Football Governance Bill [HL]

Baroness Taylor of Bolton Excerpts

Consideration of Commons amendments and / or reasons
Tuesday 15th July 2025 Lords Chamber

Thirdly, seeking to balance these two objectives, the amended Bill recognises that this should be light-touch regulation, with the regulator intervening only where it is necessary. I thank the Secretary of State, the Minister and the Bill team for their efforts to engage with me and with other noble Lords to improve the Bill. I congratulate the Secretary of State, the Minister and the Bill team on their significant achievement in managing this Bill and, mixing the sporting metaphors, getting it over the line.

[Baroness Taylor of Bolton (Lab)]

My Lords, I will say a few words in support of what the Minister said this evening. It is right that we talk a little about the new arrangements for mediation and the backstop. The original amendment was overcomplex, but many of us were concerned about the binary nature of the choice that was to be made. For many of us, the important factor in finding a way forward was that we maintained a backstop, because we are not talking about negotiations between equal partners. That is why we needed the retention there; that is very important. I congratulate Ministers on finding a way through this which is satisfactory to everybody who expressed concerns and wanted to move forward.

I welcome what the two previous speakers said about the new independent regulator. He is intent on making this job work and moving things forward very quickly, which is exactly what football needs.

On behalf of my noble friend Lord Bassam, who cannot be here this evening, we are very impressed by and very much welcomed the engagement of the Minister in this House, my noble friend Lady Twycross. It is a model of how Ministers, Back-Benchers, civil servants and external parties can react. I am very glad to see the noble Lord, Lord Parkinson, nodding, because we have not agreed on every aspect of this Bill. That has been important.

I should declare my interest: I am looking forward to the new season, with Bolton Wanderers playing Stockport on that first Saturday—I think I am looking forward to it anyway. Bolton Wanderers went through all the problems that are very well known. I was struck, in the final stages of the debate in the other place, by how many individual MPs had to get up to say that their individual clubs had just gone through difficulties or were facing similar difficulties in the very near future; Sheffield Wednesday is the most obvious example.

The need for this Bill is well and truly proven. It is now in extremely good shape, and I congratulate those who have been involved. We should mention Tracey Crouch, who started this process with her review. I will also say that I am very pleased that three talented women Ministers have been the ones to see this through.

[Lord Goddard of Stockport (LD)]

My Lords, I will be reasonably brief. The noble Lord, Lord Burns, covered most of what I was going to say on the technical stuff. We sent the Bill back, and I think everybody agreed it was not perfect. Then we got this list of amendments back, and my heart sank at the thought of another 12 hours’ debate on each and every one of them. The only person whose eyes lit up was the noble Lord, Lord Pannick, who obviously gets paid by the hour by Manchester City. We are nine months into waiting for the 115 charges result; we are still playing a lot of extra time on that one, but let us park it. I am not sure who is the underdog in the game between Bolton Wanderers and Stockport County, but it will be an interesting encounter.

We went over these amendments to try to find fault with them, to pick something out, and to see whether the Government were trying to slide something through. Honestly, they have improved the Bill tremendously, and that is partly because of the slight input from the regulator designate, who has clarified the situation. We were a little bit in the dark before about what we thought the role should be and what it was morphing from and to, but just talking to David and understanding his love of what he is going to do, and hearing the passion with which he speaks about being the regulator, tells me it is in safe hands.

I had a number of chairmen, not so much from Championship but from League One and League Two clubs, emailing me, and I said that it is going to be good for the game. That is really where I have always been: at the bottom of the pyramid. The Premier League is fantastic—it will flourish and it will carry on delivering—but League One and League Two clubs, and some of those in non-league clubs, will take a deep breath now and say, “Let’s see this happen”. It will give them that certainty and hope that there will always be something there for them when times are difficult. I have known football clubs that have had to come to local authorities and beg and borrow for assistance. That is a difficult thing to do with public funds, but we did it, and the benefits for the economy, for local councils and for shopkeepers are there now for all to see. The community is all football, and if you had any doubt about that, you would look at this.

I have no complaints about Chelsea becoming the world champions, but that was the most ridiculous competition in the most ridiculous place. Any regular football fan seeing two o’clock in the morning kick-offs was the Armageddon that was said would happen to us. It has not happened because we have got our Bill through; we have got our ducks in a line, and we will be able to protect the league that we love and cherish. I wish the Bill well on its way now. We can move forward. If the noble Baroness has nothing to do, she might want to help me out with the employment Bill tomorrow if she is free, because that is another challenging Bill.

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[Lord Moynihan of Chelsea (Con)]

My Lords, despite the very kind words of my noble friend the senior Lord Moynihan, and indeed of the noble Lord, Lord Goddard, I understand that we have to be careful in declaring our interests. I declare myself a season ticket holder of the Club World Cup champions of the world, whose games I have been attending since 1958—a time when many noble Lords were not even alive.

As we enter what we might call the final minutes of extra time on this Bill, it would certainly be churlish of me not to repeat the words of my noble friend Lord Maude about the Minister’s very careful and kind attention throughout this Bill, and the improvements that have been made as this Bill has come back from the Commons. But somebody must stand up and say that there is an opinion that can be heard in this House that a regulator is a really bad idea for this sector.

In saying that, I accept that it was our side, scoring, as you might say, an own goal, who started all of this. I hope that, if ever we come to power again, we have leaders who do not say, “There go the people, I must follow them”, but who think rather longer-term, not about how football fans respond to artfully constructed opinion polls but how football fans will react to the depredations of this regulator, however well-intended and good—and everybody on all sides has applauded the selection of the regulator—that will make this sector worse, and possibly very bad.

Why do we have this regulator? Because, as the noble Baroness, Lady Taylor, mentioned, Bolton football club took some risks, went bust and got relegated. Is Bolton football club no longer? Has it now vanished? Oh, no, it is still around. For those who are not massively enamoured of or conversant with the world of business—it appears that most of the Cabinet is comprised of those who have never been involved in business—it may come as a surprise to know that this is how business works. You take risks and sometimes you go bust, then you get re-formed, as Bolton football club did, and you carry on, with the same fans and the same ground. They are in a lower division but can fight back and get re-elected to higher divisions.

[Baroness Taylor of Bolton (Lab)]

Time is late, so I do not want to go through the whole history of Bolton Wanderers, but the noble Lord’s facts are not quite correct. What we are concentrating on here is that all clubs should have a better business approach to football and not just rely on wealthy local individuals or people who come along and buy up a club. We need a fit and proper persons test. That is the kind of progress we will be making. We need to make sure that, all through the pyramid, there is a better business approach to football. That is what the new regulator will help create.

[Lord Moynihan of Chelsea (Con)]

I thank the noble Baroness. It is a pity we are discussing football and not chess, where maybe the clock would have been stopped to give me the time I would need in view of that lengthy interruption. The noble Baroness has made my point. In life, one takes risks. The fact that we have in this country the best football in the world is because enormous risks were taken in setting up the Premier League, and it has been enormously successful.

The noble Baroness was basically saying, “We know best and, to impose our view of how it should be—the non-commercial view—we will have a regulator. By the way, when we have the regulator, we will impose all sorts of little baubles on the Christmas tree”, as we discussed earlier in these debates. One example was EDI. She was basically saying, “We will impose EDI on all football clubs. Just as that pernicious doctrine is fading away, we’re going to impose it”. The Labour Party—God bless—won an election and has the right to impose these Bills. I am merely warning about what will happen.

I wrote to the Minister, who very kindly responded at length. The Labour Government often pray in aid the McKinsey studies on how EDI is a jolly good thing and leads to better organisations. I wrote to her pointing out that the McKinsey work has been completely discredited. She kindly wrote back to me saying, “Yes, I agree that the McKinsey work has been discredited, but many other studies have not been discredited and show that EDI is a jolly good thing”. So I called one of the most senior people at McKinsey and said, “Your studies have all been discredited, haven’t they?”. He said yes. I said, “Well, people are saying that there are many other studies that support the EDI idea”. He said, “There aren’t any. We’ve looked for them. They aren’t there”. The Minister did not give me examples—she may have examples, but she did not give me any in the letter—of anything but the utterly discredited McKinsey idea of EDI. That is just one example of the kind of baubles that have been put on this Christmas tree and that will make things worse in our industry.

It is indeed late, as noble Baroness said, and I will try to wrap up. We do not know best; the market knows best. The market has produced one of the most extraordinarily successful industries that we have in this country. We are going to try to take the market away and impose on it all sorts of rules. I am here just to put down a marker—