EU Settlement Scheme

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Wednesday 23rd October 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I have heard this concern time and again. I can understand how some people might feel that a physical document was somehow more secure and better proof of status. However, in actual fact everyone gets a letter or an email, and the digital status—or token, if you like—is actually a far more secure way of proving status. I acknowledge the concerns that arise when people do not have a physical document in front of them, but they do receive a letter.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, I declare that I have been registered as a resident in Portugal for the past 30 years. The question of reciprocity potentially becomes centre stage given that no deal is still on the table. Can the Government give an absolute surety that the UK will not jeopardise the rights and privileges of UK citizens on the continent with that still a possibility?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

The noble Viscount will of course be aware that as the United Kingdom, we have done our duty by EU citizens in the UK. We have done that unilaterally. We hope that the EU would do the same; therefore, we are reliant on that good will on both sides. But I am satisfied that we now have over 2 million applications out of a cohort that I estimate to be about 3 million.

Illegal Seaborne Migration

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Wednesday 5th June 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

As I said earlier, the vast majority of the individuals who have attempted to cross the Channel have declared themselves as Iranian. Some who have gone on to claim asylum have declared their conversion to Christianity. Therefore, I assume that they would have been Muslims converting to Christianity, but I cannot say for definite. However, a number of asylum claims have been based on conversion to Christianity.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, the Minister has identified Iranians crossing the Channel as refugees. The situation for Iranian citizens is dire, which is due in greater part to sanctions targeting Iran. Are sanctions imposed to achieve policy change? If so, is destituting Iranians helping to achieve this, rather than impacting the leadership?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

The noble Viscount is straying into territory that is perhaps not in my purview; however, I am not seeking to evade the question other than to say that I recognise the point he makes and it is clear that a lot of arrivals in the country at the moment are Iranians.

Immigration (European Economic Area Nationals) (EU Exit) Order 2019

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Monday 18th March 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Ah. Do noble Lords mind if we do this one first?

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

I think that every Member who has taken an interest in this has been in the Chamber, so the Minister can probably be allowed to continue. That is my view, but other Members may think differently.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I have just taken advice and apparently I cannot do that. Please ignore everything I have just said.

On a day when you have three statutory instruments, an Urgent Question, a Question and a speech to deliver to the LGBT conference, this is what happens. I apologise to noble Lords that I have got the right speeches but in the wrong order. I will sit down for a minute to make sure that I have got the right instrument.

Windrush Scheme

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Tuesday 5th February 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Certainly, there has to be a co-ordinated approach to this whole Windrush issue, as the noble Baroness said, and quality assurance is absolutely paramount given what some of these people have suffered, some for many years. So she is absolutely right. The DWP is certainly one of the referral routes for the Windrush generation because some of them may have lost or not been able to receive benefits to which they are entitled. I totally take her point. Yes, my right honourable friend did say when he became Home Secretary that a humane approach was definitely the new culture within the Home Office.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, I have learned about midnight flights for deportees to the Caribbean. I do not wish to interfere in any way with judicial processes, or even to suggest that, but would it not be a gesture of post-Brexit good will to declare what some countries have done: a carefully constructed amnesty leading into our next-stage immigration policy?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

The noble Viscount should be clear about what and whom he means when he talks about midnight flights. I do not know that they take place at midnight, but the people who are set to be deported to the Caribbean are rapists, murderers and people involved in drugs and firearms. Does the noble Viscount really mean an amnesty for serious criminality?

[Viscount Waverley]

No, I was talking about a more general point that possibly, going into a post-Brexit situation, the Home Office might wish to consider amnesty for certain types of individuals. It may find that helpful. That is all.

Russia: Threats to Individuals in the UK

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Thursday 8th March 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I repeat that anybody who carries out an attack on a citizen of this country in such a way will be dealt with severely.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister agree that there might be merit in having a relationship with Moscow rather than the current sub-zero arrangements, whereby no agencies have any communication that constitutes a relationship?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Again, I cannot speak for the Foreign Office on what relations are currently like, but I can certainly take the noble Lord’s point away.

Online Hate Speech

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Thursday 30th November 2017 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, it is absolutely correct that Daesh has nothing to do with Islam. Daesh seeks to promote its ideology as a form of Islam, but actually it is nothing to do with Islam, which is a peaceful religion.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, has not the time now come when we should welcome an imam to our House?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

It would be a great moment if we did.

Hamas

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Tuesday 31st October 2017 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, as I said earlier, we will not provide a running commentary on any proscribed organisations. I have already laid out some of what we expect from Hamas.

[Viscount Waverley (CB)]

My Lords, what is the mechanism by which a proscribed organisation becomes delisted? Does it require a court process to achieve that?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, it does not require a court process but an application to the Home Secretary.

Brexit: Acquired Rights (EUC Report)

Debate between Baroness Williams of Trafford and Viscount Waverley

Tuesday 4th July 2017 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Home Office (Baroness Williams of Trafford) (Con)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy, for bringing this debate to the House this evening. A number of noble Lords have asked why we have not yet responded to the report. I understand the importance of engaging with Parliament and the courtesy of responding to reports, and this is no exception. I undertake that we will, of course, respond to it in due course, but I hope that tonight’s debate goes some way to give a flavour of the Government’s thoughts. It is obviously a very important topic, particularly at this time. As the noble Baroness said, this is about people’s lives and we cannot forget that. The Government have listened carefully to the recommendations made in the report and the concerns raised in it, in this House and across the country, on the rights of those citizens who make such an important contribution to the UK and to the member states in which they choose to live. As noble Lords have alluded to, last week we published our offer for EU citizens in the UK and our expectations for UK citizens elsewhere, which responds to those concerns and recommendations. I am grateful for the opportunity to discuss these in greater detail with noble Lords this evening. If I run out of time or do not answer every question, I shall of course respond in writing.

We have been clear that we want to give EU citizens in the UK certainty about their future. This report noted our obligation to provide certainty and clarity to EU citizens in the UK and British nationals living elsewhere in the EU, and we have done so. Indeed, I remind noble Lords that last year the Prime Minister sought to agree on this very issue with the EU, but was told at the time that there could be no negotiation without notification.

We committed to this House that we would undertake comprehensive work to examine each of the rights afforded to EU citizens under EU law and examine the different circumstances in which people find themselves to ensure that there are no unforeseen or unintended consequences as we move forward with the process of exiting the EU. Providing certainty on what could be achieved for those individuals also requires consideration of the other member states’ position. The EU set out its position on citizens’ rights on 9 June 2017 and we responded promptly and appropriately, with the Prime Minister publishing ours soon after. It is now clear that there is much common ground between the UK and the EU positions and we are confident that we can reach an agreement on this issue early in negotiations. Our starting point is that it is the Government’s intent to reassure all those EU citizens who are in the UK and who have made their lives and homes in the UK that no one currently lawfully resident will have to leave as a result of our exit from the EU. What is more, we are clear that we will not see families enjoying their lives here together split apart.

The committee’s report rightly notes that the rights to live and work in another member state and to gain a permanent right of residence in that state after five years are the most fundamental of EU citizens’ rights. As the report accurately describes, these are the rights that are necessary for EU citizens and their families,

“to conduct their lives in an EU Member State of their choosing on equal terms with the nationals of that State”.

We share the committee’s assessment that international law does not provide for these rights to be retained automatically. After we leave the EU, the UK will no longer be subject to EU law. Free movement rights will come to an end and therefore cannot be carried forward as an EU legal right into the post-exit UK legal regime. However, this Government are clear that it is right and proper that the substance of those rights noted by the report should be protected, and that EU citizens who have built their lives here and who came to the UK on the basis that they would be able to settle permanently should have that expectation honoured. This Government are committed to honouring that expectation.

As noble Lords have also noted, it is not just these people’s ability to live in the UK that we are committed to protect; we also want to ensure that EU citizens continue not only to be able to live here as they do now but to enjoy other important rights such as access to healthcare, education, benefits and pensions. That is why, on 26 June this year, we laid before Parliament a policy paper proposing that all EU citizens lawfully here when the UK exits the EU will have the opportunity to regularise their status to remain in this country, and all EU citizens here before a specified date will have the opportunity to acquire settled status after five years’ residence. This will enable EU citizens to reside in any capacity, as a worker, a student, a stay-at-home parent and so on, and undertake any lawful activity. We also intend to treat EU citizens with settled status in the same way as if they were UK citizens for the purposes of education, benefits and pensions. We have listened to the concerns of EU citizens who have made the UK their home and the concerns raised in this report. Those concerns are reflected in our offer and we believe that it is a fair and serious offer.

Noble Lords have also talked about the application process. We are determined that EU nationals who have built their lives here should continue to be able to live their lives here as they do now, and we have proposed a fair process to ensure that these rights are enforced. To this end, we will be providing eligible EU citizens with documentation enabling them to enforce their rights and prove their continuing right to live, work and access public funds and services in the UK after we leave the EU.

The noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, asked about the documentation and whether it amounts effectively to an ID card. I echo the comments of the Secretary of State for the Department for Exiting the EU, who said that,

“it is not an ID card. We are talking about documentation to prove that people have the right to a job and the right to residence, but they will not have to carry that around all the time. It is not an ID card”.—[Official Report, Commons, 26/6/17; col. 373.]

We have listened to concerns about the application process by which the resident population of EU citizens will be able to acquire settled status, which the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy, asked about. This is why we have been clear that we will improve upon the existing application system, and why we have committed to ensuring the process is as simplified, streamlined and user-friendly as possible. For example, unlike EU law, which requires economically inactive EU citizens such as stay-at-home parents to hold comprehensive sickness insurance to acquire the right of permanent residence, we have proposed that no one will be required to demonstrate that they have held comprehensive sickness insurance to be eligible for settled status.

We want to reassure EU citizens that they will be able to acquire the necessary documentation confirming their status quickly and easily. We are working hard on this new system and expect it to be up and running in 2018. The noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Newnham, asked for the details of this system, and of course we will provide further details in due course. What is more, we have committed to providing a grace period, which we expect to last up to two years after we leave the EU, to give EU citizens the time and opportunity to regularise their status.

The noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Newnham, asked about Ireland, Cyprus and Malta. On Ireland, we have both been clear about the shared desire to protect the freedoms our nationals currently enjoy in each other’s states. Irish citizens residing in the UK will not need to apply for settled status to protect their entitlements. I hope I can write to the noble Baroness on Malta and Cyprus.

The noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, asked what “strong ties” means when we are offering protections to those who have left the UK for more than two years. Settled status would generally be lost if a person was absent from the UK, unless they have strong ties here. This approach replicates the approach to returning residents with indefinite leave to remain under the Immigration Rules.

The noble Baroness, Lady Smith of Newham, also asked about the costs of the application process. The fees are being looked at as part of negotiations, but the aim is to keep them as reasonable as possible.

Family members were talked about, particularly by the noble Baroness, Lady Kennedy. We have listened when EU citizens told us their concerns that their families would be divided once the UK leaves the EU. My first point is that all EU citizens, be they children, students, husbands or partners, who arrive before the cut-off date, will be able to apply for settled status in their own right. However, I recognise that many EU citizens have family members who are not EU citizens, as the noble Viscount, Lord Waverley said. That is why we have proposed that family dependants who join a qualifying EU citizen in the UK before the UK’s exit will also be able to apply for settled status after five years, irrespective of the specified date. The Government are clear that we do not want to see families who have made their lives here together while we are still a member of the EU split apart.

[Viscount Waverley]

I apologise to the Minister. Maybe I misheard it, but I would just like a clarification. Supposing a non-EU spouse was married to a UK citizen but living on the continent, how will the five-year system that she has suggested work?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I am sure that the noble Viscount knows the system now. If a dependant who joined a qualifying EU citizen in the UK before the UK’s—sorry—

[Viscount Waverley]

Perhaps the noble Baroness would care to write to me.

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I think I know the answer, but I do not want to be quoted as giving your Lordships’ House—

[Viscount Waverley]

Would the noble Baroness kindly consider writing?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

I will.