ME: Treatment and Research

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Thursday 21st June 2018 Westminster Hall

[Sir Edward Davey (Kingston and Surbiton) (LD)]

I congratulate the hon. Member for Glasgow North West (Carol Monaghan) on securing the debate and all hon. Members who will participate in it. It is essential that we speak for the millions missing, and it is great to see so many people in the Public Gallery.

What I find so shocking is that scientists seem not to want to have the debate. I hope that right hon. and hon. Members across the House find it shocking that the hon. Member for Glasgow North West was written to by a scientist and called out. I have seen scientists writing in journals such as the Journal of Health Psychology calling out the PACE trial, so the idea that the scientists who produced that work have gone unchallenged by other scientists is simply not true. A huge amount of evidence from eminent people in the science community questions the PACE trials, including the methodology, the evidence they used and how they treated their patients, as the hon. Lady said. Therefore, it has been proven not to be the case that the NICE guidelines, built on that questionable evidence, are the only way in which we should consider this disease, and she did that well in a previous debate.

It is great that the NICE guidelines are to be reviewed, but my concern is that that will take some time. I am sure that is the right process; we must get it right and ensure that the voices of ME sufferers are heard. Scoping working groups have been set up in which ME sufferers have been able to participate, and that is welcome. But I find it quite scary that the current guidelines will be in place until October 2020. I have listened to my constituents and read about those of other right hon. and hon. Members who feel that if they are prescribed according to those guidelines and go through all that, it makes them more ill. Far from helping them, it makes them deteriorate. Indeed, I have a constituent who feels that the programme she was put through set her back two or three years.

Real harm is being caused by some of the therapies recommended in the guidelines. If that is the evidence from ME sufferers—I am not a scientist, but from what I have read, that experience is widely shared—it is up to the Minister, working with the chief medical officer and others, to question whether the NICE guidelines should be suspended, at least with respect to GET. If GPs, perhaps because they have not been trained, are making medical prescriptions for treatment following NICE guidelines because Ministers and the chief medical officer have not acted, if that treatment is harming people, and if that continues until October 2020 there will, as I said in my intervention, be a case for those who are harmed to go to court and seek compensation.

No one wants that. To avoid it, surely there must be a way in which Government Ministers, working with NICE and the CMO, can issue guidelines directly to GPs and medical professionals to say, “Be careful before you prescribe GET. Ensure that you have read the evidence. Ensure that you have talked properly to the patient.” With many drugs and pharmaceuticals, there are sometimes side effects. Therapy does not work for everybody. Where is the warning in the NICE guidelines of the side effects of GET? That is serious, because people could be seriously hurt in the period between now and the conclusion of the NICE review.

I will move on to research. Looking at the work that Invest in ME Research has done, for example, setting out the calls for research in this country over two decades or more, I find it quite disturbing that those calls have been ignored. Only charities have enabled a meagre amount of research to be done. Some £5 million was set aside for the PACE trial; if we could have a small amount of that money to start real, biomedical research into ME, we would be making a step forward.

[Andrew Selous]

Does the right hon. Gentleman share my concern that, as I understand it, there are roughly two and a half times more people with ME than with multiple sclerosis, yet there is 20 times more research on multiple sclerosis than on ME and, of what little ME research there has been, the vast majority has been through psychological and behavioural studies rather than the biomedical approach?

[Sir Edward Davey]

I share the hon. Gentleman’s concern. I should say that we still need a lot of research into MS, so it is not one or the other, but given the incidence of ME, as he rightly says, the case for research into the biomedical aspects is strong. Invest in ME Research makes a number of proposals in its recent report. For example, it proposes a ring-fenced fund of £20 million a year for the next five years for biomedical research. That recommendation comes from a detailed report; it is not just plucked out of the air. That sort of figure would show that the Government mean business.

I am aware that Ministers cannot stand up at the Dispatch Box and say, “Yes, of course we will direct research money into this probe; I myself will do it.” I am not suggesting the Minister can do that today. I know he cannot. He has to work with research councils and others to direct the research. I am also aware that if researchers do not make proposals, sometimes research moneys cannot be granted.

Grangemouth Refinery

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Wednesday 23rd October 2013 Commons Chamber

[Mr Davey]

The right hon. Gentleman is absolutely right. It is critical that we do everything possible to keep the petrochemicals plant and the refinery working. I am clear that, working with the Scottish Government, we will do everything that we can to get negotiations going again. I understand from INEOS this morning that it will be talking to Unite today, not just to tell it about the shareholders’ decision, but to discuss the issue in more detail. Let us see what comes from those talks. Should they not be successful, and should INEOS decide to walk away, of course we will be very much involved in trying to find a future. The Scottish Government have a key role for the petrochemicals plant in particular, and we will work with them on that. A lot will depend on the process that the INEOS management at the petrochemicals plant decides to follow. It says that it will talk to liquidators, but it has other options, so we will be in close contact with it as it develops those options. There may be alternatives with INEOS’s involvement. Whatever happens, we will be active in seeking an acceptable solution for the people involved and the Scottish economy.

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

The loss of any jobs is, of course, a real tragedy for those concerned and their families. May I welcome what the Secretary of State says about a review of refining capacity, especially with regard to diesel? My understanding is that much of the diesel used in the UK is refined in Russia, which obviously adds to costs for motorists, who have been under a lot of pressure recently.

[Mr Davey]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. When we decided to undertake the review of refinery capacity, we did so in the light of a huge amount of evidence that we needed to ensure that our economy was not vulnerable, yet with the developments in the refining industry, there was a danger that it would become increasingly so. He is right that we are importing a lot of refined fuel at the moment, and we need to ensure, as an energy security issue, that we know where our supplies of transport fuel are coming from.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Thursday 14th March 2013 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

T8. The United Kingdom is not alone in Europe in wanting to build new nuclear power stations. How can we co-operate with other European countries to our advantage, without ceding further powers to them?

[Mr Davey]

Only just last week we hosted, here in London, a meeting of EU member states which either have nuclear power or want to invest in it. We are working with them, not just looking for opportunities for new finance and so forth, but trying to ensure, together, that the EU understands the case for investment in low-carbon energy sources such as nuclear power.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Thursday 13th December 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Davey]

This Government are doing everything they can to tackle fuel poverty. My predecessor, my right hon. Friend the Member for Eastleigh (Chris Huhne), set up the review to look at how we measure fuel poverty, and that concluded that the last Government could not even measure fuel poverty correctly. We are using a whole set of new initiatives, including collective switching, using the power of people coming together. One would have thought that Labour Members would have used that in their 13 years in power. They failed to use the collective principle to try to help people; we are doing that, and we are determined to tackle fuel poverty.

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

2. What steps he has taken to exploit reserves of shale gas in the UK.

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[The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change (Mr Edward Davey)]

Shale gas may prove to be a useful addition to the UK’s diverse portfolio of energy sources, and would be particularly valuable in replacing declining North sea supplies, with benefits to energy security as well as to the economy and employment—but its exploitation will be acceptable only if it is safe and the environment is properly protected.

Hydraulic fracturing operations for shale gas were suspended last year, pending consideration of seismic events in Lancashire. Based on the latest evidence and expert advice, and having considered the responses to a public consultation on that advice, I have concluded that, in principle, fracking for shale gas can be allowed to resume— subject to new controls to mitigate the risk of seismicity. I have made full details available to both Houses by means of a comprehensive written statement tabled this morning.

[Andrew Selous]

I want to see proper environmental safeguards and generous community benefits for the areas where fracking will take place, but does my right hon. Friend agree that shale gas has the potential not only to lead an industrial renaissance in this country but to play a serious part in dealing with fuel poverty?

[Mr Davey]

I agree that shale gas has an important part to play in our energy mix and in our economy, and I also agree that we must ensure that communities benefit and that there is proper environmental regulation. I have been very impressed by the way in which Members in all parts of the House have contributed to the debate and to the Department’s thinking, but I pay particular tribute to the hon. Member for Fylde (Mark Menzies), who, along with the independent experts, has really influenced our thinking. It is very important for us to take the public with us as we explore the potential for shale gas in the United Kingdom.

Gas Market Fraud

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Tuesday 13th November 2012 Commons Chamber

[Mr Davey]

Again, we should not speculate. We do not know whether an offence has been committed, and we do not know what the implications of any such offence might be for individual consumers, for companies or for markets. We must not jump to conclusions but, as I said to my hon. Friend the Member for St Albans (Mrs Main), if it turns out that there has been detriment to consumers, there are powers to give them redress under existing law.

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

LIBOR, oil markets and now gas: it is a depressing litany. Does the Secretary of State agree that we are a Government who believe in social responsibility and that, if market manipulation is proven, ignorance will be no excuse and that senior management—not just traders—should be held to account?

[Mr Davey]

That will depend on what the investigations find out. There are powers to take on individuals and companies that have committed wrong-doing. Depending on what the offence is shown to be—if an offence is indeed uncovered—there are civil and criminal penalties.

Convention on Domestic Workers

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Wednesday 29th June 2011 Westminster Hall

[Andrew Selous]

I am not sure that the convention actually gives them any particular rights that they do not have under employment law. I suggest that they contact Kalayaan, as the hon. Member for Slough said. There needs to be an education campaign. With evil people treating domestic workers like that, we need to find every opportunity to help them to realise what rights they already have.

[Mr Davey]

Before my hon. Friend moves on, his point about the number of countries that are members of the ILO not ratifying is very important for hon. Members to understand. Only one of the 25 conventions agreed in the ILO in the 20 years up to 2006 has achieved more than 30 ratifications, although there are 183 members of the ILO. That speaks volumes for how some member states approach voting on conventions and subsequent ratification.

[Andrew Selous]

I am grateful to the Minister for giving us those points of detail, so that they are now on the record.

The workers whom the hon. Member for Slough did not mention, and the reason that I have come to speak in this debate today, are people such as child minders, carers, housekeepers, cleaners and nurses who work for many of our frail and elderly constituents. The worry is that the imposition of criminal health and safety law in people’s private homes could mean that some of our frail and elderly constituents could be forced out of their homes and into residential care. All I would say to hon. Members is that they can come here and share my passion, and the passion of the hon. Lady, against the evils of human trafficking—we are as one in this Chamber on that issue. If she looks closely, however, at the text of the convention and its implications, inspectors could come into our constituents’ private homes, examine the rooms, gadgets and layout of the house, and perhaps tell a frail, elderly lady that her home is not fit to have a carer. That lady could be forced to move into a residential home.

The Government are right to be wary of some of the unintended consequences that they believe the ILO convention could have. As I said earlier, it is important for the Government to enforce those parts of the convention that are important and that we can agree on. There is, however, another group of perhaps 250,000 or 300,000 workers who we have not heard about—child minders, carers, cleaners and housekeepers. We have not heard what the effect on their employment could be if the enforcement of this ILO convention is not got right.

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[Mr Davey]

I am not suggesting that, because health and safety inspectors do not raid people’s homes.

I ask colleagues to reflect carefully on the legal implications of the position they are taking. The convention would undermine the Government’s policy to support independent living, which includes offering personal budgets in the form of direct payments to people receiving state-funded care. In line with Government policy, social care is increasingly being delivered in the recipient’s own home, and more than 150,000 people are currently working as social care personal assistants in private homes. That policy was begun by the previous Government, and we support it.

[Andrew Selous]

I am glad that my hon. Friend has mentioned the personalisation agenda. Does he agree that many of our vulnerable constituents who employ people are quite worried about their obligations as employers anyway? They are not evil people, and they just want their care, but they are quite worried about the implications of being an employer in their own homes.

[Mr Davey]

Indeed. That is why previous Governments, understandably, did not choose to extend domestic law in the way proposed in the convention; they had the choice, but they did not do that.

Oral Answers to Questions

Debate between Ed Davey and Andrew Selous

Thursday 9th June 2011 Commons Chamber

[Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con)]

T4. Small businesses are the engine of growth and jobs for our economy, and all the time that owners and managers spend dealing with red tape is time taken away from expanding their businesses, so what have the Government done to reduce regulation on small businesses?

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills (Mr Edward Davey)]

I assure the hon. Gentleman that we are spending a huge amount of time on tackling red tape through the red tape challenge, and I can report to the House a little victory. On bank holiday Monday, I attended the EU Competitiveness Council to argue for an exemption for micro-entities from various accounting rules under an EU directive. I am sure that the House will be pleased to know that that exemption passed the Council.