Genetic Technology (Precision Breeding) Bill

Debate between Neil Hudson and Katherine Fletcher

2nd reading
Wednesday 15th June 2022 Commons Chamber

[Dr Hudson]

Hear, hear!

[Katherine Fletcher]

Quite. That is a mouthful, but the key here is “transgenic”. We were putting a gene from Escherichia coli—E. coli—into an itty-bitty nematode worm, an animal, and making a cross-species C. elegans. Those little guys were effectively harnessing natural stress repair mechanisms to produce something that we could measure easily.

I was a scientist; I was fascinated by that, but it did not always sit brilliantly with me, and the mechanisms that were used to produce that transgenic environment were at best embryonic and new. It was effectively taking DNA material in vectors such as plasmid, and pebbledashing a target DNA area. We did not know where it was going to land, and we had a lot of wastage where bits of DNA were going in the wrong place. That is not what the Bill is about, and I look forward to going into that in more detail.

[Dr Hudson]

We have heard concerns that people feel that an exogenous species of DNA would be coming in. Does my hon. Friend agree that this technology is not about that? This is not about an external species coming in, and perhaps the Bill could be tightened up by clarifying that, which would appease some of people’s potential fears.

[Katherine Fletcher]

Yes. If the Bill contained a way of opening up the transgenic debate, be that in plants or animals, it would not enjoy my support.

While I have put on a lot of weight since the mid-1990s, science has also massively moved on. In response to the intervention by the hon. Member for Brighton, Pavilion (Caroline Lucas), this is a bit like comparing a 1997 diesel car with modern zero-emissions vehicles. Yes, they both have wheels, go along in a straight line and are called cars, but the two things are completely different. The British public were right to be cautious at the time, but let us explain why this is different. We now know the genome sequences of other target species and plants, and we have exact tools that are effectively like clever genetic snippers that will go along a genome and only cut in the exact place. There is confidence and science behind that point. We then insert something that, as my hon. Friend the Member for Penrith and The Border (Dr Hudson) highlighted, comes from the same species. If we have wheat that does not taste nice but is good at growing in dry conditions, why can we not give it that dry condition gene, so that it tastes nice and is nutritious and can help feed the third world? There are scientists chomping at the bit to have a go at that—I really cannot wait.

As part of my undergraduate degree I went to Rothamsted and saw the scale that has to be put in place for traditional breeding techniques—think fields and fields and fields. Variant 1 has been crossed with variant 2 in a modern way, but it then needs to be tested, because in traditional breeding techniques we basically take the whole genome, throw it up in the air and ask nature to pick one variant out of two. That means we are looking at multiple generations to try to keep the tasty wheat, as well as the dry, coarse wheat. This is a fantastic opportunity to use fewer resources while doing that research, and to use fewer resources from the environment.

Let me highlight some of the extremely exciting opportunities that I have pulled out of the literature: disease-resistant wheat that needs less pesticide, as mentioned by the Secretary of State; tomatoes with a little extra vitamin D; wheat with reduced asparagine to ensure that people are not exposed to carcinogens, especially if, like me, they cannot cook properly and always burn everything; or chickpeas with high protein levels that help those who are making an environmental choice by being vegan or vegetarian. The possibilities for health, climate, environment, farming and our planet are as endless as the natural variation within species that had Darwin so fascinated. We must do this, and I totally support the Bill.

Medical Cannabis (Access) Bill

Debate between Neil Hudson and Katherine Fletcher

Friday 10th December 2021 Commons Chamber

[Katherine Fletcher]

The hon. Lady perhaps needs to let me make some of my points. She keeps asking me, but I am genuinely trying to get there.

[Dr Neil Hudson (Penrith and The Border) (Con)]

I am grateful to the hon. Member for Manchester, Withington (Jeff Smith) for bringing forward this important debate. He spoke with power and passion about a very important issue. I want to touch on the comments that my hon. Friend the Member for South Ribble (Katherine Fletcher) made about the difficulties in decision making for clinicians on the frontline. I speak as a veterinary surgeon, cognisant of the difficulties in making rational, evidence-based decisions in our profession when we are looking at licensed products for the species we are treating and having to make tough decisions about when we go off-licence. I am very sympathetic to my colleagues in the medical profession wanting a large evidence base to make them feel comfortable about making those decisions. Does my hon. Friend agree that it is welcome that NICE has made some recommendations about some trials that can take place and that there are trials under way? That will try to help us improve and increase the evidence base to help clinicians on the frontline make rational decisions.

[Katherine Fletcher]

My hon. Friend anticipates a couple of points I was about to make. I am talking not just about the individual who is prescribing, but about the medical system. There are rightly in our wonderful NHS medically qualified people engaged in lots of layers—my hon. Friend the Member for Gedling (Tom Randall) talks about bureaucracy—but they are people who have taken the Hippocratic oath. That is not just the person on the one-to-one with patients; it goes all the way through the system, and that is what I am worried about, basically.