Health and Social Care Bill

Lord Clement-Jones Excerpts

Wednesday 16th November 2011 Lords Chamber

[Lord Clement-Jones]

My Lords, from the outset the noble Lord, Lord Warner, and my noble friend Lady Williams have hit the button on this debate. Like the noble Lord, Lord Warner, I am a sceptic about nudge theories and think that they need to be investigated. I thought that the House of Lords committee under my noble friend—my former noble friend—the noble Baroness, Lady Neuberger, interrogated the issue extremely well. We are in an obesity crisis. We are expecting 50 per cent of adults to be obese by 2020 and I believe that we are going to have to do something rather more drastic than simply nudge people. Personally, I am quite attracted to the idea of a fat tax. Let us see the evidence of whether a nudge is going to prevent us from facing a major obesity crisis by 2020 that is even greater than the one that we already have, or whether a fat tax is the only way that we are going to get there. The spirit of the amendment moved by the noble Lord, Lord Warner, is absolutely correct in that respect.

Very ingeniously, the noble Lord has introduced the idea of patient control over their own records. I do not know whether this is the right place in the Bill to be debating this issue, but I do know that it is an extremely important suggestion. Patients should have control over their own records, which should not be simply under the control of the local GP. It is increasingly important for pharmacists to have sight of a patient’s records—with the consent of the patient; that is the essential control—and that other healthcare professionals should do so. There should not be a monopoly on the sight of patients’ records for general practitioners. With the consent of patients, other health professionals should be able to see them. We will then have proper integration of healthcare without expecting GPs to be the gatekeepers for all an individual’s healthcare needs.

I do not know whether we are starting the debate that was referred to at Second Reading, but this is an important area which I hope will be discussed further during the course of the Bill.

[Baroness Cumberlege]

My Lords, I should like to make a short intervention to ask my noble friend one or two questions. When I was a Minister I was responsible for the Health of the Nation policy, which I much enjoyed. At the time we introduced the five-a-day programme. That was 21 years ago, so we can see how long it has taken to get that message deep into the psyche of the British people. There is something about promoting good health and habits of living to the population—it takes a very long time.

I want to speak to Amendments 62, 65 and 68. I was very much hoping that we would have a debate on Amendment 94A, which is about Public Health England. But courtesy is the hallmark of this House and, as the noble Lord, Lord Patel, is not here, it is absolutely right that we should not debate it today.

On Amendment 62, on scientific and other evidence, from the noble Lord, Lord Warner, it is the “other evidence” that I want to ask my noble friend about. As my noble friend Lady Williams said, other evidence is something that you build up, and I am quite concerned about how we are going to get this evidence into health and well-being boards and how we will ensure that the Government have enough evidence that builds from the bottom up. One problem is with access to data; if we are going to have joint needs assessments through the health and well-being boards and strategies, and if that information on the ground cannot be shared, it will be very difficult to ensure that we have joint needs assessments. The GPs have those data and share them with other people in the National Health Service, but I do not believe that at this time they can share them with local government. That will be a very important issue because, although they are anonymised data, if you are going to run a public health programme on obesity you really need to know exactly in what geographical area that obesity is at its worst so that you can target it. When you are looking at the needs of individuals, you may have information about the numbers of people who have diabetes or coronary heart disease, but it is when you link those diseases to individuals that you get back to the previous debate that we were having on long-term conditions. Linking some of this stuff together is absolutely critical, and maybe my noble friend could think about that in the intervening time and write to me—and to other noble Lords, if they are interested.

I agree with my noble friend Lord Clement-Jones that this may be not quite the right moment to discuss medical records, but I really cannot resist it, although I will be brief. Some 21 years ago, in this House, from the place where my noble friend now sits, I made my maiden speech on medical records, so it is something that I have quite an interest in. When I produced a policy document on changing childbirth, one recommendation was that women who were pregnant should hold their own medical record, sometimes known as hand-held maternity notes. That has had an enormous impact; it has made those women feel that they are very important—they are pregnant and they are going to have a child and a whole readjustment to family life. That is a very important time in a woman and her partner’s life, and it acted as a sort of passport to them. Bearing in mind that 30 per cent of women who are pregnant are obese, which has a huge impact on the next generation, it seems to me that having hand-held records or access to or ownership of your own records is terribly important. Of course, we have the red book that women get about their children so that they can share that information with health professionals.

My last point is on Amendment 68 and the standing advisory committee. I absolutely understand why the faculty of public health and other people like that idea. I am not sure whether that advisory committee, as has already been suggested by the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, will make an annual report. That is possible. We will have the Chief Medical Officer’s report annually, as she said, which is a very brave and independent document; the Chief Medical Officer says how it really is, and I know that it is very often extremely uncomfortable for the Government.

--- Later in debate ---

[Baroness Whitaker]

My Lords, I rise to support Amendments 72A, 81A, 91A, 200A, 201ZA, 327B, 327C, 329A, 331C and 333B—all amendments on speech and communication. I think that Amendment 218A should also have been included because it deals with integration—in this case, for the commissioning groups. I hope that when the Minister deals with that later amendment, he will be able to recall this debate.

I support these amendments very warmly for all the reasons that the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, and my noble friend Lady Wilkins have set out so cogently. I should also, in this very brief intervention, like to draw attention to the excellent BBC film “The Kid’s Speech”—not “The King’s Speech”, although that was very good too—which graphically portrayed not only the crippling effects of stammering on children’s development, as well as on their happiness, but also an integrated way to deal with it, employing educational as well as physiological expertise. I commend this short documentary to anyone who wants to understand why it is so important to help these children properly early on.

The assessment and treatment of speech, language and communication problems must come within public health. I asked the Minister about this when I made a few remarks at Second Reading. However, with that vast marathon of questions, I quite understand that he did not have time to reply, although I hope that he will be able to do so at the end of this debate. The information must be accessible to those with low literacy and poor understanding. Finally, there must be integration not only with the health and social care services but also with education and children’s services, or we shall fail that very large number of children with speech, language and communication difficulties.

[Lord Clement-Jones]

I, too, support the amendments of the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham. He clearly has a great deal of support in the Committee for the amendments, on which he spoke so eloquently, as did the noble Baroness, Lady Wilkins.

I come at this as a former chairman, and now the president, of Ambitious about Autism, the autism education charity, and also as a very strong supporter of I CAN, the communications charity for children. I also strongly believe that speech, language and communications needs should be regarded as a public health issue. As both the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, and the noble Baroness, Lady Wilkins, highlighted, speech, language and communication needs are the most common disability experienced by children or adults, and it is now being recognised that communication is indeed the single most significant factor in determining a child’s life chances. Because our economy has become increasingly dependent on communication-based employment, the fitness of a person in this century will be defined ever more in terms of his or her ability to communicate effectively. The economic impact on society of people whose communication disability renders them unemployable is significant and is growing year on year. As a society, we need to recognise this issue and find ways to improve the communication skills of children and adults.

As has been pointed out by the noble Lord, Lord Ramsbotham, a number of primary care trusts and local authorities in England have indeed already recognised the importance of boosting early language and communication development. They have aligned the work of speech and language therapists with the Healthy Child Programme and Sure Start children’s centres to create a powerful public health approach based on primary prevention.

However, in contrast, many commissioners—this was also mentioned by the noble Baroness, Lady Wilkins—as reported by Sir Ian Kennedy last year in Getting it Right for Children and Young People, have a limited understanding of children with speech, language and communication needs. Many of these local areas are still not doing enough to address these needs, and it is clear that the economic and social benefits of early intervention and prevention of speech, language and communication needs must be much better promoted. That is why the approach indicated by these amendments is so important and why I support them.

[Baroness Finlay of Llandaff]

I have added my name to one of the amendments in this group but support many of the others. The key issue is that children often need accurate diagnosis but do not get it. It is the way in which you detect learning difficulties of all sorts—sensory impairment and motor impairment. The need for a range of services integrated to support children is critical because as they grow up, unless their needs are addressed early they become greater; they do not decrease.

I shall illustrate that. A little girl, whom I shall call Emily, is eight. She was born prematurely but by the time she is eight, having had a stormy neo-natal period, she has epilepsy, cerebral palsy and swallowing difficulties. She is wheelchair-dependent, partially sighted and has communication difficulties. For her ordinary care, like other children, she needs her GP, district nurse and health visitor. For her hydrocephalus she needs paediatric neurosurgery. For her complex epilepsy she needs paediatric neurology. She needs physiotherapy because of the cerebral palsy and cramps. She needs speech and language therapy to help her learn to swallow efficiently and occupational therapists who help her to manipulate her communication device through which she communicates with her family who love her dearly and want to do the best for her.

That is one example and we have hundreds of children in our country who need integrated co-ordinated care. Perhaps Emily was lucky because she got the interventions that she needed and they were brought together. But, we also have a lot of children, as referred to in this debate, who are being missed on the way through because they do not have such clear-cut presentations. That is why, unless we use this as an opportunity to really change the way that we look after our children in health and social care in the broader context, we will be failing them.