Alleged Spying Case: Role of Attorney-General’s Office

Lord Pannick Excerpts

Monday 27th October 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Hermer (Lab)]

Consent was given by a law officer under the previous Government to this prosecution. I hope the noble Lord will forgive me if I do not go into the evidential details in this case. The decision was made by the independent CPS. In this case, the Director of Public Prosecutions also received the assistance of First Senior Treasury Counsel, our most experienced criminal barrister, who advised in the run-up to the intended trial and who will be giving evidence, together with the DPP, in the next hour or so before the JCNSS, where they will no doubt be able to give further evidence of the materials they considered. My experience is of the grave disappointment felt by the hard-working teams in the Crown Prosecution Service—including the Director of Public Prosecutions—and in the National Security Secretariat, all of whom were disappointed that the prosecution could not proceed.

[Lord Pannick (CB)]

The noble and learned Lord will know that the Court of Appeal recently stated that an “enemy” includes a country which poses a threat to the national security of this country. Is it the Government’s view that the People’s Republic of China does pose a threat to the national security of this country?

[Lord Hermer (Lab)]

I will deal first with the Roussev case and the difficulties the Crime Prosecution Service faced in bringing this prosecution. The noble Lord is quite right that in Roussev, which was a rare case for the courts to look at—the meaning of “enemy” under the 1911 Act—it was said that it can include a threat to national security. That, however, will be a matter of fact and degree, and as the noble Lord will know full well, the jury still has to be satisfied that the country in question is an enemy. The threat is a question of fact and degree, but it still has to be an enemy. At the time relevant to this prosecution, which was between 2021 and 2023, the official position of the Government was that China was not an enemy. Your Lordships’ House will immediately see some of the difficulties that a prosecution would have faced if this had proceeded to trial.

As to the threats China poses to national security, this Government, as indeed did the last Government, set out fully the nature of the threat that it perceived China posed—that is, Mr Collins in his witness statement—as well as the need for this country to engage with China. But this Government will always put national security first.