Defence, Security and Resilience Bank

Debate between Lord Spellar and Lord Livermore

Tuesday 19th May 2026 Lords Chamber

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

As I am sure the noble Lord knows, the defence investment plan is the first zero-based review of defence spending in almost two decades. It will set out the MoD’s plans to ensure that resources are directed effectively to meet its priorities. The Government are working hard to facilitate this and to ensure that it delivers the outcomes the UK needs for defence and for taxpayers, and it will be published shortly.

[Lord Spellar (Lab)]

My Lords, does my noble friend the Minister accept that there is a significant problem of access to finance for the defence industry, particularly for medium and small enterprises, driven partly by absurd bans on investment in our national defence by financial institutions? Given the failure, frankly, of the City and the Government to address this systemic problem, should we not at least give serious consideration to, and engage in discussions on, this initiative from the Canadian Prime Minister, Mark Carney?

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

I agree with much of my noble friend’s analysis, but they are two slightly separate issues. The Government have been very clear that there is nothing contradictory between ESG considerations and defence, and that no company should ever be denied access to financial services solely on the basis that they work in the defence sector. The Government are working closely with the defence sector and with financial services to identify the extent of this issue, to reduce barriers to essential banking services and to support a resilient defence industry. More widely, the proposed multilateral defence mechanism will help improve value for money and address fragmentation in the defence sector through joint procurement. It will support greater standardisation and interoperability, helping to ensure that allies’ capabilities work together more effectively. It will increase the availability of munitions and other critical capabilities when we need them most. It will support a more resilient and efficient defence industrial sector, and it will accelerate defence sector investment.

VAT Relief: Business Donations

Debate between Lord Spellar and Lord Livermore

Tuesday 19th May 2026 Lords Chamber

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

I totally understand what the noble Baroness is saying. I do not think I said that it was not possible to do that; I said that we had not yet been presented with sufficient evidence to justify doing that. As I say, we will keep monitoring the situation carefully and we will maintain an open dialogue with the sector.

[Lord Spellar (Lab)]

My Lords, before my noble friend the Minister might be tempted down the route of putting price restrictions on food coming from supermarkets, would it not be better to wait and see whether the experiment in Scotland actually succeeds?

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

For the avoidance of doubt, I was not tempted to go down that path. Having heard from my noble friend, I am even less tempted to do so than I was before.

Grass-roots Music Venues

Debate between Lord Spellar and Lord Livermore

Monday 26th January 2026 Lords Chamber

[Lord Spellar (Lab)]

My Lords, can the Minister take back to Whitehall the very clear message on the importance of the music industry, including for Britain’s place in the world, that he has identified? No one starts their career playing the O2; they learn their trade—particularly how to relate to an audience—by playing the small venues, night after night. This is hugely important for our soft power but also for a significant part of our economy. Is that understood in Whitehall?

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

I hope it is understood. I agree with much of what my noble friend says. He will know that we have provided £2.5 million of funding this year for Arts Council England’s Supporting Grassroots Music Fund, enabling grass-roots music venues, recording studios, promoters and festivals to apply for grants to develop new revenue streams, make repairs and improvements, and enhance live music experiences.

Road Pricing

Debate between Lord Spellar and Lord Livermore

Thursday 18th September 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

I am grateful to the noble Lord for his question. I absolutely recognise the considerable expertise and experience that he has in this matter—experience and expertise that is probably found right across this House. I do not have specific thoughts on the specific points he raises because, as I say, we have no plans to introduce road pricing.

[Lord Spellar (Lab)]

My Lords, the last question identifies some of the key problems with road pricing. Mention was made of peak-time charging. That may be fine for civil servants and those living in London and the Home Counties, who have a high propensity to travel to work by rail, but the great majority of the rest of the country go to work by car. Those who live in rural areas have to travel long distances for facilities and for work. Those who work in industrial areas, again, quite often because of the location of the work, have to travel by car. There are huge socioeconomic issues here. Quite frankly, it needs to be taken out of the rarefied atmosphere of discussions between think tanks in Whitehall and instead have some common-sense examination involving car drivers.

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

I am grateful to my noble friend for his question. I agree with a great deal of what he said. As I said at the outset, one of the objectives we must keep in mind is that motoring must remain affordable for consumers. As I say, that is why in the last Budget we extended the temporary 5p fuel cut and cancelled the planned increase in line with inflation, which saved drivers around £3 billion this year. It is why we are introducing a new fuel finder to increase competition between fuel stations and to help drive down prices. As my noble friend rightly says, a well-developed road network cuts transport costs, connects businesses to markets, and unlocks jobs and investment right across regions. That is why at the spending review the Chancellor announced £24 billion of capital funding over this Parliament to maintain and improve both motorways and local roads.

Budget: Taxes and Borrowing

Debate between Lord Spellar and Lord Livermore

Monday 4th November 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

We had to take some very difficult decisions in the Budget. They were the right decisions to clear up the mess that we inherited from the party opposite, to rebuild the NHS after years of neglect, to choose investment and not decline, and to keep our promises to working people. However, the noble Baroness is absolutely right and of course I agree with what the Chancellor said. This was a very significant Budget, because of the need to repair the public finances and rebuild our public services simultaneously. We have now wiped the slate clean, meaning we never have to do a Budget like this again. The noble Baroness asks about tax, and I point out that we have kept every single promise that we made on tax. Her Government, when she was a Treasury Minister, froze income tax thresholds, costing working people nearly £30 billion. We could have extended that but we chose not to.

[Lord Spellar (Lab)]

My Lords, is it not the case that the last Government’s plans would have taken tax as a share of GDP to 37.1%? Even then, they subsequently announced, but failed to account for, billions of additional public spending while promising unrealistic tax cuts. Does my noble friend agree that last week’s Budget measures were necessary to fill the last Government’s black hole and get this country back on track?

[Lord Livermore (Lab)]

My noble friend is absolutely right in what he says. We faced a £22 billion black hole at the heart of our public finances, which we had to take steps to address. We also faced promises for compensation payments, which the previous Government had completely failed to put a single pound behind, and we had to repair public services simultaneously. In the process, though, we kept every single one of our manifesto commitments to restore stability, invest in our public services and protect working people.