic warrants, that does not compare to the infinitely greater unease we ought to feel about our intelligence agencies being unable to use those tools to keep us safe. In a democratic country with such a tradition of liberty, such measures are always proposed reluctantly, but when the asymmetry between the state and the threats it faces is more apparent than ever, the arguments are pretty convincing.

The creator of England’s first systematic intelligence services, Sir Francis Walsingham—it was some time ago—wrote:

“There is nothing more dangerous than security.”

Today, unfortunately, that is more true than ever. With that in mind, I accept the clarity, effectiveness and necessity of this Bill.

Policing and Crime Bill

David Warburton Excerpts

Monday 7th March 2016 Commons Chamber

[Mrs May]

I am tempted to do that. I should perhaps respond that my hon. Friend the Member for Winchester (Steve Brine) is the apple of my eye when he stands up and makes such a point about Hampshire. [Interruption.] Well, I have to say to my hon. Friend the Member for Braintree (James Cleverly) that he has not yet put into practice what he said he wished to do.

Hampshire is a very good example of the collaboration that can work. The Minister for Policing, Crime and Criminal Justice has visited Hampshire. He has seen Winchester fire and rescue service and the police station. These are all innovative ideas that provide a better service to people. I commend Hampshire and other parts of the country where they are putting this collaboration into practice.

[David Warburton (Somerton and Frome) (Con)]

Does my right hon. Friend agree that collaboration and co-operation are very important when an incident occurs? During and after the Somerset floods, many of my constituents wrote to me and spoke to me about the importance of the emergency services working in tandem. That is the best way to ensure that the most vulnerable in each community get the help they need.

[Mrs May]

My hon. Friend makes a very important point. When an incident takes place, the three emergency services will often be called and will have to work together. That is why the Government did a great deal of work under JESIP, the joint emergency services interoperability programme, to look at improving how the three services work together—the protocols, the language that is used and the command structures that can be put in place—so that, as my hon. Friend says, they also work together on their emergency response.

The national picture remains patchy. Collaboration should be the rule, not the exception. That is why, as I have said, part 1 of the Bill places an overarching duty on the three emergency services to collaborate. It will help to drive close working across the country when that would improve efficiency or effectiveness. In the case of police forces and fire and rescue services in particular, I believe that there is a compelling case for taking such collaboration agreements a step further. To facilitate enhanced collaboration and strengthen democratic oversight, part 1 provides a framework for police and crime commissioners to take responsibility for delivering foreign rescue services by local agreement.