Deregulation Bill
Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord McKenzie of Luton(9 years, 6 months ago)
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Lord Gardiner of Kimble
My noble friend is always extremely persuasive. Clearly, the record of these discussions will go back to the department.
In his amendments, the noble Lord seeks to place in the Bill the list of exempted areas where local authorities can continue to use CCTV to issue tickets in the post. The department does not think that it would be expedient to set the exemptions in primary legislation. It is conceivable that exemptions could be increased or reduced in the future, so it might be more desirable to include them in secondary legislation. Everyone will have their own view on what is the right balance for the use of CCTV, whether that is in parking, as your Lordships are debating today, or more widely. The Government have given careful consideration to the list of exemptions and, in particular, have reflected the views of those who responded to the consultation.
The noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, also seeks to introduce a requirement for impact assessments to be carried out for the provisions. As I am sure he will know, the Government have been clear in their determination to reduce the impact of rules and regulations on businesses and policymakers. Indeed, the Government’s Better Regulation Framework Manual, which was published in July 2013, states that impact assessments are required only for measures that regulate or deregulate business or concern the regulation of business. This clause applies only to local authorities that carry out parking enforcement, so we believe that no impact assessment is required.
Lord McKenzie of Luton
Will the Minister remind me what the criteria are for an equality impact assessment?
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
I think that I might need a little assistance on that, but I will return to it.
The noble Lord also suggested the insertion of a new clause that would prevent the measures in the Bill from affecting off-street parking. However, the measures in the Bill already apply only to on-street parking, so we consider that the noble Lord’s suggested new clause is not necessary.
I should also reply to my noble friend Lord Bradshaw on the issue of traffic flow. Local authorities will still be able to enforce parking. Indeed, the great majority of authorities do this without the use of CCTV. As I said, in those areas where traffic flow is vital, the Government have provided for CCTV to continue.
I promise to write to the noble Lord about equality impact assessments.
Lord McKenzie of Luton
My Lords, this is an important amendment, and we should thank the noble Lord, Lord Tope, for moving it on behalf of the noble Lord, Lord Low. As the noble Lord, Lord Tope, said, we all signed up to the Private Member’s Bill, which has stalled at the other end but is due for a Second Reading in January.
Under the existing legislation, it is illegal to drive on pavements and footpaths, but there is no specific prohibition against pavement parking. The ambiguity in the law means that most local authorities struggle to enforce restrictions, in contrast to London, which has operated a separate system since 1974. I understand that there are also exemptions in place in Exeter and Worcester. As the campaigning charity, Living Streets, said in written evidence to the Transport Select Committee:
“Inconsiderate parking can cause a major barrier to many vulnerable road users. It is clear that the current legislative situation relying on police enforcement isn’t working”.
Of course, there are some areas where parking on the pavement is unavoidable, and there are other legitimate reasons why it might sometimes be necessary—but all too often parking on the pavement obstructs access to pedestrians, forcing them to navigate busy and dangerous roads instead. Some 74% of adults report being forced to walk on the road because the pavement was being obstructed by cars and other vehicles. For some, pavement parking can effectively extinguish their right of way altogether. I refer to elderly people, people with buggies and those with disabilities. For them, cars that block the pavement can be a serious restriction on their freedom of movement.
I know that the measure proposed today has the support of the Guide Dogs UK, Age UK and several other organisations referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Tope. Banks of parked cars can also force cyclists to swerve into dangerous traffic flows, which can be especially dangerous on narrow roads. Pavements are not designed to bear the weight of cars, as the noble Lord, Lord Holmes, just said, let alone heavier goods vehicles; over time, they can become degraded, posing additional challenges for pedestrians and costs for local authorities.
The reality of the problem is not in contention, I suggest. In 2006, the Transport Select Committee said that the then Government,
“must grip the problem of pavement parking once and for all and ensure that it is outlawed throughout the country … rather than relying on the use of individual Traffic Regulation Orders on specific streets and local Acts to impose”,
a fine. Last year, the Transport Select Committee called for reform to end,
“a confusing patchwork approach across the country”,
and for a clarification of the rules for loading and unloading by haulage companies, and action to rectify the long-standing problems over poor signage. It is important that, even as the Government try to move towards allowing more diverse road signs from local authorities, common national standards can be agreed on this issue.
The status quo brings challenges for drivers as well as pedestrians and cyclists. The British Parking Association and the RAC Foundation all support the calls for change. Inappropriately parking vehicles can interfere with traffic flows for other road users, causing jams and congestion, and drivers are often unsure about restrictions—and which, if any, are in place. Given the growth in congestion on many of our roads, these problems are likely to be magnified in the years ahead.
The Government also seem to be in agreement, on the principle at least, that pavement parking is a problem that needs to be addressed. The amendment gives the Minister and the Government ample opportunity to do so. I urge them to take it.
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
My Lords, I first thank the noble Lord, Lord Tope, for speaking to the amendment; I am most grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Low, for tabling it.
The Government recognise entirely the importance of making the local environment convenient, safe and attractive to walk in, and of keeping footways in good order. I do not think anyone could have failed to be struck by all that my noble friend Lord Holmes of Richmond has said. However, as I think the noble Lord, Lord McKenzie, acknowledged, part of the dilemma is that there are indeed some streets where pavement parking may be inevitable, whether to maintain free passage of traffic, to allow loading and unloading or to allow the setting down of passengers in certain situations. I am afraid that I can think of instances when I have parked on a pavement for an elderly relative to get out safely, which I think was legitimate; it was not in London, either. There are therefore issues with a blanket ban, as the amendment is drafted, that are problematic.
Local authorities already have many powers to ban pavement parking; I have a list of them and they are quite considerable. However, I agree with my noble friend Lord Deben on this occasion. Local authorities are in the best position to decide on local parking restrictions and need to consider all road users when taking such decisions. A national ban of the type proposed would require local authorities to remove all existing restrictions, then to review their urban areas for where footway parking should nevertheless still be permitted, consult the community and erect new signage and markings, which would of course impose a burden on local government.
The amendment also proposes banning footway parking but allowing authorities to permit it where desired by a simple resolution. Circumvention of the traffic regulation order process would take away an important protection for the public. This process requires authorities to undertake consultation and advertise the proposals before councillors take final decisions. The Government’s guidance to local authorities makes clear that, during the appraisal of their parking policies, an authority should consider whether pavement parking is problematic in any part of its area. If it is, and is not covered by an existing traffic regulation order, the authority should consider amending the existing order or making a new one. Indeed, my noble friend Lady Kramer wrote to all English traffic authorities on 27 June this year to remind them of their existing, wide-ranging powers to prevent people from parking on the pavement where it is a problem.
Given the significant issues in managing a change of this scale, and the fact that authorities already have comprehensive powers to ban footway parking, I will ask the noble Lord to withdraw his amendment. However, before that, I want to emphasise that I am not asking the noble Lord to do that because the Government do not understand or accept the concerns that have been expressed. Indeed, the Government consulted the Disabled Persons Transport Advisory Committee on this. Although that body favours having no parking on the footway, it recognised that there would need to be exemptions from the national ban and that issues arise from this.
Although I am sure all noble Lords in the Committee will have every sympathy for what is intended, there are issues, which is why I ask my noble friend to withdraw his amendment.
Warm Home Discount (Amendment) Regulations 2014
Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord McKenzie of Luton
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
I may have to write to the noble Lord because this is getting intricate. However, we are intending to consult this spring on the changes to pension credit impacts. This will include impacts to the changes to the benefits system vis-à-vis, as the noble Lord mentioned, pension credit and universal credit. Therefore, the best thing I can do is to make sure that I get this absolutely right for the noble Lord. Rather like these regulations, some of it is quite intricate, and I would like to give the noble Lord a full answer to that particular point if that would be helpful.
Lord McKenzie of Luton
That would be very helpful, and I am grateful to the Minister. I will revert to this issue about the changes which the Government are proposing to the state pension. Part of that is that the savings credit will simply not be available in the future—it will disappear as a benefit. Therefore what discussions have taken place and what planning is under way to make sure of the position of people who currently access the warm home discount scheme because they are in receipt of that benefit? What will be their position and access in the future? That is a pretty important policy issue. We have tried to get some clarity via the Pensions Bill; it would be good to get some clarity somewhere on this.
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
Given the points the noble Lord has made, the best thing would be for me to include that issue in a letter. That would be more fulfilling as regards getting the answer he is looking for.
Lord McKenzie of Luton
It would be particularly helpful to have that explanation by the time we get to Third Reading of the Pensions Bill, as it is one of the few residual issues on that piece of legislation.
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
I shall ensure that the noble Lord gets a letter.
In conclusion, the noble Lord, Lord Grantchester, was right to say that the basis of this is to get the right groups targeted. This is part of the way in which the Government wish to address fuel poverty. It is right that the net effect is to ensure that another £34 million goes in to help families. I agree that we should look at how we simplify these matters, but under the regulations we are dealing with we need to have this amendment.
Localism Bill
Debate between Lord Gardiner of Kimble and Lord McKenzie of Luton
Lord Gardiner of Kimble
My Lords, I will speak to Amendment 144A in my name and that of my noble friend Lord Cathcart. The intention is to set out explicitly some types of disposals of land that should be exempted from the moratorium rules and that would therefore not require notification to the local authority. I am very aware of many discussions that noble Lords have had about seeking a positive result from what we do. I hope that the amendment will produce some harmony, because there are legitimate concerns from owners of private property.
New paragraph (a) proposed in Amendment 144A would exempt from the moratorium disposal of a listed asset where the asset forms part of a larger site that is held as a single legal estate. The intention is to avoid delaying the sale of a larger piece of land or an estate if one small part of it has been listed as an asset of community value. New paragraph (b) would exempt other types of disposals of land, such as bona fide gifts following a philanthropic donation, transfers between members of the same family, made as either a gift or a sale, land passed on by inheritance, transfers between associated companies or companies in the same group, and transfers between trustees or partners in a firm. Indeed, there may be other exemptions that other noble Lords are more aware of. The intention of this amendment is to avoid any disruption to internal transfers between business partners and trustees. It would not interfere with the rights of landowners to pass their land on to future generations.
Lord McKenzie of Luton
I start by reiterating that I hope it is clear that we on these Benches very much want to see the Government achieve their aspirations in these provisions. However, Amendment 144A in particular illustrates the danger we are getting into of making this very complicated and bureaucratic. For example, there is a proposition that transfers between companies in the same group should not be a relevant disposal. Let us reflect on how you would cast that provision. There are plenty of differing definitions of groups of companies around. If we think one step beyond that, what happens if you sell the shares of a company that owns the asset, but not the asset itself? If that company were not only to have the asset but another asset, for example, the group of pubs mentioned by the noble Lord, Lord Hodgson, where does that leave you? We ought to be focusing on something that is deliverable, even if at the edges it is a bit rough and not technically watertight. It offends me as an accountant to suggest that, but this group of amendments and the issues that were raised in respect of the previous amendment illustrate the complexity that we are in danger of building into this provision which could undermine it completely.