Veterans Advisory and Pensions Committees Bill

Debate between Greg Smith and Robin Millar

2nd reading
Friday 24th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Robin Millar (Aberconwy) (Con)]

I beg to move, That the Bill be now read a Second time.

I cannot help but observe that today is 12 months since Putin invaded Ukraine, which we marked in the Chamber earlier today. I make clear my admiration and support for the stubborn resistance of the people of Ukraine, which has inspired all in the free world and put fear in the hearts of their would-be conquerors. This grim spectacle of the return of war to Europe must serve as a reminder, if one were needed, that the privileges and freedoms we enjoy have been hard won and, in many ways, are a gift offered by those willing to stand guard over our nation and democracy and, when required, to fight to protect it. It is their interests that this Bill seeks to promote.

I start by thanking Members on both sides of the House who have supported the Bill to this stage, many of whom have a service background. In particular, I thank Lord Lancaster, whose work on an amendment to the Armed Forces Act 2021 was the forerunner to this Bill. I also thank those across the veterans community, including many of my constituents, and the supportive charities and organisations for their feedback and thoughts.

Although the Bill contains provisions of particular interest to veterans and their families, it is clear from my conversations with Members from all walks of life and all political leanings that a desire to support our services community is widespread across the House, which should not be a surprise. After all, British forces were deployed to conflict zones in every year from 1945 to 2021. For service personnel, the last 25 years have been defined by relentless conflict, with deployments to wars in Kosovo, Sierra Leone, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria and Mali. These former servicemen and women, to whom we owe so much, represent about one in 25 of our fellow citizens—1.9 million people. Since world war two, they have seen their colleagues fall in 29 conflict zones across the world. They have provided vital aid, disaster relief and peacekeeping in dozens more.

As I stand here today, British forces are deployed to support our allies across 17 nations. They continue to ensure safe passage on the world’s oceans and, of course, they watch and stand ready in defence of our borders. They are the vital deterrent against those who would threaten our freedoms, our borders and our way of life. I know the whole House will agree that we owe a great debt to these men and women.

Conwy has the highest proportion of veterans of any county in Wales and, when I have met them, it has been a privilege to discuss life after service and, on occasion, their time in the armed forces. I have also had the privilege of meeting many serving men and women through the armed forces parliamentary scheme. The opportunity to discuss their lives and mission today has been incredibly insightful and humbling, a feeling that I know is shared by many colleagues here this afternoon. It is one of my key motivations in introducing this Bill.

Most veterans will speak of the benefits of fulfilling careers and excellent training. They will live long, happy and fulfilled lives after leaving service. Indeed, many make an invaluable contribution to our life in Aberconwy, to their family, their community and wider society. For some, however, the transition to the civilian world is a challenge. Their struggle to deal with the practicalities of everyday life is very real. They may require help to access services, tailored mental and physical healthcare, appropriate housing, opportunities for employment, simply adjusting to the conventions of civilian life, timely financial support or, indeed, some combination of these. These stresses point to a clear duty owed by us and society to veterans, one that this Bill aims to further in a modest but important way.

In Aberconwy, I have been impressed by the work of established institutions such as Blind Veterans, which operates its principal facilities, serving veterans from across the UK and beyond, from its hospital overlooking Llandudno. I have been moved by the spontaneous emergence of groups and initiatives from within the community in Aberconwy, such as Military Minds football club and the Troop Café. These are the organic and dynamic organisations—the network of Burke’s “little platoons”—that need encouragement and enabling in their work of support for veterans more than they need any direction or regulation. It is that spirit of enabling volunteers that the Bill is intended to promote.

The Government, of course, have the first responsibility in the care and support of our veterans, and I have been proud of this Government’s pursuit of making the UK the most supportive society in the world for veterans and their families. Among other changes, we have enshrined the armed forces covenant as a statutory duty at all levels of public service. Last year, that helped 13,000 veterans’ families improve their accommodation, supported the education of 80,000 service family children, and brought into operation the veterans’ mental health high intensity service.

It would, however, be disingenuous not to recognise the long-standing concerns over the delivery of support services to veterans and their families. That can at times be disjointed, uneven and even untimely. It can also be over-bureaucratic, fostering a complexity that both prevents access and creates gaps through which the deserving and needy may fall. By way of example, just three weeks ago my office was contacted by an RAF veteran in need of a hip replacement. He was aware of the veterans orthopaedic centre in Gobowen and the services it offers, but neither he nor his GP knew how to access that referral process, despite the presence in the local health board of an armed forces champion tasked with disseminating information about working with veterans to relevant organisations such as councils and GPs.

You will be pleased to know, Mr Deputy Speaker, that this brings me to the substance of the Bill. The pressing issues of co-ordination and consistency in support for veterans point to the need for scrutiny, feedback and support at a local level. VAPCs are a less well known part of Government support for veterans. Formed as war pensions committees almost a century ago, they advise and liaise with veterans, their families and relevant organisations about their needs, issues and concerns. The VAPCs—or veterans advisory and pensions committees, to give them their full name—aim to assist, raise awareness, act as advocates and provide governance to the veterans community, and to champion the rights of veterans and their families where there is injustice, inequality or a lack of fairness.

I believe that the VAPCs have enormous potential. There are currently 12 across the UK and they are distinctive, identifiable and independent points of reference for veterans. They are staffed by volunteers. It has been my privilege to meet some of the current and former volunteers in preparing this Bill, and I would like to recognise their contribution to it. Their clear commitment, considerable efforts on behalf of veterans and, dare I say, their forthright opinions on these matters have been striking. They are a credit to their cause. They have spoken to me candidly about their desire to do more and about their frustration at the current legislative constraints. At present, VAPCs are limited in the services they can offer. They lack a clearly defined remit; as a result, their relationships with other stakeholders can be frustrated.

I hope that this Bill will start to address these concerns. First, it would move the statutory powers of the advisory committees into the Armed Forces Act. That is fitting, given the proximity of VAPCs to the implementation of the armed forces covenant. The Bill would also allow Ministers greater flexibility to amend the functions of the committees over time so that they can best serve the needs of veterans and their families. That should enable greater ministerial responsiveness to the challenges that have been highlighted by volunteers, veterans and families, and to recommendations arising from periodic reviews—notably the quinquennial review now under way, which will report in the coming weeks.

Secondly, the Bill would widen the scope of the VAPCs’ role and responsibilities. Monitoring and advising on the war pension scheme and the armed forces compensation scheme is an important but essentially limited function. A much broader range of support is now available to veterans, and there is a real opportunity to make a difference by linking and co-ordinating services on behalf of individuals. Broadening the role of the VAPCs will enable them to better identify gaps in provision and co-ordination. Such scrutiny, as all politicians know, has the potential to provide further helpful incentives for action. The groups who have spoken to me are hopeful that this reform can improve feedback from veterans on important issues, such as Ministry of Defence services to veterans, and can raise awareness of the armed forces covenant within the local community. Again, that will give decision makers an incentive to action.

[Greg Smith (Buckingham) (Con)]

My hon. Friend is making a powerful speech. I absolutely support the aims of his Bill, which, as he says, will give the committees greater powers and greater clarity about their role. Beyond MOD oversight, will it cover certain charities, such as one that operated in my constituency and—I have to say—let veterans down badly? Will it make it possible to intervene to fix the problems facing veterans who are let down by other bodies?

[Robin Millar]

My hon. Friend makes a very good point. This is a complex landscape. As well as the statutory bodies, there are institutions and individuals who are keen and motivated to help; I am thinking of Military Minds football club, which was started by family members who recognised the impact of service on veterans and sought to help them to accommodate and cope with everything they had to deal with. However, it makes for a congested and, at times, overlapping and complex landscape. There are also organisations—the little platoons to which I referred.

My hon. Friend is right to mention clarification. In clarifying the role of the VAPCs and the link to Government, the Bill seeks to bring further clarity to the space so that better relationships can be formed. My hope is that, with better relationships, more effective functioning will follow and there will ultimately be a better outcome for veterans.

Thirdly, the Bill would widen the cohort of veterans and families who can access support. Currently, only those who are in receipt of funds from the war pension scheme or the armed forces compensation scheme are guaranteed help from the VAPCs. That hinders the committees’ ability to attend to the broad range of social support that families and ex-servicepeople often need. As my hon. Friend points out, it also limits their ability to communicate with the wider service community, which in turn limits their ability to advocate for veterans and provide representative feedback. By widening the remit of the advisory committees to include all veterans and their families, regardless of length of service and compensation entitlement, the Bill would strengthen support services and provide all veterans with a clear means of having their voice heard in Government.

By making provision to enlarge the veterans community cohort eligible for support, widen the scope of statutory functions and increase ministerial flexibility in response to veteran needs, the Bill will offer the opportunity for dialogue, comment and even advice, rooted in ground truth—a phrase that I have heard a lot in preparing the Bill—for Ministers from the VAPCs. Although this is not explicit in the legislation, I ask the Minister for a commitment that the MOD will respond in writing to the VAPCs when they make representations to the Government.

I am pleased to say that the Bill has received support from stakeholders across the veterans community, as well as from veterans charities and from Cobseo, the umbrella Confederation of Service Charities. All that remains is for me to encourage colleagues to support the Bill so that we can take another step towards achieving our ambition for the UK to be the best place in the world to be a veteran. We also acknowledge our debt to those who have already served and, most important, we make a promise to current and future servicemen and women: “This nation and its Parliament will support you.”

Employment Relations (Flexible Working) Bill

Debate between Greg Smith and Robin Millar

3rd reading
Friday 24th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Greg Smith (Buckingham) (Con)]

For the second debate running, it is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Stoke-on-Trent Central (Jo Gideon).

Over recent years, not just since the pandemic, flexible working has revolutionised the way people go about their employment, their business and their day-to-day lives. That is visible in my constituency on the daily commute: getting on the train at Haddenham & Thame Parkway on a Monday or a Friday, the car park is noticeably emptier. When people get to Marylebone and try to get on the tube, they can get on the platform at the first time of asking; if they try it from Tuesday to Thursday, they have to wait four or five tube trains before they can get on one to get wherever they are going. On the trains, on the underground and on public transport generally, the sheer volume of people who have gone on to a more varied working week is clearly visible—the days of nine-to-five are well and truly gone, and people are working in much more flexible patterns.

I congratulate the hon. Member for Bolton South East (Yasmin Qureshi) on her Bill. As others have said, it seeks to provide greater balance by giving everybody—no matter who they are, no matter how senior or junior they are, and no matter what their station within their particular business—the ability to better engage to get a working pattern that is right for them and for their business and that ensures we have a buoyant, growing economy. The growth of technology such as Zoom, Teams and all the other video conferencing software has, to a great extent, enabled the ability to work remotely that others have spoken about—to do three days in the office and two days at home, or whatever it might be.

However, I have considerable sympathy with the view expressed by my hon. Friends that we cannot just take that technology to be a replacement for the office. We cannot say that Zoom and Teams mean that everybody should always be able to work from home and never go into the office, because that brings many disadvantages—not least, from my perspective, for people starting out on their careers and trying to get up the ladder in their places of business. I would argue that it has always been the case that graduate entrants, apprentices or people starting off in whatever business or profession they have chosen do not learn the most from textbooks, from university or from whatever degree they have done, or by some process of osmosis; they learn from the people further up the ladder. They learn from going to the next rank up and saying, “I’m struggling with this particular bit of work, I’m struggling to get my head around this.” They learn by asking for the advice of more senior colleagues.

In encouraging flexible working, although I am a huge fan of it, we absolutely must not throw the baby out with the bathwater by going too far. I say that without any technical interest to declare, Madam Deputy Speaker, but I do have three small children at home. Without flexible working—particularly for my wife, because we all accept that being an MP is not particularly flexible and that we absolutely have to be here at certain hours—our childcare arrangements would be an absolute nightmare, and that would certainly be to the detriment of my children.

I will focus most in my comments on the issue of childcare. Enormous steps forward have been made, not least by Governments since 2010, in supporting families with childcare—the 30 free hours that the coalition Government brought in is one example. However, I know from my own constituency that lots of parents struggle with childcare and with being able to pursue the careers that they want. They find that difficult within the confines of many working practices and set-ups around the country. Everything we can do to ensure that working parents are able to pursue their career of choice and fulfil their professional dreams, while not being punished for having, loving and wanting to bring up children, is to the good.

When the Minister responds to the debate, I urge him to look beyond the Bill, which is a strong starting point, and to ensure that we continue to lock in family-friendly practices, where necessary through regulation—although I am generally sceptical about whether we have to regulate for everything to get the best result—so that we are as family-friendly as possible.

Another point that came up earlier highlights or double-underlines the need for there to be a balance—a balance that, as I said a few moments ago, the Bill does support. I am thinking of the impact that flexible working can have on localities and geographies: towns, villages and cities where business plays a big part. Think of the impact on hospitality during the rail strikes in December, when no one was able to come into London—on the cafés, pubs and bars, and all the businesses set up over the years to support workers who buy their cups of coffee and get their lunches on their way into work and socialise with colleagues or friends after it. We cannot allow too much remote working to undermine our towns and cities and the businesses set up within them.

To conclude, I would like to briefly commend the comments made earlier, not least by my hon. Friend the Member for Bury North (James Daly). We can use flexible working not just to support those with childcare needs or the other things I spoke about earlier, but to ensure that there is a clear path into employment for those who, as my hon. Friend mentioned, suffer with autism or other disabilities—to break down those barriers and ensure that there is a place of work, a career and a professional path for absolutely everybody in our society. That might mean slightly different hours or some days at home and some in the office, but we have to be certain that the Government, the state and this Parliament have made things as accessible and open as possible for everybody with a particular need, in a way that the old system—if I may call it that—did not allow. The Bill goes a very long way towards redressing the balance and opening up much greater flexibility.

[Robin Millar]

It strikes me that the argument my hon. Friend is making is that such flexibility must be inherent in our response to the changes we are seeing in society. There are changes in personal circumstances, such as the points he made about caring for his children—I was glad to hear that he would not throw them out with the bathwater. There are changes in the marketplace and, indeed, in the travel patterns of consumers—I think of my constituency of Aberconwy, which has a tourism-based economy that relies heavily on seasonal working. Is that the thrust of his argument?

[Greg Smith]

As ever, my hon. Friend puts it far more eloquently than I could. He has hit the nail on the head, certainly on the seasonal aspect of some businesses and the changing times that we have all seen, not just through the pandemic but in recent years. If we want to have the most dynamic, growing, buoyant economy, we have to ensure that the paths into employment and by which people hold down employment—seasonal, permanent or whatever it might be—are allowed for in regulation. It is important that we do not dictate too firmly to businesses how they must go about their practices, but we must ensure that they are fair and open with their employees, so that nobody feels left behind, unable to enter the workplace or held back in some other way.

Indeed, that principle goes beyond business and into the public sector. To back up an argument I made a few moments ago, I am a member of the Transport Committee, which has looked at the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency and the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency. All right hon. and hon. Members probably grappled with delays in the issuance of driving licences and heard nightmare stories from their constituents. One of the causes of those delays, stemming from the pandemic, was the inability of DVLA staff to access the weight of documents that people had posted to Swansea and to process them from home.