Finance Bill

Debate between Rob Marris and Greg Mulholland

Monday 5th September 2016 Commons Chamber

[Rob Marris]

I agree that it is designed to help some companies in their early stages, but with the effluxion of time, those companies should pass through the pipeline and we should see the fruit of their endeavours, helped indirectly by taxpayer support. The evidence should be coming through now. We could not have looked after one year to see whether it had been effective, but now that it has been around for a few years, we can.

I move on to amendment 177. I was amazed to hear the right hon. Gentleman say that he would be prepared to examine the question of having a turnover tax instead of corporation tax. The hon. Member for Leeds North West (Greg Mulholland) said the same thing. I absolutely agree, and I have long advocated looking at that, precisely because of tax avoidance. If it turns out to be the case that Apple has been avoiding tax in the United Kingdom, it would not have been able to do that so successfully if we had had a turnover tax rather than a corporation tax.

I have to say to the hon. Member for Leeds North West that I am a bit bemused. He said tonight that the leader of his party had set up a review of corporation tax, but the leader of his party has also tabled amendment 177 —supported, as far as I can tell, by the hon. Gentleman—which would abolish corporation tax completely for the financial year 2017, without bringing in a turnover tax instead. It seems a very strange amendment to table.

[Greg Mulholland]

As I think I made clear, amendment 177 is a probing amendment, which is designed entirely to make that point. We share the view that the reduction of corporation tax is flawed, but through this amendment we are saying that it needs to be done in a better way. It is a probing amendment and we will not be voting on it, but it is time that we had that debate and put something better in place.

[Rob Marris]

It is a strange way to do a probing amendment. I am not saying that it is wrong; that is not for me to say. However, it is common for the Opposition to table new clauses or amendments—as with those that we are considering tonight, such as new clause 10—that are designed to produce evidence. Presumably, the hon. Gentleman’s party will be looking at such evidence in its review. If the House could produce that evidence, it would speed up the process and help all of us towards evidence-based policy making.

On new clause 5, interestingly, I think that the Scottish National party reveals its hand; it is not much concerned about greenhouse gas emissions from oil production, let alone from burning oil. We saw the same thing last year in the debate on air passenger duty, when the SNP was all in favour of loads more people flying, despite what it does to the environment. The tenor of the remarks made by the hon. Member for Aberdeen North (Kirsty Blackman) was that she wants the taxation of oil and gas cut. Essentially, she is advocating indirectly, yet again, for another bung for Scotland from English taxpayers. The SNP Government have the power to put up taxes in Scotland and fail to do so, but they want English taxpayers to give them a bigger bung.