Heritage Steam Sector: Coal
Debate between Lord Blunkett and Lord McFall of Alcluith(2 years, 5 months ago)
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The Lord Speaker (Lord McFall of Alcluith)
My Lords, we have a virtual contribution from the noble Lord, Lord Jones of Cheltenham.
House of Lords: Size
Debate between Lord Blunkett and Lord McFall of Alcluith
Lord McFall of Alcluith [V]
I thank the noble Baroness for that question; again, there is something very positive in that. However, the problems that have arisen in the past lie elsewhere; they do not lie in the House itself. Whatever the Procedure Committee can do, it will do because, as mentioned earlier, the whole House endorsed the Burns report and the Lord Speaker’s initiative in setting it up.
Lord Blunkett (Lab)
My Lords, I do not expect the Senior Deputy Speaker to comment on anything to do with party politics, but I wonder whether he could reflect on whether the Procedure Committee—and the Burns committee, for that matter—could think about the writ of summons to attend the House and whether, after a year of some Members not attending the House physically at all, it would be possible for the political parties to be brought together to think about the implications for those who might choose to stand down once the House returns fully in person.
Lord McFall of Alcluith [V]
I thank the noble Lord for that question and apologise for the delay in answering; I am having to unmute every time. On the issue of the writs of summons, the person who receives writs of summons
“to attend the House of Lords and sit and vote therein accordingly”.
So the House is restricted in what it can do to limit introductions without undermining that Act of Parliament. It is the Government and the party groups who are best able to ensure that we continue to reduce the size of the House, should they choose to accept the recommendations in the report from the Lord Speaker’s committee on the size of the House.
House of Lords: Remote Proceedings
Debate between Lord Blunkett and Lord McFall of Alcluith
The Senior Deputy Speaker
This is an issue for the Procedure Committee. It will be informed by the views of members of the committee and the usual channels. However, I can say with confidence that the aim of having a virtual Chamber is for everyone to participate in Parliament, which is very important. If we have that as a primary objective, I am sure that noble Lords’ views and comments will be in accordance with those of the Procedure Committee.
Lord Blunkett (Lab)
Is this is a means to an end or an end in itself? Is it a means to ensuring that all Members, wherever they live and whatever their circumstances, can continue to participate, rather than a Cromwellian move to have a lockout where Parliament does not function at all as a Chamber for the foreseeable future? Will the Senior Deputy Speaker be kind enough to reassure me that consideration will be given in stage 2 to developing a hybrid system so that we can move gradually out of the lockdown without ending up with a lockout?
The Senior Deputy Speaker
I thank the noble Lord for his question. He has already been in touch with me this week on this issue. I mentioned to him then, and reassure him today, that this is a temporary measure. Our primary aim at the moment is to have a virtual Chamber so as to ensure that every Member of the House is able to participate to the same extent if they wish. The Procedure Committee met last week; it will meet again next week. As chairman of the committee, I can assure the noble Lord that we will meet as and when. The views of Members are important to me and to the committee. I look forward to constant engagement with Members so that we get this right. The primary aim is to get the virtual Chamber in place now and then to review it as we go along, informed by the views of Members and the usual channels.
Liaison Committee
Debate between Lord Blunkett and Lord McFall of Alcluith
Lord Blunkett (Lab)
My Lords, I assure the noble Lord, Lord Forsyth, that being mugged by a Chief Whip is a badge of honour, not something to resile from. First, in what will be a very brief intervention, I pay tribute to the Senior Deputy Speaker, the noble Lord, Lord McFall, who is doing a first-class job in modernising and seeking to reform the system. My remarks are in no way critical, therefore, of his work.
We saw from the Questions this morning, as the noble Lord, Lord Forsyth, has just indicated, a real need to be able to prepare for future debates and legislation in a timely manner. The issue of verification of identity will be vital in any new immigration system, not least given what the Minister said in answer to the final Question, that there will be an end to free movement of labour. As a consequence, all kinds of issues will arise in respect of verification of identity and authentication of those measures or pieces of paper that are required to verify that, as underlined by the intervention on the final Question—I think it was the noble Baroness, Lady Ludford, of the Liberal Democrats who rightly said that there would be both red tape and problems for business. If there has ever been a moment when this issue should have been investigated thoroughly by a committee of this House, it should have been now. As it cannot be now, I hope very much that it will coincide with the legislation that the Government are going to bring forward next year in relation to the changes to immigration policy required by and arising from the decision to remove Britain from the European Union.
The Senior Deputy Speaker
My Lords, when I put my feet on the bedroom floor this morning, I felt that it was going to be a topsy-turvy day and so it has proved so far. I am reminded of my primary school teacher when she did the 12 times table, from one to 12, and then went on to division. She would say, “McFall, 35 into three?” and I would say, “Won’t go”. What do you do? You bring down the nothings: 35 into 30 will not go and that is what we face today, with 35 submissions from which to pick three at the end of the day. Am I sympathetic to the comments that have been made this morning? Absolutely, because, as the noble Lord, Lord Blunkett, said, I see my role as serving Members’ interests in this matter. The points made by the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours—he also made them last year—are very relevant. Indeed, they were articulated in the EU debates by the noble Baroness, Lady O’Neill, and by the noble Lord, Lord Reid, in today’s Questions. They resonate with noble Lords, but sadly they were not chosen.
The noble Lord said that the meeting was ugly and that the Chief Whip was in the committee. As the chairman of the committee, I do not recognise that as having been an issue. All members of the Liaison Committee participated—if you speak to them, I think you will get the same response as you have had from me. Substitutes for all the usual channels are allowed in the committee, and there were substitutes there that day. But, in terms of transparency and rigour, I would like to reassure Members that all the proposals are published in the report before the House; the criteria used to decide what proposals to recommend have been published throughout the process, including when inviting submissions from Members; and decision documents from each Liaison Committee meeting are published on the website as soon as practical following the meeting. Those Members whose proposals were not selected for further scoping—that selection took 35 proposals down to 10—were informed shortly after the first meeting of the Liaison Committee on this subject.
In terms of rigour, the committee initially considered the full list of proposals, and from these selected eight themes and two post-legislative scrutiny options to be scoped further by committee staff. I pay tribute to the work of the committee staff, because there is a difference between policy and process here, and the committee staff went to speak to Members to see if they could modify their proposals so they could be included in the scoping work. Following that extensive work, the committee met again to consider which proposals ought to be recommended to the House. The results of that discussion are detailed in the report before the House.
The noble Lord made a point about the review of committees. That is an extremely important issue. I have already been to the meeting of the usual channels and will be going back again. I am open to individual Members or a collective coming to talk to me about this, because this is the first review for 25 years and we have to get it right for the long term.