Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Tuesday 11th July 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, I thought it would be helpful to the House if I briefly set out the plan for further consideration of the Illegal Migration Bill in this House next week. As announced in a revised Forthcoming Business published yesterday, the plan is for noble Lords to consider any message from the House of Commons tomorrow, if the Bill is returned from that House as expected. The deadline for amendments will be 1 pm tomorrow, which will allow time for the House authorities and noble Lords to prepare. We therefore expect to commence consideration of the message later in the afternoon, after making some progress on Report on the Online Safety Bill.

Further announcements about the precise timings and arrangements will be placed on the annunciator tomorrow. I will also make additional announcements in the Chamber throughout this week and early next week about the arrangements for further proceedings on this Bill and others before summer as necessary.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

When these arrangements are made, what consideration is given to the problems of those of us who do not live in and around London in getting to and from this place?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, noble Lords come from here, there and everywhere. We do try to be considerate. I am thinking particularly of our Labour Front Bench; the noble Baroness has to travel for some hours to get here, so we absolutely take that into consideration.

Business of the House

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Tuesday 13th June 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, on behalf of my noble friend the Lord Privy Seal, I beg leave to move the Motion standing in his name on the Order Paper.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, when we had a similar Motion to this some weeks ago, calling us in on a Wednesday morning at short notice, I raised some objections, particularly on behalf of people who do not live round the corner in London and who are expected to change all their plans to get here without proper advance notice. On that occasion, I got virtually a promise from the Government Front Bench that we would not have it again. But here we are, having it again, because the Government’s legislative programme is in total disarray. We sat until 4 am last week and 2 am this morning; they cannot organise their legislative programme. It is really ridiculous that Members should be treated in this way.

I wonder if Boris’s friends who are going to be joining us have been told what to expect. How is Ben Houchen going to manage to get down from Teesside suddenly on a Wednesday morning? What about Charlotte Owen? It is going to interfere with her social life, that is one thing for sure. Indeed, Nadine Dorries does not realise what she is gaining by not being nominated to this place.

This is ridiculous. This place is being treated disgracefully and Members are being treated disgracefully. We are human beings. We need to sleep at night, we need to be treated properly, and we need to be consulted on the programme. This is not happening, because this Government are in total disarray.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, I am sure the noble Lord was sleeping soundly in his bed when the Committee stages were being heard last night and on Wednesday of last week. Sitting early was the suggestion of one of the usual channels and was agreed to by all the usual channels.

I also want to say, if I may, that I find it utterly condescending that the noble Lord would speak about a young lady and her social life in such a way.

Scotland Act 1998: Section 35 Power

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 18th January 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, I have a very short question—

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, the Green Benches have been waiting to get in all through these questions, so we will hear from the Greens first, and then I think the House would probably like to hear from the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy.

Public Order Bill

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

1st reading
Wednesday 19th October 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, it might be helpful to read from the Companion about the status of a First Reading:

“The Question is put from the Woolsack. The first reading of a bill is agreed to without dissent or debate, both as a matter of courtesy and because the House has no knowledge of the contents of the bill until it is published.”


On that basis, I beg to move that this Bill is read a first time.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, that is a very helpful answer but if that is the case—and it is—why does the chair have to say “Content” or “Not Content”? Does it not make this House look even more stupid?

Extradition Act 2003

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 29th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Lord goes quite nicely back to one of my noble friend Lord Moylan’s questions about Germany. Germany is not alone in not extraditing its own nationals, but we have processes in place which completely adjust to that fact—it is nothing new and nothing unusual now.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, is there any person in the United Kingdom who is exempt from the extradition provisions?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I know where the noble Lord is leading. I will not comment on that; I will get him an answer in writing to that.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

In writing?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

Yes.

Migration and Economic Development Partnership with Rwanda

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 15th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, we had much discussion about the UNHCR’s view of the Nationality and Borders Act. We disagreed. He is perfectly within his rights to say what he did, but we respectfully disagree.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, saying in answer to my noble friend that we are committed to a Bill of rights for this country does not answer the question about the European convention. Britain initiated the European Convention on Human Rights and Winston Churchill was one of its architects. The great advantage of it is that it holds other countries to an international standard. If we are going to ask countries such as Turkey, Hungary and Azerbaijan to adhere to standards, we have to do so as well. To suggest—even to hint—that we will withdraw from the European Convention on Human Rights is an absolute disgrace. If it happens, this country will not be able to show its face in any international fora again.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, I did not state that we were going to withdraw; I said that the Deputy Prime Minister was looking at a Bill of rights. All through the passage of the Nationality and Borders Act, we were absolutely clear that that Act complied with the ECHR.

Civil Servants: Reduction in Numbers

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 15th June 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

During lockdown, there was a massive diminution in the number of people applying for passports. Last year, we sent out reminders to people that their passports were going to expire. Unfortunately, that did not result in an increased number of passport applications, but we are currently processing 250,000 passports a week.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, may I move to other agencies? At this time of increasing threats, can the Minister give us an absolute assurance that there will be no cuts in the staff of the intelligence agencies?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The security of our people is the number one priority for this Government, and the security and intelligence agencies will have the resources they need to do their job.

Intelligence: Russia

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Monday 31st January 2022 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My noble friend homes in on a very important point, which is that we must use all the skills and tools in our armour to counteract whichever threat we are facing. That is why it is so important that this Bill comes forward to allow us to use those skills and tools.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, does the Minister think that President Putin is going to treat seriously any threats from Boris Johnson or Liz Truss, when we are continuing to give hundreds of Russian oligarchs golden visas to enable them to get British citizenship and, perhaps even eventually, membership of the House of Lords? Is this not a total farce?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

My Lords, in terms of people being a threat to this country, the noble Lord talked about, as I have often done, the funny money that might be swirling around—

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

The golden visas.

Ten-Year Drugs Strategy

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Thursday 9th December 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I am very pleased to have heard from the noble Lord, Lord Brooke, who equates the harms from alcohol with the harms from drugs. Socially, in many cases, the harms from alcohol are worse, because it is so freely available. He is right that quite often these things end in prison—whether it is drugs or alcohol. He talked about the ministerial meeting, and I would be very happy to join him in that if he wishes—and I would also be very happy if he wanted to join the Government. It is not my call, though.

The original impetus for a new strategy came from Dame Carol Black’s review of drugs, which recommended the setting up of this cross-government drugs unit, responsible for co-ordinating and delivering a drugs strategy. Of course, our strategy goes wider than just the health harms—although the noble Lord’s point about alcohol stands just as much. That said, I look forward I hope to joining him, and take on board all the points that he makes.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

While the situation in England and Wales is bad, it is even worse in Scotland, which has the highest level of drugs deaths in Europe. The SNP Government have always tried to blame this on Westminster, saying that it is because the Government here refuse to change the law—but, of course, that ignores the fact that the law is the same in Scotland, England and Wales. What are the UK Government doing to counteract this propaganda that comes from the “Comical Alis” up in Scotland?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

From some of the contributions that we have heard today, clearly some of the propaganda works. Drug consumption rooms are in Scotland, and they do not work. Scotland has a huge drugs problem, and its strategy clearly has not worked. This is not a strategy for the whole UK but aligned to the devolved and reserved policies led by the six contributing departments; we continue to work with devolved authorities, so certain aspects cover England, Scotland and Wales. I am very glad that the noble Lord mentioned it, because he is absolutely right.

Windrush Compensation Scheme

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 24th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

When someone is deported, it is usually for criminality. I do not have up-to-date figures on people who have been deported who would also be eligible for Windrush. Rather than make them up at the Dispatch Box, which I am disinclined to do, I will get those figures to my noble friend.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, I have listened very carefully to the noble Baroness the Minister, who we all have a lot of respect for. She said two years ago that she was frustrated at the delays. She has done her best at the Home Office and there are still huge delays. It was recommended months ago that the scheme should be transferred to an independent body. Would it not give greater trust and confidence to the people who are seeking compensation if some action was taken on this?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I did try to explain what action has been taken, which has meant that compensation has risen from less than £3 million to over £31.6 million, with a further £5.6 million being offered since the changes were made in December. As I have explained, transferring out of the Home Office would not necessarily result in further improvements.

UK–EU Trade and Cooperation Agreement: Foreign Workers

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 10th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[The Lord Speaker (Lord McFall of Alcluith)]

The noble Baroness, Lady Ritchie of Downpatrick, is not present, so I call the noble Lord, Lord Foulkes of Cumnock.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, the Minister will be aware that there is some confusion arising from statements made by the Home Secretary about our adherence to the European Convention on Human Rights. Earlier, I think she said that the Government were still adhering to it. Will she confirm that there is no intention in any way to withdraw from the European Convention on Human Rights and the Council of Europe?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I will not add to what I said to the noble Baroness, Lady Chakrabarti, but our departure from the European Union will not diminish the UK’s engagement with the Council of Europe. We are committed to the European Convention on Human Rights and to improving the effectiveness of its court. We are a leading player, a founder member and one of the five major financial contributors, having given €34.2 million this year. We use the Council of Europe to hold member states to their human rights obligations and deliver messages to them, in public and in private.

Immigration Rules: Au Pairs

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Monday 8th November 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I agree with my noble friend. Debates have been had over the last few months and years, but the whole point is to offer competitive wages here for workers from either here or abroad. Au pairs certainly are labour on the cheap.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that, although we have had critical shortages of HGV drivers, fruit-pickers, nurses, doctors and care workers, it takes a shortage of au pairs for some people to realise that Brexit is an unmitigated, self-inflicted disaster? When will the Government acknowledge this and try to find a new, positive relationship with the European Union?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Lord knows very well that the problems with HGV drivers and poultry workers are to do with easing supply chain pressures and are nothing to do with Brexit.

EU Bilateral Agreements for Asylum Seekers

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Monday 6th September 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I disagree with the noble Lord on a number of points. I think this country is incredibly generous in terms of how it supports and welcomes people who need our help. He mentioned Wendy Williams. I very much look forward to welcoming her back later this month when she reports on the findings of her first report. I am also very pleased that the Minister appointed for Afghanistan refugee resettlement is my honourable friend VickyAtkins, who will be a very compassionate and suitable candidate for the role.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, returning to the original Question, is not the truth that the Home Office has been unable to negotiate any bilateral agreements—indeed, none is in sight in the near future—causing chaos and confusion? The UN High Commissioner for Refugees has said that we are breaching the 1951 agreement. The truth is also that if we were still in the European Union, we would have the common European asylum system, which worked extremely well. Is this not all a self-inflicted disaster?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Lord will not be surprised to hear me say that no, it is not a self-inflicted disaster. Of all EU states, we have been one of the most generous. As I said previously, we do not think we are doing anything that breaches our international obligations.

Police: Body-worn Videos

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Wednesday 7th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

I do not agree with the noble Baroness, she will not be surprised to know. She can surely acknowledge that our efforts to enlist an extra 20,000 police officers are all to the good in fighting crime.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

Is the Minister aware that Police Scotland started a trial of body-worn video on 1 June? Will she ensure that the experience in England is passed on to Police Scotland?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

Indeed; our relationship with the devolved authorities is always one of learning from each other and passing on examples of good practice.

Asylum: British Overseas Territories and Ferries

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Monday 5th October 2020 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Home Office (Baroness Williams of Trafford) (Con)]

My Lords, as my right honourable friend the Home Secretary said yesterday, the asylum system is broken, and we stand by our obligations to safeguard the most vulnerable people fleeing oppression, persecution and tyranny. We will take every necessary step to fix this broken system and we will continue to examine all practical measures to effectively deter illegal migration. We do not comment on leaks.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, but will the Minister concede that the options which have been very authoritatively leaked and have been in almost every newspaper would be inordinately expensive, probably illegal but, above all, inhumane? As a do-gooder, I ask the Minister if she will go back to the Home Secretary and say that on this issue, doing good is just common humanity.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

Well, I think any noble Lord who listened to my right honourable friend yesterday will at least concede that humanity was at the heart of what she was saying. She was talking about a “firm and fair” immigration system, and about the people traffickers who exploit the most vulnerable. I can confirm that we will act in accordance with our international conventions, and I will not comment on the leaks.

Emergency Services Network

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Thursday 24th September 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

The noble Lord is absolutely right to point to the importance of emergency networks in the London Underground. In fact, that work and that testing has begun with TfL— I visited one of its sites in Canada Water—but it has been delayed because of Covid-19, for very obvious practical reasons. I can assure the noble Lord on this. The testing is absolutely imperative, so that the technology that we have works in emergency situations such as those he referred to.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op) [V]]

My Lords, will the Minister admit, in a moment of frankness and honesty, that this project is a total shambles? Will she tell the House what the arrangements are for consulting with the authorities in Scotland and Wales? What is their view about this interminable delay?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford (Con)]

Well, I think I was quite frank initially in saying that it had been a challenging project. It is a project that I have paid particular attention to in trying to get it moving, in terms of emergency services testing it and taking it up. In terms of the Scottish view on it, we engage with all devolved Administrations on this sort of thing, and we want to get it up and running as soon as we possibly can.

Extradition (Provisional Arrest) Bill [HL]

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

3rd reading & 3rd reading (Hansard) & 3rd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 15th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op) [V]]

My Lords, I have a question to which others may know the answer; forgive me if it is widely known. The Minister said in relation to Scotland that the court applicable was Edinburgh Sheriff Court. Can she let us know why Edinburgh Sheriff Court in particular was chosen, and why only Edinburgh Sheriff Court? Scotland is a very large country stretching from the border with England right up to Shetland. I wondered whether there might not be some practical problems if only Edinburgh Sheriff Court was applicable. So, what was the criterion and why only Edinburgh?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, it has been Edinburgh Sheriff Court since the Extradition Act 2003 has been in place.

Public Order

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Tuesday 9th June 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I think the noble and learned Lord is right about the balanced approach and the importance of the rule of law. I respect those who very peacefully protested on Sunday, but of course that was completely undermined by those who just flouted the rule of law and those who put other people at risk of the virus when we are going through quite a critical stage in in trying to wipe it out. The noble and learned Lord talks about more resources for the criminal justice system. From a Home Office point of view, our ambition to recruit an extra 20,000 police officers over the next few years is well on track to be delivered. I hope that, as he says, the whole fairness of the criminal justice system will lead to a public feeling of a more fair and equal society.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op) [V]]

My Lords, is the Minister aware that one of the causes of the protest and the pulling-down of the Colston statue in Bristol was the failure to act on previous lawful representations about that statue and the frustration caused? Why is the Prime Minister now refusing to meet with Sadiq Khan, the Mayor of London? Why are the Government refusing to deal with legitimate BAME concerns, such as Windrush? Will the Government ever learn to start listening to peaceful representations, particularly from elected Members?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, the Colston statue is in Bristol, and therefore is a matter for the elected representatives of Bristol to deal with democratically. If people are not happy with the democratic process in Bristol, they can do something about it at the ballot box. If people want to make representations to Sadiq Khan about the various statues they may object to across London, it is for them to do so.

European Arrest Warrant, Europol and Eurojust

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Lord Foulkes of Cumnock

Monday 2nd March 2020 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I think it would mean that those states will try in their own countries—I have talked about the enhanced safeguards—but I do not think that will make this country less safe.

[Lord Foulkes of Cumnock (Lab Co-op)]

My Lords, is this one of the areas in which the Permanent Secretary advised the Secretary of State of the dangers of going ahead, and which the Secretary of State paid no attention to and shouted?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, one thing I cannot comment on is private conversations between Secretaries of State and their officials—