Assisted Dying Bill [HL]

Lord Grade of Yarmouth Excerpts

2nd reading
Friday 22nd October 2021 Lords Chamber

[Lord Grade of Yarmouth (Con)]

Like so many in your Lordships’ House, I suspect, I have been undecided on this very complex, and at times today, exceedingly moving, question. I have been trapped in a cross-fire of competing and very persuasive arguments for and against assisted dying. I have changed my mind so many times along the way as I have read the many thoughtful comments about this Bill in the run-up to today’s debate.

I reject one key argument: that assisted dying restores an individual’s dignity. I cannot accept that it is undignified to succumb to nature, however inevitable or distressing. Dignity and indignity in the dying process depend entirely on the treatment and care afforded to the patient. To be the involuntary victim of fatal illness cannot be regarded as undignified.

On the other side, I was not persuaded that to vote against the Bill and deny choice means that you must be uncaring, content to stand idly by and allow individuals to suffer unimaginable pain and despair. For one thing, we offer palliative care, although as we have heard from many contributors, that can certainly be improved. If there is a choice to end life, why bother to continue to improve palliative care?

By inclination, I am socially liberal, with a small “l’’. So, to be in favour of giving individuals at the end of their lives or their families the choice of assisted dying has great appeal. However, I have finally concluded, I think, that I have to go against my natural instincts. I just cannot overcome my fundamental fear that to legalise assisted dying would be so far beyond any safeguarding regulation or statute we might draft in Parliament that the risks of abuse would be too great. Only in a perfect world might any regulation proposed have any chance to be effective in eliminating unworthy motives for choosing to end life. Sadly, as the noble Lord, Lord Alton, so eloquently described, we do not live in a perfect world.

Assisted dying is a concept that, in my view, is way beyond statutory regulation. My noble friend Lord Gold, the noble Lord, Lord Carlile, and others warned in their earlier remarks of the dangers that lie ahead with this Bill. Therefore, I conclude that I cannot support it. However, there are eight speakers still to come, and my indecision is final.

Anti-Semitism: University Campus Incidents

Lord Grade of Yarmouth Excerpts

Thursday 21st January 2021 Grand Committee

[Lord Grade of Yarmouth (Con) [V]]

I refer your Lordships to my register of interests. I was especially interested to hear what the noble Baroness, Lady Tonge, would have to say in this debate, given her form on anti-Semitism. I have to say that it was predictable.

Criticism of Israel is usually healthy, especially in Israel itself. But there is a distinction between fair criticism and criticism that crosses that shocking line into race hate. Those across campuses who repeatedly voice their contempt for Israel and all it stands for reveal their prejudice by refusing ever to acknowledge any context.

Israel is the only fully-fledged democracy in the Middle East. The country itself is threatened daily by Hezbollah, Hamas and Iranian-sponsored terrorism—never mentioned. Israel’s regard for constitutional and civil human rights—never mentioned. Israel has many times been poised to conclude a two-state peace treaty with the Palestinians only to be thwarted by the extremists who prefer terror to peace—never mentioned. Criticism that ignores this context is nothing but a thin veil to hide deep seated and ill-disguised hatred of the Jewish state and all Jews. Anti-Semitism has no place anywhere in Britain, but most especially in places of learning.

Public Bodies Bill [HL]

Lord Grade of Yarmouth Excerpts

Monday 28th March 2011 Lords Chamber

[Lord Grade of Yarmouth]

My Lords, I declare a past history of relationships with S4C through my involvement at Channel 4 and later at the BBC. While I cannot speak with the passion of a Welsh language speaker, of a Welsh inhabitant or of somebody of Welsh birth, I have always supported S4C whenever I have had the opportunity and have been involved. I am sure that the archives—because that, sadly, is where my support now sits—will demonstrate that I have always supported the ambitions of S4C and its contribution to the culture and life of these islands.

That said, I regret that I cannot support the amendment. I am listening to this debate as a broadcaster who has in various guises seen various free-to-air public service broadcasting bodies be picked up by the roots more often that the petunias in my garden, be pruned, re-examined, replanted and repotted, with attempts to kill them off and so on. I have been listening to the fear and worry in noble Lords’ minds. However, from where I sit and from my experience, I can say that S4C occupies the most privileged position in British broadcasting that is possible to imagine, and the idea of introducing a greater level of accountability and transparency seems perfectly reasonable. Obviously, the devil lies in the detail and change creates uncertainties. However, I am sure that the uncertainties will be ironed out.

I am in some confusion surrounding the independence of S4C. I have heard a number of noble Lords express concerns about its future independence, but then I hear that the solution is to give the money to the Treasury to dole out or to give it to the DCMS—the Government of the day—to look after. I cannot imagine anything more likely to undermine the independence of a broadcaster than being in the hands of the Treasury and the DCMS. I am trying not to sound in any way antagonistic towards S4C, which I believe in passionately. I wish there were a Yiddish channel for the language that is dying out in my culture, but there is not. S4C is a very, very important part of Welsh sovereignty and identity and so on. It deserves to be protected and it deserves public money, but the price you pay today for that privileged position is greater accountability and transparency.

I am sure that the Government are hugely sensitive to the issues that surround broadcasting. I would be very comfortable if my future depended on the BBC Trust. It understands the independence of broadcasting and it exists to create an independent BBC. I can think of no greater guarantor of the independence of S4C than the BBC Trust. Therefore, with great regret, I cannot support the amendment and I commend the words of my noble friend Lord Crickhowell.

[Baroness Gale]

My Lords, I agree that this has been another great and passionate debate. There have been contributions from many noble Lords who are steeped in the language and culture of Wales and have great knowledge of S4C’s history and of how it is run. I am sure that the Minister will have taken note of what has been said.

First, I thank the Minister for arranging a meeting with the Secretary of State, the right honourable Jeremy Hunt. It gave interested Peers the opportunity to discuss their concerns about the Government’s proposals for S4C. I believe that all the Ministers and the Secretary of State were made aware of the very strong feelings that Welsh Peers have regarding this matter.

I am sure that over the past few days many noble Lords have, like me, received numerous e-mails from a range of people and organisations in Wales expressing their fears and concerns about the future of S4C. The people who wrote to me were not extremists; they were from organisations such as the National Eisteddfod of Wales, Merched y Wawr, Urdd Gobaith Cymru and a number of churches. I also received letters from a number of individuals, and everyone was very concerned about the Bill as it stands. It seems that very few people in Wales agree with the Government’s proposals regarding the future of S4C, although they all recognise that there are problems which need to be addressed, as some noble Lords have mentioned. Of course, funding issues, too, have to be looked at.

In Committee, we mentioned that the four leaders in the Welsh Assembly made very sensible suggestions in their letter to the Prime Minister, calling for an independent inquiry commissioned by the Welsh Assembly and the Westminster Government. However, that suggestion seems to have been ignored—if there was a response, we are not sure what it was. The Minister, the noble Baroness, Lady Rawlings, said in Committee that it had not been practical to have in-depth discussions with all interested parties ahead of the announcement, and that the timetable reflected the Government’s desire to put the UK finances in order. Later, she said:

“We have had lengthy dialogues with Cardiff to secure the future of S4C within the BBC partnership with DCMS funding”.—[Official Report, 9/3/11; col. 1640.]

Can she say something about those discussions in Cardiff, as we are not sure how they went? Who took part, what was the outcome, and are the discussions continuing? I feel that if more discussions had taken place earlier, the general feeling that the Government have not been listening could have been dealt with.

In a letter to the noble Lord, Lord Wigley, Jeremy Hunt said that the Government are committed to the future of Welsh language programming and to S4C as a strong and sustainable Welsh TV service with editorial independence. He said that a change to the funding model did not represent any threat to S4C as an independent service. I hope that the Minister can give positive answers today in order to alleviate the concerns expressed by noble Lords. I emphasise that all the organisations and individuals in Wales who have written to a number of us are concerned. They believe that S4C should be taken out of the Bill. They have great knowledge of what is going on in Wales and of how S4C operates, and they all want to see it taken out of the Bill. As I said, these people are not extremists.

Everyone who has spoken today has said that they support S4C and wish to see it continue. The one desire is to maintain a strong Welsh language television channel in Wales for the benefit of all who live in Wales and who value the language and culture. The people of Wales need some reassurance that that will happen. The amendments in this group would go some way towards achieving that, especially if S4C were to be removed from Schedule 4.

I hope that the Minister can give some assurance on the independence of, and funding for, S4C. I repeat that we would like to see S4C removed from Schedule 4. We look forward to the Minister’s response, bearing in mind what has been said today and that the people of Wales will be listening to what she says. We support the amendment of the noble Lord, Lord Wigley.