Welfare Cap

Debate between Jim Shannon and Justin Tomlinson

Monday 12th December 2016 Commons Chamber

[Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con)]

It is a pleasure to contribute to this important debate. I pay tribute to the Minister, who showed that she had a genuinely deep understanding of the issues. She already has a record of being very willing to engage, particularly with charitable groups, which have a wealth of experience. We, as a Government, would do well to listen to them and allow them to help to shape future policies.

The debate is important because it focuses our minds. We have set a clear marker, and we have to justify any deviation from our original plans. It was interesting to listen to the last speech. The shadow Minister said that the Government have spent something like £130 billion more, but she then criticised us for not spending sufficient money in basically every area. The two things did not quite marry up. It is right to focus our minds, because under the previous Labour Government welfare was simply left to drift. The number of workless households doubled and an extra 470,000 people were abandoned to unemployment. Those are not just statistics; they represent real people who were in desperate need of the right support.

Through our strong economic growth—I am not sure what the shadow Minister was referring to, because it is still the strongest of any major developed economy—we have seen record employment. That is not just a south-east phenomenon; it has happened in every region of the country. I know that hon. Members are all desperate to know the situation in my constituency: 8,100 more people are in work since the general election, and that is even larger than the number of people who go to the county ground to watch the mighty Swindon Town. Unemployment is at an 11-year low.

We have introduced the national living wage, directly benefiting 2.75 million of our lowest earners. The income tax threshold rises year on year, taking 3.2 million people out of paying any income tax at all. While wages have grown, on average, about 2% this year, the wages of the lowest earners have risen by an average of 6%. That is in addition to the welcome extension of free childcare, which has created more opportunities for people to work.

The recent Green Paper announcement gives us a real opportunity to build on the progress that is being made, particularly if we look at the 590,000 more disabled people in work in the last three years. Now, 48% of disabled people are expected to be in work—up from 44% when we first came into office. We still have much further to go, but charitable groups and people who work in this area are encouraged by the fact that we are going in the right direction. The key thing is to deliver tailored individual support, because for those who are still looking for work, there are challenges. It is not as simple as learning how to create a CV and taking part in interview training. We are right to look at delivering more tailored support, to make further progress in delivering more people into work and thus reducing welfare spending.

We are right to identify that we have to do joined-up work with health. Many people who are now looking for work will also have to navigate health challenges, and they need support from the beginning. We are, rightly, introducing the small employer offer to engage proactively with employers on providing opportunities. People who play by the rules and work with the support on offer need the opportunity to go into work at the end of the process.

The announcement on disability apprentices and the increase in funding for Access to Work and universal credit, which has universal support across all parts of the House, reinforce the point that work should always pay and recognise a welfare system that is fair to those who receive it and to those who pay for it. Crucially, we are removing the 16-hour cliff-edge rule and providing, on average, 13% more time for the claimant to look. Most importantly, for me, for the first time ever a claimant has a named contact who can help them to navigate the process of not just looking for work, but dealing with all the different forms of benefit and the extra support they will need.

Crucially, when a claimant goes into work, the named contact will continue to provide support. Until now, we, as a society, would help people to get into work and wish them all the best, and that would be our last contact with them unless they came back to look for work again. Now we realise that those people, many of whom are taking their first step into work, may need support. They may lack confidence. If they attend work regularly and engage in the right way, their named coach can help them to try to increase their hours, increase their responsibility and earn more money in work.

[Jim Shannon]

One of the things I would like to see in my constituency and across the whole of the United Kingdom is incentives for small and medium-sized businesses, which, because they are small, find it difficult to support disabled people in gaining employment. Does the hon. Gentleman agree that small and medium-sized businesses have so far not been encouraged to do just that?

[Justin Tomlinson]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for making that very important point. Large employers, with their well-resourced HR and highly educated personnel teams, are very good at making such changes—they are often small changes—to take full advantage of the disabled people who are looking to work and have the great skills and abilities needed to fill the existing skills gaps. Small and medium-sized businesses often do not have the necessary confidence and skills, and may not even be aware of the talent that is available.

The small employer pilot is so important because it is about going around industrial parks, business parks and shops to ask, “Where are your skills gaps? We will match them to the people who are looking for work.” We have had some really encouraging results from the pilots. I had a Disability Confident event in my constituency, and the Shaw Trust managed to place a further 22 people. We got small and medium-sized employers who had never thought about doing this to come forward and say, “These are our skills gaps. Please help find people for us.”

Construction Companies (Fatal Accidents)

Debate between Jim Shannon and Justin Tomlinson

Wednesday 23rd March 2016 Commons Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Disabled People (Justin Tomlinson)]

It is a pleasure to respond to this debate. I congratulate the hon. Member for Jarrow (Mr Hepburn) on securing it and welcome the opportunity to respond to his concerns. I know he is very active in this area, having received several parliamentary questions on it in recent weeks, and that his interest is long standing.

The hon. Gentleman made a powerful speech. He rightly wishes to hold to account duty holders who fail to manage serious risks to their workers in the construction industry—failures that can give rise to indescribable suffering for loved ones. That is a desire we all share on both sides of the House. My thoughts go out to all the families of those tragically killed when working in the construction industry, particularly those recently affected by the catastrophic building collapse at the Didcot power station.

The House will be interested to hear that recovery operations on the debris pile of the collapsed structure at Didcot resumed at the weekend, with the aim of recovering the missing men as quickly as possible while ensuring that no harm comes to the recovery workers. HSE’s main role at Didcot is to investigate jointly with Thames Valley police the circumstances of the incident to find out what went so tragically wrong with the demolition process.

I tribute to the hon. Members for Rotherham (Sarah Champion) and for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) and my hon. Friend the Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey), who have been very active throughout recent weeks making representations on behalf of their constituents. I formally put on record my thanks to all the professionals who have been working tirelessly to try to resolve this as quickly as possible, particularly for the families still waiting for conclusions about their loved ones.

The investigation of workplace fatalities is HSE’s top operational priority. Fatal incidents are investigated by HSE to determine the underlying causes; to learn lessons and prevent recurrence; to establish whether there have been breaches of health and safety law; and, if so, to hold those responsible to account though the criminal courts. HSE’s enforcement policy statement makes it clear that where a failure to comply with the law has caused death, the expectation is that a prosecution will result.

It is clearly in everyone’s interests—especially those of the bereaved—that fatal incident investigations and decisions about any prosecution proceed as quickly as possible; the hon. Member for Jarrow made that point very powerfully in his speech. However, some investigations can be complex, involving painstaking forensic analysis, interviewing large numbers of witnesses and examining the roles and interactions between a number of parties, including workers, contractors, suppliers, architects, designers and clients, some of whom may be based overseas.

[Jim Shannon]

We had an event in the last Parliament that HSE and the industry attended. An issue about equipment being up to the British standard was brought to our attention. Are checks regularly performed on safety equipment such as helmets to ensure it matches the British standard, as we believe it should?

[Justin Tomlinson]

I shall come on to the point about proactive inspections, which the hon. Gentleman raised in an earlier intervention. I shall cover this issue. Checking against standards is an important point to highlight.

Several factors can affect the pace at which fatal accidents are investigated before any prosecution can be brought to court. The police normally assume primacy for the investigation to identify whether serious offences, such as corporate manslaughter, are involved. This can take many months, or in some cases years, during which HSE is unable to initiate proceedings. The police and Crown Prosecution Service might be in charge of the case right through to any court cases.

In the majority of cases, once HSE has primacy, a prosecution cannot start until after the coroner’s inquest. This does not always happen quickly and sometimes further evidence emerges at an inquest and HSE has to make further inquiries. Once a defendant has been charged, it can take several months before the case comes to trial, especially if it is defended in the Crown court.

The hon. Member for Jarrow has publicly raised concerns that, on average, it takes nearly three and a half years from the death of a worker to the point at which those responsible are convicted. I questioned that when I became the Minister and had my first briefings. We all agree that we want this period to be as short as possible, and HSE works closely with its partner agencies, the Courts Service and its counterparts in Scotland, to minimise any delays.

HSE has a performance standard for completing investigations of fatal incidents within 12 months of receiving primacy. Currently, more than 80% of prosecution decisions for construction incidents meet this standard, and most take considerably less time. Indeed, half of HSE’s decisions to prosecute are made within two years of the date of a fatal construction incident, which includes any time during which the police had primacy and a coroner’s inquest decision was awaited.

HSE has signed the work-related deaths protocol with fellow regulators to ensure that investigations are completed and that any decision to prosecute is made as quickly as possible, taking into account the nature of the case. There is now a new practical guide for investigators, which should ensure that all parties work effectively together and that any prosecution is brought as soon as possible. Other than in exceptional circumstances, it should be no later than three years after the date of the death. To be very clear, HSE recognises the need to maintain pace in all these investigations.

I appreciate how the hon. Member for Jarrow has raised through parliamentary questions the important issues in this area. We need to make it clear, however, that there has been no fall in HSE conviction rates in recent years; conviction rates for those prosecuted for breaking health and safety laws in construction have actually risen in recent years from 92% to 94%. The number of HSE prosecutions being approved following fatal construction accidents is not falling over time and there has been no increase in the time taken to make a decision on prosecution. The average number of days between fatal incidents and prosecution approval over the last five years has reached a relatively settled position. Average figures can be heavily influenced by the fact that a small number of complex investigations take several years to conclude, but the HSE expects the average time for inspection between its taking primacy and a prosecution decision to continue to fall in future years.

In connection with the debate, I have asked the HSE to look again at the way in which such figures are presented, and to consider whether it would be possible to produce median figures so that we could see how long a typical investigation would take. However, we must remember that we would do a real disservice to those who have lost loved ones if we introduced an artificial pressure to speed up investigations at the cost of quality, increasing the risk of prosecution failure through inadequate evidence collection and failing to learn lessons.

The HSE fully recognises the important role that investigation, inspection and enforcement play in securing improvements. However, sustained improvement requires an integrated strategic approach. That includes ensuring that the legal framework and guidance are flexible and easier for small businesses to understand. I have received positive feedback on that, suggesting that there is much more engagement on their part. It also includes encouraging all players in the industry to play their part, working with industry and others to develop practical solutions, and encouraging industry supply chains to provide help and support for small businesses. That approach has contributed to a very significant reduction in the number of fatal construction incidents over the last 15 years, which is currently less than a third of the rate in 2000-01. I am sure we all welcome the fact that the number of fatal injuries fell from 5.9 per 100,000 workers in 2000-01 to 1.62 per 100,000 in 2014-15.

The hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) pointed out that the Health and Safety Executive for Northern Ireland makes surprise visits. That happens here as well, and rightly so, because it is vital to keep people on their toes.

Members have given various figures for the number of inspectors in the HSE’s construction division, so let me give the House the actual figures. In 2011-12, there were 196. In 2012-13, there were 193. In 2013-14, there were 184. In 2014-15, there were 180. In 2015-16, there were 187, and the HSE is in the process of recruiting more. The position is clearly relatively settled, and numbers are currently growing.

Construction work is, all too often, an unnecessarily high-risk activity. We know that the risks can be properly managed—I do not need to remind the House of the exemplary record that was achieved during the construction of the 2012 Olympic Park—but some duty holders still fail miserably. The HSE will continue to prioritise its investigation work in order to hold the right people to account for those who are harmed by construction work, and to do so as quickly as possible.

If the hon. Member for Jarrow wishes to know more about the HSE’s work, I—or HSE officials—would be happy to meet him to discuss the matter further with him, along with representatives of the Union of Construction, Allied Trades and Technicians. I thank him for raising this important issue this evening.

Question put and agreed to.

Under-occupancy Penalty

Debate between Jim Shannon and Justin Tomlinson

Thursday 28th January 2016 Commons Chamber

[Justin Tomlinson]

That is absolutely the case.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

In Northern Ireland 66% of Housing Executive tenants and 62% of all working-age housing benefit recipients are under-occupiers. Under the Fresh Start agreement accepted by all parties in Northern Ireland last year, it has been agreed that the moneys to offset the bedroom tax for Northern Ireland will come out of the Northern Ireland block grant. Has the Minister had any discussions with the other devolved Administrations to enable them legally to make similar decisions?

[Justin Tomlinson]

I have not, but that is something I will look at.

Employee Pay (DWP)

Debate between Jim Shannon and Justin Tomlinson

Wednesday 18th November 2015 Commons Chamber

[Justin Tomlinson]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his intervention, but all good things come to those who wait patiently. I am only part way through my contribution, and I have already addressed some of the points, but more is to come.

Pay and allowances are part of the total reward package. Employees also benefit from a package including a staff discount scheme, generous annual leave entitlement and a defined benefit pension scheme.

On the point about equality, DWP has one of the lowest gender pay gaps in Whitehall. It currently stands at 3.4%. Typically, it is rated at 5%. If an organisation or body is below 5%, they are making progress. The Department is committed to improve that further through the introduction of a range of measures including name-blind recruitment and female representation on senior recruitment panels. This is something that we take very seriously, and we are proud to be leading as a Department in that area.

Let me turn now to the future. The Chancellor of the Exchequer announced in this year’s Budget that the Government will fund the public sector workforce for a pay award of 1% for the length of this Parliament. Each year, DWP negotiates with PCS and other unions on their pay awards and that will continue for future pay deals.

[Jim Shannon]

Very quickly on that, can the Minister give us some indication of the wastage among the staff—those who move on to other jobs? I do not expect an answer now, but could he give me a response later? I ask my question because the hon. Member for Glasgow South West (Chris Stephens) referred to the wage increase for those in similar jobs in different companies. The increase in their wages was significant. I was wondering whether the Minister’s Department was holding on to its staff. If it is not, what steps is he taking to address that?

[Justin Tomlinson]

I will have to come back on those specific details.

The Chancellor also announced in the Budget earlier this year the very welcome introduction of a statutory national living wage for those aged 25 plus from April 2016. Our Secretary of State has long championed the principle that, if people work hard, they should be rewarded. He welcomed the introduction of the national living wage as

“perhaps the most significant measure in all the Budgets that I have listened to during my many years in this House.”—[Official Report, 9 July 2015; Vol. 598, c. 482.]

Child Poverty

Debate between Jim Shannon and Justin Tomlinson

Tuesday 15th September 2015 Westminster Hall

[Justin Tomlinson]

I thank the shadow Minister, but I am afraid we disagree on that, and I am setting out why I think that is not going to be the case.

Despite a huge increase in spending, by 2010, the number of households where no member ever worked nearly doubled, in-work poverty rose and the Labour Government missed their own 2010 child poverty target by 600,000 children. Compare that with our record. During the previous Parliament, we turned around Labour’s legacy of worklessness. There are now 2 million more people in work. To put that in context, it is more than the figure for the whole of Europe put together. We have the fastest growing major economy.

[Jim Shannon]

I have to follow on from what the shadow Minister said. The changes in tax credits will, according to Barnardo’s and other charities, push another 180,000 children into poverty in Northern Ireland alone. Those facts are coming from charities as well.

[Justin Tomlinson]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention, but again I plead with hon. Members to be patient; I am coming to those points.

There are now 800,000 fewer people in relative poverty, including 300,000 children. Compared with the second quarter of 2014, there are 50,000 fewer households where no one has ever worked. And importantly, the number of children living in workless households has fallen by 390,000 since 2010 and is now at a record low.

On the specific point about in-work poverty—that theme was followed in the majority of speeches and is important—the figure for relative low income in work is now 200,000 lower than the peak in 2008-09. However, we all recognise that more needs to be done. Wages are rising faster than inflation. That is on the back of having a strong economy. Everything that we do must be underlined by a strong economy. We talk about austerity, but without taking the difficult decisions, we would not now have a strong economy. We have only to look at our neighbours in Europe to see the consequences of not having a strong economy.

We have increased income tax thresholds year on year. We have now taken the lowest 3.8 million earners out of paying any income tax at all. We have set a commitment to raise the allowance to £12,500, and once we reach that point, we will link that to wages going forward, so the lowest earners will never be dragged back into paying income tax. We have set out our ambitious plans for the national living wage. That will make a huge difference. People are forgetting that the impact will not be just on those who get an immediate pay rise, which I think is about 2.6 million people. There will be a ripple effect that could impact on more than 6 million, according to some predictions. Also, the introduction of universal credit will remove the barriers preventing people from increasing their hours. As I mentioned, the biggest improvement is for those people who go from part time to full time. The benefits system was putting in artificial barriers, preventing people from increasing their hours. Universal credit will give people the flexibility steadily to increase their hours where they wish to do so.

We want to build on that progress, which is why we are bringing forward our new life chance measures. The Welfare Reform and Work Bill introduces a new duty to report annually on worklessness and educational attainment in England. We have chosen those measures because the evidence tells us that those factors have the biggest impact on child poverty and children’s life chances, and that is what matters. We want legislation to drive action that makes the biggest difference in the lives of our children. The worklessness measures will identify the proportion of children living in workless households and of children in long-term workless households. The educational attainment measures will focus on GCSE attainment for all pupils and for disadvantaged pupils. We will develop a range of other measures and indicators of root causes of child poverty, including family breakdown, problem debt and addiction, and set those out in our life chances strategy. As my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State has made clear, we will continue to publish low-income statistics annually, as part of the “Households Below Average Income” publication.

We should be focused on those pathways to poverty, not moving people around an arbitrary income line. As the right hon. Member for Birkenhead (Frank Field) put it,

“raising everybody above a set percentage of median income is rather like asking a cat to catch its own tail.”

Focusing on work and education will drive real action, which will make the biggest difference to children’s lives now and in the future.

Education is key to transforming children’s futures. Good English and maths skills are key to improving children’s future life chances. Nearly two thirds of men and three quarters of women with low literacy never receive promotion and are locked into their starting income.