Tobacco and Vapes Bill

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering Excerpts

Committee stage
Monday 3rd November 2025 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering]

30: Clause 16, page 9, line 20, at end insert—
“(4A) The Secretary of State must by regulations make provision for and in connection with a streamlined process for granting personal and premises licences to businesses that—(a) both have an alcohol premises licence and are a personal licence holder, and(b) have not been subject to enforcement action in the last 12 months for actions that a licensing authority would judge as inconsistent with conditions set out in regulations.”Member's explanatory statement
The purpose of this amendment is to acknowledge that the majority of retailers selling tobacco products and vape products do so responsibly and have robust policies in place to prevent sales to children and to prevent the sale of illicit or non-duty paid products.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am delighted to speak on the Bill for the first time—not because of a lack of interest, but because it clashed with other Bills going on at the same time. I declare my interest as chair of the Proof of Age Standards Scheme, known as PASS, which looks to provide age verification in the form of a PASS card—currently it is a physical card, but I hope it will be digital—for those wishing to access shopping, nightlife and alcoholic drinks to prove their age.

I will say at the outset what the purpose is and why there is a need for Amendment 30. I am grateful to the Association of Convenience Stores for helping me prepare and draft the amendment. The ACS has 50,000 local shops and its membership would be greatly affected by the Bill, if this amendment is not carried. The explanatory note helpfully sets out the purpose of the amendment, which is to acknowledge that the majority of retailers selling tobacco and vape products do so responsibly and have robust policies in place to prevent sales to children and to prevent the sale of illicit or non-duty-paid products.

The Bill proposes the creation of a new licensing system for the sale of tobacco and vaping products, which will require thousands of existing retailers to transition to new administrative processes. Local authorities will also have to handle a significant volume of licensing applications. I omitted to say that I also chaired the ad hoc committee of your Lordships’ House that looked at the review of the Licensing Act 2003 and which reported in 2016-17.

Without a proportionate transition system, the Bill may create unnecessary burdens for both businesses and enforcement bodies. There is an established precedent for a proportionate approach. I referred to the introduction of the Licensing Act 2003, dealing with alcohol, which allowed grandfather rights that gave responsible existing licence holders permission to transit to the new framework in a streamlined way. With Amendment 30, I propose the creation of a fast-track application route for retailers that can demonstrate existing robust controls and compliance. The process would not remove scrutiny or licensing requirements but recognise that many retailers already operate under strong regulatory expectations. Eligible businesses would be those that hold an alcohol premises licence, are a personal licence holder and have not been subject to enforcement action in the last 12 months inconsistent with the conditions set out in the regulations.

Why does this matter? The majority of retailers act responsibly, uphold age-verification policies and do not deal in illicit products; for compliant retailers, we should freeze enforcement capacity to target bad actors and high-risk sellers. Also, a proportionate transition would reduce significant administrative strain on local authorities and businesses.

I look forward to hearing from my noble friends Lord Kamall and Lord Howe on their Amendments 35 and 42 in this group, but I end with a request for information on how retailers such as convenience stores and others are expected to have enough time to train and prepare their staff for the provisions of the Bill and particularly for a transition phase. That is key. With those few remarks, I beg to move.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth (Con)]

I support this group of amendments. It is absolutely right that we have a thoroughgoing licensing scheme. Many people would be very surprised to find that we do not have a licensing scheme for tobacco, as we do for alcohol. It is unregulated, so I welcome the proposals to have a thoroughgoing licensing scheme. It should be streamlined; we need to recognise that the vast majority, as has been said by my noble friend, comply with the law and are fully responsible.

In developing a licensing scheme, we need to look at the experience of other, diverse countries that have a licensing scheme—Finland, Hungary, France, Italy, Spain, Australia, Canada and Singapore, to name some—because there is a lot to be learned from them. I urge the Minister to have a good look at what is happening elsewhere.

A vaping licensing scheme is particularly welcome. Currently, vapes are prolific on our high streets, in markets and at counters in nail salons, and so on. They are unregulated, and that must change to protect people and hold those that are responsible to account. I very much welcome the move to have a licensing scheme here, and I associate myself with what my noble friend Lady McIntosh of Pickering has just said.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Care (Baroness Merron) (Lab)]

My Lords, I am most grateful to noble Lords for their contributions to this debate. This group of amendments deals with the details of the forthcoming retail licensing scheme.

Let me say in opening, in response to all of these amendments, that our intention in this regard is very much what the noble Earl, Lord Howe, just spoke about: to support legitimate businesses that stick to the rules while deterring and being able to deal with rogue retailers. We want the scheme to minimise the burden on retailers and local authorities as far as is possible—again, a point that was rightly made by a number of noble Lords.

Let me first turn to Amendment 30, moved by the noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh. I hope I can reassure her that the Government are carefully considering the design and implementation of the licensing scheme. In respect of her opening comments, we look forward to continuing to work with the Association of Convenience Stores and other important and relevant groups. Considering the design and implementation of the scheme will include the interaction with alcohol licensing.

I can tell the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, that we are working closely with the Department for Business and Trade as well as the Home Office. However, as she recognised, ultimately, our objectives and motivations are different; they may be complementary, but they are different. For example, on alcohol licensing, the focus is on supporting resilience and growth of on-trade venues that provide safe and regulated spaces for people to socialise. With tobacco and vape licensing, as I said, it is about ensuring that we support those who abide by the rules and act as a deterrent to those who do not. Of course, we have a public health objective.

The noble Baroness, Lady McIntosh, asked about pressures on enforcement, which is a very reasonable question. Local authorities will be able to use the licensing fee they collect from retailers to cover the cost of running and enforcing the licensing scheme. That will assist local authorities and will ensure that the scheme is implemented and sustainable. I believe the noble Baroness also asked if there would be enough time for training and development. Again, that will be part of our discussions that will follow from the call for evidence and the consultation after that, which I will come to very soon.

I want to pick up the point the noble Lord, Lord Bourne, made about looking to other nations. We are aware of several international examples where this has been very successful, including some cities in the United States, Finland, Hungary, France, Italy, Spain and Australia. We have much to call on and will absolutely be considering what works best in the development of our own scheme.

Noble Lords will recall from earlier discussions that we have recently launched a call for evidence, which closes on 3 December. That is on a whole range of issues, including questions about the process for granting licences and implementation more generally. That will inform a subsequent consultation on the detail of the scheme. The points being raised today are all important and they will be considered through both those actions.

I turn now to Amendments 35 and 42, tabled by the noble Lord, Lord Kamall. Amendment 35 seeks to prevent the Secretary of State requiring licensing authorities to consider the location and/or density of tobacco and vape retailers when they make decisions on the granting of licences. The call for evidence asks for feedback on how licensing authorities should make decisions and whether and how much factors such as the ones the noble Lord rightly raised, location and density, should have a role. However—I am sure many noble Lords would agree with this—there are certain places where it would obviously be inappropriate for a tobacco or vape shop to be located. For example, I have not heard a call for vape shops to open next door to children’s nurseries, so there are some obvious points. As our aim is to stop children and young people smoking and vaping, it is absolutely right that we consider factors that might have a role, such as the location and density of retailers. I am very much looking forward to the feedback on this through our call for evidence.

Amendment 42 would require the Government to consider the benefits of combining tobacco and alcohol licensing into a joint scheme. I certainly understand the noble Lord’s very good intention to learn from existing licensing schemes and to avoid unnecessary burdens on retailers—something I have already associated myself with. We recognise that alcohol licensing is established and familiar to a lot of businesses, and that we can learn from alcohol licensing when designing the new scheme. That is why the call for evidence includes detailed questions on the design, and why we have to consult. It is the right thing to do, but it will also meet the intentions of the amendments before us. This process will allow us to consider where we can make use of existing systems and practices, as noble Lords have called on us to do. We share the view that the minimisation of additional costs and burdens, as far as possible, is the right thing to do, while ensuring that the new licensing scheme achieves our aims on tobacco and vapes.

I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Bourne, when he said that the current lack of a licensing system for tobacco is a major gap in enforcement. Therefore, I am glad that the introduction of this new retail licensing scheme is strongly supported by retailers and the public alike. I hope I have been able to reassure noble Lords and that they will not press their amendments.

[Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Con)]

My Lords, I am very grateful for the opportunity to have had a debate on this small group of amendments. I am also grateful for the support from my noble friend Lord Bourne. I took great comfort from the fact that this has been achieved in other countries, so we can perhaps follow their good practice. I also thank my noble friend Lord Howe.

I think the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, misunderstood what I am trying to achieve here. I am trying to set out similar grandfather rights to those awarded in the implementation of the original alcohol licensing Act, as applied in 2005. These rights would allow those businesses already selling the products to continue selling them, but under a process I have set out. I hope that is something she might support going forward.

This is intended as a probing amendment, and my noble friend Lord Howe made the point that we are looking for fairness, proportionality and practicality. I hope that will be a red line running through this process. I hope we can return to this at a later stage, but for the moment I beg leave to withdraw my amendment.

Amendment 30 withdrawn.