Skills and Post-16 Education Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Committee stage
Monday 19th July 2021 Lords Chamber

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall) (Lab)]

I have received one request to speak after the Minister, from the noble Lord, Lord Adonis.

[Lord Adonis (Lab)]

My Lords, the noble Baroness said that there was now a scheme for enabling large employers to transfer part of the proceeds of the apprenticeship levy to SMEs. What is the incentive for them to do that? It was not clear to me why they would do it, apart from just good will—they may do it for good will, but it is good to have some incentives. Also, although she issued a lot of warm words about younger apprenticeships, she did not—unless I missed it—directly address the third part of the amendment from the noble and learned Lord, Lord Clarke, which requires employers receiving apprenticeship funding to spend

“at least two thirds of that funding on people who begin apprenticeships at Levels 2 and 3 before the age of 25.”

What is the Government’s view on an actual requirement that two-thirds of the funding be spent on those who are under 25?

Business of the House

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Wednesday 30th December 2020 Lords Chamber

[Lord Adonis (Lab)]

My Lords, I say first, I think on behalf of the whole House, how grateful we are to the staff of the House for the exemplary arrangements that they have made for our meeting today in the most exceptional circumstances. I also thank the Chief Whip for the courtesy that he has shown to me and to the House, as always. I pay tribute to those in the usual channels who have done the best that they can to make—let us be frank about it—the best of a bad job today. However, we should be aware of the enormity of the step that we are taking today, which is why I make no apology for moving this amendment.

What we are essentially doing is giving the Government power, in one of the most important matters that will face us in this generation, to legislate by decree. There will be no Committee on this Bill, no Report and no ability to move amendments on Third Reading. We will have just one debate, then a guillotine, then a vote, and then all 80 pages, 40 clauses and five schedules of this Bill, which is of enormous importance to the whole future of the United Kingdom, will become law immediately, with Royal Assent signified before the end of the Sitting. If this were an act of God, or some emergency for which we had to provide immediately—such as, for example, the pandemic—one might understand the need for legislative arrangements of this kind, although I note that when we passed the Coronavirus Act, which gave huge sweeping powers to Her Majesty’s Government, we gave it significantly more scrutiny in the most difficult of circumstances, including the need for Members to participate in unusual ways, than we are giving this Bill today.

It is not only that this is an act of the Government, not an act of God. Even given the fact that they reached an agreement only on Christmas Eve, it was still possible for there to be significantly more scrutiny of this Bill than we are giving it today. The Government could have called Parliament back on Monday. We could have had three days of debate on the Bill, which would have enabled normal Committee and Report stages to take place. Recognising, after discussions with noble Lords, that, given the constraints we are under—as I say, they are imposed on us by the Government, but we are under them none the less—we cannot have a normal Committee, I am not moving my first amendment, but I think that it is important for your Lordships to put on record that we deplore these arrangements and we do not regard them as in any way acceptable.

I note that the noble Lord, Lord Ashton, said that this Motion and our arrangements today should not be regarded as a precedent, but they will be regarded as a precedent. Let us be clear: precedents are things that have happened before—that is the meaning of the word “precedent”. We cannot do something and then argue that it is not a precedent for the future; it is a precedent. I can tell the noble Lord, because I have sat on that Bench too, that Ministers in future will be salivating at the powers that your Lordships will give the Government today over the most important piece of legislation that this Parliament will enact. They will cite it as a precedent for similar arrangements, which are without precedent before today.

There is no precedent at all—I have consulted the clerks, who are learned in these matters—in, so far as we can tell, the 800-year history of the House of Lords, and certainly not its modern history, for both suspending the need to have gaps between consideration of Bills in Committee and on Report and suspending Committee and Report entirely, which removes the power to move amendments. There is no precedent for this on a piece of major contested legislation. Your Lordships have done that historically only ever for emergency legislation that has the agreement of the opposition parties—notably terrorism legislation, where there is an obvious and sometimes compellingly urgent need to do so. In the history of this House, a piece of legislation like this has never been considered in the way that we are considering it today.

The issues that we are talking about are not small. Those of your Lordships who listened to the opening speeches in the House of Commons today will have seen the gravity of the issues that are being considered. If I may put in a plug for my leader, my right honourable friend the leader of the Opposition made a forensic speech, which went through in detail all the big issues in this agreement which must be debated and tested and which are at the moment unclear—the Erasmus programme, workers’ rights, the ability of artists and professionals to travel across the continent, what will happen to financial services, which are outside this treaty, business services and the nature of the security partnership. Noble Lords need only read the headings of each of the 40 clauses in the Bill, which relate to matters as big as any that your Lordships have ever debated and legislated for, to see the importance of the issues at stake. What is happening today is not just, as the noble Lord, Lord Ashton, said, not in keeping with our usual practices—I must say that that is the understatement of the parliamentary year; it is the noble Lord’s job to try to keep our proceedings as low key as possible—but something that the House should regard as totally unacceptable.

We are where we are. Today is the 30th and the Bill must become law, so I do not propose that we reimpose Committee stage, but it is important that we put on record that these arrangements are unacceptable. They will be regarded as a precedent in future. They treat the general public, who are looking at our proceedings and expecting us to legislate with scrutiny, with contempt. That is why it is right that we put on record that we deplore these arrangements. With that in mind, I beg to move as an addition to the Chief Whip’s Motion that

“this House regrets the gross abuse of the Parliamentary process and lack of any opportunity for effective scrutiny that has been necessitated by the failure of Her Majesty’s Government … to enable Parliament to meet in a more timely manner, and … to make other provisions for the rights of Parliament to be upheld.”

[The Deputy Speaker (Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall) (Lab)]

My Lords, the original Question was that the first Motion in the name of the Lord Privy Seal be agreed to, since when a second amendment has been moved by the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, as set out on the Order Paper. The Question before the House is that the second amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, be agreed to. I have received no notification, but I suspect the noble Lord, Lord Stoneham, would like to speak.

Patents (Amendment) (EU Exit) Regulations 2018

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Monday 14th January 2019 Grand Committee

[Lord Henley]

Will the noble Lord sit down? I have not given way to him. The noble Lord can make his point when I have given way.

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall) (Lab)]

My Lords, it might be for the convenience of the Committee if I were to put the Question so that the debate can then continue.

[Lord Adonis]

My Lords, I do not think it is for the convenience of the Committee, because the noble Lord has just made a direct allegation that I was not present in my place to listen to his response. The reason is that I was speaking in the debate on the EU withdrawal agreement in the Chamber. I have made the point to the Whips, including on our side, that it is highly unsatisfactory for the debate to be taking place in the Grand Committee on regulations concerning exactly the same matters as are being debated in the Chamber. It is not possible, even for the noble Lord with his considerable abilities, to be present in two places at once. It is because I wished to participate to the debate—it is a discourtesy to the House that I am not able to be present for most of it, because I am fulfilling my duties in the Grand Committee—that I was not here. I hope the noble Lord will withdraw the remark he just made, which appeared to imply—maybe because he was not aware that I was in the Chamber—that I was not fulfilling my duties. After he has noted that I was not here because I was in the Chamber, I think he needs to answer this point to begin with. Otherwise, I will continue interrupting until he actually gives us some information on what consultation took place on this regulation—before we can properly consider it and whether we think the consultation that took place was adequate.

Intellectual Property (Exhaustion of Rights) (EU Exit) Regulations 2018

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Monday 14th January 2019 Grand Committee

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall) (Lab)]

My Lords, it might be helpful, as this is the first instrument that the Committee has considered this afternoon, if I remind the Committee that the Motion is to consider the draft instrument and that it will be the subject of an approval Motion before the House in any event, whatever the decision of the Grand Committee. I also remind the Committee that a single voice of not content will negative the Motion.

The Question is that this Motion be agreed to. As many as are of that opinion will say “Content”; to the contrary “Not content”.

[Lord Adonis]

Not content.

Quality and Safety of Organs Intended for Transplantation (Amendment) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Wednesday 9th January 2019 Grand Committee

[Baroness Manzoor]

I am afraid that is the only answer I can give, even if it is not one that the noble Lord, Lord Adonis, feels is adequate. If there are issues that I feel I need to write to noble Lords about, I will do so, but I think I have given the best answer that is available to me.

The noble Baroness, Lady Barker, raised an important point regarding traceability. The requirement to ensure the traceability of tissues and cells, including reproductive cells, will remain. UK-licensed establishments were already using systems to ensure traceability from donor to receiver of tissues and cells before the introduction of the single European code, and in most cases the code was added to the existing system. After exit, UK-licensed establishments will be able to use the same IT systems that they are using now if they want to. The code will be removed and establishments will use the traceability system that was in place before the introduction of the single European code.

The noble Baroness asked about the powers and the instruments in relation to the Secretary of State. The Secretary of State can make changes to deal with new safety issues, and that is what the SIs will enable to happen. If the Government decided to do that, though, they would need to make new regulations which would have to have parliamentary scrutiny at that point, so he cannot do it just like that.

I restate that all the points that I have made relating to all three SIs go across the board for all of them. I hope noble Lords will appreciate that I have done my best to answer as many of the points as I could, if not all of them. I cannot go any further in terms of processes of statutory instruments and what the Committee can or cannot do, nor can I comment on the wider EU Brexit deal.

I thank all noble Lords who have taken part in this excellent debate. I believe in the scrutiny of legislation, and noble Lords have certainly carried that out with gusto today. I beg to move.

[The Deputy Chairman of Committees (Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall) (Lab)]

The Question is that the Grand Committee do consider the draft Quality and Safety of Organs Intended for Transplantation (Amendment) (EU Exit) Regulations 2019.

[Lord Adonis]

Not content.

House of Lords (Hereditary Peers) (Abolition of By-Elections) Bill [HL]

Debate between Lord Adonis and Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall

Committee: 2nd sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Friday 7th September 2018 Lords Chamber

[Lord Adonis]

My Lords—

[Baroness McIntosh of Hudnall (Lab)]

My Lords—