(1 month, 1 week ago)
Grand Committee
Lord in Waiting/Government Whip (Lord Katz) (Lab)
I meant to stand up at the start of the group, but the noble Lord, Lord Harper, was a little too quick on his feet. I just want to point out that we now have bang on an hour to finish the remaining groups, which I think that we can achieve, if we have concision in our remarks. That would be very helpful.
My Lords, I note the comment just made. I welcome the probing amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Harper. That is useful in the Bill, so I thank him for that.
I will speak to my Amendments 106 and 107. Together, they seek to form a coherent case for environmental accountability in the regulation of civil aviation. Amendment 106 asks the Secretary of State within 12 months of the Act passing to lay before Parliament a report assessing its impact on passenger information, on low-carbon travel choices and on emissions from civil aviation. The Bill contains important consumer protection measures, but a consumer framework is only as good as the information that it generates and the behaviour that it manages to change. The amendment asks a simple question: once the Act is on the statute book, how is it actually working?
My amendment calls for a report, which must address four things. First, it must address whether consumers are receiving clear and consistent information about the carbon emissions associated with their flights. Currently, there is no standard for presenting that, and the report would help to establish whether the Act drives progress. Secondly, it must address whether consumers are genuinely comparing aviation and rail options at the point of decision. At present, they largely cannot and booking platforms are entirely siloed. The integrated comparison of journey time door to door, total price and carbon footprint and the whole booking simplicity just barely exist for people who want to be able to do that. For short-haul routes, where rail is a credible alternative, this is a serious market failure. Thirdly, and relatedly, it must address whether consumer awareness of lower-carbon alternatives to short-haul flights has improved. Evidence from France and Sweden shows that better information helps to shift consumer behaviour. Fourthly, it must address the overall emissions trajectory of civil aviation, which, as we know, is one of the most difficult to decarbonise. Demand management, through better information, has an unavoidable role to play while sustainable aviation fuels and zero-emissions flight technology continue to mature.
The amendment would also require consultation with aviation, rail and consumer representatives. It would require the report to include recommendations, not merely descriptions. If the Act is working, the report will say so. If not, Parliament will have the information that it needs to act.
Amendment 107 addresses a related but distinct gap: the absence of any statutory environmental duty on the Civil Aviation Authority itself, particularly in relation to the new powers in the Bill. The duty that I am seeking is deliberately light touch. The amendment says that the CAA “must have regard to”. It does not override safety, does not prescribe outcomes and leaves the CAA to weigh its environmental responsibilities against its other functions. It would simply require those commitments to be present when decisions are made.
Three specific matters in subsection (2) are carefully drawn out: reducing greenhouse gases and other environmental impacts; supporting biodiversity and natural environment, consistent with the framework in the Environment Act 2021; and improving resilience in the aviation sector to the physical effects of our warming and changing climate. This would be in the form of an annual report, which would also be published to Parliament. It might be that the amendment is clunky and not acceptable because of how I have drafted it. I am more than happy to work with the Minister between now and Report. If there is a form of wording that could capture some of this in a better way, I am more than happy to discuss it.
Finally, I will speak to Amendment 115 in the name of noble Baroness, Lady Bennett of Manor Castle. This amendment is straightforward in its purpose. It seeks to insert a new clause requiring the Secretary of State to make regulations by statutory instrument to reduce carbon emissions from private aviation. These regulations could impose restrictions on private aircraft operations, impose changes on private aircraft movements, prohibit specific categories of movements and make different provisions for different classes of aircraft. This instrument would be subject to the negative procedure.
We have not talked about private aviation yet, but it is important. There is a compelling case here. Private jet movements in the United Kingdom have grown by over 40% since 2020. The carbon emissions per passenger of a private jet are on average five to 14 times higher than those of a commercial flight, yet private aviation sits entirely outside the consumer and environmental framework that this Bill seeks to create. That is a significant gap. The vast majority of private aviation growth is coming from short-haul flights and private aviation is a big part of that. It is in precisely these segments where we have the strongest leverage to change consumer action.
We cannot meet our obligations under the Climate Change Act, as have heard, without using some of those levers. Short-haul flights and private aviation are two of the matters that we need to move the dial on. On these Benches, we have considerable sympathy for the principles contained in this amendment and I welcome the challenge. However, I am not fully supportive of the drafting. The powers in subsection (2) of the new clause are substantial. They are broad, restrictive changes prohibiting entire categories of movements, yet subsection (3) subjects them only to the negative procedure. For powers of this reach, the affirmative procedure would provide more appropriate parliamentary scrutiny. We would welcome a clearer policy framework sitting behind the regulation-making powers, rather than leaving it entirely to ministerial direction.
To conclude, I hope that the Minister can tell the Committee what assessment the Government have made of private aviation emissions and whether a levy, perhaps proportionally hypothecated towards sustainable aviation, has been considered alongside perhaps a restrictions-based approach. How do the Government plan to regulate that sector, considering that it is not mentioned in the Bill?
(1 month, 1 week ago)
Grand CommitteeNo, I do not. The question I had to answer was that if you have a status quo and if you are going to make a change, you have to ask yourself, does the change drive an improvement in behaviour or outcomes? I simply was not persuaded that it would.
Picking up my noble friend’s point about perhaps having saved the Minister a bit of bother, I thought, when I was listening to him make his case, that there is, of course, the opportunity, when one is now both in opposition and on the Back Benches, to let the Minister do all the work. But since the event happened on my watch, as it were, and we put quite a lot of thought into whether we should make the change that my noble friend set out, and since the answers that he received from our noble friend Lady Vere of Norbiton when she was Aviation Minister were effectively on my behalf, I thought it would be a bit slopy-shouldered of me to sit here quietly, not say anything and not give the Committee the benefit of the thought process at least. Being slopy-shouldered has never really been my style, so I thought it was at least worth giving the Committee the benefit of the effort that went in on behalf of aviation consumers who were disadvantaged by this, the work that went on by the industry and the work that the Government did to try to put things right.
My final point is just to say that the industry—NATS, the airlines and the airports—demonstrated a remarkable ability to work together to serve the interests of consumers. The industry has a lot to be proud of in the way that it comes together when there are these difficult circumstances to serve the people who pay their wages.
Lord in Waiting/Government Whip (Lord Katz) (Lab)
Respectfully, before my noble friend responds for the Government, I point out to the Committee that it is a convention—I will put it no more strongly than that—that we let Back-Benchers come in before Front-Benchers. It rather dulls the flow of the argument if we go back from Front-Benchers to Back-Benchers. I urge all colleagues who want to make a contribution to do so before we get to Front-Benchers, because that generally aids the flow of debate.
My Lords, these amendments raise important questions about how we strengthen air passenger rights. As I said at Second Reading, the strong intention of the Bill is to increase protections. The Government’s approach is to build on a strong existing framework while preserving the flexibility to act where it is most needed and avoiding unintended or overly prescriptive requirements. Taking each amendment in turn, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, for her excellent work on the Aviation Accessibility Task and Finish Group report and for her amendments seeking to ensure that regulations are made in relation to the areas listed in Clause 1. I am very pleased to see the noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, in her place supporting that.
I confirm that the Government intend to make a serious change in the experience of disabled people when flying. The intention of this clause is to provide a non-exhaustive list of areas that can be addressed through regulations. While regulations exist in many of these areas, requiring regulations in all these areas may have unintended consequences. The list of areas currently included could be considered an exhaustive list and therefore prevent amendments on other areas of air passenger rights. Equally, it could require amendments where they may not be required.
This amendment would also require that any regulation made under this clause to address all the areas listed, which would not be necessary for every regulation made under the clause. I reassure the noble Baroness that many of the areas listed are already covered by existing regulations. The Bill allows us to strengthen and update those protections over time, while retaining the flexibility to act where it is most needed. I will discuss with her and others what the next steps will be, to give confidence that action will be taken in secondary legislation, because that is firmly the Government’s intent. That is a commitment to the noble Baroness and others, including the noble Baroness, Lady Grender, and the noble Earl, Lord Russell. I hope that the noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, feels able to withdraw her amendment.
I thank the noble Lord, Lord Moylan, for his amendment on price transparency. I reassure him that there is already legislation in place to ensure this. All mandatory fees, taxes, charges and surcharges must be included and broken down in the final price paid by the passenger. In addition, any non-mandatory costs, such as baggage or seat selection fees, should be clearly displayed during booking and should be on an opt-in basis, meaning that passengers select which options they want for their trip. The Civil Aviation Authority is already responsible for ensuring that airlines meet those requirements. In response to the noble Lord’s question, I note that the CAA publishes comparison tables for passengers on the charges and fees of different airlines and airports. Clause 2 will strengthen the CAA’s enforcement toolkit, enabling it to deal more efficiently with non-compliance.
I note the point from the noble Earl, Lord Russell, on the current issues with Ryanair charging parents to sit with their children. He will appreciate that I cannot comment since it is currently under investigation by the Competition and Markets Authority. For the reasons I have set out, I hope that the noble Lord, Lord Moylan, will not press his amendment.
I turn to the amendments from the noble Lord, Lord Moylan, on travel intermediaries. Consumers should be able to rely on fair and transparent information and functionality wherever they book air travel. I reassure the noble Lord that existing regulations already set out a code of conduct on computerised reservation systems. This seeks to ensure transparent, fair and non-discriminatory approaches for airlines and intermediaries. Should future reforms be necessary on this issue, they would be possible under Clause 1.
The noble Lord’s proposal for the CAA to produce a code on access to airline fares and booking systems for travel intermediaries concerns commercial arrangements between airlines and intermediaries, rather than air passenger rights. These are business-to-business matters for industry, with competition concerns best addressed through the existing body of competition law. It is also not clear that there is sufficient evidence of consumer harm to justify this level of government intervention. Although intermediaries play a role in providing choice to customers, it is not established that this is currently being undermined by a lack of transparency from airlines. Established transparency requirements are already in place, as I have mentioned. If evidence showed that further intervention was needed, Clause 1 powers could be used to consider that properly. For those reasons, I ask the noble Lord not to press his amendment.
I thank the noble Earl, Lord Russell, for his amendment seeking to expand Clause 1 to require upfront information at the time of ticket sales, as well as minimum standards and automated payments for compensation. In addition to requirements for transparency around pricing, there are also clear rules about the rights of passengers during disruption, including when compensation is payable. Clause 1, as drafted, can be used to strengthen these rights further, and we can discuss the Government’s intentions around this.
The noble Lord, Lord Holmes, asked about Delay Repay, which the previous Government considered under a past consultation. It was clear that there were both benefits and risks inherent in this approach, and several respondents noted that aviation is not comparable to rail due to the operational complexities in aviation. However, this could be considered through Clause 1 powers if necessary.
Work is already happening—I will not use the word “ongoing”—to increase transparency around the environmental impact of journeys. The CAA published a framework on implementing consumer environmental information for UK flights earlier this year. Airlines and other relevant organisations are expected to take adequate steps towards implementing this by April 2027. As a result, I hope that the noble Earl feels able not to press his amendment.
I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Grender, for her amendment, which would make regulations on consistent hand baggage sizing. Although I appreciate that this would give consumers consistency, it could have unforeseen consequences for passengers. I cannot, therefore, support this amendment. Aircraft have different overhead and under-seat storage capacities. Setting a standard size would necessitate using the smallest aircraft capacity, resulting in many passengers needing to use a smaller case or bag. Many passengers appreciate the flexibility of choosing add-ons, such as baggage, in order to be able to make decisions about how they travel in a way that works for them. This amendment could force more passengers to use checked baggage, which often comes with an additional fee and time inconvenience due to the need to drop off and collect bags. Moreover, there could be unintended consequences for passengers. I hope that this enables the noble Baroness not to press her amendment.
I now move on to the amendments relating to cabin air quality in the names of the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay of Llandaff, and the noble Lord, Lord Empey. All of us will of course be grateful to the noble Baroness and others for responding to medical incidents aboard aircraft; I am especially grateful to the noble Baroness for her knowledge of this subject, which is far more detailed than my own.
The safety of passengers and crew is vital. The department recognises and takes seriously the concerns raised around cabin air quality. The Government have commissioned independent studies and evidence reviews relating to cabin air. The most recent evidence review by the Committee on Toxicity concluded that
“the concentrations of the chemical contaminants … reported in aircraft cabin air are unlikely to cause adverse health effects in aircrew following acute or long-term exposures”.
Commercial aircraft are already required to meet and maintain a number of design requirements for certification, which include ventilation and cabin air flow. The Government are committed to keeping this area—in particular, the technological innovations described by the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay—under review. Operators are also required to report and investigate any incidents involving toxic cabin air. The CAA’s expert medical team regularly reviews every suspected cabin air incident and takes action if it identifies a concerning trend. I hope that this provides reassurance that there is a continuous mechanism to identify and investigate any cabin air issues; and that noble Lords will therefore feel able not to press their amendments.
I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, for her amendment relating to the enforcement of regulations. The Government will ensure that any regulations made under Clause 1 can be properly enforced. This will be enhanced by the CAA’s direct enforcement powers, which are being introduced via Clause 2. The purpose of Clause 1(3) is to outline the types of enforcement provision that can be made in regulations under Clause 1. Amending the wording from “may” to “must” would mean that any regulations made under this clause would have to contain all the enforcement provisions listed. This would not be necessary for all regulations made under this clause. Consideration of any enforcement provisions will be given during the policy development and secondary legislation process. This will be subject to appropriate and full assessment of the available evidence. For these reasons, I hope that the noble Baroness will not press her amendment.
On alignment with the EU, I agree with the noble Baroness, Lady Grender, that we must maintain a high level of consumer protections in aviation. Since leaving the European Union, the UK has had the flexibility to set its own approach. The power in Clause 1 enables the UK to keep pace with the EU and, where we choose to do so, to go further. As I have said, the intention of Clause 1 is to strengthen and enhance air passenger rights through secondary legislation. This is in line with the shared UK-EU objective, under the trade and co-operation agreement, to achieve a high level of consumer protections; it also gives us flexibility to improve on these standards over time. However, requiring all future reforms to be “equal or superior” to the current standards is subjective and could have unintended consequences.
Similarly, on the noble Baroness’s further amendment on automatic alignment with Regulation 261/2004, requiring the UK to mirror both the current EU framework and any future changes to that regulation, including those currently in course in the EU, would place a statutory obligation to follow EU reforms without discretion. Although we continue to monitor developments closely, it is important that the UK retains the flexibility to design a complex compensation regime based on the evidence, consultation and what works best for UK passengers and the aviation sector. Therefore, although I agree with the intent that the Bill is used to strengthen rather than reduce protections—and I believe that Clause 1 would allow for this—I would welcome further discussion on this. Meanwhile, I ask the noble Baroness not to press her amendment.
(1 year, 4 months ago)
Lords ChamberI was wondering what I had said in April 2022. When I spoke to the Rail Industry Association, it was in respect of industrial relations in Network Rail, which I had the privilege to chair for nine years with 30,000-odd employees. What was very successfully concluded in the summer of 2023 was a ground-breaking deal with extensive productivity in a public sector corporation. It was not widely celebrated by the Government of the time because they did not welcome that progress, but it was very much in line with what I said in April 2022.
Lord Katz (Lab)
My Lords, I draw your Lordships’ attention to my register of interests. Does my noble friend not agree that the lamentable record of the previous Government when it comes to industrial relations on the railway demonstrates the need for an independent guiding mind in the form of GBR, which we will hopefully legislate for soon? Does it not demonstrate the need to have an organisation that can take the heat and the fire—and, I might say, in some cases, the ideological approach—out of industrial relations on the railway and set a positive, modern and long-term framework for workforce relations in that sector?
Not only do I completely agree with my noble friend, but the noble Lord, Lord Moylan, might recall that, when he was deputy chair of Transport for London and I was the commissioner, we went to the ends of the earth to keep industrial relations matters away from the political leadership of the mayor and within the organisation. The right way of concluding both wages and conditions is for the employer to negotiate with the recognised trade unions of the employees, and political influence does not help much in those relationships.