Recall of MPs Bill

Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord Grocott

Wednesday 14th January 2015 Lords Chamber

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

My understanding is that the gentleman would no longer be disqualified.

I will conclude, because in effect these amendments are technical. They are about implementing the will of the other place and ensuring that all convictions for providing false or misleading information in relation to parliamentary expenses claims under Section 10 of the Parliamentary Standards Act—

[Lord Grocott]

I know that the Minister is being patient and reading his resounding conclusion. He mentioned decisions in the other place, and quite rightly and properly treating them with enormous respect. He even gave us the figures—I think he said that the vote on this amendment was 281 to 2. The figures themselves—I put it to the noble Lord gently—tell a bigger story than they apparently present. In my maths, something like 370 Members did not take part in the vote at all. I think we all know part of the reason why that took place in the way that it did. It is because many Members feel very intimidated indeed about making a stance on issues relating to parliamentary expenses. One can understand it with an election just around the corner. Please can we make it almost a rule in Committee that large majorities with even larger numbers of absentees do not necessarily mean the wholehearted support and commitment of the House of Commons?

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

Well, the obvious rejoinder—I am sure that the noble Lord will take this in the spirit I intend—is that if one looks at the voting numbers and abstentions in a House that is considered by many to be rather too large, one might get an interesting result. So I am not sure that I am fully persuaded, although of course I understand what the noble Lord is seeking to do.

I should conclude, because a lot of the points made by noble Lords have been of a Second Reading variety. My task before your Lordships is to move amendments that we believe are necessary to effect what the House of Commons has sent us. They are, as I say, technical and consequential, but they have given us a good opportunity to open the batting. I know that there will be other amendments where some of the details of some of the points noble Lords have made in their opening remarks can be discussed fully.

BBC Licence Fee: Non-payment

Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord Grocott

Tuesday 1st April 2014 Lords Chamber

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

My Lords, the new Clause 20 is about a discussion about whether there should be a civil monetary penalty regime. Without wanting to prejudge, I do not think that it is at all intended as an undermining of public service broadcasting. Clearly, the important thing is that the BBC remains independent; that is a key feature of our national life.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

As it seems that there is still no absolute clarity as to the form that the review should take, may I make a suggestion—unauthorised from these Benches—that two critical people to include as part of the review process would be the noble Lords, Lord Grade and Lord Fowler?

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

I shall certainly make sure that the Secretary of State is mindful of my noble friends’ names.

Leveson Inquiry

Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord Grocott

Thursday 24th October 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

My Lords, I understand my noble friend’s position, particularly given that he chairs the Communications Committee. However, we have debated the cross-party charter and the Leveson report on many occasions, and I have been delighted to answer—or seek to answer—questions on them. I sense that the public are seeking some conclusion to this and that is why the cross-party charter is going before the Privy Council on 30 October. It is about trying to get some resolution so that we can move forward and set the structure in place.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

Does the Minister detect something that I have not yet detected? The Leveson inquiry came about in the first place as a result of the most appalling treatment by the print media of individual innocent members of the public. It was that outrage that led to the inquiry. In the kind of almost academic exchanges that are going on, I get no sense at all that the leaders of the print industry share or understand that outrage. Can the Minister simply report to the House and reassure me that the Government feel the same sense of outrage that the overwhelming majority of the British people feel?

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

I sense from our exchanges in your Lordships’ House that there is a very strong feeling here which reflects what the nation feels. This is why the Prime Minister was absolutely right to start on the path of asking Lord Justice Leveson to look into these matters, because they should not have happened and responsible people could not possibly justify them. I say to those who are very senior in the press: I see no demons in what is proposed by the cross-party charter. This is about trying to have two very important things in our nation’s life: a responsible free press that can scrutinise and look at all that we and our institutions do, but will also safeguard the rights of the citizen.

Ofcom: Public Service Broadcasting

Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord Grocott

Wednesday 12th June 2013 Lords Chamber

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

I would say to the noble Baroness that the work we are doing on Ofcom is designed to ensure that we do not do things that are unnecessary and inefficient. We should be enabling Ofcom to undertake its really important responsibilities. I refer to refinements because, having looked at the recommendations in the consultation, I think they give a more refreshing and up-to-date twist on what we wanted Ofcom to do when the noble Lord, Lord Puttnam, was so involved in its creation.

[Lord Grocott]

In the light of this Question and the wider debate about the Leveson inquiry, is it not worth reminding ourselves of the fact that in this country broadcasters work within a democratically established regulatory framework? This is in comparison with the press, which talks at great length about freedom of the press. Of course we need to respect this and it is very important, but the broadcasters’ regulatory framework thoroughly enables them to conduct investigative reporting and news and current affairs reporting to the highest standards. It is perfectly possible to have the highest quality of media output within a proper regulatory framework.

[Lord Gardiner of Kimble]

I would say to the noble Lord that I think we should have a free and a responsible press.