Visas: European Union Students

Baroness Garden of Frognal Excerpts

Monday 4th November 2019 Lords Chamber

Asked by

[Baroness Garden of Frognal]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what guidance they have given to universities recruiting European Union students on courses longer than three years concerning the eligibility of such students for a visa for the duration of their studies.

[The Minister of State, Home Office (Baroness Williams of Trafford) (Con)]

My Lords, the Government will continue to welcome all international students who wish to study in our world-leading higher education sector after we leave the EU. We will ensure that there are visa arrangements in place to allow all EEA students who start studying a course in the UK after we leave the EU to complete their course, whether we leave with or without a deal.

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

My Lords, at the moment there is no guarantee beyond the three years of the European temporary leave to remain visa, and many university programmes are four years or more: the Scottish university courses, medicine, dentistry, many part-time courses and so on. What reassurance can the Government give that these students will definitely be able to complete courses that go beyond three years? If they cannot do so, is this not every encouragement for those much-needed EU students to choose to study in other countries?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

It is pleasing to note that the number of students from EEA and non-EEA countries who come to this country to study continues to rise. There is no suggestion that those on courses longer than three years will be unable to complete them. Those with Euro TLR will be able to make an application under the student route before their leave expires.

International Widows Day

Baroness Garden of Frognal Excerpts

Wednesday 19th June 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

My Lords, I join in the thanks to the noble Lord, Lord Loomba, for this debate on a topic on which he knows so much and has done so much good work. I know that his particular interest is widows in developing countries, but the inclusion of International Widows Day gives me an opportunity to speak on widows closer to home. I offer my sympathy to the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. My late husband was an RAF officer for 30 years and I am a vice-president of the War Widows Association of Great Britain; the wonderful noble Baroness, Lady Fookes, is its much-loved president.

Widows in developing countries face challenges which we hope that our widows no longer do, but our widows have not always been treated with compassion and care. I first came face to face with widowhood nearly 50 years ago in RAF Germany with my husband, where a good friend’s husband ploughed into the airfield while practising for a display for the families’ day that weekend. Her children were four and a few months old. The station commander and his wife duly appeared on her doorstep to break the news, closely followed by the information that, without a serving officer in the house, she would need to move out as soon as possible, since she was no longer entitled to live in a married quarter. The problem was that she had nowhere to go; nor did she have any money, as he had not served quite long enough to have earned a pension. Her life was really tough. These days, the Royal Air Force Benevolent Fund often steps in to help with housing, but not then. She got help from the fund for her children’s education at an RAF school, and was always touched that it sent presents which she could not afford for birthdays and Christmas.

These days, things have greatly improved in the military. The newly bereaved have an effects officer allocated to cope with the practicalities and the War Widows Association uses its skill as a pressure group to improve the conditions of widows and their dependants in Great Britain. In answer to the noble Baroness, Lady Hodgson, it is currently conducting a survey of widows to gather experiences and stories, which it hopes will help to inform people about the work. Its work encompasses those who have suffered bereavement as a result of World War II and all conflicts since then, including Iraq and Afghanistan. As the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, said, many of them are actually very young. Its campaigns have improved the conditions of war widows and war widowers, including ending the situation where widows lost their meagre pensions if they found happiness with someone else. There are regional organisers who offer friendship and support. They organise social events and telephone calls to those who can no longer get to events, because loneliness can feature large in widows’ lives.

Remembrance is very important. We have our own Cenotaph service on the Saturday before the national Remembrance Day. At one stage, war widows were not allowed to march on the Sunday; these days they are, and young and old can be seen stepping out proudly with the Sunday parade, but we still value the Saturday ceremony too. Hearing their experiences can be really humbling, while making one quite angry at the way in which widows can be left to fend for themselves without support or money. To hear of mothers who struggle to return from overseas and find work while caring for small children, or to hear of their efforts in making ends meet with resourcefulness and courage, all the while coping with grief and the loss of a life partner, really makes you stop and count blessings. As I have discovered—to my cost—there is a great camaraderie of widows, which I trust is true in other countries too.

It has taken us a while to support the widows of men serving our country, but even they can be better off than civilian widows, who often have nowhere to turn. When I worked for the citizens advice bureau, I well remember the distraught people with no idea how to arrange a funeral, sort finances or generally cope with life without a partner. The CAB could offer practical advice and point to counsellors or often churchmen, because religious people can be rather wonderful at times of death.

As we have heard, in developing countries there is often a stigma in being a widow, to add to all the practical and emotional problems of losing a breadwinner and partner. But there can be a stigma here too: old friends tend to avoid those bereaved, lest they cause upset. Quite often on social occasions, people do not particularly relish having an odd one out. In some countries, widows lack legal rights, cannot inherit and experience violence and ostracism, as we have heard powerfully from the noble Lords, Lord Loomba and Lord Parekh, and others. Losing a husband can mean losing the wherewithal for life, love and respect, but we hope not here.

What actions have the Government taken since the debate in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Loomba, last year to support and empower widows? Has the violence against women and girls help desk been able to intervene to help widows? As we try to treat our widows with more compassion and support, has the Minister suggestions on how we can reach out to those in other countries whose suffering is more acute than the grief and sorrow which are part of the lot of any widow?

Brexit: Foreign Language Teaching and Public Service Interpreting

Baroness Garden of Frognal Excerpts

Wednesday 23rd January 2019 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

My Lords, I join in thanking the noble Baroness, Lady Coussins, for introducing this debate. She is a tireless supporter of modern foreign languages and has campaigned for the public sector interpreters in their attempts not to be undercut by cheaper but far less qualified people. I thank those who have sent us briefings for this debate. The noble Lord, Lord Dykes, mentioned the Library briefing, and we also heard from the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Modern Languages about its views. It is a great pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Hannay, who speaks with such expertise on these matters. I agree with absolutely everything he said.

We know that translation can increasingly be done online—sometimes with some rather bizarre results, I have to say, but nevertheless it can be done. But the very specialist task of interpreting, particularly for such people as court interpreters, cannot be so easily mechanised. They need to have a knowledge of legal procedures as well as language skills. We shall continue to need skilled interpreters, in very many diverse languages, to ensure that people who do not speak English are fairly represented. But we have not sent out messages of welcome for these specialist professionals and many have returned or are returning to home countries. People have a right to interpretation and translation in criminal proceedings; their very freedom may depend on fully understanding court procedures and their case being fairly put.

As we have already heard, as transnational organised crime becomes ever more sophisticated and complex across borders and languages, the police need interpreters and translators—not all thugs are British. So does the NHS, where communication issues can have consequences for health outcomes and fundamental rights such as patient confidentiality and consent. We certainly cannot rely on foreign nurses being there to help with translation, because the latest figures from the Nursing and Midwifery Council have shown that the number of new nurses coming from the EU to work in the UK has dropped by 87%, from 6,382 in 2016-17 to a mere 805 in 2017-18. This poses a real dilemma for the NHS and British citizens are unlikely to fill the gap.

I declare an interest as an honorary fellow of the Chartered Institute of Linguists. I read French and Spanish at university, lived in France as a child, in Spain as a student and taught in a Gymnasium while living in Germany with my RAF husband. That required a rather speedy learning curve to make sure I could understand at least enough German to know what the students were saying about me in class. I have always considered myself European, I am distraught by Brexit and I have always had a fascination with languages. Like the noble Lord, Lord Dykes, I enjoy learning them and do not find it too difficult, although when I became a member of the UK-Japan group I went into Waterstones to buy Teach Yourself Japanese in Three Weeks and the man selling it looked at me and said, “You won’t, you know”, and he was dead right: I have found that Japanese is a challenge too far.

It is deeply disturbing that the numbers studying modern languages have declined dramatically in recent years. In 2002 76% of students took a language. This was down to 47% in 2017 and, as we have heard, universities are closing their language departments. In both schools and universities, we are increasingly dependent on foreign nationals, particularly those from the EU, filling teaching posts. We have heard from the noble Baroness, Lady Coussins, and others that we have a recruitment crisis in modern foreign language teaching. As the noble Lord, Lord Thurlow, said, we need to attract native speakers of languages to come and fill those posts in our schools. How can young people be enthused by languages if there are not enough enthusiastic linguists to inspire them? We will end up in a vicious circle: there are not enthusiastic teachers, so the children do not get enthusiastic and do not go on to learn languages, and so the decline happens. This is really not helped by the perception that it is more difficult to get a good grade in languages than in other subjects.

As the noble Lord, Lord Thurlow, said, young people’s horizons can be broadened by learning languages. In doing so, they learn about other cultures and communities. The EU has stated that foreign language skills are important for citizens’ social cohesion and employability, and for the continent’s competitiveness and economic growth. If that is true for the EU, it is certainly also true for the UK. The education sector is extremely concerned about barriers to recruiting from abroad. Higher education institutions are particularly concerned about the risks to international mobility and co-operation for teaching and research. Of course, they derive immense benefit from EU funding and collaboration.

Foreign nationals contribute to the UK economy and help create the UK’s vibrant and world-leading research and innovation system. In universities and colleges, it is not just in the language departments: we read that in economics alone 64% of academic staff are non-UK nationals. There are real concerns that, post Brexit, there will need to be a significant increase in the number of visas to be issued, bringing increased cost and administration. There are currently just under 50,000 EU academic and non-academic staff employed by universities. Not all may need visas; certainly not all will be earning the threshold salary of £30,000, already referred to, which the Government are proposing; but all are doing jobs which may not be easily filled by native British people. There are many laboratory technicians and language assistants, for instance, whose work is invaluable. What plans do the Government have to issue visas and what guidance will be given to those who have not needed visas hitherto but who may in the future? Speed and simplicity will be of the essence. What about the threshold salary, which will be an enormous barrier to so many in the education world?

If we do leave the EU, it will be more important than ever that we can speak the languages of the neighbours we have turned our backs on. Why should they bother to speak English if we are no longer in the club? If or when the UK leaves the EU, only 1% of the EU population will speak English as a first language—little incentive for it to keep its dominance. French and German are waiting in the wings to resume their rightful place. As Willy Brandt was reported to have said: “If I am selling to you, I will speak your language, but if I am buying, dann müssen Sie Deutsch sprechen”. I will not insult the House by translating that. How will our trade deals look if we insist on speaking English loudly?

The Government’s ambiguity about the status of EU nationals has added to uncertainties and encouraged more of them to return to their countries of origin. A head teacher recently told me that a brilliant Polish physics teacher had decided to return to Poland so that her job could be given to a British teacher. Some hope! Physics teachers are like gold dust and the prospect of a replacement was a dim one.

Moving slightly away from teaching and interpreting, another sector which would be profoundly affected is the hospitality sector, which would be lost without foreign workers. British people, it seems, are not prepared to work in industries which require late hours, weekend working and hard physical work. I was talking to the owner of a West End restaurant recently who said he could not find any British people to come and work there because they did not like the hours. We enjoy eating in restaurants and staying in hotels but our choices will be severely limited if there are no foreign nationals to staff them.

We have wasted precious time in leaving EU citizens in uncertainty. The Government are now trying to make up for lost time, but for some it will be too little and too late. What is the Government’s long-term plan? What steps are they taking to ensure that EU citizens and other foreign nationals who are such a crucial part of the workforce and the community will be warmly encouraged to stay, with any administration as simple, friendly and cheap as possible? We have very real concerns about the future of our country without the very many foreign nationals who contribute so greatly. I look forward to the Minister’s reply.

Refugees (Family Reunion) Bill [HL]

Baroness Garden of Frognal Excerpts

Committee: 1st sitting (Hansard): House of Lords
Friday 11th May 2018 Lords Chamber

I share the delight of the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, that we heard nothing about the “pull factor” last time we talked about this—and I really hope that we will not hear anything about it today.

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

I speak briefly in support of my noble friend’s Bill and against the amendment proposed by the noble Lord, Lord Marlesford. The Bill is about united families and his amendment would see families split in different ways. The Bill really does not open the floodgates to hordes of ravening immigrants. As my noble friend set out, we are talking about small numbers, and this is a small and measured way of helping refugee families in trouble and distress to be together. We have had some excellent briefings from SOS Children’s Villages, which says:

“Children who have been separated from their families are some of the most vulnerable, having lost the people primarily responsible for making decisions on their behalf, guaranteeing their safety and supporting their development to adulthood”.


It is both heartening and heart-rending to read the tales of some of those children, who have battled against the odds with courage and determination and, for the small numbers involved, the measures in this Bill could be transformational.

This is a humanitarian Bill in the best traditions of the society that we should aspire to be, which welcomes those in need, cares for refugees and offers hope and support, particularly for children who have already suffered so much. These are people who can and will contribute to the community; in the past, these are the very people who have contributed not only to the community but indeed to the economy. It is the right and moral way, and I urge the Government to support the Bill unamended as it passes through the House.

Asylum Seekers: Students

Baroness Garden of Frognal Excerpts

Wednesday 9th May 2018 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

My Lords, I stress to the noble Earl that anyone under the age of 18 in the UK has a right to study. That covers asylum-seeking children and children who are dependants of migrant workers. The following people can also study: care leavers, to whom the noble Earl alluded, former unaccompanied asylum-seeking children without standing claims, appeals or ongoing litigation concerning their asylum application, and any adult asylum-seekers without standing claims and/or appeals.

[Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD)]

My Lords, what the Minister says does not quite seem to accord quite with some of the tales that have been coming out. There have been some really sad and shameful stories of young people who have been totally affected by this ban on education. What, if any, inquiries are made of the individual before deciding to impose this condition on them?

[Baroness Williams of Trafford]

Because of the nature of the Question of the noble Baroness, Lady Hamwee, I can say that there may be cases that have fallen foul of a study restriction. As I said, it is not mandatory to impose a restriction on study, and it should be imposed only where appropriate. We are proactively looking at cases that might have been affected and are issuing new immigration bail notices.