UK Armed Forces

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Tuesday 12th March 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (The Earl of Minto) (Con)]

My Lords, I will say something about the Armed Forces to start off with. Our Armed Forces are, at all times, ready to protect and defend the UK. We continue to meet all operational commitments, including supporting Ukraine in the face of Putin’s illegal and unjust invasion and tackling Houthi aggression in the Red Sea. The Royal Navy contributes 25% of NATO’s maritime strength, which has four times as many ships and three times as many submarines as Russia. The RAF has greater lift capacity than at any time since the Second World War. The Army was globally deployed in 67 countries last year, with 14,000 troops deployed on exercises and operations across Europe. We are rightly proud of all their efforts.

On the money side, I have gone into this in quite some detail, and it is the difference between budget and outturn. Budget is a figure struck at the beginning of the financial year, and outturn is what actually gets spent by the end of the financial year. In 2023-24, the budget was £51.4 billion and the outturn was £54.2 billion. This year, the budget is £51.7 billion and the outturn is £55.6 billion—a 1.8% increase of £1.4 billion.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, yesterday in another place a Conservative Member suggested to the Minister for Defence Procurement that the timing of the 2.5% target should be determined by the level of threat rather than as economic conditions allow. In response to this entirely rational and pretty obvious proposition, the Minister replied:

“I do not think that we can commit to levels of public expenditure … without being confident that the economy can support them in a prudent fashion”.—[Official Report, Commons, 11/3/24; col. 25.]


Does the Minister really think that giving fiscal considerations priority over the scale and immediacy of the threat to this nation’s security can be characterised as any kind of prudence?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, as I have said before, and I can do no more than say again, we are faced with a lot of conflicting needs and requirements from all the different departments of Government. Looking at the level of defence spending, we are spending more in financial terms than we have ever spent before—the highest level in history—and it is increasing in real terms. It is not where we would like it to be, and I think the Prime Minister has made clear the direction of travel in which he wishes it to go.

Military National Service

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Thursday 7th March 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, we are. The current mix that we have in the Army is about 70,000 ground troops and about 30,000 reserves. The 100,000 target is where we are focused at the moment. The full size of the forces, currently at about 131,000, is an issue. The outflow is also an issue, as everybody is aware, and we are taking action to improve retention.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, I agree entirely with the Minister’s remarks about conscription. One area where the Government could do more is in support for the cadet organisations. Although it is certainly not a recruiting arm of the military, the Air Cadet organisation already offers challenge, excitement, adventure and a sense of service to more than 43,000 young people from all backgrounds and communities across the UK. Can the Government ensure that they not only support this organisation in its current work but do their best to expand it?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, I entirely agree. In a past life, I had something to do with cadets and I also trained Junior Leaders soldiers. There is no doubt that the success of those particular intakes into the Armed Forces pays dividends time and again.

Conventional Weapon Stocks: Expenditure

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Monday 19th February 2024 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, the Defence Command Paper places great emphasis on technology and innovation. A great deal of innovation comes from small and medium-sized enterprises, most of which view the MoD as one of the world’s worst organisations with which to do business. What progress is the MoD making to change that culture and eliminate what those enterprises refer to as the “valley of death” between good ideas and commercialisation of those ideas?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

The noble and gallant Lord knows only too well that procurement is really difficult when it comes to military assets. We had a conversation last week about appetite for risk, but getting SMEs involved at the correct level will always be quite tricky because of the scale of operation that we need to deal with weapons and munitions. However, it is absolutely a focus in the MoD to ensure that procurement is much more light-footed that it has been in the past.

Afghan Relocations: Special Forces

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Monday 5th February 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

I thank my noble friend for that question. I will ask my colleagues in the Foreign Office and find out.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, the Minister has said that each case will be considered individually, which of course is good, but he will be aware that it is often extremely difficult for applicants to produce incontrovertible evidence of their entitlement. Will he assure the House that, in cases where there is some fuzziness and a little bit of doubt, the Government will exercise their generosity rather than their bureaucracy?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, I recall a very similar question the last time we raised this, and I think I said at the time that there is flexibility and that it is important that we get it right. That is the indication that I will give.

Royal Navy: Drone Attacks in the Red Sea

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Monday 5th February 2024 Lords Chamber

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, I welcome the congratulations and commitment of the other Benches to the service of the individual men and women. As I understand it, no two warships are exactly the same; they have different capabilities that overlap, and they complement each other and the international force with which we are operating. There is no worry about the effectiveness of their capability.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, firing surface-to-air missiles at drones is a very expensive way of attacking relatively cheap and numerous targets. There have been reports of successful UK tests of much cheaper laser-based defensive systems. Can the Minister assure the House that research into such systems will be pursued vigorously, and, if successful, will be translated into both operationally and commercially effective solutions?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

I thank the noble and gallant Lord for his question; that is a very good point. When firing an expensive missile at a cheap drone, you are not protecting the missile; you are protecting half a billion pounds-worth of equipment behind you—that is certainly worth it. As your Lordships know, we have invested a large amount of money in drone and missile technologies, and we will incorporate that in all future designs.

Former Afghan Special Forces: Deportation

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Tuesday 12th December 2023 Lords Chamber

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

CF333 and ATF444, known as the Triples, were Afghan-led task forces set up to counter drug trafficking and organised crime, and they reported to the Ministry of Interior Affairs. They are therefore a component of the Afghan national security forces and are not automatically in scope for relocation.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, answers to questions on this issue tend to be full of bureaucratic detail and process. This hardly seems appropriate for people who are facing rapid expulsion from Pakistan and almost equally rapid assassination by the Taliban. Why will the Government not set up a mechanism to pursue this issue proactively and urgently, in order to sort it out? If the Minister needs any advice, perhaps he could turn to the noble Lord, Lord Lancaster of Kimbolton, who has a lot of experience in this area and could point him in the right direction.

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

I do not disagree with quite a lot of what the noble and gallant Lord said. However, perhaps I may just take a moment to advise noble Lords of the scale of the challenge. There have been 142,000 applications under the ARAP scheme, 95,000 of which are unique—in other words, there are a certain number of repetitions. From April 2023 until the end of August 2023, the bureaucracy coped with 75,000 of those applications. To date, we have settled nearly 14,000 Afghans in this country, and we are hoping to settle another 2,800 by the end of December. There are 2,500 people with approval currently in Pakistan, with whom we have very good relations, and they all have the document which allows them to leave. In fact, 500 were approved last week. While I am not saying that we are on top of it, we are very close to getting there.

Ministry of Defence: Equipment Plan

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Thursday 7th December 2023 Lords Chamber

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, the Ministry of Defence certainly does not consider the report in such a way. Where the Ministry of Defence is coming from is that our Armed Forces are operating in an increasingly contested and dangerous world, and we are working hard to deliver what our servicepeople need to keep the United Kingdom safe. We are in a period of great change, which is why the equipment plan budget has increased to £288.6 billion over the next decade. It is about the next decade—10 years forward.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, one of the most interesting forecasts in the NAO report is not a figure but a word: “Unknown”. It is the forecast of the equipment plan cost if it were to reflect all the capabilities outlined in the 2023 integrated review and defence Command Paper refresh. The gap between resource and ambition is serious and leaves us exposed in an increasingly dangerous world. When are the Government going to get a grip on it?

[The Earl of Minto (Con)]

My Lords, I do not buy that the plan is unfundable and unworkable. There is significant flexibility within the figures and large contingencies to allow the flexibility of the correct platforms to be developed over the period of time to meet the defence needs for the state.

Intelligence and Security Committee of Parliament: China Report

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Monday 23rd October 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

For understandable reasons, in the MoD we regard Defence Intelligence as a pivotal part of our operation and defence capability. Quite rightly, it is highly regarded within the UK and globally. It is important that we share these facilities and what we can do with that capability with friends and allies, which we do. Particularly on the noble Baroness’s question, I say that the report indicated a need for us to have regard to what we are doing in this country to augment the infrastructure for engaging with China. She is aware that there has been increased funding, government wide, for a China capabilities programme that embraces Mandarin language training and in-depth diplomatic expertise. A lot of concerted work has been done across the piece.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, I was very surprised that the noble Lord, Lord Howell of Guildford, passed up the opportunity to mention the Commonwealth, so I will jump in in his stead. The Commonwealth is strongly represented in many nations, islands and territories throughout the Indo-Pacific region. What strategy do the Government have to strengthen, reinforce and foster this network, and to counter China’s rather obvious attempts to undermine it?

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

It is important that we have a coherent approach to the Indo-Pacific, and I strongly suggest that this is exactly what we have. We work bilaterally, minilaterally and multilaterally across a range of fora, with a range of countries in the region, some of which are Commonwealth countries and others which are not. The important thing is that we have a strategic united vision, which was demonstrated when I was at this defence dialogue in Seoul. It was uplifting and encouraging to see a unity of purpose, for everyone to stand together and, by doing that, to recognise the strength that this unanimity represents.

Ukraine

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Thursday 21st September 2023 Lords Chamber

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, I too welcome this overdue opportunity to continue the debate on the courses and potential consequences of Russia’s illegal invasion of Ukraine and of the horrific war that has been raging there for over a year and a half.

It is clear that Ukraine has made some progress in pushing back the invading forces over recent months, but it is also clear that the conflict is nowhere near over. As I said in our debate on 9 February,

“offensive action to retake and hold ground is a very different proposition from mounting a defence against the kind of unco-ordinated and poorly led attack that we saw from Russian forces last summer”.—[Official Report, 9/2/23; col. 1364.]

The ability to manoeuvre sizeable units with concentrated firepower, to clear obstacles, both natural and manmade, and to co-ordinate different force elements are all significant challenges to any military, particularly in the absence of air superiority. Of course, the offensive forces need extensive logistical support, technical capabilities and, crucially, significant weapons stocks.

Meanwhile, both sides in this war have learned important tactical lessons from their respective successes and failures. Both sides have demonstrated their resolve to sustain their military efforts over the long term and both sides have reasons to hope for a successful outcome. In the case of Ukraine, sustained financial and logistic support from the West, combined with local innovation, adaptability and enormous courage, have shown the world that Russia is hard pressed just to sustain its illegal gains to date, let alone increase them. But the very things that have benefited Ukraine have also, paradoxically, given the Russian leadership reasons for hope. Their calculus is that a protracted campaign will become increasingly unpopular in the West and that the political will to sustain the financial and materiel costs will erode over time, with a consequent weakening of Ukraine's military ability to resist. Putin no doubt believes that a Republican—not just a Trump but any Republican—victory in next year’s American election could be very helpful in that regard.

All of this underlines the importance of a Western strategy for the support of Ukraine over the long term and, in particular, of Europe developing a sufficiently robust military and industrial capacity to underpin such support. This means substantially increased investment within Europe. Such investment has been talked about in a number of countries, but in many ways, it has not yet materialised. It will, of course, be difficult to deliver in the current economic circumstances, but a failure to deliver it will have far worse consequences, so we must sustain the pressure and set an example in this regard.

There are, I know, some that cling to the hope that an early political settlement can be reached in Ukraine and that this will obviate the need for such a long-term commitment. There are many who hope that such a settlement will then enable a return to the status quo ante bellum—that life can somehow return to normal. They are all of them deceived. They are deceived because it is not just a matter of bringing an end to the fighting. That in itself seems far off and will be difficult to achieve, but even when that moment does come, we will still be faced with a Russia that bears responsibility for a mountain of war crimes—a mountain that grows in size with every day. The consequences of this and of our responses to the situation will be profound.

During the 20th century, the international community went to great lengths to restrict, as far as possible, the suffering and destruction that are the inevitable consequences of war. In particular, the development of the law of armed conflict and international humanitarian law has imposed certain important constraints on competence. The use of force must be justified by the doctrine of military necessity. Attacks must never be directed against civilians. Unintended civilian harm must always be proportional to the anticipated military advantage, and appropriate care must be taken to spare the civilian population as much as is feasible.

It is certainly true that such requirements have and are still being ignored in some parts of the world, but until now, the major powers have held fast to the law and have in many cases taken or acquiesced to punitive action against transgressors. It is quite clear, however, that in Ukraine, Russia has made no attempt to comply with any of these legal requirements. Indeed, quite the contrary: it has made a bonfire of the rules. It is engaged in the deliberate and wholesale destruction of civilian infrastructure. It has employed methodical violence against large numbers of Ukrainian non-combatants. It has arbitrarily detained and in many instances executed civilians. It has tortured and raped civilians. It has abducted and in many cases tortured a great many Ukrainian children. There are at least 20,000 documented cases of abduction, and some Russian officials put the number as high as 700,000. The truth is probably somewhere between the two, but wherever it lies, it represents an appalling situation. These are all war crimes. They are not just down to the actions of a few rogue individuals; they are state- endorsed crimes that are being committed on an industrial scale.

In March this year, the International Criminal Court issued an arrest warrant for Vladimir Putin on charges of the abduction of children—the first time such action has ever been taken against a Head of State of a UN P5 nation. Yet there is no prospect of Putin or any of his henchmen appearing in court. Russia has quite deliberately and unashamedly flouted the law of armed conflict in just about every respect. If its actions in this regard are, over time, allowed to pass unsanctioned, then the civilised world’s attempts to contain many of the worst effects of conflict will be in tatters.

President Zelensky has claimed that Ukraine is fighting not just to protect itself but to lessen the risks of illegal aggression elsewhere. He is of course right. That is one of the many powerful reasons why we must support his country in its struggle. But we must also accept, in dealing with a post-conflict Russia, that we will be fighting for the survival of the legal constraints on armed conflict. A failure in that struggle would signal a return to unrestrained savagery in warfare; that surely cannot be an acceptable outcome. There is, alas, no realistic prospect of prosecuting Putin and his accomplices, but the international community simply cannot resume its relations with him as if nothing had happened. It must accept at last that it is dealing not with a normal Government but, as I publicly asserted nine years ago, with a gangster regime—a regime that will tell any lie, betray any promise, and commit any crime in pursuit of what it sees as its interest. The West must respond accordingly. It must impose an appropriate cost on Russia.

That will inevitably have long-term consequences for international relations. There can be no return to the status quo ante bellum. I ask the Minister to confirm that the Government will continue the efforts that have already begun to document and publicise Russia’s abhorrent actions. I further ask what efforts they are making to encourage a long-term international strategy, most particularly amongst our European neighbours, to hold Russia to account for its many and manifold crimes. What consideration have they given to the long- term foreign policy and security consequences of such action?

The conflict in Ukraine has much further to run, but Ukraine will be successful if we hold our nerve and steel ourselves for the long haul. European nations, in particular, must up their efforts in security terms. So far, they have talked a good game; they now have to deliver. I do not exclude the UK from that stricture. Importantly, we must decide how to confront Russia over its heinous and premeditated crimes in Ukraine and what consequences that will have for European security in the years ahead. We have a responsibility not just to ourselves but to future generations to ensure the survival of the legal safeguards that our predecessors set on conflict, which were won only after untold bloodshed and are crucial if we are not to see a widespread return to such suffering.

Armed Forces: Remuneration, Housing and Family Support

Lord Stirrup Excerpts

Monday 18th September 2023 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

Yes, I can confirm to my noble friend that that initiative is under way. I do not have specific information about the extent to which sales have taken place, but I undertake to get that and I shall write to him. We are working on updating our accommodation offer to deliver the commitments made in the defence accommodation strategy. The Minister for Defence People and Veterans will be making a further announcement with more detail about the new accommodation offer later this month.

[Lord Stirrup (CB)]

My Lords, can the Minister update the House on the progress with unpicking the disastrous Annington Homes agreement, following the High Court decision in favour of the MoD earlier this year? Does not this sorry saga, in which billions have been lost to defence, illustrate the importance of taking a long-term view of value for money rather than responding to management whims of the moment and engaging in value destruction in response to short-term budgetary pressures?

[Baroness Goldie (Con)]

The noble and gallant Lord might be surprised to find that I am largely in agreement with his opinion. This is a long-standing arrangement; as he will be aware, it became the subject of judicial proceedings. We have been able to make progress, and I think the department has learned a great deal from that adventure, if you like. The noble and gallant Lord is quite correct that we can do better, and we are now on a much more sustainable footing.