Finance Bill

Sammy Wilson Excerpts

Tuesday 28th June 2016 Commons Chamber

Of course my party wants a competitive tax rate, but we also want a fair tax system. My understanding is that in 1999-2000, corporation tax as a percentage of total HMRC receipts was 11.67%. By 2015-16, that percentage had crashed to 8.31%—a huge drop. The Minister has referred to the efforts of this Government and the Government that immediately preceded them to rebuild the British economy, which he referred to as being fundamentally strong. It will not surprise him that I beg to differ. However, there are definitely good points.

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

While there may have been a drop from 11.7% of total receipts to 8.3%, will the hon. Gentleman accept that other new forms of taxation, such as climate change levies and other climate taxes, have been imposed on businesses and have increased total tax revenues? The cake is bigger, so the slice of corporation tax is smaller, but the total amount is larger.

[Rob Marris]

The hon. Gentleman is quite right about the climate change levy. Changes in this Finance Bill effectively make the climate change levy just another tax, because it will no longer be used by the Government as a lever to change behaviour, which is why Labour dislikes the proposal. Business tax has probably gone up a bit overall, but what has happened in the economy, which the Minister described as fundamentally strong, is that employment is up by almost 2.5 million, and we salute that as a considerable achievement.

However, it has been bought on a sea of debt, on the drip, on the never-never. The national debt has gone up 60% in six years. We still have a huge annual deficit. Pay has stagnated for six years, and public sector pay will remain stagnant for another two or three years. Overall capital investment is markedly down. We have the biggest trade deficit in our history. Productivity is completely stalled. It is welcome that 2 million more people have jobs, which is good and the best route out of poverty, but almost every other economic indicator is poor and the Government propose to cut corporation tax.

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[David Rutley (Macclesfield) (Con)]

I want to add my support to clause 42, notwithstanding the important points made by my hon. Friend the Member for Amber Valley (Nigel Mills), who set out the need for further thinking, perhaps, in the light of the Brexit vote. I was on a different side of the debate from him—only marginally—because I thought that there were concerns about economic risk, but there are certainly opportunities ahead, as well.

We need to ensure that we are ready to explore and realise those opportunities and the Government are absolutely committed to doing that. I hope that the Opposition are as well. It seems that the hon. Member for Wolverhampton South West (Rob Marris) is indicating that. We are up for that. As a result, I am perplexed about why clause 42 is not being supported by the Opposition. Such measures were vital when the proposals were first set out, and it is now even more important to put out a clear signal that we are open for business, that we understand business, that we want business to continue to come to the UK and that we want our exporters to thrive and flourish.

The corporation tax level is an important signal and an important driver in that regard. It is noticeable that the Federation of Small Businesses stated at the time of the announcement that it saw clause 42 as an important statement of intent that will provide a boost for affected firms. Small businesses are of course the backbone of our economy, but it is clear that the clause is an important signal for bigger businesses, too. It helps to illustrate and underline that Britain is open for business.

Given the decision made by the public, which I fully respect, it will be very important that we maintain the flow and increase the levels of foreign direct investment. I thought we were exposed in that area for a period of time, and I think that that exposure is still real, but we are currently the biggest destination in Europe for foreign direct investment. We have seen the biggest increase in FDI in projects in the north-west and I want to work with the Government and whichever party is around to ensure that we continue to see that flow. I want to ensure that the success we see in the country continues and that the northern powerhouse can fulfil its full potential. Key initiatives such as the life sciences corridor in Cheshire will require clear signals to businesses in the UK and abroad that we are open and want to move further forward, which is why I will support clause 42 when we vote, as I understand we will.

[Sammy Wilson]

I want to show our support for clause 42. In fact, I think it would be a bit strange for someone from Northern Ireland to take a different stance, especially given the fact that the Northern Ireland Government have put the reduction and devolution of corporation tax at the centre of their policy for attracting investment into Northern Ireland over the next 10 to 15 years.

There are two things. First, we must ask ourselves whether we believe that a reduction in taxation on businesses acts as an incentive. As I listened to the Opposition spokesman’s opposition to this measure, it raised a query in my mind: is the reduction of other business taxes regarded as acceptable and indeed desirable by the Labour party as a means of incentivising and helping small business? For the Opposition, it seems as though the reduction in business rates, which are a form of taxation, is desirable because it helps small businesses, but that the reduction of corporation tax seems to have no effect, or the opposite effect. If we are going to have some consistency, we must ask ourselves whether the principle of reducing taxes on businesses and their profits, and the impact that that has on the amount of money they retain for investment, is an effective means of stimulating business. If it is true of one form of tax, it is true of another. That is one of the reasons why I believe that the reduction in corporation tax is an important decision.

Secondly, during my former role as a Member of the Northern Ireland Assembly and as a Minister there, one of the things that came up consistently when we spoke to investors was corporation tax. We had an especially big problem, because we were living next door to a country—we have a land border with it—that had emphasised the reduction in corporation tax. Time and again, though not exclusively—there is no point in over-egging this pudding—investors mentioned the level of corporation tax: 12.5% in the Irish Republic and 22% then in Northern Ireland. When companies looked at the headline level of taxation, they viewed the Irish Republic as a much more desirable place to invest. Of course they looked at other things—the skills base, the availability of office and factory space, the infrastructure and so on—but corporation tax was an important factor.

[Rob Marris]

May I caution the hon. Gentleman? For some of those companies—not all of them—this is a classic sob story. Corporation tax in America is roughly twice the rate that it is here. People still invest in companies in America. Corporation tax is part of an overall picture, as he says. Yes, companies should pay tax. If we followed the logic of some of the things that he has said this afternoon, we would not tax companies. That may be his position; it is not the position of Labour party.

[Sammy Wilson]

It is not the position of the Democratic Unionist party either, because there are other ways in which companies can be held responsible for their infrastructure requirements. For example, one of the forms of taxation that the Government have introduced recently is the apprenticeship levy, where companies will be held responsible. They need trained workers, and they have to make a contribution from their profits to train those workers. There are ways to target the contribution that we require companies to make. I am not saying that companies should not pay for the infrastructure from which they benefit, but we must address one of the issues that they raise when they are considering whether we are a competitive place to invest.

[David Rutley]

The hon. Gentleman is making characteristically important points. Although there has been a nod to what has gone on in the US, it is important to look at what is happening in the UK. As we have seen a reduction in corporation tax, we have seen a strong performance in foreign direct investment. Let us look at what has happened here, which has helped to move the situation further forward—and no doubt it has done so in Northern Ireland as well as the mainland.

[Sammy Wilson]

The hon. Gentleman is quite right: if we look at the record of companies in the United Kingdom as corporation tax has decreased, we see that we have experienced increasing foreign direct investment. Indeed, since the Northern Ireland Government announced that corporation tax will be reduced in, we hope, a year and a half’s time, there has been an upsurge of interest in the number of companies that wish to consider Northern Ireland as an investment proposition. We are already the second most successful region in the United Kingdom for foreign direct investment—I suppose that this bears out the Opposition spokesman’s point—because we have emphasised the other selling points that are available to us at present, but corporation tax is the additional one that will make things easier for us.

[Mr Jim Cunningham]

Coming back to something that the hon. Gentleman said earlier about the training levy, for want of a better term, employers and particularly small businesses in this country have traditionally been reluctant about that levy. What do businesses in Northern Ireland feel about the levy?

[Sammy Wilson]

Of course, all businesses will seek to emphasise the additional costs that the levy imposes on them. However, many businesses that face a shortage skills in Northern Ireland now recognise that there must be a means to ensure that we have a supply of skilled labour. Opinions differ on how to provide that supply of skilled labour and how the apprenticeship levy should be applied and used, but people now accept, given the importance of skilled labour to firms, that they have to pay for it.

[Roger Mullin]

I return to the earlier point that the hon. Gentleman was making about inward investment. Does he agree that, compared to Brexit, this measure is pretty marginal in its likely impact in encouraging inward investment? As I am sure we are both very concerned about inward investment, does he agree that we should have an urgent debate to consider the implications of the Brexit vote?

[Sammy Wilson]

I am reluctant to get involved because I know that the Chair will call me to order, but perhaps you will indulge me, Mr Howarth, and allow me to answer the point. I do not share the hon. Gentleman’s views about the detrimental impact of Brexit. Indeed, for businesses in Northern Ireland, where we have become export-oriented, it opens up the opportunity to look to those parts of the world where there are growing economies and allows us to make our own trade deals with them. I believe that Brexit will be of benefit to us and—

[The Temporary Chair (Mr George Howarth)]

Order. I understand the connection that the hon. Gentleman is making, but he is about to strain it beyond the limits.

[Sammy Wilson]

I was about to say, Mr Howarth, that the reduction in corporation tax will be an additional means by which we can capitalise on those opportunities.

[Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)]

Would the hon. Gentleman like to see corporation tax in Northern Ireland at the same level as in the Republic of Ireland? Would that be possible?

[Sammy Wilson]

I have two more points that I want to make. The first is that the reduction in corporation tax in this Budget gives the Northern Ireland Government more flexibility. I hope the Minister will be able to clarify how much this reduction in corporation tax will reduce the bill for the devolution of corporation tax to the Northern Ireland Assembly. The reduction of that bill enables the Northern Ireland Government to do one of two things: either to have a lower cost for the reduction—the 12.5% —or to reduce the rate below 12.5%, accepting that there will be a hit of £280 million. If that has already been factored into the Budget, the rate of corporation tax can be reduced even further to make us more competitive.

Lastly, if the Government had decided not to go down the route of lowering the headline rate, one way of giving incentives to firms would simply be to increase the number of capital allowances or make them more complex. Although it could be argued that that would allow the Government to target particular kinds of investment, it has two impacts. First, it increases the cost of collecting tax, and, secondly, it makes it more complex for firms to have their corporation tax calculated. For small firms that is a burden. For larger firms it may not be such a burden.

I wish to quote that famous Scottish economist, Adam Smith—I am sure my friends in the Scottish National party will be glad to hear this. He set out in his principles of taxation that in the collection of taxes there should be economy, certainty and equity. I believe that having more capital allowances militates against that and makes it more costly, and firms will have less certainty about what their eventual tax bill should be. That is one of the reasons why I welcome clause 43 and some of the other clauses that reduce the number of allowances, as that simplifies the tax system and makes taxes easier to collect.

There may be only 10 companies that claim the vaccine research relief, but that requires an infrastructure to carry out the collection and a number of civil servants to be appointed to do the job. If we want to find ways of cutting the cost of collecting taxes, it makes sense to look at reliefs that may not be widely used but still absorb resources within HMRC. For these reasons, my party and I will not support the opposition to clause 42 and we will join the Government in pushing it through.