Lords Chamber
Friday 9th May 2025
Skip to latest contribution
This debate has concluded
(began 8 hours, 27 minutes ago)
Watch LiveSkip to latest contribution
This debate has concluded
10:07
Debate: 80th Anniversary of Victory in Europe and Victory Over Japan
-
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My My Lords...
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Order, order.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Order, order. Motion for debate, the 80th
Debate: 80th Anniversary of Victory in Europe and Victory Over Japan
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My My Lords...
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Order, order.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Order, order. Motion for debate, the 80th
10:07
Lord Coaker, The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (Labour)
-
-
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Motion for debate, the 80th anniversary of the three in Japan and Victory in Europe Day.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
This milestone 80th anniversary of VE Day reminds us that they are as relevant today as they ever have been. As I have seen at many events been. As I have seen at many events up and down the country, with one thing standing out, so many children thing standing out, so many children involved, as well as people from all walks of life. Proud of our country, walks of life. Proud of our country, pride in our country, what we stood for then what we stood for now.
We for then what we stood for now. We talk about what divides us, but the talk about what divides us, but the struggles and fights of the past provide the social glue that binds provide the social glue that binds us together. Britain must defend international freedoms now as it did international freedoms now as it did then. It's worth remembering it's then. It's worth remembering it's something that we can be proud of. Can I also start at the beginning of this debate to pay particular tribute to the noble Lord Lord Christopher who is not in his place, but I believe is the only current but I believe is the only current parliamentarian to have served in World War II.
Can I equally pay tribute to Lord Soames who is in the Channel Islands. What a great testimony he is to his grandfather in the work he has continued. And also to pay tribute to the noble Lord Lord Bradley whose grandfather's role in VJ Day and beyond. He, like Lord Soames, both grandfathers would be extremely proud of their grandsons. VE Day is one of the most iconic days. People tuned in as Winston Churchill took to the airwaves. Our great leader who steered Britain through the wall.
He informed the nation that yesterday morning at 2:41 AM German officials had signed the act of unconditional surrender. Declaring that day as Victory in Europe Day. And later from a balcony draped with the Union Jack in what is now in His Majesty's Treasury. Jubilant faces filled the streets. As church healed -- as Churchill held up the victory sign, small groups form circles and dance, not unlike the teachers and footage we have seen this week of jubilant people up and down the country.
Rejoicing having come through our nations darkest hour with courage, ingenuity and the Dunkirk spirit. Through the Battle of Britain, through the battle of the Atlantica, through punishing campaigns in North Africa and Italy, to D-Day, market garden and the Battle of the Bulge, people rejoice with gratitude for all those who deliver that victory. Far too many of whom were no longer alive to share in it. Gratitude to the brave soldiers, pilots and sheepskin jackets, the courageous soldiers of the Royal and Merchant navies, codebreakers and intelligence officers, the engineers, firefighters and industrialists and those who worked on farms and armament factories and in other crucial roles on the homefront, including many millions of women whose nation also needed them the role was redefined in society forevermore.
People that weakens as in cities and towns across the country friends and acquaintances first united by a common enemy danced into the night. The triumph of hope over despair, oaf freedom -- of freedom over tyranny. We will never step back. This country will never step back from defending the freedoms we have and of democracy, but as Winston Churchill in his own words new we may allow ourselves a brief. Of rejoicing that we could not forget the toils and efforts that lay ahead because Japan remain unsung dude.
The conflict in the far east far too often overlooked theatre of war were more than 50,000 British personnel were killed would arrange for another four months. We must not also forget the contribution from our Commonwealth friends and Allies as well. It brought back costly conflict of six years to an end. And today we debate freely in the mother of all parliaments. Freedom secured by a parents, grandparents and by that generation then. And including true Sergeant Vernon Koko, the encore I never meant to storm the Beach on D-Day.
You helped to seize the critically important beaches. He cleared German forces out of villages and he was left in charge of his entire true when his CO headed off to scout the next mission. Only to return at 8:30 PM that evening to find that Sergeant Major Koko lying in the Renault the Post Office, killed by an enemy mortar. Killed alongside 441 casualties on D-Day alone. 19 years later his commanding officer noted of my uncle we had lost a fine soldier who had been in many operations, including the most prominent ones.
My family story shared by so many reminds us of the sacrifice. I never forget on the grave and war cemetery it says God rest Sergeant Koko, killed at the age of 24. 80 years later this generation has become the latest generation to come together to thank our greatest generation. On behalf of the government, can we thank all of those up and down the country who have organised and been involved in the commemorations over recent days.
In particular my colleagues in the Department for Culture, Media and Sport, the MoD, the Armed Forces have been out in all their splendour. What a great credit they splendour. What a great credit they are to our nation. The staff of the Royal British Legion and other military charities and associations and the organisers of street parties and events across all of our nation. Today I feel it is incumbent on all of us not only to reflect and appreciate the millions of individual sacrifices that secured our freedoms, but also learning lessons about our security.
Lessons about solidarity and lessons about service that will serve us well in once again this dangerous area in which we live. In security never Chamberlain quickly became shorthand for the folly of appeasement over time or more historians have pointed out that Britain was in no position to stand up to Hitler in September 1938. The lesson today needs to be fully understood and is accepted by all of us. If we want peace in our time and in the future, we can never again take our eye off the importance of deterrence, particularly as potential adversaries arm themselves to the teeth.
A pro-Russia understands our review and should President Trump be successful in his efforts to bring peace to Ukraine, enhance deterrence in Ukraine and across Europe and NATO will be the decisive factor in securing peace in Europe again and preventing further Russian aggression. As we celebrate VE Day, let us also remember the strength and courage of the Ukrainian and all those who have supported them in resisting the illegal invasion of The second lesson I want to touch on a solidarity, solidarity with our Allies.
Some will know better than me. And the importance of solidarity of our nation. The wartime platform given by Germany to Lord Hawhaw illustrates enduring power, and I believe it is incumbent on all of us who love this country to ensure that British people are in no doubt that our solidarity is under ongoing sustained attack from today's propagandists and armies of bots armed with infinite supplies of disinformation. Under the command of adversaries like Russia and other states working against their interests. It should never take a walk for us to speak out about those attacks and the fact that we will defend ourselves against them.
Like previous governments, we are alive to this threat, and it is an essential and existential threat to us and our review will guide us we step up work to counter it. The other lesson I want to draw is about service. It is about the power of individuals and collectives service, and it is about valuing those that serve. The relentless determination of that war generation who gave their blood, their toil, their tears and sweat, and their lives, over six long years, was summed up by Churchill when he said " Success is not final, failure is not fatal.
It is the courage to continue that counts. " We must have that courage, have that will, have that determination, and many years after, listen to the words of Churchill as they ring down the ages. Our current Armed Forces are full of people who have these and other winning qualities in abundance. People who step forwards to serve with the support of their families who also sacrifice to facilitate the long deployments and frequent moves that service life can entail. We all need to realise this threat today.
Too few people who are going about their busy lives perhaps truly appreciate that, and this VE Day, the commemoration and celebration gives us the chance to understand the sacrifices and for all of the country to understand the sacrifices that are made on their behalf. We are determined to change that and work with the support of others and make sure the Armed Forces Covenant is fully implemented. And with the support of the whole of Parliament, appointing an Armed Forces Commissioner as an independent champion as well tasked with approving service life.
It is also why commemoration is so important. To remind each generation of the sacrifices made in the past for our freedoms. Sacrifices that are still being made today, by members of our armed forces and the families that support them. The end of World War II marks the beginning of a new chapter. A chapter written by the men and women who turned our darkest hour into one of our finest hours. Many women who had witnessed the absolute worst of humanity, as no doubt Lord Dubs can tell us about.
They had witnessed some of the worst that people can actually do to each other. But they were determined to use their hard-won freedoms to build a better future. They were the architects of the United Nations, the architects of NATO and of greater European cooperation. Whilst at home they built homes for heroes, the NHS, and the welfare state. They built global institutions that improve the lives in Britain in an attempt to ensure that the sacrifices of that generation would be honoured, never forgotten.
Never repeated. Today we come together to remember. And we come together to honour the proud legacy of our greatest generation. And recommit to upholding. Isn't it that three commitments, that's determination, that pride, that gives us the hope and belief that this great nation is once more the standardbearer for freedom and democracy? Just think of it, what a tribute that is. What a tribute that is to those that have served and are serving. It moves us all. As we put down the flanks, as all.
As we put down the flanks, as we put down, let us remind ourselves that we will never put down our values. We will always stand up for those values. That is what makes this country great. And on days like this it reminds us of what unites us. I'm proud to move this report, this motion today. I know it is supported by everyone across the house. But what a great country we are. What a brilliant celebration we have had over the last week.
Communities coming together, standing up those things that bring standing up those things that bring us together, notwithstanding some of the debates and arguments that take place. Just think of our reputation place. Just think of our reputation across the world, as the pictures of the king saluting the troops and others as they came down the mall. Of the public there cheering, of the various events across all of our various events across all of our great nation which has shown that the great nation that we are still exists.
I beg to move.
Lord Coaker, The Minister of State, Ministry of Defence (Labour)
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Motion for debate, the 80th anniversary of the three in Japan and Victory in Europe Day.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
This milestone 80th anniversary of VE Day reminds us that they are as relevant today as they ever have been. As I have seen at many events been. As I have seen at many events up and down the country, with one thing standing out, so many children thing standing out, so many children involved, as well as people from all walks of life. Proud of our country, walks of life. Proud of our country, pride in our country, what we stood for then what we stood for now.
We for then what we stood for now. We talk about what divides us, but the talk about what divides us, but the struggles and fights of the past provide the social glue that binds provide the social glue that binds us together. Britain must defend international freedoms now as it did international freedoms now as it did then. It's worth remembering it's then. It's worth remembering it's something that we can be proud of. Can I also start at the beginning of this debate to pay particular tribute to the noble Lord Lord Christopher who is not in his place, but I believe is the only current but I believe is the only current parliamentarian to have served in World War II.
Can I equally pay tribute to Lord Soames who is in the Channel Islands. What a great testimony he is to his grandfather in the work he has continued. And also to pay tribute to the noble Lord Lord Bradley whose grandfather's role in VJ Day and beyond. He, like Lord Soames, both grandfathers would be extremely proud of their grandsons. VE Day is one of the most iconic days. People tuned in as Winston Churchill took to the airwaves. Our great leader who steered Britain through the wall.
He informed the nation that yesterday morning at 2:41 AM German officials had signed the act of unconditional surrender. Declaring that day as Victory in Europe Day. And later from a balcony draped with the Union Jack in what is now in His Majesty's Treasury. Jubilant faces filled the streets. As church healed -- as Churchill held up the victory sign, small groups form circles and dance, not unlike the teachers and footage we have seen this week of jubilant people up and down the country.
Rejoicing having come through our nations darkest hour with courage, ingenuity and the Dunkirk spirit. Through the Battle of Britain, through the battle of the Atlantica, through punishing campaigns in North Africa and Italy, to D-Day, market garden and the Battle of the Bulge, people rejoice with gratitude for all those who deliver that victory. Far too many of whom were no longer alive to share in it. Gratitude to the brave soldiers, pilots and sheepskin jackets, the courageous soldiers of the Royal and Merchant navies, codebreakers and intelligence officers, the engineers, firefighters and industrialists and those who worked on farms and armament factories and in other crucial roles on the homefront, including many millions of women whose nation also needed them the role was redefined in society forevermore.
People that weakens as in cities and towns across the country friends and acquaintances first united by a common enemy danced into the night. The triumph of hope over despair, oaf freedom -- of freedom over tyranny. We will never step back. This country will never step back from defending the freedoms we have and of democracy, but as Winston Churchill in his own words new we may allow ourselves a brief. Of rejoicing that we could not forget the toils and efforts that lay ahead because Japan remain unsung dude.
The conflict in the far east far too often overlooked theatre of war were more than 50,000 British personnel were killed would arrange for another four months. We must not also forget the contribution from our Commonwealth friends and Allies as well. It brought back costly conflict of six years to an end. And today we debate freely in the mother of all parliaments. Freedom secured by a parents, grandparents and by that generation then. And including true Sergeant Vernon Koko, the encore I never meant to storm the Beach on D-Day.
You helped to seize the critically important beaches. He cleared German forces out of villages and he was left in charge of his entire true when his CO headed off to scout the next mission. Only to return at 8:30 PM that evening to find that Sergeant Major Koko lying in the Renault the Post Office, killed by an enemy mortar. Killed alongside 441 casualties on D-Day alone. 19 years later his commanding officer noted of my uncle we had lost a fine soldier who had been in many operations, including the most prominent ones.
My family story shared by so many reminds us of the sacrifice. I never forget on the grave and war cemetery it says God rest Sergeant Koko, killed at the age of 24. 80 years later this generation has become the latest generation to come together to thank our greatest generation. On behalf of the government, can we thank all of those up and down the country who have organised and been involved in the commemorations over recent days.
In particular my colleagues in the Department for Culture, Media and Sport, the MoD, the Armed Forces have been out in all their splendour. What a great credit they splendour. What a great credit they are to our nation. The staff of the Royal British Legion and other military charities and associations and the organisers of street parties and events across all of our nation. Today I feel it is incumbent on all of us not only to reflect and appreciate the millions of individual sacrifices that secured our freedoms, but also learning lessons about our security.
Lessons about solidarity and lessons about service that will serve us well in once again this dangerous area in which we live. In security never Chamberlain quickly became shorthand for the folly of appeasement over time or more historians have pointed out that Britain was in no position to stand up to Hitler in September 1938. The lesson today needs to be fully understood and is accepted by all of us. If we want peace in our time and in the future, we can never again take our eye off the importance of deterrence, particularly as potential adversaries arm themselves to the teeth.
A pro-Russia understands our review and should President Trump be successful in his efforts to bring peace to Ukraine, enhance deterrence in Ukraine and across Europe and NATO will be the decisive factor in securing peace in Europe again and preventing further Russian aggression. As we celebrate VE Day, let us also remember the strength and courage of the Ukrainian and all those who have supported them in resisting the illegal invasion of The second lesson I want to touch on a solidarity, solidarity with our Allies.
Some will know better than me. And the importance of solidarity of our nation. The wartime platform given by Germany to Lord Hawhaw illustrates enduring power, and I believe it is incumbent on all of us who love this country to ensure that British people are in no doubt that our solidarity is under ongoing sustained attack from today's propagandists and armies of bots armed with infinite supplies of disinformation. Under the command of adversaries like Russia and other states working against their interests. It should never take a walk for us to speak out about those attacks and the fact that we will defend ourselves against them.
Like previous governments, we are alive to this threat, and it is an essential and existential threat to us and our review will guide us we step up work to counter it. The other lesson I want to draw is about service. It is about the power of individuals and collectives service, and it is about valuing those that serve. The relentless determination of that war generation who gave their blood, their toil, their tears and sweat, and their lives, over six long years, was summed up by Churchill when he said " Success is not final, failure is not fatal.
It is the courage to continue that counts. " We must have that courage, have that will, have that determination, and many years after, listen to the words of Churchill as they ring down the ages. Our current Armed Forces are full of people who have these and other winning qualities in abundance. People who step forwards to serve with the support of their families who also sacrifice to facilitate the long deployments and frequent moves that service life can entail. We all need to realise this threat today.
Too few people who are going about their busy lives perhaps truly appreciate that, and this VE Day, the commemoration and celebration gives us the chance to understand the sacrifices and for all of the country to understand the sacrifices that are made on their behalf. We are determined to change that and work with the support of others and make sure the Armed Forces Covenant is fully implemented. And with the support of the whole of Parliament, appointing an Armed Forces Commissioner as an independent champion as well tasked with approving service life.
It is also why commemoration is so important. To remind each generation of the sacrifices made in the past for our freedoms. Sacrifices that are still being made today, by members of our armed forces and the families that support them. The end of World War II marks the beginning of a new chapter. A chapter written by the men and women who turned our darkest hour into one of our finest hours. Many women who had witnessed the absolute worst of humanity, as no doubt Lord Dubs can tell us about.
They had witnessed some of the worst that people can actually do to each other. But they were determined to use their hard-won freedoms to build a better future. They were the architects of the United Nations, the architects of NATO and of greater European cooperation. Whilst at home they built homes for heroes, the NHS, and the welfare state. They built global institutions that improve the lives in Britain in an attempt to ensure that the sacrifices of that generation would be honoured, never forgotten.
Never repeated. Today we come together to remember. And we come together to honour the proud legacy of our greatest generation. And recommit to upholding. Isn't it that three commitments, that's determination, that pride, that gives us the hope and belief that this great nation is once more the standardbearer for freedom and democracy? Just think of it, what a tribute that is. What a tribute that is to those that have served and are serving. It moves us all. As we put down the flanks, as all.
As we put down the flanks, as we put down, let us remind ourselves that we will never put down our values. We will always stand up for those values. That is what makes this country great. And on days like this it reminds us of what unites us. I'm proud to move this report, this motion today. I know it is supported by everyone across the house. But what a great country we are. What a brilliant celebration we have had over the last week.
Communities coming together, standing up those things that bring standing up those things that bring us together, notwithstanding some of the debates and arguments that take place. Just think of our reputation place. Just think of our reputation across the world, as the pictures of the king saluting the troops and others as they came down the mall. Of the public there cheering, of the various events across all of our various events across all of our great nation which has shown that the great nation that we are still exists.
I beg to move.
10:21
The Earl of Minto (Conservative)
-
-
The Earl of Minto (Conservative)
My Lords, the question is that this motion be agreed to.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, what an honour to
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, what an honour to follow the Minister Lord Coaker in this most apposite of debates. I this most apposite of debates. I thank him for moving it. To commemorate the final surrender of the maligned Nazi forces and their acolytes which brought to a conclusion that such a notable period of this nation's history. It period of this nation's history. It is indeed, as it was then, a time for celebration, remembrance, and for celebration, remembrance, and deep reflection. My Lords it was 80 years ago yesterday when a great war leader that roaring lion stood at this Dispatch Box and announced in this Dispatch Box and announced in this chamber that was the time the House of Commons the evil that had descended upon Europe had been defeated.
This was of course the culmination of 5 1/2 years of culmination of 5 1/2 years of sustained and bitter fighting. And unspeakable violence. 5 1/2 years of unspeakable violence. 5 1/2 years of the British public sacrificing so much in support of the war effort. 5 much in support of the war effort. 5 1/2 years of families, virtually every family, been torn apart. This week, we pay tribute to our forbearance who stood firm against the menace of tyranny and who did not and would not flag or fail.
Who went on to the bitter end in defence of all our freedoms. But it is the events of the week leading up to that eventual surrender of the German forces that I would like to reflect upon today. On 5 May On 5 May 1945, Lieutenant S Charlton was instructed by his commanding officer to investigate reports of a concentration camp close to their posting just outside Hamburg. He was the first British officer to arrive at the concentration camp. What he uncovered there was a demonstrable evidence of the repugnant wickedness of the Nazi regime.
A horrifying microcosm of the very reason why it was so vital to overcome the enemy. After cautiously approaching the camp, found it deserted. Apart from a lone police officer guarding the entrance. As he was inspecting the barracks he encountered two former prisoners who offered to guide them through the camp. Recounted in his report he stumbled across a building that, at first glance, he believed was a butcher shop or a dairy. It was not. Later the building was found to have been a medical experimentation centre, where a doctor had undertaken live experiments on 20 Jewish children towards the end of 1944.
Those children were injected with tuberculosis, operated on, and eventually hangs on 20 April 1945, just weeks before the arrival of the just weeks before the arrival of the British troops and the liberation. Charlton remarked in his report that the police appeared to have been thoroughly cleaned. And he only found rubber gloves, took to be a preserved human heart stop from the records that were salvaged from the camp, and a test, the testimonies that were heard, a more comprehensive explanation was uncovered.
It was built in 1945. Business were forced to work in weapons factories, mines, building sites on the railways, labouring under the most inhumane of conditions. Evidence collected by the British Army of this describes the absence of footwear and prisoners too sick to work sent to death camps for their murder. It was estimated that at least 42,000 prisoners died at the camp. But since the SS destroyed most of the records, we will never really know how many suffered. This was just one of many concentration camps liberated by our troops throughout 1945.
The stories uncovered by brave British, American, and Soviet troops, and the test is given by those who suffered so terribly insured Nazi war crimes did not go unpunished and guarantee they could be shed for prosperity. If for no other reason than to ensure that such horror needed calling out so that it should never be countenanced to happen again. As early as 1940, in his finest hour speech, Churchill warned of a new dark age made more sinister by the lights of perverted science.
He saw clearly the evil of Nazi rule and what it was, and nobly lead our nation along with our allies throughout war. It was two days later on 7 May 1945 that Germany finally capitulated. The Soviet army had already taken Berlin, Field Marshal Bernard Montgomery had accepted what happened in Denmark and the Netherlands. Facing attack on all fronts, the unconditional surrender of all German forces was offered. The final instrument of surrender was signed in Berlin the following day, and air Marshal Arthur Tedder, later a member of this house, signed on behalf of the Allies.
The war in Europe had come to an end. Across Britain, church bells rang out in recognition of the enormity of the occasion. Victory in Europe Day was declared. The British public jubilantly poured onto the street as the noble Lord mentioned, to celebrate their victory over Hitler's forces and fascism. The victory was mementos. But at a terrible cost, it had been enormous. 383,600 British troops were estimated to have lost their lives, and their had been 1.7 million casualties from across the Commonwealth.
For many, those bells must have rung hollow. On this very day 80 years ago, Nazi forces were expelled from the only occupied territory. Throughout the war, the occupied Channel Islands and faced severe repression satellite camps established on Alderney. The liberation of our dear Channel Islands was completed when British soldiers from HMS Bulldog and HMS Eagle landed in Guernsey and Jersey. The union flag was hoisted and the crowd spontaneously sang the national anthem. Liberation Day is still to this day celebrated in joyous fashion every year on 9 May on those islands.
My Lords, from the balcony of the Ministry of health 80 years ago, Churchill reminded the nation that this wasn't a victory for a party or any class, it is the victory of the Great British nation as a whole. We were the first in this ancient island to draw the sword against tyranny. Those words are evermore pertinent today. War has returned to Europe because the and an autocracy threatened to sovereign nations. Poisonous ideologies pervade our politics. If ever there was a lesson to be learned is that we British can never appease.
Our Ukrainian brothers and sisters of valiantly resisting invasion, fighting as we wanted for their homeland and their freedom. And we are there to support their struggle in the shadow of remembrance of 80 years ago. My Lords, in these troubling times, we must once again stand firm against tyranny and express great pride in our Armed Forces. The minister spoke so eloquently about our history and the importance of communal remembrance and reflection. This day of all days is also one of celebration, of affirmative triumph over almost unspeakable evil.
As His Majesty said last night, we must never forget those who delivered that triumph. My Lords, we will not.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, what an honour to
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, what an honour to follow the Minister Lord Coaker in this most apposite of debates. I this most apposite of debates. I thank him for moving it. To commemorate the final surrender of the maligned Nazi forces and their acolytes which brought to a conclusion that such a notable period of this nation's history. It period of this nation's history. It is indeed, as it was then, a time for celebration, remembrance, and for celebration, remembrance, and deep reflection. My Lords it was 80 years ago yesterday when a great war leader that roaring lion stood at this Dispatch Box and announced in this Dispatch Box and announced in this chamber that was the time the House of Commons the evil that had descended upon Europe had been defeated.
This was of course the culmination of 5 1/2 years of culmination of 5 1/2 years of sustained and bitter fighting. And unspeakable violence. 5 1/2 years of unspeakable violence. 5 1/2 years of the British public sacrificing so much in support of the war effort. 5 much in support of the war effort. 5 1/2 years of families, virtually every family, been torn apart. This week, we pay tribute to our forbearance who stood firm against the menace of tyranny and who did not and would not flag or fail.
Who went on to the bitter end in defence of all our freedoms. But it is the events of the week leading up to that eventual surrender of the German forces that I would like to reflect upon today. On 5 May On 5 May 1945, Lieutenant S Charlton was instructed by his commanding officer to investigate reports of a concentration camp close to their posting just outside Hamburg. He was the first British officer to arrive at the concentration camp. What he uncovered there was a demonstrable evidence of the repugnant wickedness of the Nazi regime.
A horrifying microcosm of the very reason why it was so vital to overcome the enemy. After cautiously approaching the camp, found it deserted. Apart from a lone police officer guarding the entrance. As he was inspecting the barracks he encountered two former prisoners who offered to guide them through the camp. Recounted in his report he stumbled across a building that, at first glance, he believed was a butcher shop or a dairy. It was not. Later the building was found to have been a medical experimentation centre, where a doctor had undertaken live experiments on 20 Jewish children towards the end of 1944.
Those children were injected with tuberculosis, operated on, and eventually hangs on 20 April 1945, just weeks before the arrival of the just weeks before the arrival of the British troops and the liberation. Charlton remarked in his report that the police appeared to have been thoroughly cleaned. And he only found rubber gloves, took to be a preserved human heart stop from the records that were salvaged from the camp, and a test, the testimonies that were heard, a more comprehensive explanation was uncovered.
It was built in 1945. Business were forced to work in weapons factories, mines, building sites on the railways, labouring under the most inhumane of conditions. Evidence collected by the British Army of this describes the absence of footwear and prisoners too sick to work sent to death camps for their murder. It was estimated that at least 42,000 prisoners died at the camp. But since the SS destroyed most of the records, we will never really know how many suffered. This was just one of many concentration camps liberated by our troops throughout 1945.
The stories uncovered by brave British, American, and Soviet troops, and the test is given by those who suffered so terribly insured Nazi war crimes did not go unpunished and guarantee they could be shed for prosperity. If for no other reason than to ensure that such horror needed calling out so that it should never be countenanced to happen again. As early as 1940, in his finest hour speech, Churchill warned of a new dark age made more sinister by the lights of perverted science.
He saw clearly the evil of Nazi rule and what it was, and nobly lead our nation along with our allies throughout war. It was two days later on 7 May 1945 that Germany finally capitulated. The Soviet army had already taken Berlin, Field Marshal Bernard Montgomery had accepted what happened in Denmark and the Netherlands. Facing attack on all fronts, the unconditional surrender of all German forces was offered. The final instrument of surrender was signed in Berlin the following day, and air Marshal Arthur Tedder, later a member of this house, signed on behalf of the Allies.
The war in Europe had come to an end. Across Britain, church bells rang out in recognition of the enormity of the occasion. Victory in Europe Day was declared. The British public jubilantly poured onto the street as the noble Lord mentioned, to celebrate their victory over Hitler's forces and fascism. The victory was mementos. But at a terrible cost, it had been enormous. 383,600 British troops were estimated to have lost their lives, and their had been 1.7 million casualties from across the Commonwealth.
For many, those bells must have rung hollow. On this very day 80 years ago, Nazi forces were expelled from the only occupied territory. Throughout the war, the occupied Channel Islands and faced severe repression satellite camps established on Alderney. The liberation of our dear Channel Islands was completed when British soldiers from HMS Bulldog and HMS Eagle landed in Guernsey and Jersey. The union flag was hoisted and the crowd spontaneously sang the national anthem. Liberation Day is still to this day celebrated in joyous fashion every year on 9 May on those islands.
My Lords, from the balcony of the Ministry of health 80 years ago, Churchill reminded the nation that this wasn't a victory for a party or any class, it is the victory of the Great British nation as a whole. We were the first in this ancient island to draw the sword against tyranny. Those words are evermore pertinent today. War has returned to Europe because the and an autocracy threatened to sovereign nations. Poisonous ideologies pervade our politics. If ever there was a lesson to be learned is that we British can never appease.
Our Ukrainian brothers and sisters of valiantly resisting invasion, fighting as we wanted for their homeland and their freedom. And we are there to support their struggle in the shadow of remembrance of 80 years ago. My Lords, in these troubling times, we must once again stand firm against tyranny and express great pride in our Armed Forces. The minister spoke so eloquently about our history and the importance of communal remembrance and reflection. This day of all days is also one of celebration, of affirmative triumph over almost unspeakable evil.
As His Majesty said last night, we must never forget those who delivered that triumph. My Lords, we will not.
10:29
Lord Wallace of Saltaire (Liberal Democrat)
-
-
Lord Wallace of Saltaire (Liberal Democrat)
My Lords, only the oldest of us can remember VE Day, still less the Second World War itself. Exceptionally, Lord Dubs will be able to remind us. For our grandchildren, this is relatively ancient history. The issue for us is what aspects of that history we choose to emphasise. What lessons should we say they should learn of the chaos, the cruelty, the slaughter and the sacrifice, the final victory, and the contested piece that followed? The two world wars remain central to Britain's international identity.
Our own grandchildren have been learning about them in school in the past year. We have taken them to the Western front, with the view to the spring of 1918, my 18 year old father joined the Highlands division. We have taken them to Bletchley Park where my parents-in- law worked in the Second World War. We try to explain what it meant my mother to lose her younger brother, mother to lose her younger brother, mother to lose her younger brother, For all of us linking historical events to personal narratives help younger people to understand the past.
I have been struck about how quickly my grandchildren understood that in both the walls Britain did not stand alone. The Canadian troops in the Western front, the reference to French, Portuguese, Moroccan troops alongside the British and the Chinese labour, he maintained the tanks and dug trenches and graves. 20 years later is the Polish helped in the early stages of Bletchley Park and an American contingent arrived in 1942. I was surprised to discover when we visited the Yorkshire Museum there were a great many Belgian pilots in bomber command.
The Imperial War Museums display on World War II shows of something of the Caribbean contribution to written's war effort in all three armed services. I thought it underplayed the importance however of the 2.5 millions however in the British Imperial forces and the roles they played in Burma and the eighth army fighting alongside Polish and South African divisions as well as the American army across North Africa and Italy. Recording this part of our wartime history matters because the descendants of those Allied soldiers and airmen have become part of a national community.
My parents-in-law were buried in a Bradford cemetery alongside well- kept Polish and Ukrainian sections. There were displaced persons unable to go back to their homeland as the Russians reasserted hostile control. I met many Sikhs and Hindus and And neighbours were unaware of what they were doing during World War II. This should now be an intrinsic part of our historical understanding of today's Jewish national identity. What should retail today's children about why we fought the war beyond the immediate threat of Nazism.
We should teach them about the war aims that the British and Americans agreed on behalf of the world. The Atlantic Treaty met the Atlantic Charter declared in 1941 that our countries seek no angry indictment, territorial or other. They desire to see no territorial changes that do not accord with the freely expressed wishes of the people concerned. They desire to bring about the fullest collaboration between all nations in the economic field with the object of securing for all improved labour standards, economic advancement and social security.
President Roosevelt's speech to the Congress earlier that year spelt out why the United States was already acting as the Arsenal democracy. He said, we look forward to a world founded on four essential human freedoms. The first is freedom of speech and expression everywhere in the world. The second is freedom for every person to worship God in his own way everywhere in the world. The third is freedom from want, which translated into world terms means economic understandings which will secure to every nation a healthy peacetime life for its inhabitants, everywhere in the world.
The fourth is freedom from fear, which translated into world terms means a worldwide reduction of armaments to such a point that no nation will be in a position to commit an act of physical aggression against any neighbour anywhere in the world. The world order which we seek the cooperation of three countries working together in a friendly civilised society. Yesterday our defence reminded us of Ernest Bevan's speech delivered in the Commons as the Cold War began to end the hopes that the victory of 1945 would reach global peace.
Bevan declared that the three nations of Western Europe must now draw closer together. Our sacrifices in the wall, our hatred of oppression, our parliamentary democracy and striving for economic rights and the love of liberty are common amongst us all. Our British approaches based on principles which also appeal deeply to the overwhelming masses of people in Western Europe. If we are to preserve peace and our own safety at the same time, we can only do so by the mobilisation of such moral and material.
Will inspire confidence in the West and inspire respect elsewhere. It means Britain cannot stand outside Europe and regard her problems as separate from those of her European neighbours. We all recognise how far short our world today has fallen from these ideal objectives. The current US President has repudiated Roosevelt's international and domestic legacies. There is a degree of inequality within and between states which threaten social cohesion and lose too many and free from want. We are learning again the lesson of the 1930s that constitutional democracy and open societies are not the natural order.
Populist politicians offer easy answers and authoritarian regimes are hard to dislodge. Our British public does not yet appreciate how difficult the domestic and international challenges are that we face. We hold taxes down by skimping on public investment and cutting defence expenditure to fund the rising cost of health and welfare for our ageing society. Now we have to raise defence spending and engage our citizens in national security. He will in Ukraine is a threat to our -- the war in Ukraine is a threat to our security.
There are populists out there still pretending that taxes can be cut whilst spending more on defence and without cutting public services. History does not repeat itself, but it does offer warnings. Our divided and complacent country in the 1930s were slow to respond to the threat of authoritarianism fascism and Nazism. We now face threats to the liberal international order that Roosevelt and Churchill led the Allies to build and to the piece with Europe at the end of the Cold War that was promised.
Temporary or permanently, we hope only temporarily, we have lost American support and leadership. It is our sheer duty to work together to carry the public with us and to work with our democratic allies in Europe and beyond to defend the principles from which our parents, and parents and great-grandparents fought more than 80 years ago. 80 years ago.
Our own grandchildren have been learning about them in school in the past year. We have taken them to the Western front, with the view to the spring of 1918, my 18 year old father joined the Highlands division. We have taken them to Bletchley Park where my parents-in- law worked in the Second World War. We try to explain what it meant my mother to lose her younger brother, mother to lose her younger brother, mother to lose her younger brother, For all of us linking historical events to personal narratives help younger people to understand the past.
I have been struck about how quickly my grandchildren understood that in both the walls Britain did not stand alone. The Canadian troops in the Western front, the reference to French, Portuguese, Moroccan troops alongside the British and the Chinese labour, he maintained the tanks and dug trenches and graves. 20 years later is the Polish helped in the early stages of Bletchley Park and an American contingent arrived in 1942. I was surprised to discover when we visited the Yorkshire Museum there were a great many Belgian pilots in bomber command.
The Imperial War Museums display on World War II shows of something of the Caribbean contribution to written's war effort in all three armed services. I thought it underplayed the importance however of the 2.5 millions however in the British Imperial forces and the roles they played in Burma and the eighth army fighting alongside Polish and South African divisions as well as the American army across North Africa and Italy. Recording this part of our wartime history matters because the descendants of those Allied soldiers and airmen have become part of a national community.
My parents-in-law were buried in a Bradford cemetery alongside well- kept Polish and Ukrainian sections. There were displaced persons unable to go back to their homeland as the Russians reasserted hostile control. I met many Sikhs and Hindus and And neighbours were unaware of what they were doing during World War II. This should now be an intrinsic part of our historical understanding of today's Jewish national identity. What should retail today's children about why we fought the war beyond the immediate threat of Nazism.
We should teach them about the war aims that the British and Americans agreed on behalf of the world. The Atlantic Treaty met the Atlantic Charter declared in 1941 that our countries seek no angry indictment, territorial or other. They desire to see no territorial changes that do not accord with the freely expressed wishes of the people concerned. They desire to bring about the fullest collaboration between all nations in the economic field with the object of securing for all improved labour standards, economic advancement and social security.
President Roosevelt's speech to the Congress earlier that year spelt out why the United States was already acting as the Arsenal democracy. He said, we look forward to a world founded on four essential human freedoms. The first is freedom of speech and expression everywhere in the world. The second is freedom for every person to worship God in his own way everywhere in the world. The third is freedom from want, which translated into world terms means economic understandings which will secure to every nation a healthy peacetime life for its inhabitants, everywhere in the world.
The fourth is freedom from fear, which translated into world terms means a worldwide reduction of armaments to such a point that no nation will be in a position to commit an act of physical aggression against any neighbour anywhere in the world. The world order which we seek the cooperation of three countries working together in a friendly civilised society. Yesterday our defence reminded us of Ernest Bevan's speech delivered in the Commons as the Cold War began to end the hopes that the victory of 1945 would reach global peace.
Bevan declared that the three nations of Western Europe must now draw closer together. Our sacrifices in the wall, our hatred of oppression, our parliamentary democracy and striving for economic rights and the love of liberty are common amongst us all. Our British approaches based on principles which also appeal deeply to the overwhelming masses of people in Western Europe. If we are to preserve peace and our own safety at the same time, we can only do so by the mobilisation of such moral and material.
Will inspire confidence in the West and inspire respect elsewhere. It means Britain cannot stand outside Europe and regard her problems as separate from those of her European neighbours. We all recognise how far short our world today has fallen from these ideal objectives. The current US President has repudiated Roosevelt's international and domestic legacies. There is a degree of inequality within and between states which threaten social cohesion and lose too many and free from want. We are learning again the lesson of the 1930s that constitutional democracy and open societies are not the natural order.
Populist politicians offer easy answers and authoritarian regimes are hard to dislodge. Our British public does not yet appreciate how difficult the domestic and international challenges are that we face. We hold taxes down by skimping on public investment and cutting defence expenditure to fund the rising cost of health and welfare for our ageing society. Now we have to raise defence spending and engage our citizens in national security. He will in Ukraine is a threat to our -- the war in Ukraine is a threat to our security.
There are populists out there still pretending that taxes can be cut whilst spending more on defence and without cutting public services. History does not repeat itself, but it does offer warnings. Our divided and complacent country in the 1930s were slow to respond to the threat of authoritarianism fascism and Nazism. We now face threats to the liberal international order that Roosevelt and Churchill led the Allies to build and to the piece with Europe at the end of the Cold War that was promised.
Temporary or permanently, we hope only temporarily, we have lost American support and leadership. It is our sheer duty to work together to carry the public with us and to work with our democratic allies in Europe and beyond to defend the principles from which our parents, and parents and great-grandparents fought more than 80 years ago. 80 years ago.
10:39
Lord Craig of Radley (Crossbench)
-
-
Lord Craig of Radley (Crossbench)
My Lords, join in with all the expressions of bravery of so many in and out of uniform to contribute to victory. Victory in Europe and victory in the far east. If I may be permitted a brief personal reflection, I was two weeks short of my 10th birthday when the war my 10th birthday when the war started in 1939. The Irish Free State as it then was determined to remain neutral and did so without -- throughout the conflict.
But that did not stop many thousands of my countrymen to cross to the UK and volunteered to join one of the three services. My father had lost all of his right leg in the first world war otherwise he, too, will Robert Lee have wanted to join up again. For me and my sister live continued as normal. There was no food rationing. We had a family car that was on blocks because there was no petrol. Some cars had been converted to run on gas.
For us and the rest we depended mostly on trams and bicycles and those in the countryside on ponies and traps to get around. Live continued with few changes. Contrast that with the disruption to life and at times this year terror of those exposed to the blue and those who had lost loved ones. Many children were evacuated, separated from their parents and friends and it was an experience of a friend of mine of 50 years standing.
Coverage was by newspaper standing. Coverage was by newspaper or radio, there was no TV. I have no recollection of being encouraged to listen to news bulletins. We were quite detached, as many were in Southern Ireland in the 19 We were quite detached, as many were in Southern Ireland in the 1930s and 40s. It's also true that the direction of the media coverage has so much bearing on what has been highlighted or what was left to one side.
Media management of coverage has an important place to play in so much of life today. The real much of life today. The real challenge is a truth that is the same truth, no matter where it comes from. Any difference becomes a story of itself and it is ever more difficult to manage as the speed of global information expands. To finish, we need to remember with true admiration those who answered the call of duty. Those who were prepared to sacrifice or for the freedom and democracy of future generations.
As we the beneficiaries honour, salute and thank them, so must we all as much now after 80 years as we did after one single year remember them.
But that did not stop many thousands of my countrymen to cross to the UK and volunteered to join one of the three services. My father had lost all of his right leg in the first world war otherwise he, too, will Robert Lee have wanted to join up again. For me and my sister live continued as normal. There was no food rationing. We had a family car that was on blocks because there was no petrol. Some cars had been converted to run on gas.
For us and the rest we depended mostly on trams and bicycles and those in the countryside on ponies and traps to get around. Live continued with few changes. Contrast that with the disruption to life and at times this year terror of those exposed to the blue and those who had lost loved ones. Many children were evacuated, separated from their parents and friends and it was an experience of a friend of mine of 50 years standing.
Coverage was by newspaper standing. Coverage was by newspaper or radio, there was no TV. I have no recollection of being encouraged to listen to news bulletins. We were quite detached, as many were in Southern Ireland in the 19 We were quite detached, as many were in Southern Ireland in the 1930s and 40s. It's also true that the direction of the media coverage has so much bearing on what has been highlighted or what was left to one side.
Media management of coverage has an important place to play in so much of life today. The real much of life today. The real challenge is a truth that is the same truth, no matter where it comes from. Any difference becomes a story of itself and it is ever more difficult to manage as the speed of global information expands. To finish, we need to remember with true admiration those who answered the call of duty. Those who were prepared to sacrifice or for the freedom and democracy of future generations.
As we the beneficiaries honour, salute and thank them, so must we all as much now after 80 years as we did after one single year remember them.
10:44
The Lord Bishop of Peterborough (Bishops)
-
-
The Lord Bishop of Peterborough (Bishops)
My Lords, it is a privilege to be making my Maiden speech today and I'm grateful to Lord Coaker for opening this debate and for the opening this debate and for the encouragement for us to mark and free -- and reflect such an important anniversary. It is an honour to follow on from such moving speeches. Before saying any more, I'd like to thank the many members and staff of your Lordships House for making me feel so welcome. I have been struck by the care that has been shown to help me find my feet and I'm most grateful for the time taken to do so.
I have been The Lord Bishop of Peterborough for just over a year, following four years as Bishop of Southampton. I hope to bring experience from both dioceses as I take place among you. As we have heard the 80th anniversary of victory in Europe and Victory over Japan Day has been marked in our communities in a number of different ways. Across Peterborough diocese there have been street parties in Northamptonshire, bunting in the beautiful villages of Rutland, bells ringing out, including Peterborough Cathedral, which has always been a place of gathering at times of national significance.
Last night it played its part again, drawing people together and helping them remember. It is the theme of remembering that I would like to focus on. Having begun full-time ministry as their family and children's worker over 20 years ago I have been inspired by young people in the work that goes on in our local schools. As Lord Woolley said, it is so important for our children One of them most moving expenses I had was an annual remembrance service which took place without elderly midweek congregation and the year two children from a school.
This is a genuinely collaborative exercise, and each generation learned from it. For that seven year old children, it brought to life their study of World War II. When they could hear personal stories of those who had lived through it. Speaking with a woman who had been an evacuee, or a gentleman who had served in the army, the school lesson came alive for them because these personal stories had power, as we had shared from Lord Craig. For our seniors, it was a time for them to share their stories, to be listened to, to be given permission to talk about the hardships of their time.
But there was more going on. As they listened, they could hear the hopes of young children. In their own short lives, they already knew of recent conflicts, some of which were having direct impact on two or three of them. How do we change? How do we move on if we do not remember? If we do not learn together. I would like to suggest that putting ourselves into the shoes of others helps to take an act of remembrance into something that can bring change for the future.
As we learn from others. Peter Brett diocese is linked with the diocese of Seoul in Korea. Our partnership is based on listening to one another and seeing life through the eyes of another. Their experience of war and conflict has shaped their theology and their worship. And we can learn from that. Two is ago, I had the privilege to visit the Anglican Church in Burundi. I had stories of strife and struggle. We also met many young people who are determined to ensure that life is different in the future.
They taught as much about the transformation of relationships across different social groups. Young people give us hope for a different future. Across Peterborough diocese there are many church schools. These are places where children are encouraged to develop values that they believe will help society. Ways of living that will decrease conflict. One area that is being encouraged is that of courageous advocacy. Promoting an ethos of action taking, challenging injustice and becoming agents of change. As I play my part in your Lordships House, I hope to be involved in the work of education and family life.
Supporting children and to become those agents of change, and claim their part in shaping the world to be a better place. This would indeed be a tribute to the people we remember today.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is an honour and a privilege to follow the right privilege to follow the right reverend Prelate. The Bishop of Peterborough in this important Peterborough in this important debate. She brings not just a deep
I have been The Lord Bishop of Peterborough for just over a year, following four years as Bishop of Southampton. I hope to bring experience from both dioceses as I take place among you. As we have heard the 80th anniversary of victory in Europe and Victory over Japan Day has been marked in our communities in a number of different ways. Across Peterborough diocese there have been street parties in Northamptonshire, bunting in the beautiful villages of Rutland, bells ringing out, including Peterborough Cathedral, which has always been a place of gathering at times of national significance.
Last night it played its part again, drawing people together and helping them remember. It is the theme of remembering that I would like to focus on. Having begun full-time ministry as their family and children's worker over 20 years ago I have been inspired by young people in the work that goes on in our local schools. As Lord Woolley said, it is so important for our children One of them most moving expenses I had was an annual remembrance service which took place without elderly midweek congregation and the year two children from a school.
This is a genuinely collaborative exercise, and each generation learned from it. For that seven year old children, it brought to life their study of World War II. When they could hear personal stories of those who had lived through it. Speaking with a woman who had been an evacuee, or a gentleman who had served in the army, the school lesson came alive for them because these personal stories had power, as we had shared from Lord Craig. For our seniors, it was a time for them to share their stories, to be listened to, to be given permission to talk about the hardships of their time.
But there was more going on. As they listened, they could hear the hopes of young children. In their own short lives, they already knew of recent conflicts, some of which were having direct impact on two or three of them. How do we change? How do we move on if we do not remember? If we do not learn together. I would like to suggest that putting ourselves into the shoes of others helps to take an act of remembrance into something that can bring change for the future.
As we learn from others. Peter Brett diocese is linked with the diocese of Seoul in Korea. Our partnership is based on listening to one another and seeing life through the eyes of another. Their experience of war and conflict has shaped their theology and their worship. And we can learn from that. Two is ago, I had the privilege to visit the Anglican Church in Burundi. I had stories of strife and struggle. We also met many young people who are determined to ensure that life is different in the future.
They taught as much about the transformation of relationships across different social groups. Young people give us hope for a different future. Across Peterborough diocese there are many church schools. These are places where children are encouraged to develop values that they believe will help society. Ways of living that will decrease conflict. One area that is being encouraged is that of courageous advocacy. Promoting an ethos of action taking, challenging injustice and becoming agents of change. As I play my part in your Lordships House, I hope to be involved in the work of education and family life.
Supporting children and to become those agents of change, and claim their part in shaping the world to be a better place. This would indeed be a tribute to the people we remember today.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is an honour and a privilege to follow the right privilege to follow the right reverend Prelate. The Bishop of Peterborough in this important Peterborough in this important debate. She brings not just a deep
10:49
Lord Boateng (Labour)
-
-
Lord Boateng (Labour)
debate. She brings not just a deep and abiding faith, and a passion for community development, the growth of parish congregations, and the pivotal role of young people in communities. In two diocese. She brings not just that but she brings her own personal experience having been brought up in a rectory, and her personal experience of working as a manager in the NHS. I have no doubt that she will make a hugely valuable contribution to this House going forward.
My Lords, this week, and these proceedings, are very much about memory and about commemoration. It is my privilege to chair the Sir Winston Churchill archive trust and the Memorial Gates foundation Council. We are very much in the trust about ensuring that Sir Winston Churchill's personal things are available and accessible to the nation. And the world. With the Memorial Gates, founded, many members of this House will recall, by the late and much loved baroness Sheila, who sat for so long on the benches opposite and gave so much to our nation's life.
But her enduring gift was the Memorial Gates. They highlight and commemorate the particular contributions of the Commonwealth, and the Asian African Caribbean Commonwealth in particular. To the service of this nation. They need to be remembered. But both the archive trust and the Memorial Gates foundation are not just about remembering individuals, their service, and in many cases, their ultimate sacrifice. They are their ultimate sacrifice. They are also about remembering the cause which they served.
And the reason for that sacrifice. And that's because was most succinctly laid down in the Atlantic Charter to which reference has already rightly been made. And we hold, in the Archive Trust, you can look at it on the website at any time, the website that is available generally, globally, and particularly accessible to schools. We hold the original documentation and the writings of Sir Winston Churchill. writings of Sir Winston Churchill. And the charter represents the causes one of self-determination, causes one of self-determination, sovereignty, freedom, and justice.
Self-determination, sovereignty, freedom of justice. The very cause that is at stake in so many places in our world at this time. And particularly on the continent of Europe. We need to remember that cause. One man who did and who never cause. One man who did and who never forgot it was a member of the Royal West African Regiment. His name was Joseph Hammond. And he has written of his experiences in the 14th Army, our 14th army, the 14th army of Great Britain in Burma.
And he served in that army, and this weekend, he will be 100 years old. And his life and service will be commemorated in Ghana. I have had the privilege of meeting him. I grew up in what was Ghana, and he has established a foundation. The foundation, the heart of which is the cause of peace, development, and education. In memorialising as we have done this week, one of the best things we can do is to make sure that, in the review that is currently taking place, we make sure that the history and the sacrifice, and above all, the values that we are commemorating are not lost for generations to come.
That is something positive and practical we can do. I do hope ministers in responding will indicate that will be their response to a review. But you know, Joseph Hammond remembered the charter, self-determination, freedom, and justice. And he, with other returning members, ex-service men, of the 14th army, coming back to the Gold Coast, took part in the struggle for independence. Because they took Churchill at his word. And they fought for independence. And they won, after a demonstration on 28 February 1948.
And marking the spot where they demonstrated today in Accra, there is a Marble Arch. And emblazoned on the arch of the words "Freedom and justice. " That is what they fought for. That is what they won, that is what we must never forget. And we remember Joseph Hammond and all those others who died who served.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great privilege to take part in this debate today.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Oh... I have been a member of this
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I have been a member of this house for 33 years. I can tell noble house for 33 years. I can tell noble Baroness, I made exactly the same mistake the noble Baroness made when I was sat on the crossbenches and I jumped up and made a speech in exactly the same way as the noble exactly the same way as the noble Baroness. And that noble Viscount who was due to speak did exactly who was due to speak did exactly what I did, it was sits down.
And then I finished he said, it was an excellent speech, what a pity he excellent speech, what a pity he made it six places out. My Lords, made it six places out. My Lords, rarely have I heard a minister make such an effective and passionate such an effective and passionate opening speech for a government led debate. I have to say I think the noble Lord is an excellent Defence Minister. And I support everything that the noble Lord said and his settlements.
The VE Day and VJ Day ATA celebrations are a celebration
My Lords, this week, and these proceedings, are very much about memory and about commemoration. It is my privilege to chair the Sir Winston Churchill archive trust and the Memorial Gates foundation Council. We are very much in the trust about ensuring that Sir Winston Churchill's personal things are available and accessible to the nation. And the world. With the Memorial Gates, founded, many members of this House will recall, by the late and much loved baroness Sheila, who sat for so long on the benches opposite and gave so much to our nation's life.
But her enduring gift was the Memorial Gates. They highlight and commemorate the particular contributions of the Commonwealth, and the Asian African Caribbean Commonwealth in particular. To the service of this nation. They need to be remembered. But both the archive trust and the Memorial Gates foundation are not just about remembering individuals, their service, and in many cases, their ultimate sacrifice. They are their ultimate sacrifice. They are also about remembering the cause which they served.
And the reason for that sacrifice. And that's because was most succinctly laid down in the Atlantic Charter to which reference has already rightly been made. And we hold, in the Archive Trust, you can look at it on the website at any time, the website that is available generally, globally, and particularly accessible to schools. We hold the original documentation and the writings of Sir Winston Churchill. writings of Sir Winston Churchill. And the charter represents the causes one of self-determination, causes one of self-determination, sovereignty, freedom, and justice.
Self-determination, sovereignty, freedom of justice. The very cause that is at stake in so many places in our world at this time. And particularly on the continent of Europe. We need to remember that cause. One man who did and who never cause. One man who did and who never forgot it was a member of the Royal West African Regiment. His name was Joseph Hammond. And he has written of his experiences in the 14th Army, our 14th army, the 14th army of Great Britain in Burma.
And he served in that army, and this weekend, he will be 100 years old. And his life and service will be commemorated in Ghana. I have had the privilege of meeting him. I grew up in what was Ghana, and he has established a foundation. The foundation, the heart of which is the cause of peace, development, and education. In memorialising as we have done this week, one of the best things we can do is to make sure that, in the review that is currently taking place, we make sure that the history and the sacrifice, and above all, the values that we are commemorating are not lost for generations to come.
That is something positive and practical we can do. I do hope ministers in responding will indicate that will be their response to a review. But you know, Joseph Hammond remembered the charter, self-determination, freedom, and justice. And he, with other returning members, ex-service men, of the 14th army, coming back to the Gold Coast, took part in the struggle for independence. Because they took Churchill at his word. And they fought for independence. And they won, after a demonstration on 28 February 1948.
And marking the spot where they demonstrated today in Accra, there is a Marble Arch. And emblazoned on the arch of the words "Freedom and justice. " That is what they fought for. That is what they won, that is what we must never forget. And we remember Joseph Hammond and all those others who died who served.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great privilege to take part in this debate today.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Oh... I have been a member of this
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I have been a member of this house for 33 years. I can tell noble house for 33 years. I can tell noble Baroness, I made exactly the same mistake the noble Baroness made when I was sat on the crossbenches and I jumped up and made a speech in exactly the same way as the noble exactly the same way as the noble Baroness. And that noble Viscount who was due to speak did exactly who was due to speak did exactly what I did, it was sits down.
And then I finished he said, it was an excellent speech, what a pity he excellent speech, what a pity he made it six places out. My Lords, made it six places out. My Lords, rarely have I heard a minister make such an effective and passionate such an effective and passionate opening speech for a government led debate. I have to say I think the noble Lord is an excellent Defence Minister. And I support everything that the noble Lord said and his settlements.
The VE Day and VJ Day ATA celebrations are a celebration
10:59
10:59
Earl Attlee (Conservative)
-
-
Earl Attlee (Conservative)
Soames, to represent our grandfathers at yesterday's service at Westminster Abbey. I am sure my at Westminster Abbey. I am sure my noble friend shares my gratitude. I also very much enjoyed the Maiden speech of the right reverend Prelate speech of the right reverend Prelate speech of the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Peter Peterborough. Sadly I no longer live in her Sadly I no longer live in her diocese. The sacrifices made by people is key. We will remember people is key.
We will remember them. But in addition to remembering the sacrifices, the hardship, and the sacrifices, the hardship, and the cost, we must remember how we got ourselves into the Second World got ourselves into the Second World War. Of course there are two main reasons. One was the effect of the reasons. One was the effect of the Treaty of Versailles, the other was the failure to rearm or to rearm fast enough in the face of an obvious threat. But we can easily understand why, then, we were so reluctant to rearm in preparation for war.
When the first war was so terrible that no sane person would want to go through a war again. When we made our final ultimatum in 1939, out combat power, when assessed by our opponents was insufficient to avert and avoid war. This was a point made so well by the noble Lord. And we paid a very high price for not rearming soon enough. In the 1970s, many of the Masters at Stowe School which I attended had served with distinction during the war.
They have plenty of emcees or equivalent. But they drummed into us that war was to be avoided at all possible costs. Nevertheless, in order to deter, they took great care to ensure that we understood how to The CCF was important to the school and was initially compulsory. I recall the reverent Josh Nicholl MC playing a key part in it. When I came to your Lordships House in 1992, most of the senior members of the House had tasted defeat and been hungry.
Many had served with distinction during the war and I recall the noble Lords Lord Healey, Carrington, Runcie, Mowbray Lauderdale, Jellicoe, just to name a few. There was even a noble Lord who had served in the First World War. Those noble lords would never do anything that would allow us to be defeated, or to use military pylons, to be fixed again. My Lords, happily now than of our leaders at the top have tasted defeat or been hungry.
But the post World War II order that the noble Lord the Minister refer to that led to this comfortable situation is breaking down. We need to remember what happens if we do not Ryyan fast enough in the face of a clear threat and I think that we need to do much more about educating our people about the need for some very hard choices that will need to be made if we cannot very soon stopped state on state conflict in Europe.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great privilege to take part in this debate today to take part in this debate today and I am so grateful to noble Earl for his graciousness and generosity. I am afraid I was just a little bit too keen. I congratulate the Right too keen. I congratulate the Right Reverend Prelate The Lord Bishop of Peterborough on her excellent Maiden speech and it is always a pleasure to listen to my good friend and old to listen to my good friend and old friend the noble Lord.
When I look at the list of the great speakers in this debate I thought how lucky I
We will remember them. But in addition to remembering the sacrifices, the hardship, and the sacrifices, the hardship, and the cost, we must remember how we got ourselves into the Second World got ourselves into the Second World War. Of course there are two main reasons. One was the effect of the reasons. One was the effect of the Treaty of Versailles, the other was the failure to rearm or to rearm fast enough in the face of an obvious threat. But we can easily understand why, then, we were so reluctant to rearm in preparation for war.
When the first war was so terrible that no sane person would want to go through a war again. When we made our final ultimatum in 1939, out combat power, when assessed by our opponents was insufficient to avert and avoid war. This was a point made so well by the noble Lord. And we paid a very high price for not rearming soon enough. In the 1970s, many of the Masters at Stowe School which I attended had served with distinction during the war.
They have plenty of emcees or equivalent. But they drummed into us that war was to be avoided at all possible costs. Nevertheless, in order to deter, they took great care to ensure that we understood how to The CCF was important to the school and was initially compulsory. I recall the reverent Josh Nicholl MC playing a key part in it. When I came to your Lordships House in 1992, most of the senior members of the House had tasted defeat and been hungry.
Many had served with distinction during the war and I recall the noble Lords Lord Healey, Carrington, Runcie, Mowbray Lauderdale, Jellicoe, just to name a few. There was even a noble Lord who had served in the First World War. Those noble lords would never do anything that would allow us to be defeated, or to use military pylons, to be fixed again. My Lords, happily now than of our leaders at the top have tasted defeat or been hungry.
But the post World War II order that the noble Lord the Minister refer to that led to this comfortable situation is breaking down. We need to remember what happens if we do not Ryyan fast enough in the face of a clear threat and I think that we need to do much more about educating our people about the need for some very hard choices that will need to be made if we cannot very soon stopped state on state conflict in Europe.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great privilege to take part in this debate today to take part in this debate today and I am so grateful to noble Earl for his graciousness and generosity. I am afraid I was just a little bit too keen. I congratulate the Right too keen. I congratulate the Right Reverend Prelate The Lord Bishop of Peterborough on her excellent Maiden speech and it is always a pleasure to listen to my good friend and old to listen to my good friend and old friend the noble Lord.
When I look at the list of the great speakers in this debate I thought how lucky I
11:03
Baroness Hunter of Auchenreoch (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Hunter of Auchenreoch (Labour)
this debate I thought how lucky I was and I look forward to hearing from you all. Like many in your Lordships House and indeed outside Lordships House and indeed outside it, I have also been moved by the fly pasts, the street parties, the concert last night and the King's Speech amongst the many wonderful events in recent days to commemorate VJ Day. As other noble Lord have said the Second World War of course did not end until what is now known as VJ Day following the dropping of the atom bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki in August 1945.
I commend this opportunity unprecedented I am advised by the House of Lords library to muck both VE and VJ anniversaries at once. I wish to address VJ Day for personal reasons. I was born in Kuala Lumpur, a colonial child. My father, mother, grandparents, aunts and uncles, their many friends and work colleagues in Malaysia where they all lived all served and some died in the Asian theatre. Many were killed or captured in the fall of Singapore.
Incarcerated in a notorious prison or worse, forced to work on the so-called death railway. My father, a second-generation rubber planter, joined the Federated Malay States volunteer. The outbreak of war and was called up following the Japanese invasion in December 1942. He fought his way down the peninsula to Singapore, chased by the formidable Japanese army. Of the 160 men in his unit only 40 survived. He escaped in a fortuitously flat bottomed fishing boat.
In a letter a few weeks later he wrote, "Five days out and up he wrote, "Five days out and up comes a Saab, 100 yards in front of us and looses of three torpedoes. Although I had been in action, ambush, bombs, shells, altered and machine-gunned and several times almost captured, these were easily my worst moments. I honestly thought it was the end. But no, one passed in front and two went clean underneath. I arrived in Colombo with the clothes I stood up in and $0.60." He spent the rest of the war fighting behind enemy lines in the jungles of Burma and Malaya.
Trained units in intelligence gathering, sabotage and hand-to-hand combat, funnily liaising with the forces parachuted in to negotiate the Japanese surrender in Kuala Lumpur. Meanwhile my mother worked with her sister in the SOA cipher department decoding signals in the Allied HQ in Colombo. I salute the extraordinary courage of the men and women of the essay we in all theatres of the war. -- SOA. I encourage everyone here if you are in Thailand or Singapore to visit the cemeteries and memorials and the museums where there are many thousands of military personnel and workers are honoured.
There are inscriptions of over 24,000 allied personnel whose bodies were never found, including the name of my mother's first husband. I Joan -- I join other noble Lord in thanking the war commission for what they do. We are the beneficiaries of what the Second World War for four in Asia, Second World War for four in Asia, Africa and Europe. We have been protected by the international institutions they put in place. The UN, the IMF, the world, NATO WTO, the EEC.
A world of enduring alliances built on grateful sacrifices by both sides in that war. And as beneficiaries of their courage and sacrifice, and in their memory, we should keep this in the forefront of our minds. forefront of our minds.
I commend this opportunity unprecedented I am advised by the House of Lords library to muck both VE and VJ anniversaries at once. I wish to address VJ Day for personal reasons. I was born in Kuala Lumpur, a colonial child. My father, mother, grandparents, aunts and uncles, their many friends and work colleagues in Malaysia where they all lived all served and some died in the Asian theatre. Many were killed or captured in the fall of Singapore.
Incarcerated in a notorious prison or worse, forced to work on the so-called death railway. My father, a second-generation rubber planter, joined the Federated Malay States volunteer. The outbreak of war and was called up following the Japanese invasion in December 1942. He fought his way down the peninsula to Singapore, chased by the formidable Japanese army. Of the 160 men in his unit only 40 survived. He escaped in a fortuitously flat bottomed fishing boat.
In a letter a few weeks later he wrote, "Five days out and up he wrote, "Five days out and up comes a Saab, 100 yards in front of us and looses of three torpedoes. Although I had been in action, ambush, bombs, shells, altered and machine-gunned and several times almost captured, these were easily my worst moments. I honestly thought it was the end. But no, one passed in front and two went clean underneath. I arrived in Colombo with the clothes I stood up in and $0.60." He spent the rest of the war fighting behind enemy lines in the jungles of Burma and Malaya.
Trained units in intelligence gathering, sabotage and hand-to-hand combat, funnily liaising with the forces parachuted in to negotiate the Japanese surrender in Kuala Lumpur. Meanwhile my mother worked with her sister in the SOA cipher department decoding signals in the Allied HQ in Colombo. I salute the extraordinary courage of the men and women of the essay we in all theatres of the war. -- SOA. I encourage everyone here if you are in Thailand or Singapore to visit the cemeteries and memorials and the museums where there are many thousands of military personnel and workers are honoured.
There are inscriptions of over 24,000 allied personnel whose bodies were never found, including the name of my mother's first husband. I Joan -- I join other noble Lord in thanking the war commission for what they do. We are the beneficiaries of what the Second World War for four in Asia, Second World War for four in Asia, Africa and Europe. We have been protected by the international institutions they put in place. The UN, the IMF, the world, NATO WTO, the EEC.
A world of enduring alliances built on grateful sacrifices by both sides in that war. And as beneficiaries of their courage and sacrifice, and in their memory, we should keep this in the forefront of our minds. forefront of our minds.
11:08
Lord Howell of Guildford (Conservative)
-
-
Lord Howell of Guildford (Conservative)
My Lords we have had some very fine speeches and I shall use my brief five minutes for a personal memory first and a reflection of where it has taken us and where it is taking us now. First, was there on the glorious day of 8 May. There are fewer and fewer of us that can say that. My father had returned from three years away in the desert and to Italy. He took that morning to the top of the park where we watched the parade on Bayswater Road.
General Alexander was my father's most admired leader. My father came back unscathed, but my wife's father was killed during the last days, along with all three of his brothers. An entire family almost entirely wiped out. Later that day my father had to go back to work somewhere in Whitehall, which was very odd because it was supposed to be a national holiday. Of course, although he never told us or mentioned it, he wasn't working just in Whitehall, was in fact in Mr Churchill's war rooms by St James's Park whether wall was still being run from.
Matt where the war was still being run from. When I discovered this some 20 years later is when the Cabinet office released photographs of him and his photographs of him and his , it was comforting. When I worked in the Treasury I went down to those war rooms that were frozen in time with my father's desk is still there with two lumps of sugar still in his drawer. That was the end. There was a sign on the wall saying August 15, VJ Day, to Japanese shot in the Philippines, no one knows what they were doing there.
It's worth reflecting that our fathers and forefathers had learnt a lot about peacemaking. They knew what people seem to have forgotten today. Peace seem to have forgotten today. Peace is built on temporary factors. Pariah nations tend to go straight back to conflict afterwards. Ukraine is an example and something will have two change inside Russia which have two change inside Russia which is a pariah nation. If we are to get peace, the foundations need to be learnt from 1945.
Even more now than then in this world of drones and digitally, war is totally against civilians, not just the front line at all. The defence of civilians is important, is not just a military matter. Ukraine also need a vast amount of diplomatic effort to grasp what is at stake. The UN will have to be rebuilt, or built on or replaced. Ukraine will have to be rebuilt, certainly with Russian funds. Even our Commonwealth, 56 nation plus, is not united in understanding this and we should be concentrating much more on getting not just Europe, but Asia and the vast Commonwealth network agreed on a common cause and a common stance.
My Lords, I welcome the report that shows the Commonwealth is alive and working. I welcome... And finally I hope that the new Pope brings a dose of wisdom to a volatile America. So perhaps are some slim grounds of optimism beginning to emerge and particularly if we pay attention to those lessons of how to build lasting peace in 1945. Let's hope and let's learn and let's remember.
General Alexander was my father's most admired leader. My father came back unscathed, but my wife's father was killed during the last days, along with all three of his brothers. An entire family almost entirely wiped out. Later that day my father had to go back to work somewhere in Whitehall, which was very odd because it was supposed to be a national holiday. Of course, although he never told us or mentioned it, he wasn't working just in Whitehall, was in fact in Mr Churchill's war rooms by St James's Park whether wall was still being run from.
Matt where the war was still being run from. When I discovered this some 20 years later is when the Cabinet office released photographs of him and his photographs of him and his , it was comforting. When I worked in the Treasury I went down to those war rooms that were frozen in time with my father's desk is still there with two lumps of sugar still in his drawer. That was the end. There was a sign on the wall saying August 15, VJ Day, to Japanese shot in the Philippines, no one knows what they were doing there.
It's worth reflecting that our fathers and forefathers had learnt a lot about peacemaking. They knew what people seem to have forgotten today. Peace seem to have forgotten today. Peace is built on temporary factors. Pariah nations tend to go straight back to conflict afterwards. Ukraine is an example and something will have two change inside Russia which have two change inside Russia which is a pariah nation. If we are to get peace, the foundations need to be learnt from 1945.
Even more now than then in this world of drones and digitally, war is totally against civilians, not just the front line at all. The defence of civilians is important, is not just a military matter. Ukraine also need a vast amount of diplomatic effort to grasp what is at stake. The UN will have to be rebuilt, or built on or replaced. Ukraine will have to be rebuilt, certainly with Russian funds. Even our Commonwealth, 56 nation plus, is not united in understanding this and we should be concentrating much more on getting not just Europe, but Asia and the vast Commonwealth network agreed on a common cause and a common stance.
My Lords, I welcome the report that shows the Commonwealth is alive and working. I welcome... And finally I hope that the new Pope brings a dose of wisdom to a volatile America. So perhaps are some slim grounds of optimism beginning to emerge and particularly if we pay attention to those lessons of how to build lasting peace in 1945. Let's hope and let's learn and let's remember.
11:13
Baroness Amos (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Amos (Labour)
My thanks to Mike noble friend Lord Coaker for an excellent opening speech and my congratulations to the Right Reverend Prelate for her Maiden speech. I look forward to working with her in the House. My thanks also to those other noble Lords who have spoken before me, so many with their personal recollections. It is a week for me and I know for millions of others will live long in our collective memory. The sight of our veterans, fewer and fewer of them each year, fragile, but resolute.
The sharpness of their recollections. The moving stories and tributes, the belief that the vanquishing of the tyranny and injustice that we saw in that period. We believe in a safe and secure future. The remembrance of lives lost, hopes extinguished. Families, communities and countries torn apart, destroyed. And therefore us all to see, resilience, persistence and courage. But in the midst of the celebration and commemoration, I was reminded of the conflicts which still plague our world as we again face turmoil and insecurity.
In Africa, the Middle East, Asia and of course our own continent with Ukraine. I was reminded of the promises we made ourselves, the never again, which puts the onus on us to resist tyranny, to challenge injustice and do everything we can to bring peace and find solutions to conflict. Our political engagement, diplomacy and foreign policy is more important foreign policy is more important than ever. It is so important for us to defend democracy, to sustain our freedoms, but as we celebrate victory in your day, I am also reminded that it was a world war.
It involved so many, not just Europe. But in the Commonwealth, our Overseas Territories, the United States, the far east, as my noble friend so eloquently described in terms of her own family. That the battles also occurred in many countries. I have personally seen the cost of conflict. I am very glad I did not have to experience it personally, but it has reminded me that we have so much still to do. We need to make sure our young people have a full understanding of our have a full understanding of our Lord Wallace of Saltaire talked about the importance of education, because our history is sobering as well as being uplifting.
During World War II, African and Caribbean people made significant contributions to the war effort through military service. And I thank my noble friend Lord Coaker for recognising the involvement of Commonwealth and other friends. Let us also recognise that their involvement had and continues to have a long-standing impact. The RAF raised its colour bar, and 6000 black African men volunteered. 5500 as ground staff, 450 in other ways. Approximately 10,000 men and women from the black Caribbean joined the British army.
80 women joined the women's auxiliaries as service. The Royal Navy accepted no black people. Over half a million people served in British uniform with 1/5 involved in active combat. The RAF had squadrons from Nigeria, the Gold Coast, Trinidad, Jamaica. People from Britain's colonies contributed financially through fundraising campaigns and donations. In the country of my birth, Guyana, as well as the neighbouring country Suriname played a key role. 397 ships were lost in Caribbean waters accounting for 20% of all the Allied ships sunk.
The Caribbean was important because of the proximity to the Panama Canal. But even with these contributions, and here my Lords, education is so important, racism and prejudice were everywhere. British soldiers relegated to support roles whatever their capabilities. Post-war black veterans often struggled to receive support. In 1948, one such, Tom Botting, not Boateng, as my noble friend, was refused service at Rules restaurant. And the Minister for food and to intervene say could get an apology. We must embrace our whole history, imperfect as it is.
It is what has made us who we are. Vibrant, dynamic, diverse, with that strong sense of fair play and fairness, that love of freedom and justice which is so deeply embedded
**** Possible New Speaker ****
in our sense of who we are. My Lords, it is a great pleasure
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great pleasure
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great pleasure to follow the noble Baroness who has made some very important points, and indeed a privilege to take part in indeed a privilege to take part in this debate. Like most members of your Lordships House, I came into your Lordships House, I came into this world long after VE Day and have no recollection of 80 years ago. But I have a vivid recollection of 30 years ago when we celebrated of 30 years ago when we celebrated the 50th anniversary of VE day, I the 50th anniversary of VE day, I remember so well what it meant to my remember so well what it meant to my father.
Who was then only a few months away from the end of his months away from the end of his life. It's meant so much to him to know that 50 years after he and his know that 50 years after he and his friends came back from a war in which he had fought from day one in
The sharpness of their recollections. The moving stories and tributes, the belief that the vanquishing of the tyranny and injustice that we saw in that period. We believe in a safe and secure future. The remembrance of lives lost, hopes extinguished. Families, communities and countries torn apart, destroyed. And therefore us all to see, resilience, persistence and courage. But in the midst of the celebration and commemoration, I was reminded of the conflicts which still plague our world as we again face turmoil and insecurity.
In Africa, the Middle East, Asia and of course our own continent with Ukraine. I was reminded of the promises we made ourselves, the never again, which puts the onus on us to resist tyranny, to challenge injustice and do everything we can to bring peace and find solutions to conflict. Our political engagement, diplomacy and foreign policy is more important foreign policy is more important than ever. It is so important for us to defend democracy, to sustain our freedoms, but as we celebrate victory in your day, I am also reminded that it was a world war.
It involved so many, not just Europe. But in the Commonwealth, our Overseas Territories, the United States, the far east, as my noble friend so eloquently described in terms of her own family. That the battles also occurred in many countries. I have personally seen the cost of conflict. I am very glad I did not have to experience it personally, but it has reminded me that we have so much still to do. We need to make sure our young people have a full understanding of our have a full understanding of our Lord Wallace of Saltaire talked about the importance of education, because our history is sobering as well as being uplifting.
During World War II, African and Caribbean people made significant contributions to the war effort through military service. And I thank my noble friend Lord Coaker for recognising the involvement of Commonwealth and other friends. Let us also recognise that their involvement had and continues to have a long-standing impact. The RAF raised its colour bar, and 6000 black African men volunteered. 5500 as ground staff, 450 in other ways. Approximately 10,000 men and women from the black Caribbean joined the British army.
80 women joined the women's auxiliaries as service. The Royal Navy accepted no black people. Over half a million people served in British uniform with 1/5 involved in active combat. The RAF had squadrons from Nigeria, the Gold Coast, Trinidad, Jamaica. People from Britain's colonies contributed financially through fundraising campaigns and donations. In the country of my birth, Guyana, as well as the neighbouring country Suriname played a key role. 397 ships were lost in Caribbean waters accounting for 20% of all the Allied ships sunk.
The Caribbean was important because of the proximity to the Panama Canal. But even with these contributions, and here my Lords, education is so important, racism and prejudice were everywhere. British soldiers relegated to support roles whatever their capabilities. Post-war black veterans often struggled to receive support. In 1948, one such, Tom Botting, not Boateng, as my noble friend, was refused service at Rules restaurant. And the Minister for food and to intervene say could get an apology. We must embrace our whole history, imperfect as it is.
It is what has made us who we are. Vibrant, dynamic, diverse, with that strong sense of fair play and fairness, that love of freedom and justice which is so deeply embedded
**** Possible New Speaker ****
in our sense of who we are. My Lords, it is a great pleasure
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great pleasure
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a great pleasure to follow the noble Baroness who has made some very important points, and indeed a privilege to take part in indeed a privilege to take part in this debate. Like most members of your Lordships House, I came into your Lordships House, I came into this world long after VE Day and have no recollection of 80 years ago. But I have a vivid recollection of 30 years ago when we celebrated of 30 years ago when we celebrated the 50th anniversary of VE day, I the 50th anniversary of VE day, I remember so well what it meant to my remember so well what it meant to my father.
Who was then only a few months away from the end of his months away from the end of his life. It's meant so much to him to know that 50 years after he and his know that 50 years after he and his friends came back from a war in which he had fought from day one in
11:21
Baroness Laing of Elderslie (Conservative)
-
-
Baroness Laing of Elderslie (Conservative)
1939, until 1946, that 50 years later, the country and the world were remembering what they did and why it mattered. And he used to why it mattered. And he used to impress upon us as children, you must remember what happened. You must remember what happened. You must remember why it happened. You must remember why it happened. You must know about this because you, he used to say to me, you must make used to say to me, you must make sure it does not happen again.
So I am delighted to hear what the Minister has said this morning. Minister has said this morning. Because that echoes those sentiments, never let it happen sentiments, never let it happen again. Yesterday in Westminster again. Yesterday in Westminster Abbey, there was a moment when certain words brought a tear to the certain words brought a tear to the eyes of strongmen. Not the words of eyes of strongmen. Not the words of a general or an Admiral, not even the words of Winston Churchill, but the words, there will be bluebirds over the White Cliffs of Dover tomorrow, just you wait and see.
There will be bluebirds over the White Cliffs of Dover tomorrow, when the world is free. The words of the forces sweetheart Vera Lynn. The Minister mentioned rightly that the victory of 80 years ago was the victory of a nation as a whole. There are memorials all over this country to brave service men, and brilliant generals and admirals. There is no memorial to Vera Lynn. I am trying my best to carry the torch of the Dame Vera Lynn Memorial Campaign.
Not just because my father was one of those who adored the forces sweetheart. Not just because I was brought up on a series of I was brought up on a series of albums called "Hits of the Blitz. " The best hits of the Blitz etc. Not because of that, but because of a promise I made to Sir David Amess, my late colleague in the House of Commons, who started this campaign several years ago to raise the money for a memorial to Dame Vera Lynn.
I promised Sir David that I would do what I could to help him in his efforts. You will remember that Sir David was brutally murdered in the course of his duties as a Member of Parliament. So I feel a duty to try to carry on the work that he started. A place for the memorial has been identified in Dover, most of the funds for this wonderful memorial have been raised, and the memorial is actually in production. It is a rather wonderful bronze memorial, encompassing, as so many people have said not just one person but the many whose efforts we praise today, but more money is needed, in order to finish the work that Sir David Amess started, of the memorial to Dame Vera Lynn.
So I am making an unashamed plea to the Minister, to your Lordships, and through you, to a wider audience. Much money has been raised by small donations from people who cared. But £350,000 is people who cared. But £350,000 is still needed in order to put up memorial to the forces sweetheart, to the person who embodied that spirit that the Minister mentioned spirit that the Minister mentioned of the will to carry on. Please help. help.
So I am delighted to hear what the Minister has said this morning. Minister has said this morning. Because that echoes those sentiments, never let it happen sentiments, never let it happen again. Yesterday in Westminster again. Yesterday in Westminster Abbey, there was a moment when certain words brought a tear to the certain words brought a tear to the eyes of strongmen. Not the words of eyes of strongmen. Not the words of a general or an Admiral, not even the words of Winston Churchill, but the words, there will be bluebirds over the White Cliffs of Dover tomorrow, just you wait and see.
There will be bluebirds over the White Cliffs of Dover tomorrow, when the world is free. The words of the forces sweetheart Vera Lynn. The Minister mentioned rightly that the victory of 80 years ago was the victory of a nation as a whole. There are memorials all over this country to brave service men, and brilliant generals and admirals. There is no memorial to Vera Lynn. I am trying my best to carry the torch of the Dame Vera Lynn Memorial Campaign.
Not just because my father was one of those who adored the forces sweetheart. Not just because I was brought up on a series of I was brought up on a series of albums called "Hits of the Blitz. " The best hits of the Blitz etc. Not because of that, but because of a promise I made to Sir David Amess, my late colleague in the House of Commons, who started this campaign several years ago to raise the money for a memorial to Dame Vera Lynn.
I promised Sir David that I would do what I could to help him in his efforts. You will remember that Sir David was brutally murdered in the course of his duties as a Member of Parliament. So I feel a duty to try to carry on the work that he started. A place for the memorial has been identified in Dover, most of the funds for this wonderful memorial have been raised, and the memorial is actually in production. It is a rather wonderful bronze memorial, encompassing, as so many people have said not just one person but the many whose efforts we praise today, but more money is needed, in order to finish the work that Sir David Amess started, of the memorial to Dame Vera Lynn.
So I am making an unashamed plea to the Minister, to your Lordships, and through you, to a wider audience. Much money has been raised by small donations from people who cared. But £350,000 is people who cared. But £350,000 is still needed in order to put up memorial to the forces sweetheart, to the person who embodied that spirit that the Minister mentioned spirit that the Minister mentioned of the will to carry on. Please help. help.
11:24
Lord Stirrup (Crossbench)
-
-
Lord Stirrup (Crossbench)
My Lords, the commemoration of VE day this week was a particularly poignant one since it was probably the last major landmark which we will see significant numbers of veterans. When the last human link to the Second World War is gone, there is a danger that the trauma of that time will move from being a live to community experience to becoming a dry historical fact. If we allow that to happen, the lessons of history become weakened. We increase the risk of repeating past mistakes.
Remembrance is thus crucial to our understanding not just of the past but also of the present and the perils of the future. Much of this week has been about remembering the courses and conduct of the war. Important though that is, we must go further. One of my regrets, of the centenary commemorations of the First World War is that they largely ended at the anniversary of November 1918 marking the end of the fighting. We would have done well to reflect much more than we did on the diplomatic and political failures of 1919 onwards would set the conditions for the subsequent catastrophe that unfolded in the 1930s and 1940s.
The aftermath of the second world war was very different. The effort that went into reconstructing societies, to rebuilding political trust, and into creating an international order formed the context in which we have lived our lives ever since. That is the legacy of the Second World War generation. But that's legacy is now at risk. Aggressive war is once more being waged in Europe. Meanwhile the umbrella of American might under which we have sheltered for so long is looking, to say the least, somewhat vague.
We have neglected our own military power relying on others to make up the deficit was now we are being measured by events and found wanting as we were in the 1930s. NATO protected our societies through the long testing years of the Cold War. And it remains the only credible instrument for ensuring our future security. But it is a different NATO from the one we have been used to. It is a NATO that must recognise the substantial shift of American power from Europe to the Indo-Pacific.
A shift that will continue whoever occupies the White House. It is a NATO in which European members must shoulder a much greater share of the burden of their own security than they have done for many years. Those there is a growing acceptance of this tree. But we still fail to accept the consequences was the there is a need for us in Europe especially those with the larger economies to spend much more on defence was top I do not mean marginal increases I mean something of the order of twice what we currently spend.
The second consequence is the need for a way of funding, developing, curing and operating the strategic military capabilities for which we have for too long been overreliant on the United States. It cannot be NATO, it cannot be the EU because not all members of the EU are in NATO and not all European members of NATO are in the EU. The Brussels-based think tank has recently published a paper proposing a different solution. A European defence mechanism. This would be a procurement agency that would in specified areas plan, fund, and potentially own strategic enablers which could be committed to NATO.
It will be achieved through an intergovernmental treaty along the lines of that which set up the European stability mechanism in response to COVID. Importantly, it would enable the UK to engage in the improvement of European defence capabilities as an equal partner not as an adjunct to the EU, with all the limitations that come with such a status. This is the kind of innovative thinking we so desperately needed in response to the current serious challenges we face. I commend it to the Minister. And this is a particularly appropriate moment to consider such matters.
This week we commemorate the efforts and sacrifices of those who served this country and European security more widely throughout the Second World War. But there could surely be no better act of commemoration than safeguarding their legacy for future generation, then ensuring the continued defence of the freedoms for which so many of
**** Possible New Speaker ****
them, like Sergeant Coker paid such a bitter price. My Lords, I'm grateful for the
Remembrance is thus crucial to our understanding not just of the past but also of the present and the perils of the future. Much of this week has been about remembering the courses and conduct of the war. Important though that is, we must go further. One of my regrets, of the centenary commemorations of the First World War is that they largely ended at the anniversary of November 1918 marking the end of the fighting. We would have done well to reflect much more than we did on the diplomatic and political failures of 1919 onwards would set the conditions for the subsequent catastrophe that unfolded in the 1930s and 1940s.
The aftermath of the second world war was very different. The effort that went into reconstructing societies, to rebuilding political trust, and into creating an international order formed the context in which we have lived our lives ever since. That is the legacy of the Second World War generation. But that's legacy is now at risk. Aggressive war is once more being waged in Europe. Meanwhile the umbrella of American might under which we have sheltered for so long is looking, to say the least, somewhat vague.
We have neglected our own military power relying on others to make up the deficit was now we are being measured by events and found wanting as we were in the 1930s. NATO protected our societies through the long testing years of the Cold War. And it remains the only credible instrument for ensuring our future security. But it is a different NATO from the one we have been used to. It is a NATO that must recognise the substantial shift of American power from Europe to the Indo-Pacific.
A shift that will continue whoever occupies the White House. It is a NATO in which European members must shoulder a much greater share of the burden of their own security than they have done for many years. Those there is a growing acceptance of this tree. But we still fail to accept the consequences was the there is a need for us in Europe especially those with the larger economies to spend much more on defence was top I do not mean marginal increases I mean something of the order of twice what we currently spend.
The second consequence is the need for a way of funding, developing, curing and operating the strategic military capabilities for which we have for too long been overreliant on the United States. It cannot be NATO, it cannot be the EU because not all members of the EU are in NATO and not all European members of NATO are in the EU. The Brussels-based think tank has recently published a paper proposing a different solution. A European defence mechanism. This would be a procurement agency that would in specified areas plan, fund, and potentially own strategic enablers which could be committed to NATO.
It will be achieved through an intergovernmental treaty along the lines of that which set up the European stability mechanism in response to COVID. Importantly, it would enable the UK to engage in the improvement of European defence capabilities as an equal partner not as an adjunct to the EU, with all the limitations that come with such a status. This is the kind of innovative thinking we so desperately needed in response to the current serious challenges we face. I commend it to the Minister. And this is a particularly appropriate moment to consider such matters.
This week we commemorate the efforts and sacrifices of those who served this country and European security more widely throughout the Second World War. But there could surely be no better act of commemoration than safeguarding their legacy for future generation, then ensuring the continued defence of the freedoms for which so many of
**** Possible New Speaker ****
them, like Sergeant Coker paid such a bitter price. My Lords, I'm grateful for the
11:30
Lord Pitkeathley of Camden Town (Labour)
-
-
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I'm grateful for the opportunity to add a voice from one of the smaller corners of our of the smaller corners of our national story. And I do so amongst so many moving and powerful speeches today including from my noble friend the Minister. An impressive Maiden speech from the Bishop who I look forward to working with again. 18 years ago, the world breathed again. After years of darkness, brutality and sacrifice, peace was declared in Europe.
On VE Day and later on VJ Day, nations rejoiced and lives broken by war began slowly to mend. I rise with a small personal thread woven into that later tapestry. My mother, who some of you will know, and her family, from Guernsey. One of the beloved Channel Islands. The only part of the British Isles to ensure occupation by German forces during the Second World War, as has already been said. In June 1940, my noble kinsman then less than one year old was, with 24 hours notice, bundled onto a boat along with her family.
The rest were either fighting abroad or chose to remain on the island and experienced in some cases, to moan families, the occupying forces taking over their Nearly 5 years later on 8 May Winston Churchill gave his famous address to the nation, amongst his words were the simple and profound, our dear Channel Islands will be freed today. But the Channel Islands freed today. But the Channel Islands were not freed until 9 May, a day that is celebrated every year and by happy coincidence is my birthday.
Immediate hope was brought to people who had waited so long for freedom. What transpired between these two dates tell stories of hardship, suffering and extraordinary resilience. For nearly 5 years islanders lived in harsh isolation. Rations doodled to near starvation levels, electricity failed, civilians resorted to eating candle wax to stay alive and that elderly dyed cold in their beds. Some were deported to internment camps, never to return. Yet amid hunger and fear, they showed quite unwavering resolve.
They held fast to the community, their customs and their humanity. Even as the wart stripped so much else away. Today, as we mark the 80th anniversary is, we remember not only be great battles and sweeping victories, but also the quiet heroism. The perseverance of civilians under occupation, the stubborn endurance of small communities far from the centres of power and the enduring spirit that kept hope alive through the darkest years. In these uncertain times today, I take hope from their example.
The liberation of the Channel Islands reminds us that freedom must never be taken for granted and that even in the most isolated places ideals of liberty and justice burn just as brightly. We own a debt of gratitude to all who fought, all who endured and all who built. Their courage bought us our freedom. Our memory of them keeps that freedom alive.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I congratulate Right Reverend Prelate on her wonderful Maiden speech and I loved her focus Maiden speech and I loved her focus on children. We are kindred spirits. My Lords, yesterday I had the honour My Lords, yesterday I had the honour and privilege of hosting the Royal British Legion Royal British Legion British Legion Royal British Legion VE80 celebration where veterans VE80 celebration where veterans shared their vivid memories and experiences. Where children creatively perform their vision of creatively perform their vision of the past and hope for the future.
Seeing them perform, I took great Seeing them perform, I took great pride in being part of our great country. It was important for me to host the service, this emotional service because it was a way of acknowledging my own family's contribution to World War II. Three contribution to World War II. Three of my uncles fault alongside the Allied forces. Two of them died. One went on to become the mayor of Bolton 50 years later. Today, as we commemorate the 80th anniversary of Terry in Europe Day, our heart swell with pride and gratitude for all those who contributed to the Allied triumph over tyranny.
Alongside the well-deserved celebrations, let us also take a moment to remember and honour a crucial part of that victory, that is the remarkable contribution of the Caribbean people, as other noble lords have said. From the sunny shores of
Lord Pitkeathley of Camden Town (Labour)
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I'm grateful for the opportunity to add a voice from one of the smaller corners of our of the smaller corners of our national story. And I do so amongst so many moving and powerful speeches today including from my noble friend the Minister. An impressive Maiden speech from the Bishop who I look forward to working with again. 18 years ago, the world breathed again. After years of darkness, brutality and sacrifice, peace was declared in Europe.
On VE Day and later on VJ Day, nations rejoiced and lives broken by war began slowly to mend. I rise with a small personal thread woven into that later tapestry. My mother, who some of you will know, and her family, from Guernsey. One of the beloved Channel Islands. The only part of the British Isles to ensure occupation by German forces during the Second World War, as has already been said. In June 1940, my noble kinsman then less than one year old was, with 24 hours notice, bundled onto a boat along with her family.
The rest were either fighting abroad or chose to remain on the island and experienced in some cases, to moan families, the occupying forces taking over their Nearly 5 years later on 8 May Winston Churchill gave his famous address to the nation, amongst his words were the simple and profound, our dear Channel Islands will be freed today. But the Channel Islands freed today. But the Channel Islands were not freed until 9 May, a day that is celebrated every year and by happy coincidence is my birthday.
Immediate hope was brought to people who had waited so long for freedom. What transpired between these two dates tell stories of hardship, suffering and extraordinary resilience. For nearly 5 years islanders lived in harsh isolation. Rations doodled to near starvation levels, electricity failed, civilians resorted to eating candle wax to stay alive and that elderly dyed cold in their beds. Some were deported to internment camps, never to return. Yet amid hunger and fear, they showed quite unwavering resolve.
They held fast to the community, their customs and their humanity. Even as the wart stripped so much else away. Today, as we mark the 80th anniversary is, we remember not only be great battles and sweeping victories, but also the quiet heroism. The perseverance of civilians under occupation, the stubborn endurance of small communities far from the centres of power and the enduring spirit that kept hope alive through the darkest years. In these uncertain times today, I take hope from their example.
The liberation of the Channel Islands reminds us that freedom must never be taken for granted and that even in the most isolated places ideals of liberty and justice burn just as brightly. We own a debt of gratitude to all who fought, all who endured and all who built. Their courage bought us our freedom. Our memory of them keeps that freedom alive.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I congratulate Right Reverend Prelate on her wonderful Maiden speech and I loved her focus Maiden speech and I loved her focus on children. We are kindred spirits. My Lords, yesterday I had the honour My Lords, yesterday I had the honour and privilege of hosting the Royal British Legion Royal British Legion British Legion Royal British Legion VE80 celebration where veterans VE80 celebration where veterans shared their vivid memories and experiences. Where children creatively perform their vision of creatively perform their vision of the past and hope for the future.
Seeing them perform, I took great Seeing them perform, I took great pride in being part of our great country. It was important for me to host the service, this emotional service because it was a way of acknowledging my own family's contribution to World War II. Three contribution to World War II. Three of my uncles fault alongside the Allied forces. Two of them died. One went on to become the mayor of Bolton 50 years later. Today, as we commemorate the 80th anniversary of Terry in Europe Day, our heart swell with pride and gratitude for all those who contributed to the Allied triumph over tyranny.
Alongside the well-deserved celebrations, let us also take a moment to remember and honour a crucial part of that victory, that is the remarkable contribution of the Caribbean people, as other noble lords have said. From the sunny shores of
11:36
Baroness Benjamin (Liberal Democrat)
-
-
Baroness Benjamin (Liberal Democrat)
Jamaica to the vibrant islands of Trinidad where I was born, Antigua Trinidad where I was born, Antigua and Barbados, the Cayman Islands and across the entire Caribbean, there was a deep sense of solidarity and was a deep sense of solidarity and commitment to the Allied cause. Thousands of men and women driven by a profound belief in freedom and justice step forward to play their part in the global conflict. They answered the calls to arms in many answered the calls to arms in many ways.
Some, like the late Sam King and Alfred Gardner who bravely volunteered for the Royal Air Force volunteered for the Royal Air Force with over 6,000 men missing, hundreds becoming pilots, rear Gunners, ground crew, like the Gunners, ground crew, like the highly decorated Lincoln Orville Lynch. Imagine the courage it took to leave their homes and families, to leave their homes and families, crossing vast oceans to face the horrors of war in the skies over Europe. Their skill and dedication Europe. Their skill and dedication and them over 100 decorations, a testament to their bravery.
Others joined the Royal Navy and the perilous Merchant Navy, braving U- boat attacks to keep vital supply lines open. Still more enlisted in the British Army with the formation of the Caribbean regiment in 1944. Although this regiment did not see direct combat, their service in Italy, Egypt and Palestine was a crucial part of the broader war efforts, freeing up the units for the frontline. Those who served in uniform, the Caribbean islands themselves became strategically important. They provided vital naval and basis for the Allies, playing a crucial role.
Many Caribbean people work tirelessly on these bases supporting the war machine and defending their homeland. My Lords, the contribution of Caribbean women was equally significant. 80 women join the women's auxiliary Air Force and 30 join the Auxiliary territorial Service, serving with dedication and playing their part in the war efforts. While Victory in Europe Day mart the end of the war in Europe, the sacrifices and contributions of the Caribbean resonated far beyond. In Trinidad they herald victory by dancing in the streets to the music played on the newly created steel drums.
Yes, they jumped up to steel pan music. Their bravery and commitment helped to secure the freedoms we enjoy today. As we celebrate this momentous anniversary let us ensure that the story of the Caribbean contribution to World War II is never forgotten. Let us honour their courage, their resilience and their unwavering dedication to the cause of freedom. My Lords, the Caribbean stood with Britain in its darkest hours and their legacy deserves a place of pride in the history of VE Day in the Second World War.
Let their story be told today and always.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I congratulate the judge in Mac the Bishop of Peterborough on her excellent Maiden speech. -- Congratulate the Right Reverend Congratulate the Right Reverend Prelate. The Second World War calls Prelate. The Second World War calls came in suffering and loss of life of millions of soldiers and of millions of soldiers and civilians. In my remarks today I will touch on three points, deterrence against aggression afforded by defence alliances. The afforded by defence alliances. The support of democracy by human rights institutions and the current outreach and education opportunities outreach and education opportunities to strengthen international communities.
The first of these, communities. The first of these, such as NATO's deterrence, has been
Some, like the late Sam King and Alfred Gardner who bravely volunteered for the Royal Air Force volunteered for the Royal Air Force with over 6,000 men missing, hundreds becoming pilots, rear Gunners, ground crew, like the Gunners, ground crew, like the highly decorated Lincoln Orville Lynch. Imagine the courage it took to leave their homes and families, to leave their homes and families, crossing vast oceans to face the horrors of war in the skies over Europe. Their skill and dedication Europe. Their skill and dedication and them over 100 decorations, a testament to their bravery.
Others joined the Royal Navy and the perilous Merchant Navy, braving U- boat attacks to keep vital supply lines open. Still more enlisted in the British Army with the formation of the Caribbean regiment in 1944. Although this regiment did not see direct combat, their service in Italy, Egypt and Palestine was a crucial part of the broader war efforts, freeing up the units for the frontline. Those who served in uniform, the Caribbean islands themselves became strategically important. They provided vital naval and basis for the Allies, playing a crucial role.
Many Caribbean people work tirelessly on these bases supporting the war machine and defending their homeland. My Lords, the contribution of Caribbean women was equally significant. 80 women join the women's auxiliary Air Force and 30 join the Auxiliary territorial Service, serving with dedication and playing their part in the war efforts. While Victory in Europe Day mart the end of the war in Europe, the sacrifices and contributions of the Caribbean resonated far beyond. In Trinidad they herald victory by dancing in the streets to the music played on the newly created steel drums.
Yes, they jumped up to steel pan music. Their bravery and commitment helped to secure the freedoms we enjoy today. As we celebrate this momentous anniversary let us ensure that the story of the Caribbean contribution to World War II is never forgotten. Let us honour their courage, their resilience and their unwavering dedication to the cause of freedom. My Lords, the Caribbean stood with Britain in its darkest hours and their legacy deserves a place of pride in the history of VE Day in the Second World War.
Let their story be told today and always.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I congratulate the judge in Mac the Bishop of Peterborough on her excellent Maiden speech. -- Congratulate the Right Reverend Congratulate the Right Reverend Prelate. The Second World War calls Prelate. The Second World War calls came in suffering and loss of life of millions of soldiers and of millions of soldiers and civilians. In my remarks today I will touch on three points, deterrence against aggression afforded by defence alliances. The afforded by defence alliances. The support of democracy by human rights institutions and the current outreach and education opportunities outreach and education opportunities to strengthen international communities.
The first of these, communities. The first of these, such as NATO's deterrence, has been
11:39
The Earl of Dundee (Conservative)
-
-
The Earl of Dundee (Conservative)
such as NATO's deterrence, has been of limited benefit. Since its intervention in 1949 conflicts and wars, human misery and destruction have assisted almost unabated. The present concern is to bring peace to Ukraine in Europe, Gaza and in north-east Africa. The government are to be commended for their current supporting Ukraine. However when she comes to wind up, I wonder if the noble Baroness the Minister if the noble Baroness the Minister can tell us what further motions will be in place for lasting peace.
Does she agree we should launch further peace initiatives, including any such to enable civilian movements to gather more strip and -- together more strength. We are indebted to NATO. It is pivotal in preventing Third World War. NATO provides a brilliant combination of soft and hard power military defence. This is both defected in unprecedented times, protecting unprecedented times, protecting nationstates. Also assisting the release of Eastern European states from totalitarianism. Much credit should go to the Akleh government, as it should to British deployments, many who came members of this House.
One of them help to persuade the United States to deliver the Marshall plan in 1948. Human rights institutions therefore remain closely associated with NATO. These include the United Nations, ECHR and the Council of Europe with the affiliation of 46 dates. I am a recent chairman for the committee for education. They shared human rights purposes have been forged by the expense of the Second World War. As Lord Woolley has called -- as Lord Wallace has recalled, Lord Bruce of --...
Freedom of worship, freedom from want and freedom from fear. This leads to our current challenge and opportunity as Roosevelt implied that is to enable the four freedoms. 84 years later in 2025 we are in a much more convincing position for this to happen. Perhaps the noble Baroness the Minister when she once up will agree that we have the consensus of G7 countries in G20 countries. We had the digital technology to achieve useful and immediate outcomes increasingly whether from British Commonwealth states or from elsewhere we have the context and cooperation and partnership to become involved.
Following the recent G7 presidency commitments in 2021, can the Minister say what plans does the government have to coordinate the international delivery of education and employment initiatives otherwise at risk from initiatives otherwise at risk from Today. We may perhaps share a simple thought and result together. This is that ever strengthening deterrence against aggression must serve to protect human freedoms in all places
**** Possible New Speaker ****
and worldwide. I thank my noble friend for giving us the opportunity to giving us the opportunity to commemorate all those who served in the Second World War and to reflect on the values they fought for, and on the values they fought for, and to compliment him on a powerful and very moving Maiden speech. And that very moving Maiden speech. And that also of the Right Reverend Prelate The Lord Bishop of Peterborough. The Lord Bishop of Peterborough. That devastating conflict will soon pass.
It is right in this 80th pass. It is right in this 80th anniversary week could nice Britain's role and we honoured the sacrifice of so many and celebrate sacrifice of so many and celebrate the legacy of peace that they fought the legacy of peace that they fought to secure. Have been an important to secure. Have been an important way of remembering those who lost their lives. There's also been a their lives. There's also been a celebration of peace. The choir celebration of peace.
The choir concert on Wednesday night was a reminder. What all these events have done is given us the opportunity to revisit and reflect on the international cooperation and unity of purpose that brought about that peace and security. This could not be more timely. In today's challenging international environment they have been many shifts in political power and balance and the questioning of long-held alliances is all the more important that we stay clear-sighted about the need for international cooperation and indeed to our commitment to NATO.
Just as 80 years ago we still share with NATO's members are common values of
Does she agree we should launch further peace initiatives, including any such to enable civilian movements to gather more strip and -- together more strength. We are indebted to NATO. It is pivotal in preventing Third World War. NATO provides a brilliant combination of soft and hard power military defence. This is both defected in unprecedented times, protecting unprecedented times, protecting nationstates. Also assisting the release of Eastern European states from totalitarianism. Much credit should go to the Akleh government, as it should to British deployments, many who came members of this House.
One of them help to persuade the United States to deliver the Marshall plan in 1948. Human rights institutions therefore remain closely associated with NATO. These include the United Nations, ECHR and the Council of Europe with the affiliation of 46 dates. I am a recent chairman for the committee for education. They shared human rights purposes have been forged by the expense of the Second World War. As Lord Woolley has called -- as Lord Wallace has recalled, Lord Bruce of --...
Freedom of worship, freedom from want and freedom from fear. This leads to our current challenge and opportunity as Roosevelt implied that is to enable the four freedoms. 84 years later in 2025 we are in a much more convincing position for this to happen. Perhaps the noble Baroness the Minister when she once up will agree that we have the consensus of G7 countries in G20 countries. We had the digital technology to achieve useful and immediate outcomes increasingly whether from British Commonwealth states or from elsewhere we have the context and cooperation and partnership to become involved.
Following the recent G7 presidency commitments in 2021, can the Minister say what plans does the government have to coordinate the international delivery of education and employment initiatives otherwise at risk from initiatives otherwise at risk from Today. We may perhaps share a simple thought and result together. This is that ever strengthening deterrence against aggression must serve to protect human freedoms in all places
**** Possible New Speaker ****
and worldwide. I thank my noble friend for giving us the opportunity to giving us the opportunity to commemorate all those who served in the Second World War and to reflect on the values they fought for, and on the values they fought for, and to compliment him on a powerful and very moving Maiden speech. And that very moving Maiden speech. And that also of the Right Reverend Prelate The Lord Bishop of Peterborough. The Lord Bishop of Peterborough. That devastating conflict will soon pass.
It is right in this 80th pass. It is right in this 80th anniversary week could nice Britain's role and we honoured the sacrifice of so many and celebrate sacrifice of so many and celebrate the legacy of peace that they fought the legacy of peace that they fought to secure. Have been an important to secure. Have been an important way of remembering those who lost their lives. There's also been a their lives. There's also been a celebration of peace. The choir celebration of peace.
The choir concert on Wednesday night was a reminder. What all these events have done is given us the opportunity to revisit and reflect on the international cooperation and unity of purpose that brought about that peace and security. This could not be more timely. In today's challenging international environment they have been many shifts in political power and balance and the questioning of long-held alliances is all the more important that we stay clear-sighted about the need for international cooperation and indeed to our commitment to NATO.
Just as 80 years ago we still share with NATO's members are common values of
11:46
Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe (Labour)
individual liberty and democracy, individual liberty and democracy, human rights and the rule of law. We need to be realistic about the size of our Armed Forces are mindful of the changing times in regard to our historic leadership role in Europe, historic leadership role in Europe, it still vital that the UK speaks out to remind powerful others of NATO's values and promote them NATO's values and promote them My Lords in recognising the contribution of millions of people across the UK and Commonwealth is across the UK and Commonwealth is served in the Second World War, it is right to recognise it was not only our Armed Forces who achieved only our Armed Forces who achieved important victories in Europe and Japan 18 years ago.
As we honour their sacrifice and reflect on the horrendous cost in human cost of horrendous cost in human cost of war, I want to be tribute to the essential workers who could not fight. And to all those who played their part on the home front. By 1944, one third of the civilian 1944, one third of the civilian population was engaged in work, including more than 7 million women. including more than 7 million women. Those women aged between 18 and 60, had been conscripted since early 1941, either during the services or working in industry on the land or transport.
By 1944, more than 80,000 land girls were working across the country ensuring farms kept producing food for an island nation under siege. Britain's highly effective mobilisation of civilians was largely due to Ernest Bevan. As Minister of Labour and National service, he was responsible for manpower resources. Cole was an essential part of keeping the country running and the so-called Bevan Boys with the 48,000 new military conscripts sent after a random ballot straight to the mines instead of to the forces, to work long shifts in dangerous conditions more or less unchanged since the First World War.
They were often thought to be avoiding conscription and were mistaken for army dodgers by the police or indeed the public. They were not considered military competence so after the war received no medals or recognition. The contribution was only officially recognised by her late Majesty Queen Elizabeth II in 1995. Followed in 2007 the award of the veterans badge either then prime ministers Tony Blair. Bevan was also responsible for the scheme that gave skilled workers in certain occupations exemptions from military service.
Many men of fighting age were kept at home to continue working in reserve occupations. Doctors, police officers, teachers, railway workers, mechanics, civil engineers. The amazing ambulance workers who, when others had to flee to the shelters to escape the bonds, they headed out into them to rescue the wounded. Many of these men felt they had been left out of the action and resented not being able to do their bit on the frontline. Yet these often thankless jobs kept the country going through the disruption of war.
We rightly remember them as remember the 80th anniversary. The collective spirit required to defend, to defeat Nazism is still needed in today's challenging times. I applaud the government starts in promoting the importance of NATO and urge them to do everything in our power to keep this central to our long-term relationship with the US and across Europe. Europe.
As we honour their sacrifice and reflect on the horrendous cost in human cost of horrendous cost in human cost of war, I want to be tribute to the essential workers who could not fight. And to all those who played their part on the home front. By 1944, one third of the civilian 1944, one third of the civilian population was engaged in work, including more than 7 million women. including more than 7 million women. Those women aged between 18 and 60, had been conscripted since early 1941, either during the services or working in industry on the land or transport.
By 1944, more than 80,000 land girls were working across the country ensuring farms kept producing food for an island nation under siege. Britain's highly effective mobilisation of civilians was largely due to Ernest Bevan. As Minister of Labour and National service, he was responsible for manpower resources. Cole was an essential part of keeping the country running and the so-called Bevan Boys with the 48,000 new military conscripts sent after a random ballot straight to the mines instead of to the forces, to work long shifts in dangerous conditions more or less unchanged since the First World War.
They were often thought to be avoiding conscription and were mistaken for army dodgers by the police or indeed the public. They were not considered military competence so after the war received no medals or recognition. The contribution was only officially recognised by her late Majesty Queen Elizabeth II in 1995. Followed in 2007 the award of the veterans badge either then prime ministers Tony Blair. Bevan was also responsible for the scheme that gave skilled workers in certain occupations exemptions from military service.
Many men of fighting age were kept at home to continue working in reserve occupations. Doctors, police officers, teachers, railway workers, mechanics, civil engineers. The amazing ambulance workers who, when others had to flee to the shelters to escape the bonds, they headed out into them to rescue the wounded. Many of these men felt they had been left out of the action and resented not being able to do their bit on the frontline. Yet these often thankless jobs kept the country going through the disruption of war.
We rightly remember them as remember the 80th anniversary. The collective spirit required to defend, to defeat Nazism is still needed in today's challenging times. I applaud the government starts in promoting the importance of NATO and urge them to do everything in our power to keep this central to our long-term relationship with the US and across Europe. Europe.
11:49
Baroness Coffey (Conservative)
-
-
Baroness Coffey (Conservative)
80 years on from World War II, a global war that touched every continent are countries came to a juddering halt with the deployment of nuclear bombs, and fortunately we have never seen that again. As has already been eloquently said by noble Baroness Hunter about the liberation of people and inhumane treatment in Japanese prisoner of war camps, or indeed as my noble friend eloquently described the part of the Holocaust that happened with the liberation of camps.
Of course that is not the reason we had gone into those wars in the first place. It was our treaties in order to try to save other countries and also to defeat the tyranny that we saw arising. For what it is worth, I think it is still relevant and important to make sure that we commemorate all of this on Rememberance Day where we do remember the ultimate sacrifice paid by many people, not only on these shores but around the world. It is a reminder that is useful about the celebration of the end of the war.
Celebration of the coming of peace which is why it is critical to keep these events in the summer, keep going, as a reminder that peace is worth working for wherever it is in the world. And to do our bit to try to end conflict. Recently I was in Kenya and visited a refugee camp. People are still arriving there. It started 30 years ago but people are still arriving from the conflict in Sudan. I'm conscious of the work the government is continuing to do to try to bring peace there.
It is something that we must all bear in mind. We have a very visual thought about how Parliament was affected by World War II. At the other end, on the outside of the chamber, that entrance was never repaired, as a deliberate reminder to members of Parliament as they walk into that chamber. I am very much touched by other very visual reminders of what happened in that time. Think of Coventry Cathedral. I grew up in the city of Liverpool would suffer the blitz very badly, and I appreciate there will be other people here who were there.
It happens that my paternal grandfather was not deemed fit enough to go to war, but instead of being a shipbuilder, he rebuilt homes that have been bombed throughout the world war and in the restoration afterwards. If any of their Lordships had not been to a particular village in France, I would strongly recommend it. The horrors of what happens to that village is why the French may sure that village has been untouched ever since the date was liberated. And whether it was about the murder of people in the church, there is still a car there.
It is just a very visual memory of how we can not afford for this to happen again. And yet we know it does. I have to say my noble friend Baroness referred to the 50 and I read it as a salivation of great joy both my parents and my sister when we were in London enjoying that. It is particularly the case because so many people were still alive who had been through that. I'm my father saying his joy about the end of celebration of war.
He had been evacuated but his brother was a bit homesick and ended up going back to Liverpool. He enjoyed the fact that shelling had stopped. My mother who had come back from India just ahead of the war, her father was in the army, her brother had been in RAF bombers, the sisters were in the land army, but I doubt not, for several years after was exhibited in Egypt. Family life did not get back to normal straight away. In fact she remembers the pain of what went on for many years.
But recognising the cold war had ended, and that was also very telling after the after-shock of World War II. So there is still peril in our shores today if I think of countries that my noble friend referred to earlier. I was the minister in charge of the decontamination of Salisbury. I still remember the murder. I can honestly say that the people of Salisbury really were very scared about what was happening in the city. And it was extraordinary, the impact it has on what we had to do to rebuild.
So we need to continue to press for peace. We need to continue to support the institutions that were formed. But we also make sure Parliament needs to get the treat their mission not the mission creep. The alliances, the creep. The alliances, the conversations that happened in these institutions, in G7 and G20, it is important that we continue to make sure we search for peace and not appeasement. And also that we continue to respect, celebrate, and commemorate and avoid conflict in the future.
the future.
Of course that is not the reason we had gone into those wars in the first place. It was our treaties in order to try to save other countries and also to defeat the tyranny that we saw arising. For what it is worth, I think it is still relevant and important to make sure that we commemorate all of this on Rememberance Day where we do remember the ultimate sacrifice paid by many people, not only on these shores but around the world. It is a reminder that is useful about the celebration of the end of the war.
Celebration of the coming of peace which is why it is critical to keep these events in the summer, keep going, as a reminder that peace is worth working for wherever it is in the world. And to do our bit to try to end conflict. Recently I was in Kenya and visited a refugee camp. People are still arriving there. It started 30 years ago but people are still arriving from the conflict in Sudan. I'm conscious of the work the government is continuing to do to try to bring peace there.
It is something that we must all bear in mind. We have a very visual thought about how Parliament was affected by World War II. At the other end, on the outside of the chamber, that entrance was never repaired, as a deliberate reminder to members of Parliament as they walk into that chamber. I am very much touched by other very visual reminders of what happened in that time. Think of Coventry Cathedral. I grew up in the city of Liverpool would suffer the blitz very badly, and I appreciate there will be other people here who were there.
It happens that my paternal grandfather was not deemed fit enough to go to war, but instead of being a shipbuilder, he rebuilt homes that have been bombed throughout the world war and in the restoration afterwards. If any of their Lordships had not been to a particular village in France, I would strongly recommend it. The horrors of what happens to that village is why the French may sure that village has been untouched ever since the date was liberated. And whether it was about the murder of people in the church, there is still a car there.
It is just a very visual memory of how we can not afford for this to happen again. And yet we know it does. I have to say my noble friend Baroness referred to the 50 and I read it as a salivation of great joy both my parents and my sister when we were in London enjoying that. It is particularly the case because so many people were still alive who had been through that. I'm my father saying his joy about the end of celebration of war.
He had been evacuated but his brother was a bit homesick and ended up going back to Liverpool. He enjoyed the fact that shelling had stopped. My mother who had come back from India just ahead of the war, her father was in the army, her brother had been in RAF bombers, the sisters were in the land army, but I doubt not, for several years after was exhibited in Egypt. Family life did not get back to normal straight away. In fact she remembers the pain of what went on for many years.
But recognising the cold war had ended, and that was also very telling after the after-shock of World War II. So there is still peril in our shores today if I think of countries that my noble friend referred to earlier. I was the minister in charge of the decontamination of Salisbury. I still remember the murder. I can honestly say that the people of Salisbury really were very scared about what was happening in the city. And it was extraordinary, the impact it has on what we had to do to rebuild.
So we need to continue to press for peace. We need to continue to support the institutions that were formed. But we also make sure Parliament needs to get the treat their mission not the mission creep. The alliances, the creep. The alliances, the conversations that happened in these institutions, in G7 and G20, it is important that we continue to make sure we search for peace and not appeasement. And also that we continue to respect, celebrate, and commemorate and avoid conflict in the future.
the future.
11:54
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Labour)
-
-
Lord Anderson of Swansea (Labour)
80 years on we all celebrate the glorious victory. Perhaps we forget that, had they not been a victory, had the been a defeat, we would be subject to an evil tyranny and perhaps there would be more problems on own territory. This is something we must remember. There are massive consequences as a result of that victory in the world, two superpowers have emerged, it led to the end of empire. For us in the UK there were profound social changes including the enhanced role of women, and also enhanced expectations of the role of government which led for example to the National Health Service, to make a land fit for heroes.
As I was born just before the outbreak of war, I have distant memories of the blitz, the destruction of houses in front of my own house, the school just behind the blitz on Swansea which led to the obliteration of the city centre, described so well by Dylan Thomas in Return Journey. We were taken, I was told I was taken to an Anderson shelter, no relation, a cot in an Anderson shelter which later became our coal shed.
I do remember the blackouts, the barrage balloons, the air raid sirens, and particularly my little Mickey Mouse gas mask which I treasured. And then I remember also learning to say "Have you any gum hum'? I remember the returning soldiers and particularly a friend of the family. Shelling the poll. It had been a total war, total in terms of the number of countries, many mentioned, not just the Caribbean, not just Ghana but countries around including relatives of mine in Norway.
We think first of course of the total national effort of our own servicemen and women. But I join Baroness Warwick in mentioning the role of women at that time. I would commend to Lordships, a book " A Family At War ", where his mother asked all members of the family they set off to play their parts to send him a letter every week, not for publication but there is an immediacy about it and it does sum up the spirit so very well.
Later I joined in collecting for the British Legion. I tried to help the Normandy veterans Association, hence the casket in the Royal Gallery of the Sands of the Normandy invasion. And a forgotten service, the Merchant Navy Association, without whom we would not have survived too easily forgotten alas. And I do remember so many processions including a wonderful Jewish lady in the city who carries with great difficulty the standard of the Jewish ex- servicemen.
We remember those wonderful people. And at the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. A great kaleidoscope of memories, young men in sheepskin jackets racing to scramble, and those shivering in the landing craft before setting sail for the Normandy beaches. Those in the Arctic convoys. But also those particularly women who served in the homefront, in so many vital services. The list my Lords is endless. But the story glorious. And the memory is not just in these wonderfully kept cemeteries.
Not just in the glorious stories of heroism and sacrifice, but also in the togetherness of our time. We bow our heads in their memory. Yes, we shall remember them, but the best way of remembering them is to strive to promote those values for which they fought and for which so many gave their lives.
As I was born just before the outbreak of war, I have distant memories of the blitz, the destruction of houses in front of my own house, the school just behind the blitz on Swansea which led to the obliteration of the city centre, described so well by Dylan Thomas in Return Journey. We were taken, I was told I was taken to an Anderson shelter, no relation, a cot in an Anderson shelter which later became our coal shed.
I do remember the blackouts, the barrage balloons, the air raid sirens, and particularly my little Mickey Mouse gas mask which I treasured. And then I remember also learning to say "Have you any gum hum'? I remember the returning soldiers and particularly a friend of the family. Shelling the poll. It had been a total war, total in terms of the number of countries, many mentioned, not just the Caribbean, not just Ghana but countries around including relatives of mine in Norway.
We think first of course of the total national effort of our own servicemen and women. But I join Baroness Warwick in mentioning the role of women at that time. I would commend to Lordships, a book " A Family At War ", where his mother asked all members of the family they set off to play their parts to send him a letter every week, not for publication but there is an immediacy about it and it does sum up the spirit so very well.
Later I joined in collecting for the British Legion. I tried to help the Normandy veterans Association, hence the casket in the Royal Gallery of the Sands of the Normandy invasion. And a forgotten service, the Merchant Navy Association, without whom we would not have survived too easily forgotten alas. And I do remember so many processions including a wonderful Jewish lady in the city who carries with great difficulty the standard of the Jewish ex- servicemen.
We remember those wonderful people. And at the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. A great kaleidoscope of memories, young men in sheepskin jackets racing to scramble, and those shivering in the landing craft before setting sail for the Normandy beaches. Those in the Arctic convoys. But also those particularly women who served in the homefront, in so many vital services. The list my Lords is endless. But the story glorious. And the memory is not just in these wonderfully kept cemeteries.
Not just in the glorious stories of heroism and sacrifice, but also in the togetherness of our time. We bow our heads in their memory. Yes, we shall remember them, but the best way of remembering them is to strive to promote those values for which they fought and for which so many gave their lives.
12:00
5
Lord Bates (Conservative)
-
5
Lord Bates (Conservative)
The greatest generation who sacrifice and service remembered this week but only secured for us victory over tyranny but also gave us the political and idiomatic tools and institutions that would avoid its repetition. The military victories won the war but it is the often unnoticed diplomatic victories that have secured the piece. When Britain stood alone, and London was being hounded in June 1941, the city was also home to nine government in exile. On 12 June, they joined together with representatives of Britain, Canada, Australia, and South Africa, as the London International assembly meeting at St James's park to declare that the only true basis for enduring peace is the willing corroboration of free peoples in a world relieved of aggression.
The declaration was developed further two months later in a meeting between Winston Churchill and Franklin Roosevelt, and they sign the Atlantic Charter which would be later signed by 26 other nations over the next two years, this was developed further, and the foundations of United Nations began to take shape culminating in the Washington conversations on international peace and security organisation, with much of the preparatory work carried out of the preparatory work carried out It was not just institutional charters, but also the mechanism for resolving disputes between nations by law, not war, and holding those who commit war crimes to account.
On 7 October, 1942, the then Lord Chancellor spoke in your Lordships house and announced the formation of the United Nations commission for the investigation of war crimes. It led to the London Agreement and Charter, signed on 8 August 1945, at Church House, which helped establish the principle of international law, and created the first international court at Nuremberg. Given this pivotal role in the foundation of the United Nations, it was agreed that the ideal venue for the first meetings of both the United Nations General Assembly, and the United Nations Security Council, would be London.
And in January, 1946, that took place. On the eve of the General Assembly, His Majesty King George VI hosted delegates from 51 countries, at a banquet of Saint James's Palace. And said, in the long course of history, no more important meeting has taken place in the city. He was right. The venues for the General Assembly and Security Council had been chosen personally, by the then Foreign Secretary, Ernest Bevan. He chose Methodist Central Hall for the General Assembly, and Church House for the Security Council because, in his words, he wanted venues that had been bathed in prayer.
The remarkable role of this great city and great country, in shaping the post-war political diplomatic and legal order is something I believe is worth celebrating. Because when politicians, diplomats and institutions do their job, we spare our courageous Armed Forces from the enormous cost of doing theirs. These institutions cannot exist only on paper. They must act in practice. No one nation, no matter how great can do it alone, and no nation, no matter how small, can stand aside from its response to D.
Yet, he also established a world in which rights and responsibilities were no longer vested solely on sovereign states, but on individual human beings. And in all human beings. Would the Minister therefore consider inviting the United Nations General Assembly, and Security Council to return to London, in January 2026, to mark the 80th anniversary of this great diplomatic victory. So we can collectively rededicate ourselves to the vision of the United Nations Charter, which speaks so profoundly into the world of today.
When it says, we, the peoples of the United Nations, determined to save the successive generations from the scourge of war which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and to reaffirm faith in the fundamental human rights in dignity and worth of the human person and the equal rights of men person and the equal rights of men and women command of nations large and small. And for these ends, the practice tolerance, and live practice tolerance, and live together in peace with one another, as good neighbours, and to unite our strength, to maintain international peace and security.
When we honour those words, we honour their memory. those words, we honour their memory.
The declaration was developed further two months later in a meeting between Winston Churchill and Franklin Roosevelt, and they sign the Atlantic Charter which would be later signed by 26 other nations over the next two years, this was developed further, and the foundations of United Nations began to take shape culminating in the Washington conversations on international peace and security organisation, with much of the preparatory work carried out of the preparatory work carried out It was not just institutional charters, but also the mechanism for resolving disputes between nations by law, not war, and holding those who commit war crimes to account.
On 7 October, 1942, the then Lord Chancellor spoke in your Lordships house and announced the formation of the United Nations commission for the investigation of war crimes. It led to the London Agreement and Charter, signed on 8 August 1945, at Church House, which helped establish the principle of international law, and created the first international court at Nuremberg. Given this pivotal role in the foundation of the United Nations, it was agreed that the ideal venue for the first meetings of both the United Nations General Assembly, and the United Nations Security Council, would be London.
And in January, 1946, that took place. On the eve of the General Assembly, His Majesty King George VI hosted delegates from 51 countries, at a banquet of Saint James's Palace. And said, in the long course of history, no more important meeting has taken place in the city. He was right. The venues for the General Assembly and Security Council had been chosen personally, by the then Foreign Secretary, Ernest Bevan. He chose Methodist Central Hall for the General Assembly, and Church House for the Security Council because, in his words, he wanted venues that had been bathed in prayer.
The remarkable role of this great city and great country, in shaping the post-war political diplomatic and legal order is something I believe is worth celebrating. Because when politicians, diplomats and institutions do their job, we spare our courageous Armed Forces from the enormous cost of doing theirs. These institutions cannot exist only on paper. They must act in practice. No one nation, no matter how great can do it alone, and no nation, no matter how small, can stand aside from its response to D.
Yet, he also established a world in which rights and responsibilities were no longer vested solely on sovereign states, but on individual human beings. And in all human beings. Would the Minister therefore consider inviting the United Nations General Assembly, and Security Council to return to London, in January 2026, to mark the 80th anniversary of this great diplomatic victory. So we can collectively rededicate ourselves to the vision of the United Nations Charter, which speaks so profoundly into the world of today.
When it says, we, the peoples of the United Nations, determined to save the successive generations from the scourge of war which twice in our lifetime has brought untold sorrow to mankind, and to reaffirm faith in the fundamental human rights in dignity and worth of the human person and the equal rights of men person and the equal rights of men and women command of nations large and small. And for these ends, the practice tolerance, and live practice tolerance, and live together in peace with one another, as good neighbours, and to unite our strength, to maintain international peace and security.
When we honour those words, we honour their memory. those words, we honour their memory.
12:05
Lord Dubs (Labour)
-
-
Lord Dubs (Labour)
My Lords, this is clearly a day for memories. Memories that came to us for those who were around. On VE Day, I was 12 years old and I remember celebrating in the streets of Manchester, Piccadilly. Had I been a bit older, I would have enjoyed the day even more, but that is... Well, I was 12, I was innocent! But this debate gives us a chance to reflect on some of the issues of the war and subsequently. And as a refugee who arrived in London, end of June, 1939, one of my first memories, having left Nazi occupied Prague, with German soldiers everywhere, one of my first memories was seeing the ATS women marching in Hyde Park.
And I don't know why it had such a big impact on me, but I felt, well, if we have women in the army, there is something going for Britain, it really impressed me. And it is one of those things in my background. Of course, I remember, as mentioned, barrage balloons, ration books, I remember in 1942, every child in the school I went who got three oranges. I hadn't seen oranges for three years, it was quite a thing to have oranges. Anyway.
I'm going back a oranges. Anyway. I'm going back a bit, I remember listening to Chamberlain indicating we were at war with Germany, and I suppose I have learnt enough English by then to understand what he was saying. I do remember the election campaign of 1945, that perhaps, given the consensus in this House, I don't want to reflect too much on that particular election campaign. Although, I think I knew from the posters up in Manchester, the name of every Labour candidate in the various constituencies in Manchester.
But I must not go down that path too far. And we heard, in a more serious vein, we began to a more serious vein, we began to hear the shocking stories when what happened when some of the concentration camps were liberated, when the British army went to Belsen, and we heard the horrors of the people in the camps and what happened to them. Walking corpses, some of them. The shock it must have been to the British army, when they liberated Belsen, and the other camps, I am sure some of them are traumatised for life by seeing what they saw on that occasion.
Milos, in more recent years, I visited the beaches of Normandy, I also visited the Parliament assembly, the the Parliament assembly, the battlefields of the Somme, again, it was the Irish wanting to see what happened to the many Irish you fought in the British Army in 1914- 1918, and indeed of course, in the more recent war. And the contribution by the Commonwealth. They have been referred to. And the polls, Czech, French, all of them fought with us in the war, helping to win it.
The question is, have we learnt the lessons? That, I suppose, is a sombre thought. And we still have anti-Semitism, not just here, but across Europe. We have Islamophobia. We see a dreadful conflict in Ukraine. With encouragement from some countries, that we should appease the Russians. Never should we do that. And the tragedy in Israel, on 7 October, the tragedy of what is happening in Gaza at the moment, and indeed, the increasing conflict in India and Pakistan, two nuclear powers facing each other, in a position of conflict.
Looking back upon VE Day, I don't think we have done all that well as a continent. We could have done a lot better. And I think in some ways, we have let down the people who fought and gave their lives for a better future than we are seeing. I will make two other points. One has not been mentioned before. I think we should pay tribute to the way the Germans have come to terms with the past. It must have been a horrible thing for them when they realised in the war and subsequently just what was happening.
And I have met the German batted in London at various events commemorating the Holocaust, and I think Germany deserves the credit for having come to terms with the most horrible pass, and I think, on the whole, they have done pretty well for I was invited to Berlin about a year-and-a-half ago, there was a can aeration of transport and the Holocaust, and this country is doing well in dealing with such a difficult past. Finally, let me say this, I think this is a fantastic country, even though some of us criticise what is going on.
And have been critical, I think it is a fantastic country. And it is thanks to the people that fought in the war that it is still a free country, and country not under Nazi oppression, and I give my thanks to people forgivingly safety. forgivingly safety.
And I don't know why it had such a big impact on me, but I felt, well, if we have women in the army, there is something going for Britain, it really impressed me. And it is one of those things in my background. Of course, I remember, as mentioned, barrage balloons, ration books, I remember in 1942, every child in the school I went who got three oranges. I hadn't seen oranges for three years, it was quite a thing to have oranges. Anyway.
I'm going back a oranges. Anyway. I'm going back a bit, I remember listening to Chamberlain indicating we were at war with Germany, and I suppose I have learnt enough English by then to understand what he was saying. I do remember the election campaign of 1945, that perhaps, given the consensus in this House, I don't want to reflect too much on that particular election campaign. Although, I think I knew from the posters up in Manchester, the name of every Labour candidate in the various constituencies in Manchester.
But I must not go down that path too far. And we heard, in a more serious vein, we began to a more serious vein, we began to hear the shocking stories when what happened when some of the concentration camps were liberated, when the British army went to Belsen, and we heard the horrors of the people in the camps and what happened to them. Walking corpses, some of them. The shock it must have been to the British army, when they liberated Belsen, and the other camps, I am sure some of them are traumatised for life by seeing what they saw on that occasion.
Milos, in more recent years, I visited the beaches of Normandy, I also visited the Parliament assembly, the the Parliament assembly, the battlefields of the Somme, again, it was the Irish wanting to see what happened to the many Irish you fought in the British Army in 1914- 1918, and indeed of course, in the more recent war. And the contribution by the Commonwealth. They have been referred to. And the polls, Czech, French, all of them fought with us in the war, helping to win it.
The question is, have we learnt the lessons? That, I suppose, is a sombre thought. And we still have anti-Semitism, not just here, but across Europe. We have Islamophobia. We see a dreadful conflict in Ukraine. With encouragement from some countries, that we should appease the Russians. Never should we do that. And the tragedy in Israel, on 7 October, the tragedy of what is happening in Gaza at the moment, and indeed, the increasing conflict in India and Pakistan, two nuclear powers facing each other, in a position of conflict.
Looking back upon VE Day, I don't think we have done all that well as a continent. We could have done a lot better. And I think in some ways, we have let down the people who fought and gave their lives for a better future than we are seeing. I will make two other points. One has not been mentioned before. I think we should pay tribute to the way the Germans have come to terms with the past. It must have been a horrible thing for them when they realised in the war and subsequently just what was happening.
And I have met the German batted in London at various events commemorating the Holocaust, and I think Germany deserves the credit for having come to terms with the most horrible pass, and I think, on the whole, they have done pretty well for I was invited to Berlin about a year-and-a-half ago, there was a can aeration of transport and the Holocaust, and this country is doing well in dealing with such a difficult past. Finally, let me say this, I think this is a fantastic country, even though some of us criticise what is going on.
And have been critical, I think it is a fantastic country. And it is thanks to the people that fought in the war that it is still a free country, and country not under Nazi oppression, and I give my thanks to people forgivingly safety. forgivingly safety.
12:10
Baroness Meyer (Conservative)
-
-
Baroness Meyer (Conservative)
Milos, it is humbling to speak after 20 or so such excellent speeches and of course, including the maiden speech from the right reverend prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough. My Lords, I would like to centre my remarks on VJ Day, a victory that is further from the minds and memories of many in Britain. Comparatively little has been said about the war against Japan. Yet, it was arguably, even more brutal, contributing to over 30 million deaths but my Lords, it is not just the numbers, it is the message of warfare, the torture and cruelty inflicted by the Imperial Japanese Army.
Amongst the most sadistic in modern history. The experiences of those who intuit this -- Endured this atrocity were so horrific that many, like my father, never spoke of them. My father survived only because of the atomic bomb, as awful as it is. He never spoke of his experience. Except once briefly, on a chairlift in the mountain. The conversation lasted no more than 10 minutes. In a short time, I glimpsed the horror. Sadistic beatings, disease, medical experiments, malnutrition, inhuman conditions.
He only kept his mind alive by teaching French to a fellow prisoner who in turn taught him Russian. He was one of the lucky ones, released after seven months. He weighed 46 kg, he was convinced that had the war lasted any longer, he would not have survived yet, these stories remain largely untold. The memories differ vastly between nations. Germany has confronted its past throughout eviction memorials and public remembrance. Japan's memory tends to centre primarily on here are female, it's memorials on other dead, but not the crime.
Perhaps this reflects the deeper cultural divide between Western guilt culture rooted in Christianity. And Japan's reverence for its emperor. In Germany, Hitler was viewed as a monstrous aberration. In Japan, the emperor was worshipped. Japan did not issue an explicit apology until 1992. The silence around Japan war crimes were sealed over experiences left unspoken and often resolved. That silence came at a cost. For my father and many like him, it meant a life marked by trauma, never healed.
He died at the age of 97 in 2009. I knew very little about what he had endured. Once a lively, outgoing and supportive man, the man I knew was quiet, solitary, and often unwell. The toll of what he had to endure was written into his body and soul. Apart from that conversation, he never spoke again of his experiments. The images I obtained from that brief exchange told me all from that brief exchange told me all I could ever need to know.
Finally, like most Allied prisoners of war held in Japanese camps, he received no mental health support. Post- traumatic stress was neither recognised nor discussed. Seeking help, especially for a man raised by the Jesuits, was seen by weakness. So he, like many others, carried his burden in silence. He never complained, he simply carried on. My father received several distinguished decorations for his war service and bravery. I only discussed his medals talked in history after his death.
He never sought recognition. His quiet resilience and tact of his fellow prisoners reminded us of the kind of insurance forged in unimaginable , with dignity, were here today, my father would say we need to spend more on defence, how often did he tell me as a child that all the signs were there in 1936, but no one wanted to believe that war was about to happen again. So, may I ask the noble Baroness cabinet -- Noble Baroness, the minister, what step is this government going to take to ensure the future generation understands the lesser-known sacrifice made by those who fought and suffered in the Far East and that no child should forget what our parents and grandparents went parents and grandparents went
Amongst the most sadistic in modern history. The experiences of those who intuit this -- Endured this atrocity were so horrific that many, like my father, never spoke of them. My father survived only because of the atomic bomb, as awful as it is. He never spoke of his experience. Except once briefly, on a chairlift in the mountain. The conversation lasted no more than 10 minutes. In a short time, I glimpsed the horror. Sadistic beatings, disease, medical experiments, malnutrition, inhuman conditions.
He only kept his mind alive by teaching French to a fellow prisoner who in turn taught him Russian. He was one of the lucky ones, released after seven months. He weighed 46 kg, he was convinced that had the war lasted any longer, he would not have survived yet, these stories remain largely untold. The memories differ vastly between nations. Germany has confronted its past throughout eviction memorials and public remembrance. Japan's memory tends to centre primarily on here are female, it's memorials on other dead, but not the crime.
Perhaps this reflects the deeper cultural divide between Western guilt culture rooted in Christianity. And Japan's reverence for its emperor. In Germany, Hitler was viewed as a monstrous aberration. In Japan, the emperor was worshipped. Japan did not issue an explicit apology until 1992. The silence around Japan war crimes were sealed over experiences left unspoken and often resolved. That silence came at a cost. For my father and many like him, it meant a life marked by trauma, never healed.
He died at the age of 97 in 2009. I knew very little about what he had endured. Once a lively, outgoing and supportive man, the man I knew was quiet, solitary, and often unwell. The toll of what he had to endure was written into his body and soul. Apart from that conversation, he never spoke again of his experiments. The images I obtained from that brief exchange told me all from that brief exchange told me all I could ever need to know.
Finally, like most Allied prisoners of war held in Japanese camps, he received no mental health support. Post- traumatic stress was neither recognised nor discussed. Seeking help, especially for a man raised by the Jesuits, was seen by weakness. So he, like many others, carried his burden in silence. He never complained, he simply carried on. My father received several distinguished decorations for his war service and bravery. I only discussed his medals talked in history after his death.
He never sought recognition. His quiet resilience and tact of his fellow prisoners reminded us of the kind of insurance forged in unimaginable , with dignity, were here today, my father would say we need to spend more on defence, how often did he tell me as a child that all the signs were there in 1936, but no one wanted to believe that war was about to happen again. So, may I ask the noble Baroness cabinet -- Noble Baroness, the minister, what step is this government going to take to ensure the future generation understands the lesser-known sacrifice made by those who fought and suffered in the Far East and that no child should forget what our parents and grandparents went parents and grandparents went
12:16
Baroness Brinton (Liberal Democrat)
-
-
Baroness Brinton (Liberal Democrat)
It is a pleasure to follow so many excellent of wide-ranging speeches and particularly to follow Lady Meyer after her moving contribution. I also want to add my thanks to the right reverend Prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough, for her thoughtful Maiden speech and I, like others, are looking forward to hearing more from her in the future. On VE Day, Eisenhower and Montgomerie allowed a number of senior military, including my grandfather, an air marshal responsible for second tactical air group under Eisenhower, to come back from Germany to London to participate just for the one day.
So I know he was here in London celebrating, which I have to say, is more than my grandmother knew. I know because there is a biography of my grandfather. But I also know that that particular day our family were marking an empty chair in the room. Joy, tinged with much sadness. However, it is important not just to see this as marking a single day, we cannot, we must not ignore what came before, what came after and indeed, what threatens us now. We live in a historic continuum which we must learn from or we are in danger of repeating the mistakes and errors that lead to easily to war.
Today I am wearing the Royal flying Corps brooch, given to my grandmother by my grandfather, that same MR, Sir Arthur Cunningham, but always known as Mary from 1916 onwards, a distortion of Maori because he grew up in New Zealand. He, aged 16, left school in 1911 and worked on a sheep station until the war started. He joined the Anzac this bulletin regiment on 10 August and was in Western Samoan before the end of August. Literally followed, which he was lucky to survive.
-- Gallipoli followed. Then he headed to England to join RFC in 1916. A distinguished aviator, learned the importance over the trenches in the First World War of land air interaction. His theory of tactical air was first fully deployed at El Alamein, when, as an air marshal, he worked achieved header. But he learnt his craft in World War I and his service in the Middle East between the wars. He only had two brief spells back in England in the entirety of that period.
His land air tactical principles are still used today. In fact, in USA military, they are known as Cunningham's keys, the keys to victory. He used it in Italy after D-Day and all the way up to 7 May, 1945. I think it would have been particularly proud that one of his descendants who today specialises in this area works in our military. His brother Vincent was blown up guarding Belfast docks and very severely injured. After some years, he was able to return to the law and became a noted KC in Australia.
And his stepson, Lieutenant Howard Frank, was with the Grenadier Guards en route to market garden and died on 10 September, 1944. My mum then HTN was traumatised by the death of her beloved brother and it affected her mental health the rest of her life. Lady Meyer said there was no mental health support available for veterans, nor was there for the public either. As children, we lived and relived her horror of commemoration and the consequences of his death. I spoke about a continuum.
Those of us with relatives in military service, with frequent deployments and threats today, feel much I think as my grandfather's family felt throughout the first half of the 20th-century. Lord Coaker talked about deterrence. How we must always call out authoritarian behaviour.... He first they came to the Communist, which by the way, the Americans change to the socialist, completely missing the point, that actually it is the people that you don't like that you should speak up for, was absolutely key after the war, not just with the German community but he went around the world teaching people how to learn to speak out.
Many other organisations founded as a result of the Second World War have been mentioned by have not heard the Council of Europe mentioned. Which Churchill founded. With its European Court of Human Rights. Because it is one of the most important checks and balances to ensure that individual freedoms are protected. And despite differences about individual definitions of human rights, if we don't have the ability to call out other nations, then we will not listen and learn. And I want to just end by quoting briefly Edward end by quoting briefly Edward London's poem on VE Day, he says, "All their actions rise to future fame be theirs sweet peas, dear love, quite rain and sun, the life which they marched and sailed and flew, reunion, restoration, freedom, deep and true." Today that freedom is at risk.
Those who go there all is at risk. Those who go there all in the 21st-century -- those who in the 21st-century -- those who gave their all in the 20th century would be horrified if we were to lose that freedom again.
So I know he was here in London celebrating, which I have to say, is more than my grandmother knew. I know because there is a biography of my grandfather. But I also know that that particular day our family were marking an empty chair in the room. Joy, tinged with much sadness. However, it is important not just to see this as marking a single day, we cannot, we must not ignore what came before, what came after and indeed, what threatens us now. We live in a historic continuum which we must learn from or we are in danger of repeating the mistakes and errors that lead to easily to war.
Today I am wearing the Royal flying Corps brooch, given to my grandmother by my grandfather, that same MR, Sir Arthur Cunningham, but always known as Mary from 1916 onwards, a distortion of Maori because he grew up in New Zealand. He, aged 16, left school in 1911 and worked on a sheep station until the war started. He joined the Anzac this bulletin regiment on 10 August and was in Western Samoan before the end of August. Literally followed, which he was lucky to survive.
-- Gallipoli followed. Then he headed to England to join RFC in 1916. A distinguished aviator, learned the importance over the trenches in the First World War of land air interaction. His theory of tactical air was first fully deployed at El Alamein, when, as an air marshal, he worked achieved header. But he learnt his craft in World War I and his service in the Middle East between the wars. He only had two brief spells back in England in the entirety of that period.
His land air tactical principles are still used today. In fact, in USA military, they are known as Cunningham's keys, the keys to victory. He used it in Italy after D-Day and all the way up to 7 May, 1945. I think it would have been particularly proud that one of his descendants who today specialises in this area works in our military. His brother Vincent was blown up guarding Belfast docks and very severely injured. After some years, he was able to return to the law and became a noted KC in Australia.
And his stepson, Lieutenant Howard Frank, was with the Grenadier Guards en route to market garden and died on 10 September, 1944. My mum then HTN was traumatised by the death of her beloved brother and it affected her mental health the rest of her life. Lady Meyer said there was no mental health support available for veterans, nor was there for the public either. As children, we lived and relived her horror of commemoration and the consequences of his death. I spoke about a continuum.
Those of us with relatives in military service, with frequent deployments and threats today, feel much I think as my grandfather's family felt throughout the first half of the 20th-century. Lord Coaker talked about deterrence. How we must always call out authoritarian behaviour.... He first they came to the Communist, which by the way, the Americans change to the socialist, completely missing the point, that actually it is the people that you don't like that you should speak up for, was absolutely key after the war, not just with the German community but he went around the world teaching people how to learn to speak out.
Many other organisations founded as a result of the Second World War have been mentioned by have not heard the Council of Europe mentioned. Which Churchill founded. With its European Court of Human Rights. Because it is one of the most important checks and balances to ensure that individual freedoms are protected. And despite differences about individual definitions of human rights, if we don't have the ability to call out other nations, then we will not listen and learn. And I want to just end by quoting briefly Edward end by quoting briefly Edward London's poem on VE Day, he says, "All their actions rise to future fame be theirs sweet peas, dear love, quite rain and sun, the life which they marched and sailed and flew, reunion, restoration, freedom, deep and true." Today that freedom is at risk.
Those who go there all is at risk. Those who go there all in the 21st-century -- those who in the 21st-century -- those who gave their all in the 20th century would be horrified if we were to lose that freedom again.
12:22
Lord Bassam of Brighton (Labour)
-
-
Lord Bassam of Brighton (Labour)
It is a privilege and an honour to take part in today's debate with the opportunity it provides to discuss the impact war has on families, my family in particular. On the human cost of conflict. Many of my comments were already having echoed around the chamber. Most of us have a family wartime archive, mine comprises uncles personal wartime letters, ration books, clothing coupons are cap badge and puzzlingly, an engagement ring. A deeply patriotically... Believed in the war and the war aims.
My grandfather was a primitive Methodist lay preacher, based in Whitby, at the wars outset he and his wife Lizzie were part of a Methodist befriending group set up to support servicemen training away to support servicemen training away from home. Lizzie and John had three children, Ella, Edie, my mother, and Burnham. Ella died from measles H2. But Enid was the first to join the national service, the land army and then later the fire service. She trained as nog still to male firefighters.
She told me her female colleagues could tackle fires as well as any man and better because they were younger and fitter. Enid's brother joined the... Highlanders in 1941. The 31st Highland division, he saw action in the Middle East, North Africa, Sicily, Italy and finally in north-west Europe. An obituary in the Methodist magazine That, which circulated in Whitby, said this, "The past five years private has been in the thick of the fighting. First at El Alamein until they were.
Surrender, he was wounded but making a quick recovery in a military hospital in Egypt, he took part in the evasion of Sicily, where again he was wounded. He rejoined his unit in Italy and when wounded again, contracted malaria, which resulted in a return to England. After recovering, he received orders to rejoin his unit and was with the British forces which first landed in Normandy on D-Day on 6 June. His CEO Captain Ferguson wrote describing his tragic death, he was struck by a hand grenade when digging in a slit trench on the 26 July.
His bravery and commitment let his comrades distraught. He had all the toughest of war, was wounded many times and survived biting off Normandy beaches. -- Fighting off the Normandy beaches. His sacrifice was tragically necessary to see off the Eagles of Nazism. His letters home telling. In writing to his sister he described D-Day. We were told we were best troops, actually we were no good, we had the sleepout for three days in trenches full of water without food or tea and during that time marched a distance of over 70 miles.
His platoon were reserved for specialist but he worried their nerves were gone. He was planning his next leave with his new girlfriend, who he wanted to marry. This Christmas, 1943 letter tells the family he has kept in hospital though fully recovered and the French invasion may start before his leave. His last letter, written two days before he was killed, says he can't disclose where here's except always on the frontline. He ends, "Hope of keeping OK, I'm not too bad, please give my best wishes to all maybe asking for me, but now I say cheerio, may the Lord God or to be with you at all times." His death, devastated his family but they were immensely proud of a family photo Enid standing next to him, both proudly wearing the uniforms.
His arm around her shoulder as they gaze into the camera with discrete and modest camera with discrete and modest smiles. Enid passed away in 1994, aged 80. Her brother was just 21 when he died. She said he was funny, talented, loyal, caring. And all her life she wondered about what could have been. He signed off one letter with the following, " So remember the brave who fell by the way when final victory is one. Remember the price they had to pay in defeating the tyrants plan." Not a bad epitaph from a fallen soldier who simply believed in doing what was right.
Wars focus on generals and leaders but today, rightly we remember troopers like private firm and Basson and fire woman Enid Basson who gave so much. My hope, with this week's commemorations, is that we don't only dwell on the victories but think more about the centrepiece, unity and harmony that ending war can bring and try to use ending war can bring and try to use the occasion to heal divisions that sum in our country simply can't wait to perpetually reopen.
My grandfather was a primitive Methodist lay preacher, based in Whitby, at the wars outset he and his wife Lizzie were part of a Methodist befriending group set up to support servicemen training away to support servicemen training away from home. Lizzie and John had three children, Ella, Edie, my mother, and Burnham. Ella died from measles H2. But Enid was the first to join the national service, the land army and then later the fire service. She trained as nog still to male firefighters.
She told me her female colleagues could tackle fires as well as any man and better because they were younger and fitter. Enid's brother joined the... Highlanders in 1941. The 31st Highland division, he saw action in the Middle East, North Africa, Sicily, Italy and finally in north-west Europe. An obituary in the Methodist magazine That, which circulated in Whitby, said this, "The past five years private has been in the thick of the fighting. First at El Alamein until they were.
Surrender, he was wounded but making a quick recovery in a military hospital in Egypt, he took part in the evasion of Sicily, where again he was wounded. He rejoined his unit in Italy and when wounded again, contracted malaria, which resulted in a return to England. After recovering, he received orders to rejoin his unit and was with the British forces which first landed in Normandy on D-Day on 6 June. His CEO Captain Ferguson wrote describing his tragic death, he was struck by a hand grenade when digging in a slit trench on the 26 July.
His bravery and commitment let his comrades distraught. He had all the toughest of war, was wounded many times and survived biting off Normandy beaches. -- Fighting off the Normandy beaches. His sacrifice was tragically necessary to see off the Eagles of Nazism. His letters home telling. In writing to his sister he described D-Day. We were told we were best troops, actually we were no good, we had the sleepout for three days in trenches full of water without food or tea and during that time marched a distance of over 70 miles.
His platoon were reserved for specialist but he worried their nerves were gone. He was planning his next leave with his new girlfriend, who he wanted to marry. This Christmas, 1943 letter tells the family he has kept in hospital though fully recovered and the French invasion may start before his leave. His last letter, written two days before he was killed, says he can't disclose where here's except always on the frontline. He ends, "Hope of keeping OK, I'm not too bad, please give my best wishes to all maybe asking for me, but now I say cheerio, may the Lord God or to be with you at all times." His death, devastated his family but they were immensely proud of a family photo Enid standing next to him, both proudly wearing the uniforms.
His arm around her shoulder as they gaze into the camera with discrete and modest camera with discrete and modest smiles. Enid passed away in 1994, aged 80. Her brother was just 21 when he died. She said he was funny, talented, loyal, caring. And all her life she wondered about what could have been. He signed off one letter with the following, " So remember the brave who fell by the way when final victory is one. Remember the price they had to pay in defeating the tyrants plan." Not a bad epitaph from a fallen soldier who simply believed in doing what was right.
Wars focus on generals and leaders but today, rightly we remember troopers like private firm and Basson and fire woman Enid Basson who gave so much. My hope, with this week's commemorations, is that we don't only dwell on the victories but think more about the centrepiece, unity and harmony that ending war can bring and try to use ending war can bring and try to use the occasion to heal divisions that sum in our country simply can't wait to perpetually reopen.
12:27
Lord Ricketts (Crossbench)
-
-
Lord Ricketts (Crossbench)
I would like to start by declaring an interest as the founding chairman of the British Normandy Memorial. I would like to congratulate the Minister on his very powerful opening and the right reverend Prelate for her excellent Maiden speech. A lot of this week has been about celebrating VE Day. But as Baroness Hunter, Baroness Meyer very powerfully said, we should not forget those who fought and served in the far east, including my father who was in the 14th Army in Burma.
They called themselves the forgotten army and it is right that they are not forgotten today. We should also remember that for millions of people in Eastern Europe, this eighth, ninth of May was the day they swapped one totalitarian occupation for another and it was not for another 45 years until they had their liberation day. As we have seen in today's debate, celebration has to go hand-in-hand with commemoration. Of those who sacrifices made victory possible. And I wanted to reflect briefly on the trends in commemoration on the strength of the experience of designing, building and running the British Normandy Memorial.
This was the first major UK national memorial overseas for several decades. And the tradition in this country is that we commemorate here at a national commemoration monument, at the Cenotaph, the unknown soldier, while overseas, the focus of commemoration is in the intensely moving Commonwealth war graves cemeteries. The initiative for a national memorial in Normandy came from a group of veterans. They wanted all the comrades who fell in the 1944 battle to be remembered in one place, as is the case with the American and the Canadian memorials.
And with then regenerative help from the government and many donations in the public, at we built watch I can say is a fine memorial, which opened to the public in 1921. We benefited a lot from the contributions of other noble Lords, Lord who has taken over from his chairman, and other noble Lords who are also trustees of the Normandy trust. We were enormously honoured when the King and queen, with president and mad and Macron, presided at the mad and Macron, presided at the It was moving to hear the speech at the VE Day concert last night.
One advantage of a national memorial as it can be inclusive, telling the story not just of a single engagement but of an entirely military campaign, from 6 June to 31 August 1944, our memorial commemorates all those who fell under British command of different nationalities and includes those who were in the Merchant Marines. 22,440 men and two women from the Queen Alexandra's nursing service. One name indeed who figures, who having been killed on 6 June, is Sergeant Bernard Coker.
The memorial is inclusive in another sense as well, we built a separate memorial on the site to the many thousands of French civilians who were killed in that summer of 1944. Over the last 80 years the citizens of Normandy have welcomed back to veterans, calling them our liberators. And it is only right that suffering of their The second trend is commemoration The second trend is commemoration needs to be more digital, to get the next generation the memory of what happened and why.
We invested in state-of-the-art apps, so our role of honour can be searched, many families have generously donated photographs, letters home, journals, all of which are now available online. I, like other noble Lords, and convinced that telling the human stories behind the names engraving on the stone memorials is the best way to keep interest alive in those momentous events. And our trust has recently completed the Winston Churchill centre and is focusing on programs for schoolchildren. The last trend is the constant need to be creative.
These VE Day celebrations have shown the power of creativity. For us, the second summer, we are delighted to welcome summer, we are delighted to welcome Haunting life-size silhouettes of servicemen and women, created by the charity Standing with Giants, they have installed 1475 figures at our memorial, that is the number of those killed under British command on D-Day alone, and it is an extraordinary, moving installation. It has proved immensely popular, to run 50,000 visitors to the Memorial last year, and I pay tribute to Jan and Janet who founded the charity, and his inspirational work has been very powerful in many other cases as very powerful in many other cases as well.
So, if we can be inclusive, digital and creative, we can ensure the courage and sacrifice of those, including the many referred to in including the many referred to in this debate, who fought for our freedom, will never be forgotten.
They called themselves the forgotten army and it is right that they are not forgotten today. We should also remember that for millions of people in Eastern Europe, this eighth, ninth of May was the day they swapped one totalitarian occupation for another and it was not for another 45 years until they had their liberation day. As we have seen in today's debate, celebration has to go hand-in-hand with commemoration. Of those who sacrifices made victory possible. And I wanted to reflect briefly on the trends in commemoration on the strength of the experience of designing, building and running the British Normandy Memorial.
This was the first major UK national memorial overseas for several decades. And the tradition in this country is that we commemorate here at a national commemoration monument, at the Cenotaph, the unknown soldier, while overseas, the focus of commemoration is in the intensely moving Commonwealth war graves cemeteries. The initiative for a national memorial in Normandy came from a group of veterans. They wanted all the comrades who fell in the 1944 battle to be remembered in one place, as is the case with the American and the Canadian memorials.
And with then regenerative help from the government and many donations in the public, at we built watch I can say is a fine memorial, which opened to the public in 1921. We benefited a lot from the contributions of other noble Lords, Lord who has taken over from his chairman, and other noble Lords who are also trustees of the Normandy trust. We were enormously honoured when the King and queen, with president and mad and Macron, presided at the mad and Macron, presided at the It was moving to hear the speech at the VE Day concert last night.
One advantage of a national memorial as it can be inclusive, telling the story not just of a single engagement but of an entirely military campaign, from 6 June to 31 August 1944, our memorial commemorates all those who fell under British command of different nationalities and includes those who were in the Merchant Marines. 22,440 men and two women from the Queen Alexandra's nursing service. One name indeed who figures, who having been killed on 6 June, is Sergeant Bernard Coker.
The memorial is inclusive in another sense as well, we built a separate memorial on the site to the many thousands of French civilians who were killed in that summer of 1944. Over the last 80 years the citizens of Normandy have welcomed back to veterans, calling them our liberators. And it is only right that suffering of their The second trend is commemoration The second trend is commemoration needs to be more digital, to get the next generation the memory of what happened and why.
We invested in state-of-the-art apps, so our role of honour can be searched, many families have generously donated photographs, letters home, journals, all of which are now available online. I, like other noble Lords, and convinced that telling the human stories behind the names engraving on the stone memorials is the best way to keep interest alive in those momentous events. And our trust has recently completed the Winston Churchill centre and is focusing on programs for schoolchildren. The last trend is the constant need to be creative.
These VE Day celebrations have shown the power of creativity. For us, the second summer, we are delighted to welcome summer, we are delighted to welcome Haunting life-size silhouettes of servicemen and women, created by the charity Standing with Giants, they have installed 1475 figures at our memorial, that is the number of those killed under British command on D-Day alone, and it is an extraordinary, moving installation. It has proved immensely popular, to run 50,000 visitors to the Memorial last year, and I pay tribute to Jan and Janet who founded the charity, and his inspirational work has been very powerful in many other cases as very powerful in many other cases as well.
So, if we can be inclusive, digital and creative, we can ensure the courage and sacrifice of those, including the many referred to in including the many referred to in this debate, who fought for our freedom, will never be forgotten.
12:33
The Lord Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham (Bishops)
-
-
The Lord Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham (Bishops)
My Lords, it is a privilege to speak in this debate, and I first congratulate my right reverend friend, the Bishop of Peterborough, in her excellent maiden speech and look forward to are insightful and wide-ranging contribution to this House in the coming days, particularly drawing on her experience in education, and with young people. I also thank the noble Lord, the minister, for his very moving and impassioned speech, to open this debate. We commemorate, at a time of extraordinary sacrifice and service in the story of our nation, as well as our partners and notably in the Commonwealth, Victorino was hard-won.
I want to begin by paying particular tribute to the vital work of the Armed Forces chaplains who served with great distinction throughout the war. We can be thankful they remained an essential and fully integrated part of our military capability. Not only because of their vital role in times of conflict, it also, because of the well-being of all service personnel during training, an exercise, and deployment in strategic peacetime operations. Now, in my own diocese, among the Armed Forces, I also want to pay tribute to the Sherwood to pay tribute to the Sherwood Rangers, who are one of the four regiments task on leading the British assault landings on the Normandy beaches on D-Day and they remained in action for 50 of the 60 days it took to win the Normandy campaign.
Through France, Belgium and Holland, and eventually into Germany, they were used to provide the armoured push, which led infantry attacks. Yet, the casualties of war, included many casualties of war, included many lives, also lost in our cities. Which bravely withstood the relentless bombing raids early in the war, as the noble Lord, Baroness Coffey, has already expressed. So movingly. In Nottingham, 84 years ago today, during overnight raids, 159 people were killed and many hundreds were injured. They would have almost certainly been far more casualties, if the city had not also been the first to deploy a detailed ARP plan, that many other cities would soon follow.
While our cities of course were being rebuilt, the trauma and follows, which many people experience, remained painful shadow over their lives. While it is sobering that our celebrations this week take place, against the backdrop of a tense and uncertain time of global instability, and conflict, it is necessary and urgent that we rebuild our military capability is an essential deterrent, to avoid future conflicts as a number of noble Lords, perhaps particularly Lord Stewart, have expressed so clearly. Alongside this, we must also continue to retain and enhance our investment in peacekeeping resources.
Such as the training of skilled mediators and in post-conflict stabilisation. As Jesus said, Blessed are the peacemakers. And my Lords, we can join with our Roman Catholic brothers and sisters in being thankful and praying for the newly elected Pope Leo XIV, who I'm sure will be an inspiration to all Christian people and people of other faiths, in being truly lionhearted bridge builders in our broken and divided world. My Lords, our military capacity is, on one level, much reduced from what it was in the past.
That is no reason to limit our ambitions and our potential to make a difference. Especially, if we draw on our strengths and technology, creativity, and diplomacy. We need to nurture the aspirations of the rising generation, to have a compassionate worldview. A view that is not at odds with loyalty to our nation. And where deep convictions, and white sympathies, are not in conflict. I wonder whether, therefore, if this might somewhat be diminished, if we are also closing off the opportunities for young people to experience the wider world firsthand.
I would therefore ask His Majesty's government to consider how we can further incentivise our universities and colleges to maintain and enhance the opportunities for international exchange study. Perhaps also reconsidering how we might also re- engage with the Erasmus program. It provides vital opportunities for young people to have their own personal insight into our wider world. We need to deeper our listening and understanding not to compel agreement, or to undermine the distinctive police and heritage that each may hold with confidence, but in order that we may stand together in contending with the value of our, humanity, and the value of our, humanity, and the unique dignity worth and freedom of every individual, which the sacrifices of the Second World War did so much to ensure, for generations to come.
I want to begin by paying particular tribute to the vital work of the Armed Forces chaplains who served with great distinction throughout the war. We can be thankful they remained an essential and fully integrated part of our military capability. Not only because of their vital role in times of conflict, it also, because of the well-being of all service personnel during training, an exercise, and deployment in strategic peacetime operations. Now, in my own diocese, among the Armed Forces, I also want to pay tribute to the Sherwood to pay tribute to the Sherwood Rangers, who are one of the four regiments task on leading the British assault landings on the Normandy beaches on D-Day and they remained in action for 50 of the 60 days it took to win the Normandy campaign.
Through France, Belgium and Holland, and eventually into Germany, they were used to provide the armoured push, which led infantry attacks. Yet, the casualties of war, included many casualties of war, included many lives, also lost in our cities. Which bravely withstood the relentless bombing raids early in the war, as the noble Lord, Baroness Coffey, has already expressed. So movingly. In Nottingham, 84 years ago today, during overnight raids, 159 people were killed and many hundreds were injured. They would have almost certainly been far more casualties, if the city had not also been the first to deploy a detailed ARP plan, that many other cities would soon follow.
While our cities of course were being rebuilt, the trauma and follows, which many people experience, remained painful shadow over their lives. While it is sobering that our celebrations this week take place, against the backdrop of a tense and uncertain time of global instability, and conflict, it is necessary and urgent that we rebuild our military capability is an essential deterrent, to avoid future conflicts as a number of noble Lords, perhaps particularly Lord Stewart, have expressed so clearly. Alongside this, we must also continue to retain and enhance our investment in peacekeeping resources.
Such as the training of skilled mediators and in post-conflict stabilisation. As Jesus said, Blessed are the peacemakers. And my Lords, we can join with our Roman Catholic brothers and sisters in being thankful and praying for the newly elected Pope Leo XIV, who I'm sure will be an inspiration to all Christian people and people of other faiths, in being truly lionhearted bridge builders in our broken and divided world. My Lords, our military capacity is, on one level, much reduced from what it was in the past.
That is no reason to limit our ambitions and our potential to make a difference. Especially, if we draw on our strengths and technology, creativity, and diplomacy. We need to nurture the aspirations of the rising generation, to have a compassionate worldview. A view that is not at odds with loyalty to our nation. And where deep convictions, and white sympathies, are not in conflict. I wonder whether, therefore, if this might somewhat be diminished, if we are also closing off the opportunities for young people to experience the wider world firsthand.
I would therefore ask His Majesty's government to consider how we can further incentivise our universities and colleges to maintain and enhance the opportunities for international exchange study. Perhaps also reconsidering how we might also re- engage with the Erasmus program. It provides vital opportunities for young people to have their own personal insight into our wider world. We need to deeper our listening and understanding not to compel agreement, or to undermine the distinctive police and heritage that each may hold with confidence, but in order that we may stand together in contending with the value of our, humanity, and the value of our, humanity, and the unique dignity worth and freedom of every individual, which the sacrifices of the Second World War did so much to ensure, for generations to come.
12:38
Lord Lemos (Labour)
-
-
Lord Lemos (Labour)
My Lords, I congratulate the right reverend prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough, on her maiden speech, and I share many of her interests and concerns, so I look forward to working with her. My Lords, I am honoured to be the Chair of English Heritage, in which I obviously declare my interest. English Heritage takes pride in looking after the Cenotaph in Whitehall, and many other war memorials on behalf of the nation. English Heritage's job is not just to look after places and buildings.
We are also stewards of our national memory. What we as a nation choose to remember and what we cannot forget. All this week, the Cenotaph has been draped in the Union flag, to celebrate VE Day. Last night, on VE Day, Dover Castle was lit up in red, white and blue. Visible on a clear night from France. In 1940, long before VE Day could ever be anticipated, the evacuation of British troops from Dunkirk was planned, from the bombproof tunnels built beneath the cliffs of dopa.
Mac cliffs of Dover. Years later, in 1944, operation fortitude was also planned from the tunnels at Dover Castle. This was the deception strategy, to convince the Nazi's erroneously, that the Allied landing would take place at Pas-de-Calais, when in fact, the troops were going to land in Normandy. We cannot imagine, my Lords, watch those naval officers were thinking, throughout the war. But courage and commitment would have been uppermost in their minds. Not far from your Lordships house is the Belgian gratitude Memorial, on Victorian embankment.
Created to thank the British people for sheltering thousands of Belgian refugees during the First World War. Thousands of refugees. Gratitude and thanksgiving resonate powerfully on VE Day. The bodies of the soldiers who died in the First World War never came home. They fought and fell on a foreign field. Many were buried anonymously, their loved ones had no graves to mourn them at home. The first Cenotaph in Whitehall was unveiled for London P celebrations, on 18 July, 1990.
It was a temporary structure of wood and painted canvas. Built in 11 days, for parading trips, to salute their fallen comrades, and celebrate victory. The Cenotaph made a deep and immediate impression on the public. Within a week, the Cenotaph had been visited by more than 1.25 million people, and was 10 feet deep in flowers and wreaths. The Times commented at the Cenotaph is only a temporary structure made to look like stone. But Sir Edwin's design is so grave, severe, and beautiful, that one might well wish it were indeed of stone and permanent.
It was soon decided that the Cenotaph should be rebuilt as a permanent memorial important stone. -- In Portland stone. The enduring Cenotaph was unveiled by King George V at 11am, on 11 November, 1920, the second anniversary of the armistice. In the same ceremony, the remains of an anonymous British soldier, Exuma from a war cemetery in France, were interred at Westminster Abbey, to form the tomb of the unknown soldier. My Lords, the sequence of events, now so little known, changed the way our nation remembers.
That surge of public national morning for the loss, but not forgotten has meant that the Cenotaph has become the centrepiece of our national commitment to remembrance. The Cenotaph is a permanent monument to all of those who died on the battlefield, defending this country, but it also has an unshakeable place in our national identity for if I can put it like this, the Cenotaph can put it like this, the Cenotaph is a nation's commitment to the insistence of remembering.
My Lords, on VE Day, we celebrate the Victory in Europe Day Second World War, and our nations finest hour. We commemorate the courage and commitment shown at Dover and throughout the country, and in many countries, to achieve that victory. We commemorate our profound heartfelt gratitude, of all of those who spread -- Who spared and saved, and we can remember the living and the dead. Memory, my Lords, something we have, not something we
**** Possible New Speaker ****
lost. It is a pleasure to follow the
**** Possible New Speaker ****
It is a pleasure to follow the noble Lord. And I also congratulate the right reverend prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough, on her important maiden speech. My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Anderson of the noble Lord, Lord Anderson of Swansea, invited us to consider the Swansea, invited us to consider the possibility of a Nazi victory. He possibility of a Nazi victory. He was surely right to do so. For it is was surely right to do so. For it is when I reflect on the horror of what so easily might have been, but for
We are also stewards of our national memory. What we as a nation choose to remember and what we cannot forget. All this week, the Cenotaph has been draped in the Union flag, to celebrate VE Day. Last night, on VE Day, Dover Castle was lit up in red, white and blue. Visible on a clear night from France. In 1940, long before VE Day could ever be anticipated, the evacuation of British troops from Dunkirk was planned, from the bombproof tunnels built beneath the cliffs of dopa.
Mac cliffs of Dover. Years later, in 1944, operation fortitude was also planned from the tunnels at Dover Castle. This was the deception strategy, to convince the Nazi's erroneously, that the Allied landing would take place at Pas-de-Calais, when in fact, the troops were going to land in Normandy. We cannot imagine, my Lords, watch those naval officers were thinking, throughout the war. But courage and commitment would have been uppermost in their minds. Not far from your Lordships house is the Belgian gratitude Memorial, on Victorian embankment.
Created to thank the British people for sheltering thousands of Belgian refugees during the First World War. Thousands of refugees. Gratitude and thanksgiving resonate powerfully on VE Day. The bodies of the soldiers who died in the First World War never came home. They fought and fell on a foreign field. Many were buried anonymously, their loved ones had no graves to mourn them at home. The first Cenotaph in Whitehall was unveiled for London P celebrations, on 18 July, 1990.
It was a temporary structure of wood and painted canvas. Built in 11 days, for parading trips, to salute their fallen comrades, and celebrate victory. The Cenotaph made a deep and immediate impression on the public. Within a week, the Cenotaph had been visited by more than 1.25 million people, and was 10 feet deep in flowers and wreaths. The Times commented at the Cenotaph is only a temporary structure made to look like stone. But Sir Edwin's design is so grave, severe, and beautiful, that one might well wish it were indeed of stone and permanent.
It was soon decided that the Cenotaph should be rebuilt as a permanent memorial important stone. -- In Portland stone. The enduring Cenotaph was unveiled by King George V at 11am, on 11 November, 1920, the second anniversary of the armistice. In the same ceremony, the remains of an anonymous British soldier, Exuma from a war cemetery in France, were interred at Westminster Abbey, to form the tomb of the unknown soldier. My Lords, the sequence of events, now so little known, changed the way our nation remembers.
That surge of public national morning for the loss, but not forgotten has meant that the Cenotaph has become the centrepiece of our national commitment to remembrance. The Cenotaph is a permanent monument to all of those who died on the battlefield, defending this country, but it also has an unshakeable place in our national identity for if I can put it like this, the Cenotaph can put it like this, the Cenotaph is a nation's commitment to the insistence of remembering.
My Lords, on VE Day, we celebrate the Victory in Europe Day Second World War, and our nations finest hour. We commemorate the courage and commitment shown at Dover and throughout the country, and in many countries, to achieve that victory. We commemorate our profound heartfelt gratitude, of all of those who spread -- Who spared and saved, and we can remember the living and the dead. Memory, my Lords, something we have, not something we
**** Possible New Speaker ****
lost. It is a pleasure to follow the
**** Possible New Speaker ****
It is a pleasure to follow the noble Lord. And I also congratulate the right reverend prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough, on her important maiden speech. My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Anderson of the noble Lord, Lord Anderson of Swansea, invited us to consider the Swansea, invited us to consider the possibility of a Nazi victory. He possibility of a Nazi victory. He was surely right to do so. For it is was surely right to do so. For it is when I reflect on the horror of what so easily might have been, but for
12:44
Lord Shinkwin (Conservative)
-
-
Lord Shinkwin (Conservative)
so easily might have been, but for the immense sacrifices, of those who fought and died only 80 years ago, so that future generations might be so that future generations might be free, that I begin to appreciate the scale of the debt, the personal debt, which I owed them. The fact is that, like my childhood orthopaedics surgeon, a refugee from the Nazis, surgeon, a refugee from the Nazis, who took refuge in Britain, we both would have been under it, mine for being Jewish, and for being German.
Both of us would have been destined for death. Simply for the crime of being. My Lords, on a more positive note. Quite apart from the tremendous technological and medical advances of the last 80 years, who could deny that society has changed could deny that society has changed for the better in so many ways, as a result of what was one for us then. Yes, it is still a work in progress, but we are closer to the equality, then we have ever been.
Only a few days ago, I had lunch with the She is a formidable business leader. And it is remarkable that in less 100 years since truly equal suffrage was introduced, this country has already had three women prime Ministers. The first just over 50 years after that long overdue change was made. 2025 is a year of milestones for equality. 2025 marks 60 years since the first race relations act. 30 years since the first Disability Discrimination Act.
And 12 years since a marriage of same-sex couples act gained Royal assent. All important milestones for equality and all impossible without the victories we remember today. Equality. It is a crucial... Which the wartime generation did not have the luxury of enjoying. So focused where they are survival. And we know the world was such a different place then. When inequality was written into the fabric of society. But just as they would not necessarily have recognised the relatively recent concept of equality, I do wonder whether all in our society today recognise what -- or even accept the validity of the wartime generation's values.
The values so many of them, as we have heard in today's debate, fought and died for. A respect for life. Caring and compassion for those in vulnerable situations, whether through old age, disability or poverty. Respect for authority within the rule of law. A fairness and fair play, as the noble Baroness Lady Amos mentioned. And, crucially, as the noble Lord the Minister mentioned in his opening remarks, of Patriot-ism... My Lords, I worry that some of the post-Cold War generations actually believe they are entitled to freedom.
That payment for freedom does not have to be made, that the so-called peace evident is permanent. -- Peace dividend. An knowing right from wrong, good from evil is an anachronism, so desensitised and compromised has our society become by the relativism where anything by the relativism where anything goes. So let's envision, for their sake, and with abiding gratitude for the sacrifices of those who helped secure victory in Europe and victory in, I hope I'm wrong, but unless we increase our defence spending, as other noble Lords have indicated, I fear that those generations in particular are about to relearn a brutal lesson from the likes of Putin and Xi Jinping, which generations before them learnt 80 odd years ago from the Nazis.
That the value of freedom is only truly appreciated when they are at appreciated when they are at greatest risk of losing it.
Both of us would have been destined for death. Simply for the crime of being. My Lords, on a more positive note. Quite apart from the tremendous technological and medical advances of the last 80 years, who could deny that society has changed could deny that society has changed for the better in so many ways, as a result of what was one for us then. Yes, it is still a work in progress, but we are closer to the equality, then we have ever been.
Only a few days ago, I had lunch with the She is a formidable business leader. And it is remarkable that in less 100 years since truly equal suffrage was introduced, this country has already had three women prime Ministers. The first just over 50 years after that long overdue change was made. 2025 is a year of milestones for equality. 2025 marks 60 years since the first race relations act. 30 years since the first Disability Discrimination Act.
And 12 years since a marriage of same-sex couples act gained Royal assent. All important milestones for equality and all impossible without the victories we remember today. Equality. It is a crucial... Which the wartime generation did not have the luxury of enjoying. So focused where they are survival. And we know the world was such a different place then. When inequality was written into the fabric of society. But just as they would not necessarily have recognised the relatively recent concept of equality, I do wonder whether all in our society today recognise what -- or even accept the validity of the wartime generation's values.
The values so many of them, as we have heard in today's debate, fought and died for. A respect for life. Caring and compassion for those in vulnerable situations, whether through old age, disability or poverty. Respect for authority within the rule of law. A fairness and fair play, as the noble Baroness Lady Amos mentioned. And, crucially, as the noble Lord the Minister mentioned in his opening remarks, of Patriot-ism... My Lords, I worry that some of the post-Cold War generations actually believe they are entitled to freedom.
That payment for freedom does not have to be made, that the so-called peace evident is permanent. -- Peace dividend. An knowing right from wrong, good from evil is an anachronism, so desensitised and compromised has our society become by the relativism where anything by the relativism where anything goes. So let's envision, for their sake, and with abiding gratitude for the sacrifices of those who helped secure victory in Europe and victory in, I hope I'm wrong, but unless we increase our defence spending, as other noble Lords have indicated, I fear that those generations in particular are about to relearn a brutal lesson from the likes of Putin and Xi Jinping, which generations before them learnt 80 odd years ago from the Nazis.
That the value of freedom is only truly appreciated when they are at appreciated when they are at greatest risk of losing it.
12:51
Lord Griffiths of Burry Port (Labour)
-
-
Lord Griffiths of Burry Port (Labour)
My Lords, the words of His Majesty the King, as reported in the news, focused on the words that we should not forget. And it is a privilege to be part of a debate like this, where so much has been remembered, such varied and rich memories indeed. And I have been searching in my mind for how to concentrate or locus on any of the memories that are mind. -- Focus on. My father served in the Royal Navy. He survived the war but his marriage did not.
And I would like to remember all those relationships that were victims of the war. And where lives had to be rebuilt afterwards. At the end of his life, my father's second family handed me some mementos of his service. And one particular one I would lay before you now. He was a member of the crew of HMS York, that ferried Winston Churchill across the Atlantic in December, 1941, for the meeting with President Roosevelt. And there in the pictures, very historic pictures, Lord Beaverbrook, the king, Winston Churchill and other dignitaries marking the very special sense that was attached to this particular exercise.
I won't dwell any more on my father, it is far too painful. But I remember our neighbours, the Hartland family, who had television and where I was able to go and watch from time to time, their father, Bert Hartland, the annals of the poor, he will never be remembered anywhere, until now, it is in Hansard, he would break into uncontrollable fits of rage. Him being a prisoner of war, at the hands of the Japanese, and had returned a wreck. And we all just lived with that.
He did what he did. It will go as quickly as it came. But it was a reminder of things that we could only guess at. And then further afield, I led a little election monitoring group in Eritrea, in 1993. And the moment when NHA -- at the moment when Eritrea came literally onto the world map. We were assigned duties of overseeing that election. It was an ordinary exercise, a small team, lifelong friends. But to my total surprise, I found these two enormous graveyards.
For a 1942, a battle had been fought there and there is this huge graveyard that the Italians who died on that occasion, thousands of them, and hundreds of Allied troops in their own and separate cemetery. Most of them of course members of the Indian army. With Africans as well and British too of course. Reminding me of another dimension, another detail in the memories that we are sharing today. But then by chance, my wife and I, in 2005, found ourselves sitting interesting, which only a week before had had its restoration program completed, completely rebuilt after the carpet bombing of 1945.
Because 1945 marks the 80th anniversary of things other than the things that took out people onto the streets in front of Buckingham Palace. And that had to be remembered too. But my final memory, I was chair of the Hendon and Golders Green branch of the Council of Christians and Jews. And that brought me into contact with a man, another Lesley, when Leslie's meet, there is joy in heaven. And I have to say this particular Lesley was a very special one because he was born in Glyn Heath and raise the, just 20 miles from where I was born and raised.
So we fell upon each other. He turned out in the end to be an Orthodox rabbi and a senior Jewish chaplain in the forces that liberated, as Lord Dubs has referred to, the liberation of Bergen-Belsen. I remember him talking to me about it. It is inconceivable, well, let me not add to what we have heard in recent pieces ourselves already. Except a quotation from an interview that he gave to the BBC, which I shall never forget.
If all the trees in the world became a pen, if all the seas in the world became ink, if all the heavens became writing paper, they would not provide enough material on which to write the sufferings of the people that he met that day. I mean, that says it all, doesn't it really? And just, therefore indulging your Lordships, very quickly. I don't settle for don't forget, it is the flip sign of a coin that reminds us to remember.
And remember the hyphenated words etymologically is really remembering remembering what has been dismembered. That is the task before us. I'm from conversations with my friend Leslie Hartman, I can only say if he knew... Which means remember, not only the injunction to remember, not only the injunction to send one's mind back to a moment in history, to recreate a situation history, to recreate a situation that we live through then, but on the basis of that to have triggered action that sees that it never happens again.
happens again.
And I would like to remember all those relationships that were victims of the war. And where lives had to be rebuilt afterwards. At the end of his life, my father's second family handed me some mementos of his service. And one particular one I would lay before you now. He was a member of the crew of HMS York, that ferried Winston Churchill across the Atlantic in December, 1941, for the meeting with President Roosevelt. And there in the pictures, very historic pictures, Lord Beaverbrook, the king, Winston Churchill and other dignitaries marking the very special sense that was attached to this particular exercise.
I won't dwell any more on my father, it is far too painful. But I remember our neighbours, the Hartland family, who had television and where I was able to go and watch from time to time, their father, Bert Hartland, the annals of the poor, he will never be remembered anywhere, until now, it is in Hansard, he would break into uncontrollable fits of rage. Him being a prisoner of war, at the hands of the Japanese, and had returned a wreck. And we all just lived with that.
He did what he did. It will go as quickly as it came. But it was a reminder of things that we could only guess at. And then further afield, I led a little election monitoring group in Eritrea, in 1993. And the moment when NHA -- at the moment when Eritrea came literally onto the world map. We were assigned duties of overseeing that election. It was an ordinary exercise, a small team, lifelong friends. But to my total surprise, I found these two enormous graveyards.
For a 1942, a battle had been fought there and there is this huge graveyard that the Italians who died on that occasion, thousands of them, and hundreds of Allied troops in their own and separate cemetery. Most of them of course members of the Indian army. With Africans as well and British too of course. Reminding me of another dimension, another detail in the memories that we are sharing today. But then by chance, my wife and I, in 2005, found ourselves sitting interesting, which only a week before had had its restoration program completed, completely rebuilt after the carpet bombing of 1945.
Because 1945 marks the 80th anniversary of things other than the things that took out people onto the streets in front of Buckingham Palace. And that had to be remembered too. But my final memory, I was chair of the Hendon and Golders Green branch of the Council of Christians and Jews. And that brought me into contact with a man, another Lesley, when Leslie's meet, there is joy in heaven. And I have to say this particular Lesley was a very special one because he was born in Glyn Heath and raise the, just 20 miles from where I was born and raised.
So we fell upon each other. He turned out in the end to be an Orthodox rabbi and a senior Jewish chaplain in the forces that liberated, as Lord Dubs has referred to, the liberation of Bergen-Belsen. I remember him talking to me about it. It is inconceivable, well, let me not add to what we have heard in recent pieces ourselves already. Except a quotation from an interview that he gave to the BBC, which I shall never forget.
If all the trees in the world became a pen, if all the seas in the world became ink, if all the heavens became writing paper, they would not provide enough material on which to write the sufferings of the people that he met that day. I mean, that says it all, doesn't it really? And just, therefore indulging your Lordships, very quickly. I don't settle for don't forget, it is the flip sign of a coin that reminds us to remember.
And remember the hyphenated words etymologically is really remembering remembering what has been dismembered. That is the task before us. I'm from conversations with my friend Leslie Hartman, I can only say if he knew... Which means remember, not only the injunction to remember, not only the injunction to send one's mind back to a moment in history, to recreate a situation history, to recreate a situation that we live through then, but on the basis of that to have triggered action that sees that it never happens again.
happens again.
12:57
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Conservative)
-
-
Baroness McIntosh of Pickering (Conservative)
I'm delighted to be participating in this debate, marking in particular the 80th anniversary of VE Day. My contribution is a deeply personal one, taking memories handed down from my mother, grandmother and other members of my family in Denmark. Denmark was occupied from April 1940 until 5 May, 1945, although the island remained under Russian occupation for another year. I am proud of the support given by Britain to the resistance efforts in Denmark, in terms of explosives and ammunition and of course moral support.
It was always going to be difficult for a small country like Denmark, with limited military forces, to resist the German occupation of their country. Initially, the Danes declared neutrality and agreed a treaty of non-aggression with Germany. Primarily to protect Jews and I'm delighted to say that most of the Jews survived the war under the German occupation. Germany broke that treaty within one year. With support from the special operations over -- executive here, the Danish resistance movement came proactive and more daring.
Managing to damning the German occupiers with the efforts to sabotage and disrupt the occupying forces, as well as taking strike action to deny the German war effort, ammunition and arms being produced in Danish factories, destined for the German army. A strict curfew was imposed and that ours limited further as the wall went on. Many Danes defied the curfew order to take an evening stroll and were shot and killed on the streets. News of the liberation reached Denmark from the British Broadcasting Corporation, as the BBC was then known, which interrupted its normal broadcast on the evening of 4 May, 1945.
British forces played a large role in freeing Denmark, as well as assisting the resistance fighters. During World War II, there were 415 airdrops, allied aircraft dropping 6,500 containers of weapons, ammunition is and sabotage equipment to support the Danish resistance movement. There were inevitably heavy losses. 18 Allied aircraft were lost over allied soil and 69 airmen lost their lives in the line of duty. The liberation was followed by the prosecution of those who collaborated with German occupiers working against the resistance movement.
Over 10,000 were tried as collaborators or traitors between 1947 and 1950. Over 100 were sentenced to death, with more than 40 executed. Ninth of May is also Schumann day, commemorating the role played by Robert Schumann and other European leaders in bringing Europe together after the war. Initially calling their coal and steel resources to prevent the potential for further aggression between European neighbours. Today marks the 75th anniversary of the Schuman declaration, marking the first steps in greater cooperation, peace and prosperity between European neighbours who had previously been at war with each other in the 20th- century.
I consider myself a product of a very special European Union between a Scottish father and a Danish mother. Who met on a blind date. In Hamburg, in the aftermath of the Second World War. My father was serving as a Royal Army medical Corps officer and my mother was working as a translator for the British Army. Having left now the umbrella of the European Union, I hope that a review of our relations with the UK and the EU next year will be positive and reflective of the realities in which we now live.
And perhaps the European defence... Outlined by Lord Stirrup could be the next step forward in which Britain can contribute. Until now, with the Russian invasion of Ukraine, my generation have lived in relative peace. We owe that peace and our freedom to all who sacrificed their lives in the Second World War and we recognise and commemorate all who served and riveted to that success in Europe riveted to that success in Europe riveted to that success in Europe
It was always going to be difficult for a small country like Denmark, with limited military forces, to resist the German occupation of their country. Initially, the Danes declared neutrality and agreed a treaty of non-aggression with Germany. Primarily to protect Jews and I'm delighted to say that most of the Jews survived the war under the German occupation. Germany broke that treaty within one year. With support from the special operations over -- executive here, the Danish resistance movement came proactive and more daring.
Managing to damning the German occupiers with the efforts to sabotage and disrupt the occupying forces, as well as taking strike action to deny the German war effort, ammunition and arms being produced in Danish factories, destined for the German army. A strict curfew was imposed and that ours limited further as the wall went on. Many Danes defied the curfew order to take an evening stroll and were shot and killed on the streets. News of the liberation reached Denmark from the British Broadcasting Corporation, as the BBC was then known, which interrupted its normal broadcast on the evening of 4 May, 1945.
British forces played a large role in freeing Denmark, as well as assisting the resistance fighters. During World War II, there were 415 airdrops, allied aircraft dropping 6,500 containers of weapons, ammunition is and sabotage equipment to support the Danish resistance movement. There were inevitably heavy losses. 18 Allied aircraft were lost over allied soil and 69 airmen lost their lives in the line of duty. The liberation was followed by the prosecution of those who collaborated with German occupiers working against the resistance movement.
Over 10,000 were tried as collaborators or traitors between 1947 and 1950. Over 100 were sentenced to death, with more than 40 executed. Ninth of May is also Schumann day, commemorating the role played by Robert Schumann and other European leaders in bringing Europe together after the war. Initially calling their coal and steel resources to prevent the potential for further aggression between European neighbours. Today marks the 75th anniversary of the Schuman declaration, marking the first steps in greater cooperation, peace and prosperity between European neighbours who had previously been at war with each other in the 20th- century.
I consider myself a product of a very special European Union between a Scottish father and a Danish mother. Who met on a blind date. In Hamburg, in the aftermath of the Second World War. My father was serving as a Royal Army medical Corps officer and my mother was working as a translator for the British Army. Having left now the umbrella of the European Union, I hope that a review of our relations with the UK and the EU next year will be positive and reflective of the realities in which we now live.
And perhaps the European defence... Outlined by Lord Stirrup could be the next step forward in which Britain can contribute. Until now, with the Russian invasion of Ukraine, my generation have lived in relative peace. We owe that peace and our freedom to all who sacrificed their lives in the Second World War and we recognise and commemorate all who served and riveted to that success in Europe riveted to that success in Europe riveted to that success in Europe
13:02
Lord Parekh (Labour)
-
-
Lord Parekh (Labour)
As we celebrate the 80th anniversary of the end of the Second World War, it is important to remember what it actually signifies. Every act of memorialisation and celebration is also an act of re- enactment. Remembering those who , we don't celebrate the memorialised path, we do it to learn inspiration, and I hope we very much do so, in this particular context, because of the violence and injustice all over the world. As far as the Second World War is concerned, the 80th anniversary, this was one of the most vicious world was one thing,.
Far more vicious than World War I, far more casualties, military and civilian, than the First World War. In a kind of situation, different countries play different roles. The important thing was how was the role interpreted? There I think was made a serious mistake. Not that this is something new, but it is an important point to bear in mind. That is that we began to interpret That is that we began to interpret , and Americans , and Americans won , and Americans won the , and Americans won the war, , and Americans won the war, this , and Americans won the war, this is not true, the Americans supplied weapons, but the major role was played by the Soviet Union.
We signify the largest number of deaths, 27 million. Many of the republics that contributed to the Soviet Union, the Russian public are to be deleted a thousand casualties, the Soviet Union played an important role. After the war, I thought we might organise it in such a way, the Soviet role would be integrated into the Atlantic Charter and to the role that we assigned. We didn't do that. that we assigned. We didn't do that. We ended up creating a world, in my view, on one hand, we in the West and the other side, the Soviets.
I thought it was a serious mistake at the time, and if we're not careful, we are in danger of something similar. In the bipolar world be created, it is cobbling in front of us. -- Crumbling in front of. What will we replace it with? Again, we don't quite know how. I want to learn from this mistake, well, not mistake, but one failing of the treaty at the end of the Second World War. Another thing that is quite important, is how India and the role of the Commonwealth were in the Second World War.
India contributed a very large number of people and a large amount of money. In lots of ways. Some involuntary recruits. Others had to be compelled. Whatever the reason, whatever the cause, a large number of people. What will be due to remember their role in the Second World War? We don't want to show any kind of discrimination. It is simply that it never occurred to us, partly, because we were in the business of reconstructing the world, partly in the business of remembering our own past, that we forgot what India and others contributed, but the fact remains, that we didn't play fair by them.
The world that was destroyed by the partition, and an enormous amount of bloodshed. We didn't think of it, and the result was for years and years, India and Commonwealth, their role went unrecognised. There is also something else that went unrecognised. The Second World War was supposed to be about giving freedom, creating democracy. And Robert Garvey ask, before Britain joined the war, to give India independence. The commitment was made. With the result, the Indian contribution to the Second World War was far more half-hearted.
I simply want to end by saying by analysing the consequences of the world walk, directly, and ask yourself, what are the lessons to learn from this? Not just immediate lessons, but long- just immediate lessons, but long- term lessons, that I being learned.
Far more vicious than World War I, far more casualties, military and civilian, than the First World War. In a kind of situation, different countries play different roles. The important thing was how was the role interpreted? There I think was made a serious mistake. Not that this is something new, but it is an important point to bear in mind. That is that we began to interpret That is that we began to interpret , and Americans , and Americans won , and Americans won the , and Americans won the war, , and Americans won the war, this , and Americans won the war, this is not true, the Americans supplied weapons, but the major role was played by the Soviet Union.
We signify the largest number of deaths, 27 million. Many of the republics that contributed to the Soviet Union, the Russian public are to be deleted a thousand casualties, the Soviet Union played an important role. After the war, I thought we might organise it in such a way, the Soviet role would be integrated into the Atlantic Charter and to the role that we assigned. We didn't do that. that we assigned. We didn't do that. We ended up creating a world, in my view, on one hand, we in the West and the other side, the Soviets.
I thought it was a serious mistake at the time, and if we're not careful, we are in danger of something similar. In the bipolar world be created, it is cobbling in front of us. -- Crumbling in front of. What will we replace it with? Again, we don't quite know how. I want to learn from this mistake, well, not mistake, but one failing of the treaty at the end of the Second World War. Another thing that is quite important, is how India and the role of the Commonwealth were in the Second World War.
India contributed a very large number of people and a large amount of money. In lots of ways. Some involuntary recruits. Others had to be compelled. Whatever the reason, whatever the cause, a large number of people. What will be due to remember their role in the Second World War? We don't want to show any kind of discrimination. It is simply that it never occurred to us, partly, because we were in the business of reconstructing the world, partly in the business of remembering our own past, that we forgot what India and others contributed, but the fact remains, that we didn't play fair by them.
The world that was destroyed by the partition, and an enormous amount of bloodshed. We didn't think of it, and the result was for years and years, India and Commonwealth, their role went unrecognised. There is also something else that went unrecognised. The Second World War was supposed to be about giving freedom, creating democracy. And Robert Garvey ask, before Britain joined the war, to give India independence. The commitment was made. With the result, the Indian contribution to the Second World War was far more half-hearted.
I simply want to end by saying by analysing the consequences of the world walk, directly, and ask yourself, what are the lessons to learn from this? Not just immediate lessons, but long- just immediate lessons, but long- term lessons, that I being learned.
13:07
Baroness Hunt of Bethnal Green (Crossbench)
-
-
Baroness Hunt of Bethnal Green (Crossbench)
My Lords, it is a privilege to speak it today, because as Lord Shinkwin has preferred, had Hitler one, I doubt very much I would be here. Over the last five years, at This year, I worked with different parts of our Armed Forces and the Royal British Legion on matters relating to leadership and culture. As someone who was in the employ of these organisations, and is a former reservist, and perhaps overly cautious about the code of conduct, one never wants to be told off by the Baroness, I've avoided speaking on matters on the military.
But as my financial interest has ended, I feel I can speak more freely about the extraordinary institutions that strive to keep us safe. I hope that is acceptable. I want to take a moment to note my debt of gratitude to the noble Lord, Lord Etherton, for his work on behalf of LGBT, amongst his many other achievements. And express my profound condolences, to his husband. Lord Etherton will be missed. I also want to acknowledge the role my parents and grandparents played in the wars.
My great grandmother, was one of the first women to drive an ambience in the First World War, and was a suffragette. Her daughter, my maternal grandmother, a wren, my maternal father, served in Normandy, and returned, having been shot and limit all his life. My paternal grandfather, William Hunt, worked the docks in Barry, South Wales. And as Baroness Warwick of under Cliff has described, that was not a particularly easy role to play in the role. The commitment shown by my family and countless others.
Greater than themselves reveal the extraordinary sacrifice. And it is because of their service that our democracy continues to hold. As has been referred to already, we continue to face threats. Perhaps the world has always been volatile and uncertain, with multiple walls and multiple fronts require multiple responses and feel particular challenging. In many ways, warfare has not changed. In Ukraine, soldiers are still digging trenches. At the same time, our Armed Forces and allies must grapple with cyber threats, threats that are increasing at an exponential rate, that evolve, and mutate far faster than the Enigma code did.
There perhaps has always been any imbalance between resources available, but the demands we place on our Armed Forces feel greater than ever. I was struck by the comments from computer scientists this week, who suggested the Enigma code would now be cracked by AI in 13 minutes. No, of course, in 13 minutes, multiple Enigma Codes could also be created. This led me to recall a letter, sent by four government code and cyber school analysts, sent by Turing and Churchill in 1941 stop an extraordinary letter, held by the archives, is fascinating.
In it, the four authors explained they needed more staff. Women would be fine. And 20 women, to be exact, in the way that cryptology is so known to be, would be perfect. They could crack the Enigma code. Winston Churchill wrote on the letter " Make sure they have all they want on extreme priority and report to me that this has been done." My Lords, over the last 80 years, I suspect that generations of military leaders have made, if not exactly the same, a variation on this task.
More women, more hooks, more money. We need more if we are to do more. I am sure most have craved a handwritten instruction from a Prime Minister, to make sure they have all they want. The concert imbalance between resources, capability, and resources, capability, and commitments is not new. And I hope the strategic defence review, during the summer, will provide our Armed Forces more long-term certainty beyond parliamentary terms, about results. The clarity of the trade- offs we would like them to make, in utilising that resource, and the consequence of those trade-offs for consequence of those trade-offs for the UK.
We must never forget the sacrifices that were made eight sacrifices that were made eight years ago. And we must do all in our power to support our Armed Forces power to support our Armed Forces today to do what we ask them, to protect our democracy, and to keep the piece. I hope that as possible, my Lords. my Lords.
But as my financial interest has ended, I feel I can speak more freely about the extraordinary institutions that strive to keep us safe. I hope that is acceptable. I want to take a moment to note my debt of gratitude to the noble Lord, Lord Etherton, for his work on behalf of LGBT, amongst his many other achievements. And express my profound condolences, to his husband. Lord Etherton will be missed. I also want to acknowledge the role my parents and grandparents played in the wars.
My great grandmother, was one of the first women to drive an ambience in the First World War, and was a suffragette. Her daughter, my maternal grandmother, a wren, my maternal father, served in Normandy, and returned, having been shot and limit all his life. My paternal grandfather, William Hunt, worked the docks in Barry, South Wales. And as Baroness Warwick of under Cliff has described, that was not a particularly easy role to play in the role. The commitment shown by my family and countless others.
Greater than themselves reveal the extraordinary sacrifice. And it is because of their service that our democracy continues to hold. As has been referred to already, we continue to face threats. Perhaps the world has always been volatile and uncertain, with multiple walls and multiple fronts require multiple responses and feel particular challenging. In many ways, warfare has not changed. In Ukraine, soldiers are still digging trenches. At the same time, our Armed Forces and allies must grapple with cyber threats, threats that are increasing at an exponential rate, that evolve, and mutate far faster than the Enigma code did.
There perhaps has always been any imbalance between resources available, but the demands we place on our Armed Forces feel greater than ever. I was struck by the comments from computer scientists this week, who suggested the Enigma code would now be cracked by AI in 13 minutes. No, of course, in 13 minutes, multiple Enigma Codes could also be created. This led me to recall a letter, sent by four government code and cyber school analysts, sent by Turing and Churchill in 1941 stop an extraordinary letter, held by the archives, is fascinating.
In it, the four authors explained they needed more staff. Women would be fine. And 20 women, to be exact, in the way that cryptology is so known to be, would be perfect. They could crack the Enigma code. Winston Churchill wrote on the letter " Make sure they have all they want on extreme priority and report to me that this has been done." My Lords, over the last 80 years, I suspect that generations of military leaders have made, if not exactly the same, a variation on this task.
More women, more hooks, more money. We need more if we are to do more. I am sure most have craved a handwritten instruction from a Prime Minister, to make sure they have all they want. The concert imbalance between resources, capability, and resources, capability, and commitments is not new. And I hope the strategic defence review, during the summer, will provide our Armed Forces more long-term certainty beyond parliamentary terms, about results. The clarity of the trade- offs we would like them to make, in utilising that resource, and the consequence of those trade-offs for consequence of those trade-offs for the UK.
We must never forget the sacrifices that were made eight sacrifices that were made eight years ago. And we must do all in our power to support our Armed Forces power to support our Armed Forces today to do what we ask them, to protect our democracy, and to keep the piece. I hope that as possible, my Lords. my Lords.
13:12
Baroness Harris of Richmond (Liberal Democrat)
-
-
Baroness Harris of Richmond (Liberal Democrat)
My Lords, Baroness is taking part remotely, I invite Baroness Harris to speak. noble Lord, the minister, for his inspiring opening of this debate. Including also the excellent maiden speech from The Right Reverend Prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough. There have been many remarkable speeches today. In May 1944, I was six months old. I remember absolutely nothing of that momentous day. But the aftermath of that terrible war was imprinted on my memory a few short months later, when I was reunited with my father who had been away on what you do, soon after I was born.
I remember clearly his moustache and glasses and I howled when this large stranger in a scratchy brown uniform picked me up. My Lords, we didn't fight that dreadful war alone though. And we should never forget the significant contribution of the countries of the then Empire and Commonwealth fought alongside Great Britain from September 1939, when we stood alone, well before the arrival of the USSR, in mid-1941, and the USA, in late 1941. About 6 million men and women served in the Armed Forces of Great Britain.
Another 5 million, mostly volunteers, who lost over 39,000 personnel, Canada, who lost 42,000, India, who formed the largest volunteer army in the world, largest volunteer army in the world, 21 5 million. And who lost 80,000. Fighting in places like Burma, Italy, North Africa. New Zealand lost over 11,000. South Africa 11,900. As the colonies of West and East Africa, as well a Zimbabwe and Indonesia. Lost many thousands, as we have already heard. These countries, 11 million of them serving under the same flight, providing soldiers and airports in, who for, Germans, Italians, Japanese and French forces.
Included in that number, Cyprus, Poland, Norway, Denmark. Gurkhas from Nepal, London 32,000 of them, who were -- 130,000 of them, who were awarded bravery decorations as well. I and delighted to say they are still serving the Crown, in Catterick camp, near where I live, on this day. In all, some 15 million soldiers served in World War II. I also want to tell you about the RAF Regiment, in which I have the honour of being called a companion.
And I am indebted to the historian Doctor Nigel Warrick in his help in providing me with the history around World War II. Our airfields were continuously under attack and in early May, 1945, nine Regiment task groups pass through the armies for positions and moved, to occupy airfields up to the Danish border. 15 airfields were seen, and the regiment took a vendor, 50,000 German troops, along with numerous German troops, along with numerous commanders. By VE Day, there were 74 RAF regiments in north-west Europe.
On airfields, throughout the British occupied zone. They were in Germany, Denmark and Norway, making the surrender of many thousands of personnel. They were also located personnel. They were also located In Burma, RAF Regiment squadrons had moved forward with the victorious 14th Army in the advance to Rangoon. Winning their greatest battle of the defence of the airfield. The capture of which was the masterstroke of the campaign. As a force that had risen to 85,000 airmen in 1942, it had continually depleted by manpower demands from the army.
But the RAF Regiment had fault in all the major campaigns of the wall -- war and by 1945, had become the crucial component of the Royal Air Force. Thus ensuring regiments continuing existence. It protects the Royal Air Force and its aircraft and personnel to the present day, long may it continue to do so. We salute all the veterans who came through that terrible war, all the millions of civilians who helped infield, factories, in whatever way they could to help the war effort.
Today, we face the possibility of further war and we must prepare for it. But one thing is certain, it will be a very different battle to the one very different battle to the one fought in World War II. Will we ever learn the lessons of what makes the sustainable peace? sustainable peace?
I remember clearly his moustache and glasses and I howled when this large stranger in a scratchy brown uniform picked me up. My Lords, we didn't fight that dreadful war alone though. And we should never forget the significant contribution of the countries of the then Empire and Commonwealth fought alongside Great Britain from September 1939, when we stood alone, well before the arrival of the USSR, in mid-1941, and the USA, in late 1941. About 6 million men and women served in the Armed Forces of Great Britain.
Another 5 million, mostly volunteers, who lost over 39,000 personnel, Canada, who lost 42,000, India, who formed the largest volunteer army in the world, largest volunteer army in the world, 21 5 million. And who lost 80,000. Fighting in places like Burma, Italy, North Africa. New Zealand lost over 11,000. South Africa 11,900. As the colonies of West and East Africa, as well a Zimbabwe and Indonesia. Lost many thousands, as we have already heard. These countries, 11 million of them serving under the same flight, providing soldiers and airports in, who for, Germans, Italians, Japanese and French forces.
Included in that number, Cyprus, Poland, Norway, Denmark. Gurkhas from Nepal, London 32,000 of them, who were -- 130,000 of them, who were awarded bravery decorations as well. I and delighted to say they are still serving the Crown, in Catterick camp, near where I live, on this day. In all, some 15 million soldiers served in World War II. I also want to tell you about the RAF Regiment, in which I have the honour of being called a companion.
And I am indebted to the historian Doctor Nigel Warrick in his help in providing me with the history around World War II. Our airfields were continuously under attack and in early May, 1945, nine Regiment task groups pass through the armies for positions and moved, to occupy airfields up to the Danish border. 15 airfields were seen, and the regiment took a vendor, 50,000 German troops, along with numerous German troops, along with numerous commanders. By VE Day, there were 74 RAF regiments in north-west Europe.
On airfields, throughout the British occupied zone. They were in Germany, Denmark and Norway, making the surrender of many thousands of personnel. They were also located personnel. They were also located In Burma, RAF Regiment squadrons had moved forward with the victorious 14th Army in the advance to Rangoon. Winning their greatest battle of the defence of the airfield. The capture of which was the masterstroke of the campaign. As a force that had risen to 85,000 airmen in 1942, it had continually depleted by manpower demands from the army.
But the RAF Regiment had fault in all the major campaigns of the wall -- war and by 1945, had become the crucial component of the Royal Air Force. Thus ensuring regiments continuing existence. It protects the Royal Air Force and its aircraft and personnel to the present day, long may it continue to do so. We salute all the veterans who came through that terrible war, all the millions of civilians who helped infield, factories, in whatever way they could to help the war effort.
Today, we face the possibility of further war and we must prepare for it. But one thing is certain, it will be a very different battle to the one very different battle to the one fought in World War II. Will we ever learn the lessons of what makes the sustainable peace? sustainable peace?
13:18
Baroness Rafferty (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Rafferty (Labour)
It is an honour to speak on this important day and to follow the remarks of Baroness Harris of Richmond, who has already praised the many brilliant stories and speeches we have heard today. I would also like to add my congratulations to the right reverend Prelate, the Bishop of reverend Prelate, the Bishop of Peterborough, on an excellent Maiden speech. My mother, Bridget, trained as a nurse in the late 1930s and throughout the war her final assignment was nursing prisoners of war in Bridge of earn military hospital in Perthshire, in 1944.
I recall her talking of the horrific maggot infested wounds of the German prisoners of war, their shattered physical condition and her saying they were so young. One story that has stuck with me was an instance in which the rules of non-engagement were broken at Christmas. A group of carol singers were touring the wards to cheer and come -- comfort patients and staff in a candlelit procession. They were forbidden to enter the enemy wards but when they stopped outside the German ward, the doors were flung open and silence gave way to song, as the soldiers joined the chorus of Silent Night...
My father, Michael Rafferty, served in the Merchant Navy on the convoy ship so crucial to maintaining supply, communication cables and support for other services. I had the privilege of seeing the remnants of his ship in the war museum in Malta during a recent visit. The ship was part of operation pedestal, which set sail to save Malta from surrender. One of over 14 convoy ship supported by two battleships, three aircraft carriers, 13 two destroyers and seven submarines.
It was the largest convoy expedition and escort to date. And according to naval historians, it was also the most dangerous to that point in the war. Malta was strategically pivotal to the control of the Mediterranean and Suez Canal. The convoy was pounded by enemy fire, mines and air along the way. Paul Ciamis played a along the way. Paul Ciamis played a key role, as it was the convoy's flagship, as well as carrying critical supplies to beleaguered Malta. It was the first to reach the harbour whilst other ship sustained severe damage or was sunk.
It arrived relatively unscathed to cheering crowds. The mortality rate for merchant seamen was higher than all other services. My father never spoke about his experience but it is hard to imagine just how terrifying it must have been to have felt floating in a tin can, swimming in a hammock and listening to the constant clanging of the ship. A sitting duck, waiting for the worst to happen. My mother was also a member of the civil nursing reserve, set up in 1938 to boost capacity within the services the government became aware of the scale of the nursing shortage.
The UK entered the COVID-19 panic with no reserve capacity and tried to create some headroom with Ed temporary register. headroom with Ed temporary register. This generated another 20,000 nurses to provide a buffer zone to build search capacity. This temporary register closed in March 2024 but it is imperative that we learn the lessons of COVID in terms of building reserve capacity. My mother was also a member of the civil defence Corps after the war, which trained volunteers in community emergency preparedness.
The COVID inquiry, chaired by the Baroness Hallett concluded that preparedness for and resilience to a whole system civil emergency must be treated in much the same way as we treat a threat from a hostile state. Does my noble friend the Minister agree we must implement the COVID inquiry's recommendations within the UK and devolved governments to prepare for a whole system civil emergency? I urge members of your Lordships' House to reflect on the broader lessons of VE Day in securing our combined health and security needs
**** Possible New Speaker ****
for the future. Today we have heard many powerful
I recall her talking of the horrific maggot infested wounds of the German prisoners of war, their shattered physical condition and her saying they were so young. One story that has stuck with me was an instance in which the rules of non-engagement were broken at Christmas. A group of carol singers were touring the wards to cheer and come -- comfort patients and staff in a candlelit procession. They were forbidden to enter the enemy wards but when they stopped outside the German ward, the doors were flung open and silence gave way to song, as the soldiers joined the chorus of Silent Night...
My father, Michael Rafferty, served in the Merchant Navy on the convoy ship so crucial to maintaining supply, communication cables and support for other services. I had the privilege of seeing the remnants of his ship in the war museum in Malta during a recent visit. The ship was part of operation pedestal, which set sail to save Malta from surrender. One of over 14 convoy ship supported by two battleships, three aircraft carriers, 13 two destroyers and seven submarines.
It was the largest convoy expedition and escort to date. And according to naval historians, it was also the most dangerous to that point in the war. Malta was strategically pivotal to the control of the Mediterranean and Suez Canal. The convoy was pounded by enemy fire, mines and air along the way. Paul Ciamis played a along the way. Paul Ciamis played a key role, as it was the convoy's flagship, as well as carrying critical supplies to beleaguered Malta. It was the first to reach the harbour whilst other ship sustained severe damage or was sunk.
It arrived relatively unscathed to cheering crowds. The mortality rate for merchant seamen was higher than all other services. My father never spoke about his experience but it is hard to imagine just how terrifying it must have been to have felt floating in a tin can, swimming in a hammock and listening to the constant clanging of the ship. A sitting duck, waiting for the worst to happen. My mother was also a member of the civil nursing reserve, set up in 1938 to boost capacity within the services the government became aware of the scale of the nursing shortage.
The UK entered the COVID-19 panic with no reserve capacity and tried to create some headroom with Ed temporary register. headroom with Ed temporary register. This generated another 20,000 nurses to provide a buffer zone to build search capacity. This temporary register closed in March 2024 but it is imperative that we learn the lessons of COVID in terms of building reserve capacity. My mother was also a member of the civil defence Corps after the war, which trained volunteers in community emergency preparedness.
The COVID inquiry, chaired by the Baroness Hallett concluded that preparedness for and resilience to a whole system civil emergency must be treated in much the same way as we treat a threat from a hostile state. Does my noble friend the Minister agree we must implement the COVID inquiry's recommendations within the UK and devolved governments to prepare for a whole system civil emergency? I urge members of your Lordships' House to reflect on the broader lessons of VE Day in securing our combined health and security needs
**** Possible New Speaker ****
for the future. Today we have heard many powerful
13:23
Lord Sandhurst (Conservative)
-
-
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Today we have heard many powerful speeches, I congratulate the right reverend Prelate on her excellent Maiden speech and I commend the Maiden speech and I commend the noble Lord the Minister for his compelling outlook. I shall start with the example of my late father's war service. It shows just one example of how lucky we have been because of the courage and determination of those who served selflessly. He joined the Royal Air Force on fourth of September, 1939. It was his 19th birthday.
What followed marked his life forever. He never talked in detail about his experiences to us, his family, until the last few weeks of his life. He was a navigator... In April 1941, he joined 149 Squadron operating wellingtons out of Mildenhall. One notable operation included an attack in daylight on the battleships which were heavily defended in drydock in Brest. He said that the noise of the guns, some 8,000 feet, was deafening. In the next eight months or so, to December, he completed the 30 operations of his first tour.
But by then, his squadron had lost a total of two more crews than its nominal strength. Just think of that. Having miraculously survived at all, he was sent to train... He then later resumed operational duties as a Squadron bombing leader in Lancaster's, but he flew much less often, only when a crew needed a spare bomb a man. His operational duties continued to December, 1944. That year, he still had two bad experiences. Once they return shot up on only two engines.
Another time, the left undercarriage was shot to pieces, it collapsed on landing. His back was never the same that he counted himself a lucky man. In all he completed 43 operations. He was awarded the distinguished flying Cross. To put his experience in perspective, only a tiny percentage of those who started with him as bomber command..., signing up in 1939, survived. He told me frankly that each operation terrified him. At the end of the war he said he sometimes found it hard to cross a London Road, he cannot believe he was still alive.
He was a store ward attend of Squadron three reunions and annual memorial services. He was much involved in the RAF and bomber command Association activities. He never forgot those with whom he served. Nor must we. King forward, so I commend the plan to make it a criminal offence to climb our war memorials. -- Looking forward. Our society must understand and value what these represent. We must not forget our past or lose our resolve, we must educate the young.
Today we are, I fear, closer toward them for many years. -- Closer to war. This would bring greater loss of life and property, look at Ukraine, imagine if nuclear weapons came into play. So we need rapidly to increase the defence budget. That requires sacrifices and I remind this House that in 1955 to 56, after the end of the Korean War, 10 years after the world Wars, the UK still spent approximately seven % of its gross national product on defence. Deterrence is vital.
In the 1930s we failed to deter Hitler. The price of that terrible. We have to make attack of any sort are affordable to an aggressor. -- Are affordable. We must build our weaponry and our forces so they are capable of inflicting matching injury on any attacker. We need to build also several resilience. We must put resources into protecting vital undersea cables, our electricity, our IT and our other fundamental services. Last Monday in the Times, Oliver let be described our woeful and readiness.
The attacks on the Co-op, Harrods and others show how easy it is to damage vital IT. -- Oliver Letby. It took nearly 6 years of the awful World War, whose end we celebrate now, to obtain peace. We must now build conscious memories in society, we must rearm... We must build civilian resilience, we must not fritter what we have. I commend in particular the speech of the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Stirrup. We must always remember, we must act accordingly.
must act accordingly.
Lord Sandhurst (Conservative)
**** Possible New Speaker ****
Today we have heard many powerful speeches, I congratulate the right reverend Prelate on her excellent Maiden speech and I commend the Maiden speech and I commend the noble Lord the Minister for his compelling outlook. I shall start with the example of my late father's war service. It shows just one example of how lucky we have been because of the courage and determination of those who served selflessly. He joined the Royal Air Force on fourth of September, 1939. It was his 19th birthday.
What followed marked his life forever. He never talked in detail about his experiences to us, his family, until the last few weeks of his life. He was a navigator... In April 1941, he joined 149 Squadron operating wellingtons out of Mildenhall. One notable operation included an attack in daylight on the battleships which were heavily defended in drydock in Brest. He said that the noise of the guns, some 8,000 feet, was deafening. In the next eight months or so, to December, he completed the 30 operations of his first tour.
But by then, his squadron had lost a total of two more crews than its nominal strength. Just think of that. Having miraculously survived at all, he was sent to train... He then later resumed operational duties as a Squadron bombing leader in Lancaster's, but he flew much less often, only when a crew needed a spare bomb a man. His operational duties continued to December, 1944. That year, he still had two bad experiences. Once they return shot up on only two engines.
Another time, the left undercarriage was shot to pieces, it collapsed on landing. His back was never the same that he counted himself a lucky man. In all he completed 43 operations. He was awarded the distinguished flying Cross. To put his experience in perspective, only a tiny percentage of those who started with him as bomber command..., signing up in 1939, survived. He told me frankly that each operation terrified him. At the end of the war he said he sometimes found it hard to cross a London Road, he cannot believe he was still alive.
He was a store ward attend of Squadron three reunions and annual memorial services. He was much involved in the RAF and bomber command Association activities. He never forgot those with whom he served. Nor must we. King forward, so I commend the plan to make it a criminal offence to climb our war memorials. -- Looking forward. Our society must understand and value what these represent. We must not forget our past or lose our resolve, we must educate the young.
Today we are, I fear, closer toward them for many years. -- Closer to war. This would bring greater loss of life and property, look at Ukraine, imagine if nuclear weapons came into play. So we need rapidly to increase the defence budget. That requires sacrifices and I remind this House that in 1955 to 56, after the end of the Korean War, 10 years after the world Wars, the UK still spent approximately seven % of its gross national product on defence. Deterrence is vital.
In the 1930s we failed to deter Hitler. The price of that terrible. We have to make attack of any sort are affordable to an aggressor. -- Are affordable. We must build our weaponry and our forces so they are capable of inflicting matching injury on any attacker. We need to build also several resilience. We must put resources into protecting vital undersea cables, our electricity, our IT and our other fundamental services. Last Monday in the Times, Oliver let be described our woeful and readiness.
The attacks on the Co-op, Harrods and others show how easy it is to damage vital IT. -- Oliver Letby. It took nearly 6 years of the awful World War, whose end we celebrate now, to obtain peace. We must now build conscious memories in society, we must rearm... We must build civilian resilience, we must not fritter what we have. I commend in particular the speech of the noble and gallant Lord, Lord Stirrup. We must always remember, we must act accordingly.
must act accordingly.
13:29
Lord Berkeley (Labour)
-
-
Lord Berkeley (Labour)
We have had an interesting series of days commemorating World War II and 60 years are, in your Lordships' House we had wonderful tributes from many people about their experiences. -- 60 years on. It is interesting that in many other countries mark the event with a more commemorative and glorification process about the peace because peace of course is not assured, as many noble Lords have said. And recognising that war now affects whole populations, whatever the outcome, as the noble Lord the outcome, as the noble Lord Ricketts said, many in Europe had to wait 45 years after the end of the Second World War before they got any liberation at all, basically.
We tend to think that we were always on the right side of the good but the track record, I am afraid is not entirely perfect. My grandfather fought in the ball war, very long time ago. I don't think he was involved in the concentration camps but we did invent concentration camps in South Africa. -- Boer war. Where men, women and children were locked in tented accommodation with very little food and water and sanitation and barely no hope of when they might be able to escape.
They were a civilian population whose properties had been scorched to, by the general Lord... Where It is interesting only one person was brave enough to challenge these accounts, Emilie, from Devon, Cornwall, and she challenged the government to provide food, clothing, anything like that. She was ostracised by the government, nearly locked up. Kitchener refused to see her in South Africa, because she was a woman, that is an interesting way of looking at things.
But hundreds of thousands of women and children were incarcerated, no crime except for being on the wrong side. And this being on the wrong side. And this woman at the end of the war, contributed to a very large memorial, you can see it on the web, to commemorate 28,000 women and children, who died in these camps. Plus, of course, all the people who managed to get out the end. And there seemed to be no leadership understanding here of what was going on.
Now, of course, my Lords, I am not saying that our invention, if that is what it is, of concentration camps being copied from the two world wars, of course, the German example is a million times worse, but it is time that we learned lessons from things like this. As my noble friend, Baroness Amos said, education on these things for all. I think we should follow the example think we should follow the example think we should follow the example of Emilie, and put a much greater emphasis on trying to bring peace, rather than death on the battlefield.
In the case of South Africa, death after a scorched earth policy. There is a few scorched earths going on in Ukraine at the moment, but it is still happening in the world, as many noble Lords have said. Africa, Ukraine, Gaza, we must remember that our success and failures and in an open and inclusive manner, to educate people across the world, as other noble Lords have said, the transfer of movement of students and young people, between different parts of Europe, and different parts of the world, will help the understanding, and our understanding, as the Bishop of Nottingham said, so I hope the movement of students and everyone else will be part of an education process, to understand what we have done in the past.
Mostly very well done, but occasionally, some serious lapses, which tend to get shoved under the carpet, when we should
**** Possible New Speaker ****
actually recognise them as well. My Lords, may I join many others in complementing firstly, the noble Lord Coaker one really inspiring opening speech to this debate. And opening speech to this debate. And my also complemented The Right Reverend Prelate, Bishop of Reverend Prelate, Bishop of Peterborough, for her speech. I was particularly encouraged by her focus
We tend to think that we were always on the right side of the good but the track record, I am afraid is not entirely perfect. My grandfather fought in the ball war, very long time ago. I don't think he was involved in the concentration camps but we did invent concentration camps in South Africa. -- Boer war. Where men, women and children were locked in tented accommodation with very little food and water and sanitation and barely no hope of when they might be able to escape.
They were a civilian population whose properties had been scorched to, by the general Lord... Where It is interesting only one person was brave enough to challenge these accounts, Emilie, from Devon, Cornwall, and she challenged the government to provide food, clothing, anything like that. She was ostracised by the government, nearly locked up. Kitchener refused to see her in South Africa, because she was a woman, that is an interesting way of looking at things.
But hundreds of thousands of women and children were incarcerated, no crime except for being on the wrong side. And this being on the wrong side. And this woman at the end of the war, contributed to a very large memorial, you can see it on the web, to commemorate 28,000 women and children, who died in these camps. Plus, of course, all the people who managed to get out the end. And there seemed to be no leadership understanding here of what was going on.
Now, of course, my Lords, I am not saying that our invention, if that is what it is, of concentration camps being copied from the two world wars, of course, the German example is a million times worse, but it is time that we learned lessons from things like this. As my noble friend, Baroness Amos said, education on these things for all. I think we should follow the example think we should follow the example think we should follow the example of Emilie, and put a much greater emphasis on trying to bring peace, rather than death on the battlefield.
In the case of South Africa, death after a scorched earth policy. There is a few scorched earths going on in Ukraine at the moment, but it is still happening in the world, as many noble Lords have said. Africa, Ukraine, Gaza, we must remember that our success and failures and in an open and inclusive manner, to educate people across the world, as other noble Lords have said, the transfer of movement of students and young people, between different parts of Europe, and different parts of the world, will help the understanding, and our understanding, as the Bishop of Nottingham said, so I hope the movement of students and everyone else will be part of an education process, to understand what we have done in the past.
Mostly very well done, but occasionally, some serious lapses, which tend to get shoved under the carpet, when we should
**** Possible New Speaker ****
actually recognise them as well. My Lords, may I join many others in complementing firstly, the noble Lord Coaker one really inspiring opening speech to this debate. And opening speech to this debate. And my also complemented The Right Reverend Prelate, Bishop of Reverend Prelate, Bishop of Peterborough, for her speech. I was particularly encouraged by her focus
13:34
Lord Farmer (Conservative)
-
-
Lord Farmer (Conservative)
particularly encouraged by her focus on families, which is dear to my fart. My Lords, these victories in Europe and the Far East were primarily over wicked, dangerous, and anti-human ideas. John Maynard Keynes said ideas of economists and political philosophers, both when they are right and when they are wrong, or more powerful than is commonly understood. Indeed, the world is ruled by little else. Ideologies that took over Germany, and Japan, justified the complete domination of their regions.
German territorial expansion into central and eastern Europe and Japanese subjugation of East Asia. Such coercive ideologies undermine human coercive ideologies undermine human flourishing elite of the killing, at worst, or silencing, at best, vast swathes of populations. Most recently, trans ideology came close to doing the latter, ideologies victims just don't fit with the program, frequently because of immutable characteristics, such as those born Jews in Nazi Germany. They simply do not and cannot see the world through the ideological lens imposed on them.
Hence, freedom of thought and expression are such precious values. Yet, there is a deeply human need for absolutes uncertainties, which post-modern relativism has barely dented. Mathematician and philosopher, Professor John Lennon X, exposes the self-contradiction at the heart of post-modernism. It expects us to accept, as absolute truth, that there are no absolute truths. New atheists proclaiming atheism's truth and denying God defy post-modernism. Juergen, an earlier atheist, voice dangers of the shift, from our modern basis to the postmortem.
He said, Universalist Eagle at Arianism, from which sprang the ideals of freedom, and a collective life and solidarity, the autonomous conduct of life and emancipation, the individual morality of conscious, human rights, and democracy, is the direct legacy of the Judaic ethic of justice and the Christian ethic of love. So, this day, there is no alternative to it. We continue to draw on the substance of this heritage. Everything else is just idle post-modern talk. Now, new atheists, like Richard Dawkins, jettisoned what he refers to as cultural Christianity.
Something the post-war West has come perilously close to doing, means the flowering is reeled off by Habermas will lose their roots and without. That said, we have lived through 80 years of the greatest advances in the history of the world. From a technological, scientific and health perspective, no previous 80 years have ever been better to live in, so the sacrifice of those who secured the victories in Europe and Japan, have been worth it. But we cannot rest on their laurels. The survival of any world order cannot be guaranteed, and threats abound.
I see 4Ds, of decline and decay surrounding us, such as the towering levels of debt, shopper politics encourages governments lavishly, and is egged on by consumerism. Many generations are in a bind, ageing populations are not in place by -- Replaced by new births, as the extent of old age loneliness reveals. It is socially acceptable to say that one is too selfish to have children. And other forms of decadence are reinforced. Popular culture tells us to live in the moment, to avoid sacrifice, self-denial, service.
Finally, concerns over, for example, historical slavery, sharply divided over whether Western civilisation is even worth defending or upholding. Yet, the motivation to care about, speak up for, and protest over the week, the vulnerable, and those who have not, often at great personal cost, flows per Habermas, from our Judaeo-Christian foundations. The Roman Empire, in which Jesus Christ was born, was not also inclined. Our freedom to pursue those ends was bought for us, by those willing to stand against vicious authoritarian regimes.
To think then was not inevitable, neither is the client now. YouGov polling on the Bible Society's report, found an increase in church attendance across all ages, with the most dramatic church growth among young men. Now, more than one in five are attending church, at least monthly, ditto almost one in two black people, young black people, aged 18-34. Perhaps those Judeo Christian foundations of justice and love, which proved so effective in beating back the dark ideologies of the Second World War, are surfacing again for supper new generation is discovering --.
A new generation is discovering that meeting with our make each other, in solidarity, lies the wellspring of meaning of the essence for what it means to be human.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
It is right that we undertake this debate to pay tribute to those this debate to pay tribute to those who defend our freedoms in the first and Second World War is. We must and Second World War is. We must remember and honour them and use this day to commemorate the 80th this day to commemorate the 80th anniversary of VE Day. And shortly, anniversary of VE Day. And shortly, on 14 August, VJ Day. We have heard on 14 August, VJ Day.
We have heard some magnificent speeches, all of whom have been of a high quality. Much is the people relaying their personal experiences, many of which have been moving. I was there, less have been moving. I was there, less than a year old, I was not aware of it at the time. And subsequently, my parents never really talked about parents never really talked about the war. That is the experience that a number of noble Lords have a number of noble Lords have mentioned.
The point I want to make in the context of this debate, and has already been made by my noble friends, Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe, and Lord Anderson of Swansea, is that this was a total war. Everyone was involved. Total war. Everyone was involved. Total
German territorial expansion into central and eastern Europe and Japanese subjugation of East Asia. Such coercive ideologies undermine human coercive ideologies undermine human flourishing elite of the killing, at worst, or silencing, at best, vast swathes of populations. Most recently, trans ideology came close to doing the latter, ideologies victims just don't fit with the program, frequently because of immutable characteristics, such as those born Jews in Nazi Germany. They simply do not and cannot see the world through the ideological lens imposed on them.
Hence, freedom of thought and expression are such precious values. Yet, there is a deeply human need for absolutes uncertainties, which post-modern relativism has barely dented. Mathematician and philosopher, Professor John Lennon X, exposes the self-contradiction at the heart of post-modernism. It expects us to accept, as absolute truth, that there are no absolute truths. New atheists proclaiming atheism's truth and denying God defy post-modernism. Juergen, an earlier atheist, voice dangers of the shift, from our modern basis to the postmortem.
He said, Universalist Eagle at Arianism, from which sprang the ideals of freedom, and a collective life and solidarity, the autonomous conduct of life and emancipation, the individual morality of conscious, human rights, and democracy, is the direct legacy of the Judaic ethic of justice and the Christian ethic of love. So, this day, there is no alternative to it. We continue to draw on the substance of this heritage. Everything else is just idle post-modern talk. Now, new atheists, like Richard Dawkins, jettisoned what he refers to as cultural Christianity.
Something the post-war West has come perilously close to doing, means the flowering is reeled off by Habermas will lose their roots and without. That said, we have lived through 80 years of the greatest advances in the history of the world. From a technological, scientific and health perspective, no previous 80 years have ever been better to live in, so the sacrifice of those who secured the victories in Europe and Japan, have been worth it. But we cannot rest on their laurels. The survival of any world order cannot be guaranteed, and threats abound.
I see 4Ds, of decline and decay surrounding us, such as the towering levels of debt, shopper politics encourages governments lavishly, and is egged on by consumerism. Many generations are in a bind, ageing populations are not in place by -- Replaced by new births, as the extent of old age loneliness reveals. It is socially acceptable to say that one is too selfish to have children. And other forms of decadence are reinforced. Popular culture tells us to live in the moment, to avoid sacrifice, self-denial, service.
Finally, concerns over, for example, historical slavery, sharply divided over whether Western civilisation is even worth defending or upholding. Yet, the motivation to care about, speak up for, and protest over the week, the vulnerable, and those who have not, often at great personal cost, flows per Habermas, from our Judaeo-Christian foundations. The Roman Empire, in which Jesus Christ was born, was not also inclined. Our freedom to pursue those ends was bought for us, by those willing to stand against vicious authoritarian regimes.
To think then was not inevitable, neither is the client now. YouGov polling on the Bible Society's report, found an increase in church attendance across all ages, with the most dramatic church growth among young men. Now, more than one in five are attending church, at least monthly, ditto almost one in two black people, young black people, aged 18-34. Perhaps those Judeo Christian foundations of justice and love, which proved so effective in beating back the dark ideologies of the Second World War, are surfacing again for supper new generation is discovering --.
A new generation is discovering that meeting with our make each other, in solidarity, lies the wellspring of meaning of the essence for what it means to be human.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
It is right that we undertake this debate to pay tribute to those this debate to pay tribute to those who defend our freedoms in the first and Second World War is. We must and Second World War is. We must remember and honour them and use this day to commemorate the 80th this day to commemorate the 80th anniversary of VE Day. And shortly, anniversary of VE Day. And shortly, on 14 August, VJ Day. We have heard on 14 August, VJ Day.
We have heard some magnificent speeches, all of whom have been of a high quality. Much is the people relaying their personal experiences, many of which have been moving. I was there, less have been moving. I was there, less than a year old, I was not aware of it at the time. And subsequently, my parents never really talked about parents never really talked about the war. That is the experience that a number of noble Lords have a number of noble Lords have mentioned.
The point I want to make in the context of this debate, and has already been made by my noble friends, Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe, and Lord Anderson of Swansea, is that this was a total war. Everyone was involved. Total war. Everyone was involved. Total
13:42
Lord Davies of Brixton (Labour)
-
-
Lord Davies of Brixton (Labour)
war refers to a type of warfare, in which a country mobilises all its resources. Economic, industrial, civilian, and military, for the purpose of defeating an enemy. In total war, the distinction between total war, the distinction between civilian and military targets has blurred. And the entire societies blurred. And the entire societies blurred. And the entire societies involved in the war effort. In World War II, the concept of total war was fully realised in the United fully realised in the United Kingdom.
There was a mobilisation of the entire population in the war the entire population in the war effort. Now, this is not to downplay effort. Now, this is not to downplay the exceptional bravery of those in the military front line. But in the Second World War, all of us were in a real sense in the frontline. On a real sense in the frontline. On the homefront. Here, in the United the homefront. Here, in the United Kingdom, we can script millions of soldiers, but we also mobilise civilians to work in factories, grow food, and support the effort.
I thank my noble friend for mentioning the boys conscripted to work in the mines, the women directed to work in the women's land Army. We must always remember that civilians were targeted and the cities were bombed deliberately to destroy morale and infrastructure. I am not seeking here to express any judgement, but in the war, of course, there was the bombing of London, the Blitz, but also Dresden, and the historic bombings of heresy and Negus Aki, to make the -- Nagasaki, to make the point that in that war, we were all involved.
Shortly before I was born, we were under attack from V1 and V2 rockets, and I was evacuated with my mother to Wales, out of their reach. 1/3 aspect of total war was that there was industrial and economic control. Governments took control of production. And for example, here in Britain, we introduced widespread rationing of food and goods. Total war in World War II meant that every aspect of society was directed towards achieving victory no matter the cost. Everyone was fighting, those in the forces, those on the home front, were fighting for victory.
We achieved victory, and I think the biggest achievement, in Western Europe, has been the absence of any significant war in Western Europe in the last 80 years, compared to the 80 years before that, when there were at least six major wars. This has been a massive change in the massive victory of the settlement that was reached after the Second World War.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I too want to congratulate the noble prelate of congratulate the noble prelate of Peterborough, for her marvellous speech, especially as it focused on speech, especially as it focused on children. I also want to thank the noble Lord, the Minister, Lord noble Lord, the Minister, Lord Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As the opening batsmen, not out. On VE and VJ Day, I was a child, not yet conceived.
But when I was five years conceived. But when I was five years He sat me down and told me that me He sat me down and told me that me and my other uncle were members of
There was a mobilisation of the entire population in the war the entire population in the war effort. Now, this is not to downplay effort. Now, this is not to downplay the exceptional bravery of those in the military front line. But in the Second World War, all of us were in a real sense in the frontline. On a real sense in the frontline. On the homefront. Here, in the United the homefront. Here, in the United Kingdom, we can script millions of soldiers, but we also mobilise civilians to work in factories, grow food, and support the effort.
I thank my noble friend for mentioning the boys conscripted to work in the mines, the women directed to work in the women's land Army. We must always remember that civilians were targeted and the cities were bombed deliberately to destroy morale and infrastructure. I am not seeking here to express any judgement, but in the war, of course, there was the bombing of London, the Blitz, but also Dresden, and the historic bombings of heresy and Negus Aki, to make the -- Nagasaki, to make the point that in that war, we were all involved.
Shortly before I was born, we were under attack from V1 and V2 rockets, and I was evacuated with my mother to Wales, out of their reach. 1/3 aspect of total war was that there was industrial and economic control. Governments took control of production. And for example, here in Britain, we introduced widespread rationing of food and goods. Total war in World War II meant that every aspect of society was directed towards achieving victory no matter the cost. Everyone was fighting, those in the forces, those on the home front, were fighting for victory.
We achieved victory, and I think the biggest achievement, in Western Europe, has been the absence of any significant war in Western Europe in the last 80 years, compared to the 80 years before that, when there were at least six major wars. This has been a massive change in the massive victory of the settlement that was reached after the Second World War.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, I too want to congratulate the noble prelate of congratulate the noble prelate of Peterborough, for her marvellous speech, especially as it focused on speech, especially as it focused on children. I also want to thank the noble Lord, the Minister, Lord noble Lord, the Minister, Lord Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As Coaker, his wide-ranging speech. As the opening batsmen, not out. On VE and VJ Day, I was a child, not yet conceived.
But when I was five years conceived. But when I was five years He sat me down and told me that me He sat me down and told me that me and my other uncle were members of
13:46
Lord Sentamu (Crossbench)
-
-
Lord Sentamu (Crossbench)
the African kings rifles. East African command. They went to war, African command. They went to war, to then Burma, in a company from Kenya, Uganda and... They joined other companies from the rest of colonial Africa. He abruptly walked away but I did not move. He returned about an hour later and continued. Your uncle called Fred was shot in a fierce battle. We buried him in a grave in Burma. It took a very long time to get all of us who were not killed back to our different barracks.
The images of the fierce battle in which your uncle Fred was killed still haunts me. I get nightmares, which are terrifying. He got up and went for a long walk in the family banana groves, which were excessive, 17 acres in total. My mum told me that my Uncle Sam is not well, he has never been violent but his thought patterns often get jumbled up and he cannot focus on one thing. The sure conversation he just had with you is the best we have ever heard since he returned.
He takes some medicine on a daily basis, when he does not, he is really sad and needs keeping our eyes on him. He lives 40 miles away with your auntie and it is terrifying when he was missing for periods of time. The war in Burma knocked a big chunk of his memory out. Well, I will stop there, instead of telling more of the facts of the war in Burma on my Uncle Sam. We know now of course the country was not called Burma that Myanmar.
-- But Myanmar. But the British could not get their tongue around Myanmar. What still surprises me though is the theory of the colonial office to a wrecked memorials in all the African countries for the veterans of the African kings rifles. As we heard from the noble Lord was telling, the best memorial is always local because it teaches pupils lessons, not from a long distance. It is indeed right of course and proper for us to celebrate 80 years of war and the victory that came with it.
As we celebrate, let as he clearly a message -- let to us here clearly and message are message entitled the futility of war and the way in which Jacqueline do pray played it makes that message loud and clear. Lord Berkeley of course knows that I'm a very proud owner of a personalised very proud owner of a personalised signed copy of her album. My Lords, respond to violence by more violence increases darkness and a nights and devoid of stars.
May we all be instruments of peace and justice, lovers of peace. Because our world desperately needs this. The men and women we remember today did not die in vain. Their memory is calling us to hold the torch of peace. Their blood cries to us for peace and for justice. Let us do it and let us do it now.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I stand to take part in this debate as one of the few, but not debate as one of the few, but not the only ones because my good friend, Lord Dubs was 12 years old friend, Lord Dubs was 12 years old in May 1945 and I was only seven years old. But I was old enough to years old. But I was old enough to remember the VE Day and the subsequent VJ Day. I particularly remember the wartime conditions that remember the wartime conditions that had been part of my life right up to had been part of my life right up to VE Day.
The blackout requirements. Every house had to have a blackout Every house had to have a blackout curtains to prevent at night the exposure of light to enemy aircraft passing above. Similarly, every passing above. Similarly, every train had to have back outlines and when you arrived at the station, you when you arrived at the station, you are not permitted to exit the train are not permitted to exit the train and open the door until you heard one of the porters shouting the name of that station and if it is the Crypstation, it was only then you are permitted to leave the train.
-- Blackout blinds. I have one memory of particular significance, that I was in the House, in our house with my younger brother who was about three years old, I would have been about five or six, and my mother was taking my grandmother to the bus for her to go home. She seemed to be taking an awful long time so I flung open the door, let a good light shine into the driveway and up the driveway came not my mother but a policeman.
I was terrified, I thought I was going to be sent to prison. And it was therefore with great relief that my mother arrived and I managed to escape imprisonment. It was my mother who told me that the war was over. This did not mean much to me, bombing had ceased and the fine bombs known as
The images of the fierce battle in which your uncle Fred was killed still haunts me. I get nightmares, which are terrifying. He got up and went for a long walk in the family banana groves, which were excessive, 17 acres in total. My mum told me that my Uncle Sam is not well, he has never been violent but his thought patterns often get jumbled up and he cannot focus on one thing. The sure conversation he just had with you is the best we have ever heard since he returned.
He takes some medicine on a daily basis, when he does not, he is really sad and needs keeping our eyes on him. He lives 40 miles away with your auntie and it is terrifying when he was missing for periods of time. The war in Burma knocked a big chunk of his memory out. Well, I will stop there, instead of telling more of the facts of the war in Burma on my Uncle Sam. We know now of course the country was not called Burma that Myanmar.
-- But Myanmar. But the British could not get their tongue around Myanmar. What still surprises me though is the theory of the colonial office to a wrecked memorials in all the African countries for the veterans of the African kings rifles. As we heard from the noble Lord was telling, the best memorial is always local because it teaches pupils lessons, not from a long distance. It is indeed right of course and proper for us to celebrate 80 years of war and the victory that came with it.
As we celebrate, let as he clearly a message -- let to us here clearly and message are message entitled the futility of war and the way in which Jacqueline do pray played it makes that message loud and clear. Lord Berkeley of course knows that I'm a very proud owner of a personalised very proud owner of a personalised signed copy of her album. My Lords, respond to violence by more violence increases darkness and a nights and devoid of stars.
May we all be instruments of peace and justice, lovers of peace. Because our world desperately needs this. The men and women we remember today did not die in vain. Their memory is calling us to hold the torch of peace. Their blood cries to us for peace and for justice. Let us do it and let us do it now.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
I stand to take part in this debate as one of the few, but not debate as one of the few, but not the only ones because my good friend, Lord Dubs was 12 years old friend, Lord Dubs was 12 years old in May 1945 and I was only seven years old. But I was old enough to years old. But I was old enough to remember the VE Day and the subsequent VJ Day. I particularly remember the wartime conditions that remember the wartime conditions that had been part of my life right up to had been part of my life right up to VE Day.
The blackout requirements. Every house had to have a blackout Every house had to have a blackout curtains to prevent at night the exposure of light to enemy aircraft passing above. Similarly, every passing above. Similarly, every train had to have back outlines and when you arrived at the station, you when you arrived at the station, you are not permitted to exit the train are not permitted to exit the train and open the door until you heard one of the porters shouting the name of that station and if it is the Crypstation, it was only then you are permitted to leave the train.
-- Blackout blinds. I have one memory of particular significance, that I was in the House, in our house with my younger brother who was about three years old, I would have been about five or six, and my mother was taking my grandmother to the bus for her to go home. She seemed to be taking an awful long time so I flung open the door, let a good light shine into the driveway and up the driveway came not my mother but a policeman.
I was terrified, I thought I was going to be sent to prison. And it was therefore with great relief that my mother arrived and I managed to escape imprisonment. It was my mother who told me that the war was over. This did not mean much to me, bombing had ceased and the fine bombs known as
13:53
Lord Hacking (Labour)
-
-
Lord Hacking (Labour)
doodle bugs were almost ceasing. This feeling, the feeling then in This feeling, the feeling then in the country was not of great jubilation and festivity, as in jubilation and festivity, as in London and other towns, but a sense of great really. Most poignant memory was the return of the fathers memory was the return of the fathers fighting in the war. -- Of great relief. Several friends of mine had lost their fathers in the war and I remembered one day, around VE Day, remembered one day, around VE Day, that this friend was weeping and was weeping because his father was not weeping because his father was not coming home.
My most did memory was of the Victory Parade on 8 June, 1945. Marching soldiers, armoured 1945. Marching soldiers, armoured vehicles, tanks all came by, not only from the British forces but only from the British forces but also from our allies. It was General also from our allies. It was General Montgomery's heyday. He was wearing his beret, made famous in the Army in North Africa... Enjoyed taking part in that Victory Parade. It was most touching yesterday to see Members of this House returning from Westminster with a row of medals, one of them was actually, he was unfortunately not in the chamber at this moment.
And I indeed saw an admiral in full uniform yesterday in the House. I leave my friends to identify this... And my Lords, I did wonder, therefore, whether this debate was relevant today. All of those who have served in the forces, in World War II, must be over 100 years old now and indeed, I think I have only had the mention of one soldier who is still alive. So my soldier who is still alive. So my concern in part, in case I repeat, was this debate going to be relevant? But after the fine speeches of my noble friend Lord Coaker, of Lord Wallace of Saltaire, I'm glad to get his attention now, and above all, the speech by the noble and gallant Lords loan -- Lord Low has changed that, this debate is relevant and idols every word of those speakers and other speakers those speakers and other speakers who have made this relevant.
who have made this relevant.
My most did memory was of the Victory Parade on 8 June, 1945. Marching soldiers, armoured 1945. Marching soldiers, armoured vehicles, tanks all came by, not only from the British forces but only from the British forces but also from our allies. It was General also from our allies. It was General Montgomery's heyday. He was wearing his beret, made famous in the Army in North Africa... Enjoyed taking part in that Victory Parade. It was most touching yesterday to see Members of this House returning from Westminster with a row of medals, one of them was actually, he was unfortunately not in the chamber at this moment.
And I indeed saw an admiral in full uniform yesterday in the House. I leave my friends to identify this... And my Lords, I did wonder, therefore, whether this debate was relevant today. All of those who have served in the forces, in World War II, must be over 100 years old now and indeed, I think I have only had the mention of one soldier who is still alive. So my soldier who is still alive. So my concern in part, in case I repeat, was this debate going to be relevant? But after the fine speeches of my noble friend Lord Coaker, of Lord Wallace of Saltaire, I'm glad to get his attention now, and above all, the speech by the noble and gallant Lords loan -- Lord Low has changed that, this debate is relevant and idols every word of those speakers and other speakers those speakers and other speakers who have made this relevant.
who have made this relevant.
13:55
Baroness Kingsmill (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Kingsmill (Labour)
Yesterday we celebrated VE Day with a fly past, parades and parties. It was a happy time, a reflection of the relief and joy that was felt at the end of the long and terrible war. A war which reshape the world, touch nearly every family across the UK and beyond. We have heard many wonderful stories today of people's memories, other experiences of their fathers, their grandfathers and others. For me, as for other... As for many other noble colleagues, it was also personal.
My father came from New Zealand to serve in the Royal Air Force. He flew missions in liberators at very low altitudes, hunting enemy submarines, to protect the convoys that kept Britain supplied during the darkest days of the war. I like to think that possibly it was protecting a convoy that the father of Baroness Rafferty's father sailed on it, it would be a nice connection. He also met and married my mother, a young woman from the Welsh valleys, who spent much of the war years working in a munitions factory.
In many ways they were representative of a commitment of the Commonwealth countries and of women to the war effort. We remember the sacrifice of the Anzacs recently, on 25 April. There were many Australian and New Zealand servicemen fighting on behalf of the UK and the rest of Europe at the time. And I would also point out that my grandfather fought on behalf of the UK at Gallipoli and was injured there. So we have a history in the family of Commonwealth support for the European wars.
Like so many others have mentioned, my parents spoke very little about what happened. But very little about what happened. But we know, we know and we have learned what it cost and we know what it means. Victory came at an enormous price. Millions died, families were broken, Europe was left in ruins. Yet out this devastation came a determination to prevent such a war happening again. We need to remember the role of our allies, particularly the United States. Though initially they were reluctant to enter the war, they became a decisive and committed partner in the fight against tyranny.
Out of that cooperation NATO was born. A shared commitment among democratic nations to stand together in defence of peace and security. NATO has been a cornerstone of European stability ever since. Its member states united by common values, continue to play an essential role in deterring aggression and upholding international law. I am pleased to be part of that... Of the British contribution to NATO. We are now, however, reminded that such peace cannot be taken for granted. The war in Ukraine is a stark and painful warning.
Once again people are fighting and dying in Europe. Once again a sovereign country is resisting an aggressor. We cannot be complacent. Europe may be actually on the brink of war again. Maybe it already is at war. Maybe in a different form. The cyber-attacks that have been taking place across Europe are maybe the modern equivalent of bombs. Our Armed Forces in the UK and across our alliances continue to play a vital role in defending our values and supporting peace and stability.
We owe them not only our thanks but our full and active support. We need to increase their numbers. The past holds powerful lessons and one of the clearest is this, peace is not the absence of war, it is something we need to build and protect and uphold day by day, generation by generation. We honour those who fought by living up to the world they hoped to create. Thank you.
My father came from New Zealand to serve in the Royal Air Force. He flew missions in liberators at very low altitudes, hunting enemy submarines, to protect the convoys that kept Britain supplied during the darkest days of the war. I like to think that possibly it was protecting a convoy that the father of Baroness Rafferty's father sailed on it, it would be a nice connection. He also met and married my mother, a young woman from the Welsh valleys, who spent much of the war years working in a munitions factory.
In many ways they were representative of a commitment of the Commonwealth countries and of women to the war effort. We remember the sacrifice of the Anzacs recently, on 25 April. There were many Australian and New Zealand servicemen fighting on behalf of the UK and the rest of Europe at the time. And I would also point out that my grandfather fought on behalf of the UK at Gallipoli and was injured there. So we have a history in the family of Commonwealth support for the European wars.
Like so many others have mentioned, my parents spoke very little about what happened. But very little about what happened. But we know, we know and we have learned what it cost and we know what it means. Victory came at an enormous price. Millions died, families were broken, Europe was left in ruins. Yet out this devastation came a determination to prevent such a war happening again. We need to remember the role of our allies, particularly the United States. Though initially they were reluctant to enter the war, they became a decisive and committed partner in the fight against tyranny.
Out of that cooperation NATO was born. A shared commitment among democratic nations to stand together in defence of peace and security. NATO has been a cornerstone of European stability ever since. Its member states united by common values, continue to play an essential role in deterring aggression and upholding international law. I am pleased to be part of that... Of the British contribution to NATO. We are now, however, reminded that such peace cannot be taken for granted. The war in Ukraine is a stark and painful warning.
Once again people are fighting and dying in Europe. Once again a sovereign country is resisting an aggressor. We cannot be complacent. Europe may be actually on the brink of war again. Maybe it already is at war. Maybe in a different form. The cyber-attacks that have been taking place across Europe are maybe the modern equivalent of bombs. Our Armed Forces in the UK and across our alliances continue to play a vital role in defending our values and supporting peace and stability.
We owe them not only our thanks but our full and active support. We need to increase their numbers. The past holds powerful lessons and one of the clearest is this, peace is not the absence of war, it is something we need to build and protect and uphold day by day, generation by generation. We honour those who fought by living up to the world they hoped to create. Thank you.
13:59
Lord Lingfield (Conservative)
-
-
Lord Lingfield (Conservative)
I remind your Lordships of my registered interest as chairman of the Cadet vocational college and I do so because I particularly want today to refer to the engagement of cadets in the war effort and in the marking this week of the 80th anniversary of VE Day. By 1945, of course, the Cadet services had been part of national life for many years. Indeed, their roots were in the rifle volunteer battalions for home defence, within which some schools formed Cadet detachments in the 1860s.
By the beginning of World War II, there were some 180 army cadet units. During the early 1940s, Royal Navy and Royal Air Force sections were added as well. These all ensure that a good number of the young recruits to the services had covered much basic training before they were called up aged 80 aged 82 they were called up aged 80 aged 82 fight for their country. -- Aged 18. During the war many hundreds of young cadets aged between 16 and 18 could and did assist in the home guards and learned many other skills, how to help with the manning of Gunning placements, how to guard important buildings, how to take and deliver messages by radio, how to administer first aid in the aftermath of bomb attacks, even how aftermath of bomb attacks, even how Inevitably no small young number of these young civilians were injured or even killed.
The good things therefore that merged from that time of great national suffering was the creation after the war of the Combined Cadet Force. Mainly an independent selective schools then, now 80 years later the majority of cadet units is in state secondary schools of all kinds throughout the United Kingdom and very often in disadvantaged areas. This week as we have heard many events have commemorated victory in Europe and I'm delighted to say that Sea cadets, Royal Air Force cadets, army cadets and combined units had featured dominantly in most of them.
On Monday, cadets were on duty for the procession at the Queen Victoria Memorial outside Buckingham Palace, on Tuesday that were assisting World on Tuesday that were assisting World War II veterans at the Tower of London. Cadets were also present at the Downing Street party and Royal Berkshire and other cadets were chosen to attend yesterday's service at Westminster Abbey. Some 300 places were reserved for cadets and their families from across the United Kingdom at yesterday's concert on horseguards. Young people who took part in uniform in this week's commemorations will remember them for a very long time and we hope will take away many lessons about patriotism, courage and sacrifice that Lord Coaker spoke of in his excellent introductory speech.
In March there was published a report by Northampton University entitled the impact and value of school-based cadet forces, it has a forward either present Minister for veterans Alistair Carnes NP and I quote from it. Participation in the many exciting, challenging and fun activities provided by cadet forces can help develop self-confidence, teamwork, leadership and resilience in young people, preparing them for the many challenges they face and therefore setting them up to therefore setting them up to succeed.
Reports findings were that was delivering excellent value for public money, cadet forces create positive impacts for schools, including giving students from all backgrounds opportunities to come together, contributing to the prevention of absenteeism, reducing exclusions, creating positive attitudes and a sense of belonging and fostering community engagement, for instance the attendance of uniform cadet bands in local remembrance services and other events. Also mentioned where the opportunities for cadets to gain important qualifications through the cadet vocational college, leading to greater employability.
The Combined Cadet Force, founded at a time of great national adversity, has lived on to become an outstanding component of our education system. The aim of the cadet services 80 years ago at the time of victory in Europe was to train young men to be good soldiers. Their aim today is to train young people to become good citizens and I commend their work to your Lordships house.
By the beginning of World War II, there were some 180 army cadet units. During the early 1940s, Royal Navy and Royal Air Force sections were added as well. These all ensure that a good number of the young recruits to the services had covered much basic training before they were called up aged 80 aged 82 they were called up aged 80 aged 82 fight for their country. -- Aged 18. During the war many hundreds of young cadets aged between 16 and 18 could and did assist in the home guards and learned many other skills, how to help with the manning of Gunning placements, how to guard important buildings, how to take and deliver messages by radio, how to administer first aid in the aftermath of bomb attacks, even how aftermath of bomb attacks, even how Inevitably no small young number of these young civilians were injured or even killed.
The good things therefore that merged from that time of great national suffering was the creation after the war of the Combined Cadet Force. Mainly an independent selective schools then, now 80 years later the majority of cadet units is in state secondary schools of all kinds throughout the United Kingdom and very often in disadvantaged areas. This week as we have heard many events have commemorated victory in Europe and I'm delighted to say that Sea cadets, Royal Air Force cadets, army cadets and combined units had featured dominantly in most of them.
On Monday, cadets were on duty for the procession at the Queen Victoria Memorial outside Buckingham Palace, on Tuesday that were assisting World on Tuesday that were assisting World War II veterans at the Tower of London. Cadets were also present at the Downing Street party and Royal Berkshire and other cadets were chosen to attend yesterday's service at Westminster Abbey. Some 300 places were reserved for cadets and their families from across the United Kingdom at yesterday's concert on horseguards. Young people who took part in uniform in this week's commemorations will remember them for a very long time and we hope will take away many lessons about patriotism, courage and sacrifice that Lord Coaker spoke of in his excellent introductory speech.
In March there was published a report by Northampton University entitled the impact and value of school-based cadet forces, it has a forward either present Minister for veterans Alistair Carnes NP and I quote from it. Participation in the many exciting, challenging and fun activities provided by cadet forces can help develop self-confidence, teamwork, leadership and resilience in young people, preparing them for the many challenges they face and therefore setting them up to therefore setting them up to succeed.
Reports findings were that was delivering excellent value for public money, cadet forces create positive impacts for schools, including giving students from all backgrounds opportunities to come together, contributing to the prevention of absenteeism, reducing exclusions, creating positive attitudes and a sense of belonging and fostering community engagement, for instance the attendance of uniform cadet bands in local remembrance services and other events. Also mentioned where the opportunities for cadets to gain important qualifications through the cadet vocational college, leading to greater employability.
The Combined Cadet Force, founded at a time of great national adversity, has lived on to become an outstanding component of our education system. The aim of the cadet services 80 years ago at the time of victory in Europe was to train young men to be good soldiers. Their aim today is to train young people to become good citizens and I commend their work to your Lordships house.
14:05
Lord Sahota (Labour)
-
-
Lord Sahota (Labour)
It is a great honour and a privilege to take part in this VE day debate in your Lordships house. The Second World War was a conflict that had to be fought, fought to save our civil station from the tyranny of fascism. It lasted nearly 6 years and claimed the lives of over 75 million people. It was a bloody, brutal war marked by the genocide, destruction and unimaginable horror of the Holocaust. On the Allied side people of all faiths, backgrounds came together to defeat the forces of Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan.
When a call went out from Britain to its objects in Asia and Africa, millions volunteered to serve. It became the largest voluntary army the world has ever seen, from the Indian subcontinent alone some 2.5 million people answered the call. Of those, approximately 15% were Sikhs, this despite six comprising only two% of the Indian population at that time. The overrepresentation speaks volumes about their bravery and loyalty. They served in virtually every theatre of war including Burma, Italy, Lemey and other places.
Their valour did not go unrecognised. They were awarded numerous honours, Victoria crosses, military crosses, distinguished 15th Punjab Regiment received the Victoria Cross for exceptional courage. I mention this because my maternal uncle served in the same regiment and was awarded the distinguished service medal in the same campaign. His medals remain cherished by our family to the state. Six soldiers were recruited in such numbers because they were considered a martial race, yet despite their commitment and sacrifice they were not paid the same as the British counterparts.
This injustice was the result of the This injustice was the result of the colonial policy. In death also were equal, on a battlefield they were not. After the war the contributions were too often omitted from the dominant narrative. The newsreels of the time showed only white British troops returning home in triumph. The perception that victory was achieved solely by the British forces took hold. Reception not born of the malice of the public, but from a lack of leadership, political will and ahistorical honesty.
While British soldiers were rightly honoured, paraded and cared for, many Commonwealth soldiers returned home to hardship with meagre pensions. Those who once stood shoulder to shoulder in the trenches became a footnote in the history. There sacrifice slipped into obscurity. This time have moved on. Today Britain is one of the most diverse, tolerant and pure -- pluralistic societies, but when it comes to acknowledging some part of our shared history, particularly the contribution of Commonwealth soldiers, much work remains.
There has been steps in the right direction, recently Royal Mail issued a stamp featuring Mahendra Singh Pucci, seeks soldier who fought proudly wearing his turban while serving in the Second World War. This symbolic recognition matters. Many military historians now acknowledge that without the contribution of Indian soldiers, particularly seeks soldiers, the outcome of several battles or perhaps even the war might have been perhaps even the war might have been different. It is a vital that our VE Day and other commemorations properly includes service men and women from the Commonwealth.
The British public so deserved the full picture of how victory was secured. That must change. As the great Nigerian author Junior SJ Bay once said, until the Lions have their own historians history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter. Time has come for the Lions to have their own historians. Finally there has been a sustained campaign by the seek community and the seek soldiers in the UK for many years to have seek regiment in the British Army.
I would like to add my name to that campaign thank you.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
In this landmark and moving debate I would like to mention the debate I would like to mention the battle of Monte Cassino. Which I don't think has been mentioned but don't think has been mentioned but which deserves to be. It also has personal resonance for me and my personal resonance for me and my family. Let's recall significance. It was one of the most brutal It was one of the most brutal engagements of the war resulting in northern 75,000 Allied and German casualties will stop the objective casualties will stop the objective was to break through the German just off-line, heavily fortified series off-line, heavily fortified series of defences which run the width of Italy just south of Rome.
Hitler had ordered that the line was to be held at all costs Monte Cassino was a at all costs Monte Cassino was a Benedictine Abbey founded in the sixth century. And situated at the sixth century. And situated at the top of a towering 1,700 foot hill. top of a towering 1,700 foot hill. Overlooking the main road to Rome. With its heavily fortified mountain defences, Monte Cassino formed the linchpin of the Gstaad line. The overall stuffed strategy was to form -- Forster Germans to commit the maximum number of divisions in Italy at the time of the cross-channel invasion of Normandy.
The thinking was that if as many German forces as possible were tied down in Italy they couldn't be redeployed to France. Monte Cassino therefore
When a call went out from Britain to its objects in Asia and Africa, millions volunteered to serve. It became the largest voluntary army the world has ever seen, from the Indian subcontinent alone some 2.5 million people answered the call. Of those, approximately 15% were Sikhs, this despite six comprising only two% of the Indian population at that time. The overrepresentation speaks volumes about their bravery and loyalty. They served in virtually every theatre of war including Burma, Italy, Lemey and other places.
Their valour did not go unrecognised. They were awarded numerous honours, Victoria crosses, military crosses, distinguished 15th Punjab Regiment received the Victoria Cross for exceptional courage. I mention this because my maternal uncle served in the same regiment and was awarded the distinguished service medal in the same campaign. His medals remain cherished by our family to the state. Six soldiers were recruited in such numbers because they were considered a martial race, yet despite their commitment and sacrifice they were not paid the same as the British counterparts.
This injustice was the result of the This injustice was the result of the colonial policy. In death also were equal, on a battlefield they were not. After the war the contributions were too often omitted from the dominant narrative. The newsreels of the time showed only white British troops returning home in triumph. The perception that victory was achieved solely by the British forces took hold. Reception not born of the malice of the public, but from a lack of leadership, political will and ahistorical honesty.
While British soldiers were rightly honoured, paraded and cared for, many Commonwealth soldiers returned home to hardship with meagre pensions. Those who once stood shoulder to shoulder in the trenches became a footnote in the history. There sacrifice slipped into obscurity. This time have moved on. Today Britain is one of the most diverse, tolerant and pure -- pluralistic societies, but when it comes to acknowledging some part of our shared history, particularly the contribution of Commonwealth soldiers, much work remains.
There has been steps in the right direction, recently Royal Mail issued a stamp featuring Mahendra Singh Pucci, seeks soldier who fought proudly wearing his turban while serving in the Second World War. This symbolic recognition matters. Many military historians now acknowledge that without the contribution of Indian soldiers, particularly seeks soldiers, the outcome of several battles or perhaps even the war might have been perhaps even the war might have been different. It is a vital that our VE Day and other commemorations properly includes service men and women from the Commonwealth.
The British public so deserved the full picture of how victory was secured. That must change. As the great Nigerian author Junior SJ Bay once said, until the Lions have their own historians history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter. Time has come for the Lions to have their own historians. Finally there has been a sustained campaign by the seek community and the seek soldiers in the UK for many years to have seek regiment in the British Army.
I would like to add my name to that campaign thank you.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
In this landmark and moving debate I would like to mention the debate I would like to mention the battle of Monte Cassino. Which I don't think has been mentioned but don't think has been mentioned but which deserves to be. It also has personal resonance for me and my personal resonance for me and my family. Let's recall significance. It was one of the most brutal It was one of the most brutal engagements of the war resulting in northern 75,000 Allied and German casualties will stop the objective casualties will stop the objective was to break through the German just off-line, heavily fortified series off-line, heavily fortified series of defences which run the width of Italy just south of Rome.
Hitler had ordered that the line was to be held at all costs Monte Cassino was a at all costs Monte Cassino was a Benedictine Abbey founded in the sixth century. And situated at the sixth century. And situated at the top of a towering 1,700 foot hill. top of a towering 1,700 foot hill. Overlooking the main road to Rome. With its heavily fortified mountain defences, Monte Cassino formed the linchpin of the Gstaad line. The overall stuffed strategy was to form -- Forster Germans to commit the maximum number of divisions in Italy at the time of the cross-channel invasion of Normandy.
The thinking was that if as many German forces as possible were tied down in Italy they couldn't be redeployed to France. Monte Cassino therefore
14:13
Lord Carter of Haslemere (Crossbench)
-
-
Lord Carter of Haslemere (Crossbench)
played a crucial part in the success of the D-Day landings. The battle of the D-Day landings. The battle consisted of four huge Allied military assaults Monte Cassino from military assaults Monte Cassino from January to May Monte Cassino from January to May 1944. Comprised of an extraordinary multinational force extraordinary multinational force including French, US, New Zealand, including French, US, New Zealand, India, Gurkha, Canadian, South African, British and Polish African, British and Polish regiments and others. The first three assaults were all repulsed three assaults were all repulsed with heavy casualties by massive German resistance, facilitated by their entrenched positions on the their entrenched positions on the hill as well as the terrible winter flooding from heavy rains.
The flooding from heavy rains. The fourth and final engagement was led by the Polish with support from the British eighth Army and other British eighth Army and other allies. He started at 2,300 on 11 May He started at 2,300 on 11 May, May He started at 2,300 on 11 May, 1944 with an artillery bombardment from 1060 guns of the eighth Army and ended with the successful grouting of the enemy from the Abbey. The road to Rome was thereby opened and the city was taken on 4 June, 1944 just two days before the Normandy invasion.
My father was a Gunner with the eighth Army who had fought in the North African campaign before crossing into Italy. He was in that final assault on Monte Cassino and was manning one of those 1060 guns. During the battle he was wounded by shrapnel and hospitalised with sepsis. As you can see he survived. He lived to a great age, 102 in fact. He lost many close friends during the assault on Monte Cassino and long after the war in the 1960s our family returned to Monte Cassino and visited the British and German war graves.
There we met the mother of a German soldier who had fallen. For many soldier who had fallen. For many years afterwards she and my mother corresponded with each other. corresponded with each other. Blasted are the peacemakers. -- Blasted -- blessed.
The flooding from heavy rains. The fourth and final engagement was led by the Polish with support from the British eighth Army and other British eighth Army and other allies. He started at 2,300 on 11 May He started at 2,300 on 11 May, May He started at 2,300 on 11 May, 1944 with an artillery bombardment from 1060 guns of the eighth Army and ended with the successful grouting of the enemy from the Abbey. The road to Rome was thereby opened and the city was taken on 4 June, 1944 just two days before the Normandy invasion.
My father was a Gunner with the eighth Army who had fought in the North African campaign before crossing into Italy. He was in that final assault on Monte Cassino and was manning one of those 1060 guns. During the battle he was wounded by shrapnel and hospitalised with sepsis. As you can see he survived. He lived to a great age, 102 in fact. He lost many close friends during the assault on Monte Cassino and long after the war in the 1960s our family returned to Monte Cassino and visited the British and German war graves.
There we met the mother of a German soldier who had fallen. For many soldier who had fallen. For many years afterwards she and my mother corresponded with each other. corresponded with each other. Blasted are the peacemakers. -- Blasted -- blessed.
14:14
Lord Rook (Labour)
-
-
Lord Rook (Labour)
I'm grateful for the opportunity to participate in a most moving and inspiring debate, my congratulations in particular to the Right Reverend Prelate to the Bishop of Peterborough for a wonderful Maiden speech. Welcome, it's a was good to have another former youth and children's work in the House. Earlier this week the Ministry of, communities and hosted an exhibition entitled great faith, stories of sacrifice and contribution. Here I must declare an interest I am a partner of the good faith partnership which played a modest role in supporting colourful heritage with a wonderful charity that produced this arresting exhibition.
On Wednesday visitors to the atrium of MHCLG came face-to- face with 80 extraordinary individuals. Each picture painted by the renowned portrait artist Arabella Dorman commemorates and celebrates the lives of a Muslim serving in our Armed Forces from World War I to this very day. My remarks from henceforth will no doubt pick up similar themes to those shared by Lord Sahota. Each face tells a story, story of faithfulness to God and to country. One painting is of Abdul have these, the first Muslim soldier to win the Victoria Cross on 6 April, 1944, he led his platoon up a treacherous hillside in Japan, already wounded he sees the Japanese machine gun and led a charge of such ferocity that Another portrait features a British resistance agent who served as a wireless operator at that special operations executive, supporting the Assistant in France.
His Arabic name translates as "Radiant light. " He took the codename Madelyn. Following the arrest of colleagues, she remained in France moving from place to place dancing the shadows of the darkest hour and transmitted messages back to London. True to her faith, her country, and her name, she shared essential light on the dangerous activities of Nazi forces. She was eventually betrayed, rested, and subsequently executed at Dhaka. She was posthumously awarded the George Cross was not Hamid Hussain, who also featured in the exhibition, was 16 years old when he ran away from home to join the volunteer British Indian army in 1941.
He served as a machine gunner in the eighth Indian division, Fort in the battle of Monte Cassino, noble Lords will be pleased to a second mention. On VE Day, he and his colleagues advanced into Austria. Moreover, he moved to the United Kingdom where he lives to this day, one of the last remaining veterans of VE Day. As if military service were not offering enough, Mohammed has dedicated the last 75 years to serving his local community and our country, supporting fellow veterans, and promoting greater understanding among young people.
I am grateful to my noble friends, Lord Coaker and Lord Boateng and the noble Lord Wallace among others for drawing our attention to the contributions of service men and women from the Commonwealth countries. Particularly in Africa and on the eastern front. Lest we forget, more than 5.5 million Muslims fought as part of the Allied forces as part of World War II with a staggering 1.5 million killed in the conflict. Yet research from British Future indicates that only 34% of the British public are aware that Muslim men and women served in the Second World War.
At that great faith exhibition, the Minister for Faith and communities and resettlement announced progress in the creation of a national Muslim war memorial. I'm grateful to his Majesty's government for the progress made. And with other noble Lords, I look forward to paying my respects at that memorial in due time. I would also humbly ask his Majesty's government to seize the gift offered to our country through the creativity of colourful heritage and the artistry of Arabella Dorman. To see that these beautiful paintings are seen in these powerful stories are told up and down the land.
I hope that these heroic faces will be seen in schools, in universities, government buildings, and community settings. Places of work and places of worship. I hope the stories will be told far and wide. Finally, one final face staring out of the canvas in the rate faith exhibition belongs to the first Iman to serve as a chaplain in the Armed Forces. He serves today as an adviser to the Ministry of Defence, and as a Reservist in our army.
He writes this, " As a British Muslim, and someone privileged to serve alongside our Armed Forces, VE Day reminds me of the often overlooked sacrifices made by Muslims in the struggle against tyranny and in promoting peace. tyranny and in promoting peace. Today I see that same spirit and dedication in the British Muslim personnel I work with. Proud to wear the uniform, grounded in faith, the uniform, grounded in faith, committed to the values we defend, I believe a good Muslim makes a good believe a good Muslim makes a good British soldier.
When they said in the past, present, or future, when it comes to our Muslim service men and women, we should remember them. " "
On Wednesday visitors to the atrium of MHCLG came face-to- face with 80 extraordinary individuals. Each picture painted by the renowned portrait artist Arabella Dorman commemorates and celebrates the lives of a Muslim serving in our Armed Forces from World War I to this very day. My remarks from henceforth will no doubt pick up similar themes to those shared by Lord Sahota. Each face tells a story, story of faithfulness to God and to country. One painting is of Abdul have these, the first Muslim soldier to win the Victoria Cross on 6 April, 1944, he led his platoon up a treacherous hillside in Japan, already wounded he sees the Japanese machine gun and led a charge of such ferocity that Another portrait features a British resistance agent who served as a wireless operator at that special operations executive, supporting the Assistant in France.
His Arabic name translates as "Radiant light. " He took the codename Madelyn. Following the arrest of colleagues, she remained in France moving from place to place dancing the shadows of the darkest hour and transmitted messages back to London. True to her faith, her country, and her name, she shared essential light on the dangerous activities of Nazi forces. She was eventually betrayed, rested, and subsequently executed at Dhaka. She was posthumously awarded the George Cross was not Hamid Hussain, who also featured in the exhibition, was 16 years old when he ran away from home to join the volunteer British Indian army in 1941.
He served as a machine gunner in the eighth Indian division, Fort in the battle of Monte Cassino, noble Lords will be pleased to a second mention. On VE Day, he and his colleagues advanced into Austria. Moreover, he moved to the United Kingdom where he lives to this day, one of the last remaining veterans of VE Day. As if military service were not offering enough, Mohammed has dedicated the last 75 years to serving his local community and our country, supporting fellow veterans, and promoting greater understanding among young people.
I am grateful to my noble friends, Lord Coaker and Lord Boateng and the noble Lord Wallace among others for drawing our attention to the contributions of service men and women from the Commonwealth countries. Particularly in Africa and on the eastern front. Lest we forget, more than 5.5 million Muslims fought as part of the Allied forces as part of World War II with a staggering 1.5 million killed in the conflict. Yet research from British Future indicates that only 34% of the British public are aware that Muslim men and women served in the Second World War.
At that great faith exhibition, the Minister for Faith and communities and resettlement announced progress in the creation of a national Muslim war memorial. I'm grateful to his Majesty's government for the progress made. And with other noble Lords, I look forward to paying my respects at that memorial in due time. I would also humbly ask his Majesty's government to seize the gift offered to our country through the creativity of colourful heritage and the artistry of Arabella Dorman. To see that these beautiful paintings are seen in these powerful stories are told up and down the land.
I hope that these heroic faces will be seen in schools, in universities, government buildings, and community settings. Places of work and places of worship. I hope the stories will be told far and wide. Finally, one final face staring out of the canvas in the rate faith exhibition belongs to the first Iman to serve as a chaplain in the Armed Forces. He serves today as an adviser to the Ministry of Defence, and as a Reservist in our army.
He writes this, " As a British Muslim, and someone privileged to serve alongside our Armed Forces, VE Day reminds me of the often overlooked sacrifices made by Muslims in the struggle against tyranny and in promoting peace. tyranny and in promoting peace. Today I see that same spirit and dedication in the British Muslim personnel I work with. Proud to wear the uniform, grounded in faith, the uniform, grounded in faith, committed to the values we defend, I believe a good Muslim makes a good believe a good Muslim makes a good British soldier.
When they said in the past, present, or future, when it comes to our Muslim service men and women, we should remember them. " "
14:20
Baroness Porter of Fulwood (Conservative)
-
-
Baroness Porter of Fulwood (Conservative)
My Lords, 80 years ago, my grandparents were at the theatre when the show was interrupted with the announcement that the war was over. Bert, stationed for the duration of the war on Malta, as an RAF electrician working with Spitfires had managed to get a few days leave to come home and marry Winnie. They married on 7 May 1945. Peace was the best wedding present they could have had. Their story is a testament to the resistance and unity that defined a generation.
Bert's house in south-east London was destroyed early in the war. With no home of his own, he stayed with relatives in Bradford during his leave. And he met Winnie who lived next door. She spent the war weaving nylon for parachutes. After the war, they joined a self build group in Essex answering an advert in the paper. They purchased a potato field alongside others, with a loan from the local council. Over several years between them, the group built 13 pairs of semi detached houses.
They dedicated every weekend and the pressures annual leave to this endeavour. That street of houses still stands today. Stories like this, like all these that we have heard today, other legacy that we have inherited. A legacy of perseverance, hope, of courage, community, and renewal. The war shaped Britain. It is a different country today than it would have been otherwise. We are different today than we would have been otherwise. As that noble Baroness Lady Kingsmill has already pointed out, peace as we know is not just not war.
It is something in itself. Something of substance that we build and shape. I love the story about the street my grandfather helped build because it is a story about people bringing what skills and abilities they had together. And being stronger because of it. Many of the most acute challenges we currently face domestic league require collective rebuilding. They require us to strengthen our communities, and deepen the social bonds between people. This is as true when we talk about tackling loneliness as it is about tackling crime.
It is also true as we look at the vast array of global challenges we face. As geopolitical tensions, many of which have been referred to already, mounts, we must prioritise defence spending. And evolve our focus to reflect growing threats from technological advances, whether it be disinformation or cyber attacks. It is not enough though to commit to raise our defence spending and to make sure that we have the right capabilities. We need to also encourage our allies to do likewise. We cannot act in isolation, we are only ever as strong as those stood alongside us.
As we commemorate today, let's take the lessons from the stories we have heard on how to shape peace and to forge
**** Possible New Speaker ****
preparedness. My Lords, it is a pleasure and
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a pleasure and honour to follow the noble Baroness, and all noble Lords, with so many moving speeches about the sacrifices of family members, I'm thinking of family members, I'm thinking particularly of Vernon. And to hear the excellent Maiden speech by the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Peterborough. My speeches about family, in particular my father, Jim Ramsey, who died suddenly in 1990. I Ramsey, who died suddenly in 1990.
I am wearing his badge and carrying am wearing his badge and carrying one of his medals, I know we are not allowed props but forgive me. As my mother did when my sister and I went mother did when my sister and I went with her to Normandy in 2004 to commemorate the 50th anniversary D- Day. I also want to mention her Day. I also want to mention her brother, Patrick, who was one of the brother, Patrick, who was one of the Wellington bombers, as well as his wife and sister, Jenny, who both worked in factories during the war, coming home after long arduous shifts.
My dad joined the Westminster tribunes at age 18 for top I'm grateful to the regimental Association and know that they will be watching this debate. He was a gunner in the tank corps, responsible for maintaining the flails that blew up landmines ahead of the infantry. He landed on D-Day and took part and was involved in the liberation of Bergen-Belsen. And in guarding checkpoint Charlie after peace was declared. Sadly I never recorded him speaking about his war years to all of my memories, normal everyday conversations with him, usually as a result of us children asking him questions.
He prefaced asking him questions. He prefaced anything he said in response to my exclamations but his experiences seemed completely normal at the time because everyone was in the same boat. He wrote these words in an exercise book my mum to type out for a local sixth form student who had asked him about the day. " And the binning of May 1944, a squadron Westminster was stationed in West Norfolk. We had to waterproof our tanks. Every inch the outside had to be brushed, and all the nuts and bolts and openings and escape hatches had to be sealed and made waterproof.
It was boring dirty work and took a fortnight. It was unnecessary in the event. On trains we transported the tanks to Sussex where we were put under armed guard and not allowed out of the area
Bert's house in south-east London was destroyed early in the war. With no home of his own, he stayed with relatives in Bradford during his leave. And he met Winnie who lived next door. She spent the war weaving nylon for parachutes. After the war, they joined a self build group in Essex answering an advert in the paper. They purchased a potato field alongside others, with a loan from the local council. Over several years between them, the group built 13 pairs of semi detached houses.
They dedicated every weekend and the pressures annual leave to this endeavour. That street of houses still stands today. Stories like this, like all these that we have heard today, other legacy that we have inherited. A legacy of perseverance, hope, of courage, community, and renewal. The war shaped Britain. It is a different country today than it would have been otherwise. We are different today than we would have been otherwise. As that noble Baroness Lady Kingsmill has already pointed out, peace as we know is not just not war.
It is something in itself. Something of substance that we build and shape. I love the story about the street my grandfather helped build because it is a story about people bringing what skills and abilities they had together. And being stronger because of it. Many of the most acute challenges we currently face domestic league require collective rebuilding. They require us to strengthen our communities, and deepen the social bonds between people. This is as true when we talk about tackling loneliness as it is about tackling crime.
It is also true as we look at the vast array of global challenges we face. As geopolitical tensions, many of which have been referred to already, mounts, we must prioritise defence spending. And evolve our focus to reflect growing threats from technological advances, whether it be disinformation or cyber attacks. It is not enough though to commit to raise our defence spending and to make sure that we have the right capabilities. We need to also encourage our allies to do likewise. We cannot act in isolation, we are only ever as strong as those stood alongside us.
As we commemorate today, let's take the lessons from the stories we have heard on how to shape peace and to forge
**** Possible New Speaker ****
preparedness. My Lords, it is a pleasure and
**** Possible New Speaker ****
My Lords, it is a pleasure and honour to follow the noble Baroness, and all noble Lords, with so many moving speeches about the sacrifices of family members, I'm thinking of family members, I'm thinking particularly of Vernon. And to hear the excellent Maiden speech by the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Peterborough. My speeches about family, in particular my father, Jim Ramsey, who died suddenly in 1990. I Ramsey, who died suddenly in 1990.
I am wearing his badge and carrying am wearing his badge and carrying one of his medals, I know we are not allowed props but forgive me. As my mother did when my sister and I went mother did when my sister and I went with her to Normandy in 2004 to commemorate the 50th anniversary D- Day. I also want to mention her Day. I also want to mention her brother, Patrick, who was one of the brother, Patrick, who was one of the Wellington bombers, as well as his wife and sister, Jenny, who both worked in factories during the war, coming home after long arduous shifts.
My dad joined the Westminster tribunes at age 18 for top I'm grateful to the regimental Association and know that they will be watching this debate. He was a gunner in the tank corps, responsible for maintaining the flails that blew up landmines ahead of the infantry. He landed on D-Day and took part and was involved in the liberation of Bergen-Belsen. And in guarding checkpoint Charlie after peace was declared. Sadly I never recorded him speaking about his war years to all of my memories, normal everyday conversations with him, usually as a result of us children asking him questions.
He prefaced asking him questions. He prefaced anything he said in response to my exclamations but his experiences seemed completely normal at the time because everyone was in the same boat. He wrote these words in an exercise book my mum to type out for a local sixth form student who had asked him about the day. " And the binning of May 1944, a squadron Westminster was stationed in West Norfolk. We had to waterproof our tanks. Every inch the outside had to be brushed, and all the nuts and bolts and openings and escape hatches had to be sealed and made waterproof.
It was boring dirty work and took a fortnight. It was unnecessary in the event. On trains we transported the tanks to Sussex where we were put under armed guard and not allowed out of the area
14:27
Baroness Ramsey of Wall Heath (Labour)
-
-
Baroness Ramsey of Wall Heath (Labour)
where we lived in tents. We could write their letters. We were given new clothes, paid in French francs, new clothes, paid in French francs, taken into a hut which was very heavily guarded and shown a map with mythical names. It was a map of mythical names. It was a map of Normandy. I remember Poland and was taken on the first day. We were taken on the first day. We were sworn to secrecy. We set sail in the dark of night on 5 June and when morning came on the sixth, we were not alone.
There were ships as far as the eye could see from horizon to as the eye could see from horizon to horizon. Normandy came in sight, we had a motorcycle strapped on the back of the tank and a motorcyclist riding on the turret. I offered to riding on the turret. I offered to share the seat with him but he declined. He jointly quickly when something flew past his head. Shells something flew past his head. Shells were falling around us, and the ship was hit full stop out squadrons had landed with the first wave three hours earlier.
We were to push inland and the tanks. We went past a village and landed on Queen Beach according to open field a few hundred yards past the town when tanks behind us began to blow up. Three flails and 1/2 track, we carried on some distance to be halted fridge. We waited for the advance which never came. We stuck thereabout guarding the flank until 5 PM. A great mass of four engine bombers and gliders came on I left to reinforce the original drop.
Quite a number were shot down close to us. 14 Tiger tanks were heading our way. We feared the worst. I have since read that they were stopped by an anti-tank screen that the British posted on the line of advance. At last it began to grow dark and all of the tanks withdrew to form a line further back. We filled up with petrol and ammunition made a cup of tea. I was on guard for two hours. I had three single German paint up above and all three were shot down.
We were up at first light about 4 AM. D-Day was over and D plus one had started. " He wrote this on the same piece of paper about the months that followed. " We had bread for the first time a month later. I slept in bed on Christmas Eve in Brussels where I had 48,000 leave from Holland. All the infantry landing with us were killed in a few months. Several infantry divisions were disbanded. I was glad not to be in the infantry.
My dad took us his children every year to the war children every year to the war memorial and toasted fallen comrades. Today, dad, my sister and comrades. Today, dad, my sister and I will toast all of you for everything you and so many other everything you and so many other brave women including from the Commonwealth, for all you did for us.
There were ships as far as the eye could see from horizon to as the eye could see from horizon to horizon. Normandy came in sight, we had a motorcycle strapped on the back of the tank and a motorcyclist riding on the turret. I offered to riding on the turret. I offered to share the seat with him but he declined. He jointly quickly when something flew past his head. Shells something flew past his head. Shells were falling around us, and the ship was hit full stop out squadrons had landed with the first wave three hours earlier.
We were to push inland and the tanks. We went past a village and landed on Queen Beach according to open field a few hundred yards past the town when tanks behind us began to blow up. Three flails and 1/2 track, we carried on some distance to be halted fridge. We waited for the advance which never came. We stuck thereabout guarding the flank until 5 PM. A great mass of four engine bombers and gliders came on I left to reinforce the original drop.
Quite a number were shot down close to us. 14 Tiger tanks were heading our way. We feared the worst. I have since read that they were stopped by an anti-tank screen that the British posted on the line of advance. At last it began to grow dark and all of the tanks withdrew to form a line further back. We filled up with petrol and ammunition made a cup of tea. I was on guard for two hours. I had three single German paint up above and all three were shot down.
We were up at first light about 4 AM. D-Day was over and D plus one had started. " He wrote this on the same piece of paper about the months that followed. " We had bread for the first time a month later. I slept in bed on Christmas Eve in Brussels where I had 48,000 leave from Holland. All the infantry landing with us were killed in a few months. Several infantry divisions were disbanded. I was glad not to be in the infantry.
My dad took us his children every year to the war children every year to the war memorial and toasted fallen comrades. Today, dad, my sister and comrades. Today, dad, my sister and I will toast all of you for everything you and so many other everything you and so many other brave women including from the Commonwealth, for all you did for us.
14:29
Baroness Smith of Newnham (Liberal Democrat)
-
-
Baroness Smith of Newnham (Liberal Democrat)
My Lords, it is an honour and a privilege to be one of the binders in this debate today. A debate that is of huge significance as a reminder of what has happened in the last 18 years, and the years before World War II. And of the issues that we need to be thinking about in 2025. Lord Ricketts in his contribution talked about the importance of personal stories. And I think we have heard this afternoon so many personal stories, of very different types, most recently from Baroness Ramsay, whose personal stories were incredibly interesting.
And also I think help us think about how we respond perhaps to some of how we respond perhaps to some of How do we find a way of talking to young people about World War II? We are getting to the point, as several noble Lord have pointed out, that there will be nobody who fought in World War II still to celebrate future commemorations. When I was a child I think unlike almost anybody else speaking in the debate today, my parents never talked about war, they didn't ever suggest that I watch Remembrance Sunday, but somehow as a child I would run home from mass on Remembrance Sunday because I wanted to watch service from the Cenotaph.
I don't know what drew me to it but in those days there were still veterans from World War I parading. Now there are very few even from World War II. So what do we need to do to help young people understand? Not just the past, but present. And the importance of peace for our generation and beyond. Lord Wallace talks about education, so did Baroness Benjamin and she and Baroness Amos rightly challenged us to think about not just to service personnel, not just what we did on the home front, but the support the actions given by our Commonwealth friends particularly from the Caribbean, but we also then heard from Lord Howell talking about Commonwealth contributions.
Lord Boateng, I can never remember quite how one addresses former Right how one addresses former Right Reverend Prelate but also reminding us about the contributions that have been made by the Commonwealth. In particular Lord Sahota reminding us that we need to think about those who volunteered to work with the British Army because it is so easy when we commemorate VE day to think about Europe, but very much to think from a British perspective will stop but the Commonwealth matters, without our Commonwealth partners and allies but we have won the war on our own? So it is vital that we remember not just the contributions of British service personnel, but those from the Commonwealth.
But also think about who we were fighting with and who we were fighting against. Because this week the first week of May is a week of many commemorations, in the Netherlands celebration was on 5 May. In the United Kingdom we May. In the United Kingdom we celebrate on 8 May. I believe the United States would normally be celebrating victory in Europe as well, but I did read earlier in the week that perhaps Donald Trump is now preparing -- preferring to think simply about victory.
And perhaps losing the vital sense that the transatlantic relationship mattered vitally in World War I and World War II. I hope the United States remembers that, we certainly do, and it is vital that as we think about the future we also work very closely still with our partners and allies still with our partners and allies in the United States. But if we are celebrating the EAC, victory in Europe the 80th anniversary, which perhaps we might been celebrating the 75th anniversary had it not been for COVID if we had been celebrating in 2020 I think the word celebration would probably have been the correct one.
We may also have said commemoration. Would we have talked about remembering as Lord Griffiths suggested? I'm not so sure. But in 2025 on the 80th anniversary we cannot simply think about what happened when the allies won, when we had peace in Europe and then a few months later, victory over Japan. Because in the last three years we have seen the global situation change dramatically. The Russian invasion of eastern Ukraine in February in February 2022, the terrorist attacks in Israel on 7 October on 7 October, 2023 and the current situation in Kashmir mean that the world 2025 is unstable.
And that the world 2025 is unstable. And uncertain. Yesterday my new leader, I'm a Roman Catholic, Pope Leo on being elected suggested that evil will not prevail. And he wished us all peace. In the beautiful service yesterday in Westminster Abbey the gospel reading also reminded us blasted are the peacemakers -- blessed. And the Archbishop of York stressed the importance of peace. Her that is clearly what we all hope for and yet in 2025 we can't just assume that piece will prevail.
For much of the post-war period those of us who grew up post-war in Europe assumed that the future would be peaceful. Today 9 May is the 75th anniversary of the Schuman declaration as mentioned by Baroness McIntosh of Pickering. That was intended to make war among signatory states, particularly France and Germany, materially impossible. And for many years now, for over 70 years, war between signatory states of what were the European communities has looked to be materially and in every other way impossible.
But war in Europe has not gone away, we saw it in the 1990s in a conflict that I think hasn't been mentioned today in Bosnia. There are mothers in Bosnia who are still looking for the limbs of their children who were killed during the war. So war never went away in Europe. But we have in the last years begun to realise the significance of peace and rebuilding security in our own region. With the war in Ukraine.
Several noble Lords have stressed the importance of defence expenditure and I realise the debate today is being wound from the government front benches by Baroness Twycross not by a minister from the MoD. But I very much hope she will take the message that has come from a drop -- across the chamber of the importance of understanding that if we want peace we nevertheless need to take defence seriously. As Lord Coaker in his excellent opening remarks pointed out, that in 1938 we would not have been ready to take on Hitler, we wouldn't have been capable of doing wouldn't have been capable of doing so.
So I would like to echo the words of many noble Lords that defence expenditure needs to be increased and to pick up on the point that Lord Stirrup raised about the possibility of a European defence mechanism. Because as we prepare for hopefully the next 80 years of peace, we need do so in close collaboration with our nearest partners and allies. On this side of the Atlantic, this side of the channel and beyond. Today we commemorate victory in Europe, but we also need to be vigilant to ensure that we retain peace in Europe and we can move forward so that our children and young people can learn about war is history and
**** Possible New Speaker ****
not about the present. This has been a powerful and humbling debate and I share the humbling debate and I share the sense of honour that many noble Lords have expressed for the opportunity to take part in it. The
And also I think help us think about how we respond perhaps to some of how we respond perhaps to some of How do we find a way of talking to young people about World War II? We are getting to the point, as several noble Lord have pointed out, that there will be nobody who fought in World War II still to celebrate future commemorations. When I was a child I think unlike almost anybody else speaking in the debate today, my parents never talked about war, they didn't ever suggest that I watch Remembrance Sunday, but somehow as a child I would run home from mass on Remembrance Sunday because I wanted to watch service from the Cenotaph.
I don't know what drew me to it but in those days there were still veterans from World War I parading. Now there are very few even from World War II. So what do we need to do to help young people understand? Not just the past, but present. And the importance of peace for our generation and beyond. Lord Wallace talks about education, so did Baroness Benjamin and she and Baroness Amos rightly challenged us to think about not just to service personnel, not just what we did on the home front, but the support the actions given by our Commonwealth friends particularly from the Caribbean, but we also then heard from Lord Howell talking about Commonwealth contributions.
Lord Boateng, I can never remember quite how one addresses former Right how one addresses former Right Reverend Prelate but also reminding us about the contributions that have been made by the Commonwealth. In particular Lord Sahota reminding us that we need to think about those who volunteered to work with the British Army because it is so easy when we commemorate VE day to think about Europe, but very much to think from a British perspective will stop but the Commonwealth matters, without our Commonwealth partners and allies but we have won the war on our own? So it is vital that we remember not just the contributions of British service personnel, but those from the Commonwealth.
But also think about who we were fighting with and who we were fighting against. Because this week the first week of May is a week of many commemorations, in the Netherlands celebration was on 5 May. In the United Kingdom we May. In the United Kingdom we celebrate on 8 May. I believe the United States would normally be celebrating victory in Europe as well, but I did read earlier in the week that perhaps Donald Trump is now preparing -- preferring to think simply about victory.
And perhaps losing the vital sense that the transatlantic relationship mattered vitally in World War I and World War II. I hope the United States remembers that, we certainly do, and it is vital that as we think about the future we also work very closely still with our partners and allies still with our partners and allies in the United States. But if we are celebrating the EAC, victory in Europe the 80th anniversary, which perhaps we might been celebrating the 75th anniversary had it not been for COVID if we had been celebrating in 2020 I think the word celebration would probably have been the correct one.
We may also have said commemoration. Would we have talked about remembering as Lord Griffiths suggested? I'm not so sure. But in 2025 on the 80th anniversary we cannot simply think about what happened when the allies won, when we had peace in Europe and then a few months later, victory over Japan. Because in the last three years we have seen the global situation change dramatically. The Russian invasion of eastern Ukraine in February in February 2022, the terrorist attacks in Israel on 7 October on 7 October, 2023 and the current situation in Kashmir mean that the world 2025 is unstable.
And that the world 2025 is unstable. And uncertain. Yesterday my new leader, I'm a Roman Catholic, Pope Leo on being elected suggested that evil will not prevail. And he wished us all peace. In the beautiful service yesterday in Westminster Abbey the gospel reading also reminded us blasted are the peacemakers -- blessed. And the Archbishop of York stressed the importance of peace. Her that is clearly what we all hope for and yet in 2025 we can't just assume that piece will prevail.
For much of the post-war period those of us who grew up post-war in Europe assumed that the future would be peaceful. Today 9 May is the 75th anniversary of the Schuman declaration as mentioned by Baroness McIntosh of Pickering. That was intended to make war among signatory states, particularly France and Germany, materially impossible. And for many years now, for over 70 years, war between signatory states of what were the European communities has looked to be materially and in every other way impossible.
But war in Europe has not gone away, we saw it in the 1990s in a conflict that I think hasn't been mentioned today in Bosnia. There are mothers in Bosnia who are still looking for the limbs of their children who were killed during the war. So war never went away in Europe. But we have in the last years begun to realise the significance of peace and rebuilding security in our own region. With the war in Ukraine.
Several noble Lords have stressed the importance of defence expenditure and I realise the debate today is being wound from the government front benches by Baroness Twycross not by a minister from the MoD. But I very much hope she will take the message that has come from a drop -- across the chamber of the importance of understanding that if we want peace we nevertheless need to take defence seriously. As Lord Coaker in his excellent opening remarks pointed out, that in 1938 we would not have been ready to take on Hitler, we wouldn't have been capable of doing wouldn't have been capable of doing so.
So I would like to echo the words of many noble Lords that defence expenditure needs to be increased and to pick up on the point that Lord Stirrup raised about the possibility of a European defence mechanism. Because as we prepare for hopefully the next 80 years of peace, we need do so in close collaboration with our nearest partners and allies. On this side of the Atlantic, this side of the channel and beyond. Today we commemorate victory in Europe, but we also need to be vigilant to ensure that we retain peace in Europe and we can move forward so that our children and young people can learn about war is history and
**** Possible New Speaker ****
not about the present. This has been a powerful and humbling debate and I share the humbling debate and I share the sense of honour that many noble Lords have expressed for the opportunity to take part in it. The
14:40
Lord Parkinson of Whitley Bay (Conservative)
-
-
Lord Parkinson of Whitley Bay (Conservative)
opportunity to take part in it. The Bishop of Peterborough has chosen a very good debate in which to make a Maiden speech and she enhanced it with her wise and compassionate words, we look forward to hearing from her more in the years to come. Many noble Lords have shared deeply moving stories about the scars Second World War left on their families, from the poignant story that the Minister shared about his uncle Sergeant major in his excellent opening speech, to those who recalled the heroic example of their forebears from across not just the silence but from proud countries across the world.
As although stories attest, no family was left untouched by this worldwide conflict. We rightly honour those who donned uniform and took up arms, too many of whom paid the ultimate sacrifice for the freedom that we enjoy today and his names are etched in stone in every parish of the land. As well as honouring their memory we are able after this gap of a decade to give more public thanks than was possible on that first the e-gate of those who play their part in other ways, such as the men and women who worked in absolute secrecy in code breaking, counterintelligence and can understand operations of breathtaking bravery.
We recall with horror the atrocities of the Holocaust, the appalling details of which were only beginning to become known in May 1945. We remember the civilians who dug for victory, who kept the home fires burning and he sat in the biting cold on rooftops including the cathedral at Peterborough to keep watch during the Blitz. We celebrate the vital and valiant role played by our cousins of all creeds and races from the Caribbean, from Africa, the Indian subcontinent and across the British Empire.
Lady Benjamin knows of my love for Trinidad's I particularly enjoyed her summoning up of the steel pan celebrations there but we had such powerful contribution from Lord including Lord Boateng, Lord Sahota, Lord Parekh, Lord Sentamu, Lady Amos and many others. We also number though she contributed to this total war effort in other ways. I great- grandfather Isaac Parkinson was a trawlerman on the River Tyne. He was awarded the distinguished service Cross for joining the Royal Naval reserve and sweeping for mines and keeping watch for enemy submarines.
Another great-grandfather Jim Scott was a minor, exempt from military service because the vital importance of that humble but noble profession. He toiled underground with reinforcements from the Bevin boys so belatedly recognised for their contribution as Lady Warwick of Undercliffe recalled. We remember the forgotten army, men like my great uncle Bob who secured victory in Japan as well as in Europe as Lord Ricketts, Baroness Meyer and many others mentioned. It's been wonderful to hear so many powerful stories being shared not just by noble Lords in today's debate but in conversations being had a cross- country this week.
I do thank government and congratulate them on very well run week of commemorations and celebrations and I hope the ministers will take back our thanks to the officials in both of their departments the work they have played in organising them, from street parties to the service of Thanksgiving, from that wonderful concert enjoyed by 12,000 people in Horse Guards Parade last night and by millions more at home thanks to the BBC. A corporation which itself played such a vital part in maintaining morale during the dark years of the war.
I think as well many organisations like English Heritage which as Lord Lemos said the stewards of our national memory full stop people have mark this anniversary and manifold and moving ways, over the bank holiday weekend I was in Ripon bedecked with handknitted hunting and his marketplace and had a knitted tank 24 feet long modelled faithfully on D-Day tank. On Tuesday had the honour of attending the commemorations at the Tower of London whose Norman keep Rose not only rose like St Paul's Cathedral as a beacon of hope and defiance during the Blitz, but which was put back into use during the Waterhouse prisoners of war.
It was a beautifully arranged ceremony but the most moving part was the presentation of flowers by young cadets from the University of London's officer training corps, Lord Lingfield mentioned, to veterans of the Second World War. That simple gesture expressed in flowers reflects a sad fact about this year's commemorations, these are likely to be the last significant moment for us to thank personally and directly veterans of the Second World War. Throughout my life the obituary pages newspaper been filled with astonishing stories about these everyday heroes.
But those stories are flowing and soon they will stop. Only last week we lost Cecil Newton one of the last survivors of D-Day at the age of 101. If there is any injunction that the remaining veterans would give us it is to remember. Not just them, but their comrades and the sacrifices made by so many servicemen and civilians alike. As noble Lords have noted, that injunction is more pressing than ever. This is not just been a history debate, but a chastening reminder that we live once again in an age of conflict across the European continent and that European continent and that Noble and gallant Lords have made points of contemporary relevance today.
Manchester police arrested nine people this week and seized Nazi memorabilia after they celebrated Adolf Hitler's birthday in an old pub. I'm sure I'm not the anyone who was horrified by that news. Or who was dismayed by the proposal of all elected councillors to lower the Ukrainian flags are flown with pride and solidarity over so many county halls and councils controlled by all parties and none. Even in this week of commemoration, it is clear that we have much yet to learn.
Lady Twycross and I were both born closer to the end of the Second World War than we are to today. But that gap grows ever wider for all of us, even for children who are born today, wonderful commemorations that we have held this week will not form part of their memory. Deeply troubling research by that Commonwealth War Graves Commission conducted last year found that fewer than half of those aged 18 to 34 knew what happened on D-Day. And that one in five young people leave there is no longer any need to commemorate events like VE Day.
It is the generation that needs so urgently to know the dangers of extremism and hatred. While there are still some witnesses to history among us, let us all ensure that their voices are heard and that the lessons are heeded. As my noble friend reminded us, it was in this very chamber that Winston Churchill addressed the House of Commons on 8 May 1945. The other place having destroyed by the Luftwaffe in 1941. Your Lordships House sat yards away in a different room.
On VE Day considered a number of modest but important measures including a gas bill and that South Shields Corporation bill. Your Lordships House get the duties as ever with typical understatement. But here in this chamber, the Prime Minister came to tell Parliament the news it had longed to hear. My noble friend Lord Lexden has written about it in the current edition of the House Magazine. "Every seat in the tables occupied. Churchill arrived 15 minutes late, delayed by the ovation he received from the great crowd on the street outside.
As the diarist and MP for Southend Sir Henry recorded, for a few embarrassed minutes, we had nothing to do. Members asked questions about next week's business as they glanced at the doors behind the Speaker's chair. Just before 330, the great man entered. The gallery, visitors stood and clapped. Members of Parliament rose and cheered Churchill. Waving their handkerchiefs and all the papers are as Harold Nicholson put it, " MPs yelled and yelled. " The statement Churchill read out was short and powerful.
At the end he added two or three sentences seeking to convey to the house is deep gratitude to this House of Commons which has proved itself the strongest foundation for waging war that has ever been seen in the whole of our long history. As he put it, "The strength of the Parliamentary institution has been shown to enable it at the same moment to preserve all the title deeds of democracy while waging war in the most stern and protracted form. " After thanking members of all parties for the way in which they had maintained the liveliness of apology institutions under the fire of the enemy, he moved a simple but powerful motion, that this house do now attend Church of St Margaret Westminster, to give humble and reverent thanks to Almighty God for deliverance from the threat of German domination.
It was an identical motion to one he noted that had been moved in former times. On this important anniversary, we pray that we may never have occasion to move such a motion in times to come. But we recall with pride and come. But we recall with pride and utility the indomitable spirit of Britain and her allies in the Second World War. And we renew our thanks for that Deliverance as well as our for that Deliverance as well as our commitment to preserve the peace and liberty which was so hard one.
As although stories attest, no family was left untouched by this worldwide conflict. We rightly honour those who donned uniform and took up arms, too many of whom paid the ultimate sacrifice for the freedom that we enjoy today and his names are etched in stone in every parish of the land. As well as honouring their memory we are able after this gap of a decade to give more public thanks than was possible on that first the e-gate of those who play their part in other ways, such as the men and women who worked in absolute secrecy in code breaking, counterintelligence and can understand operations of breathtaking bravery.
We recall with horror the atrocities of the Holocaust, the appalling details of which were only beginning to become known in May 1945. We remember the civilians who dug for victory, who kept the home fires burning and he sat in the biting cold on rooftops including the cathedral at Peterborough to keep watch during the Blitz. We celebrate the vital and valiant role played by our cousins of all creeds and races from the Caribbean, from Africa, the Indian subcontinent and across the British Empire.
Lady Benjamin knows of my love for Trinidad's I particularly enjoyed her summoning up of the steel pan celebrations there but we had such powerful contribution from Lord including Lord Boateng, Lord Sahota, Lord Parekh, Lord Sentamu, Lady Amos and many others. We also number though she contributed to this total war effort in other ways. I great- grandfather Isaac Parkinson was a trawlerman on the River Tyne. He was awarded the distinguished service Cross for joining the Royal Naval reserve and sweeping for mines and keeping watch for enemy submarines.
Another great-grandfather Jim Scott was a minor, exempt from military service because the vital importance of that humble but noble profession. He toiled underground with reinforcements from the Bevin boys so belatedly recognised for their contribution as Lady Warwick of Undercliffe recalled. We remember the forgotten army, men like my great uncle Bob who secured victory in Japan as well as in Europe as Lord Ricketts, Baroness Meyer and many others mentioned. It's been wonderful to hear so many powerful stories being shared not just by noble Lords in today's debate but in conversations being had a cross- country this week.
I do thank government and congratulate them on very well run week of commemorations and celebrations and I hope the ministers will take back our thanks to the officials in both of their departments the work they have played in organising them, from street parties to the service of Thanksgiving, from that wonderful concert enjoyed by 12,000 people in Horse Guards Parade last night and by millions more at home thanks to the BBC. A corporation which itself played such a vital part in maintaining morale during the dark years of the war.
I think as well many organisations like English Heritage which as Lord Lemos said the stewards of our national memory full stop people have mark this anniversary and manifold and moving ways, over the bank holiday weekend I was in Ripon bedecked with handknitted hunting and his marketplace and had a knitted tank 24 feet long modelled faithfully on D-Day tank. On Tuesday had the honour of attending the commemorations at the Tower of London whose Norman keep Rose not only rose like St Paul's Cathedral as a beacon of hope and defiance during the Blitz, but which was put back into use during the Waterhouse prisoners of war.
It was a beautifully arranged ceremony but the most moving part was the presentation of flowers by young cadets from the University of London's officer training corps, Lord Lingfield mentioned, to veterans of the Second World War. That simple gesture expressed in flowers reflects a sad fact about this year's commemorations, these are likely to be the last significant moment for us to thank personally and directly veterans of the Second World War. Throughout my life the obituary pages newspaper been filled with astonishing stories about these everyday heroes.
But those stories are flowing and soon they will stop. Only last week we lost Cecil Newton one of the last survivors of D-Day at the age of 101. If there is any injunction that the remaining veterans would give us it is to remember. Not just them, but their comrades and the sacrifices made by so many servicemen and civilians alike. As noble Lords have noted, that injunction is more pressing than ever. This is not just been a history debate, but a chastening reminder that we live once again in an age of conflict across the European continent and that European continent and that Noble and gallant Lords have made points of contemporary relevance today.
Manchester police arrested nine people this week and seized Nazi memorabilia after they celebrated Adolf Hitler's birthday in an old pub. I'm sure I'm not the anyone who was horrified by that news. Or who was dismayed by the proposal of all elected councillors to lower the Ukrainian flags are flown with pride and solidarity over so many county halls and councils controlled by all parties and none. Even in this week of commemoration, it is clear that we have much yet to learn.
Lady Twycross and I were both born closer to the end of the Second World War than we are to today. But that gap grows ever wider for all of us, even for children who are born today, wonderful commemorations that we have held this week will not form part of their memory. Deeply troubling research by that Commonwealth War Graves Commission conducted last year found that fewer than half of those aged 18 to 34 knew what happened on D-Day. And that one in five young people leave there is no longer any need to commemorate events like VE Day.
It is the generation that needs so urgently to know the dangers of extremism and hatred. While there are still some witnesses to history among us, let us all ensure that their voices are heard and that the lessons are heeded. As my noble friend reminded us, it was in this very chamber that Winston Churchill addressed the House of Commons on 8 May 1945. The other place having destroyed by the Luftwaffe in 1941. Your Lordships House sat yards away in a different room.
On VE Day considered a number of modest but important measures including a gas bill and that South Shields Corporation bill. Your Lordships House get the duties as ever with typical understatement. But here in this chamber, the Prime Minister came to tell Parliament the news it had longed to hear. My noble friend Lord Lexden has written about it in the current edition of the House Magazine. "Every seat in the tables occupied. Churchill arrived 15 minutes late, delayed by the ovation he received from the great crowd on the street outside.
As the diarist and MP for Southend Sir Henry recorded, for a few embarrassed minutes, we had nothing to do. Members asked questions about next week's business as they glanced at the doors behind the Speaker's chair. Just before 330, the great man entered. The gallery, visitors stood and clapped. Members of Parliament rose and cheered Churchill. Waving their handkerchiefs and all the papers are as Harold Nicholson put it, " MPs yelled and yelled. " The statement Churchill read out was short and powerful.
At the end he added two or three sentences seeking to convey to the house is deep gratitude to this House of Commons which has proved itself the strongest foundation for waging war that has ever been seen in the whole of our long history. As he put it, "The strength of the Parliamentary institution has been shown to enable it at the same moment to preserve all the title deeds of democracy while waging war in the most stern and protracted form. " After thanking members of all parties for the way in which they had maintained the liveliness of apology institutions under the fire of the enemy, he moved a simple but powerful motion, that this house do now attend Church of St Margaret Westminster, to give humble and reverent thanks to Almighty God for deliverance from the threat of German domination.
It was an identical motion to one he noted that had been moved in former times. On this important anniversary, we pray that we may never have occasion to move such a motion in times to come. But we recall with pride and come. But we recall with pride and utility the indomitable spirit of Britain and her allies in the Second World War. And we renew our thanks for that Deliverance as well as our for that Deliverance as well as our commitment to preserve the peace and liberty which was so hard one.
14:50
Government Spokes.
Baroness Twycross (Labour)
-
Government Spokes.
Baroness Twycross (Labour)
My Lords, it is a genuine privilege to close this debate and I thank all noble Lords their contributions today. Not least my noble friend Lord Coaker for his truly inspiring opening speech, and to all noble Lords for their efforts through a range of organisations and their contributions today to ensure we never forget both the contribution of people but also the horror of World War II. It feels only right to be able to come together on this 80th anniversary week to commemorate the end of the Second World War in Europe.
I would like to join others in congratulating the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Peterborough on her powerful Maiden speech focusing both on this week and on the wider significance of remembrance. This week has seen some fantastic events to commemorate VE Day across all parts of the UK. Rightly, veterans have been at the heart of the commemorations, with their voices and their stories being central to events. As Baroness Amos said, they are now frail but still resolute. I particularly enjoyed meeting veterans at yesterday's concert including Prince Albert Jacob, originally from Trinidad.
As Baroness Smith of Newnham said, there are increasingly few veterans with first-hand accounts of the war. I would like to join Lord Parkinson in recognising and accepting this is one of our final opportunities to say thank you and say thank you we do indeed. I agree wholeheartedly with the noble Lord about the power of the stories we have been hearing. It has been great seeing young people across the country engaging with the impact of the Second World War and to see out uniformed youth groups ably supporting events through the week, as highlighted by Lord Lingfield.
I want to thank the huge number of people who have worked tirelessly to enable this week to take place. I have no doubt would have been a mammoth effort to pull off such a spectacular program of events stop from televised events to local community commemorations, everyone involved should be particularly proud of what they have delivered as part of a nationwide program of events. I want to thank Lord Parkinson for his recognition of the work the teams including the team at DCMS. I would also like to thank colleagues and civil servants at the Ministry of defence as well as those working for Westminster City Council and Royal Parks who are clearing away the barriers and debris overnight immediately after last nights fabulous concert at Horseguards Parade.
Like many noble Lords, I have found pertinent accounts particularly moving this week including from many of us today. I have not seen the knitted tank Lord Parkinson mentioned but I am now going to look out for it. I would however urge all noble Lords who have quoted from family letters to make sure they submit them to the "Letters to loved ones" campaign. We are keen to get full recognition and reflection of those stories from across the country. So that we can remember.
I am sure that, like me, everyone who saw yesterday's service at Westminster Abbey, which I was hugely privileged to attend, was moved by the sight of Alexander Churchill lighting a candle and speaking so poignantly. And of course we are privileged to serve alongside two grandson to our great wartime leaders, Lord Attlee and Lord Soames, whose grandfather played a central role in our nation's victory was the I know Lord Soames is in the Channel Islands today as part of the liberation event as well as Minister Peacock who has had ministerial oversight of the commemorations.
It was moving to hear from my noble friend of Camden, his account of the family experience of the islanders being occupied. And their unwavering resolve. There has been significant unity across this house during this debate. We must always remain united in defence of our country and our values against fascism and against Belize. This was reflected in the words of His Majesty The King last night, it has been 80 years to the day since his own grandfather spoke to the nation.
His own mother spoke at the 75th anniversary, which fell during the difficult days of COVID. And to hear her words from the wartime diaries smoke alongside ordinary people, extraordinary ordinary people, veterans as well as those left behind. An instant point on preparedness was made by Baroness Rafferty, that I will write to her in response to that point. On 8 May 1945, Lord Coaker has said that the nation listened as were Winston Churchill stood on the balcony declaring the end of the war in Europe.
It was clear that while one victory had been secured that the war was not over. He vowed to go hand in hand without allies of the US to end the war that continues to wage in the far east. We should never forget that many continued to fight long after VE Day until 15 August 1945, when we saw Victory over Japan Day. From Britain to India to Australia and throughout the Commonwealth, the war continued to wage for many. We will remember this beyond this week's comparative events as we look to the 80th anniversary of VJ Day this summer.
It was moving to hear the account of my noble friend Baroness Hunter's parents in the Far East including the extract from her father's letter, and to hear of Lord Parkinson's uncle Bob. As Baroness Coffey said, VJ Day came after the deployment of atomic bombs which, she said, we fortunately never had to deploy subsequently. And the noble lady spoke movingly of her father's reluctance to speak about his experience in a Japanese camp. In answer to her point on remembering, the government is doing a lot of work with the Commonwealth War Graves Commission and my noble friend Lord Coaker has recently met them.
I agree with Lord Ricketts, both that we must also remember VJ Day, but that we should particularly remember the noble Lords point on the continued oppression for many decades for all too many people in Eastern Europe. This was a war that took the lives of almost 400,000 British soldiers and 70,000 British civilians. Lord Wallace of Saltaire, noble Friend Lord Boateng, Baroness Amos, and Baroness Benjamin, Lord Dubs, Lord Paddick, the Right Reverend Lord Sentamu and Baroness Harris of Richmond, and Lord Sahota rightly highlighted the hugely significant role played by the Commonwealth in the Allied victory.
Over 200,000 Commonwealth troops lost their lives, whether it was the British army fighting the western desert or Gurkhas fighting Italy. These were troops who stood up for Britain and British values. Stood up for freedom and stood up for a world free of fascism. My noble friend Lord Dubs, Lord Craig, reminded us of the part played by the volunteers from the Irish Republic. We must not, and I convert we will not, forget the concretions of all those who fought and sacrificed so much.
There was a strong reminder from my noble friend's that other faiths as well as Christianity played their part in the fight against fascism. And indeed, my father's best friend when I was growing up was a Jewish, Polish refugee to this country who flew planes for the RAF. Particularly powerful comments from Particularly powerful comments from Lord Boateng on the role of soldiers including Joseph Hammond in the 14th Army of Great Britain in Burma. The fight for self-determination free from justice will stop I know noble Lords will join me in both thanking Joseph Hammond and wish you well for his birthday.
My noble friend Baroness Amos highlighted the role of Caribbean people both in volunteering and in fundraising, but also mentioned the racism faced by veterans and the need for us to be honest about the whole of history. The noble Lady Baroness Benjamin spoke powerfully about her three uncles who fought and the two that died. And it is right that we honour the courage and dedication of all those who played their part, and Baroness Brinton my noble friend Baroness Kingsmill mentioned the role played by Anzac forces.
Whilst the subsequent period of history also had its significant challenges and conflicts, I would like to take a moment, like many noble Lords, occluding Lord Stirrup, Baroness Smith of Newnham, and my noble friend Baroness Kingsmill and others, to acknowledge the importance of the post-war order including the stability provided through bodies such as the UN and NATO. And closer European cooperation through bodies such as the Council of Europe mentioned by Baroness Brinton. Not least in bringing together former adversaries to become steadfast allies working intend to preserve the sometimes fragile peace in the later 20th century, and ensuring the horrors of the 1930s and 1940s were not repeated.
The importance of prosecuting war crimes was highlighted by Lord Bates. I will pass on his suggestion to the FCDO. As hugely powerfully outlined by the noble Earl in his opening remarks about the dangers leading up to VE Day, the Holocaust remains one of the darkest chapters in the history of the 6 million Jewish people were murdered was the government's announcement Jewish people today and always. It is important as was noted by other noble Lords to remember that Holocaust also targeted those from a range of minority groups including, as the Noble reminded us, those with disabilities are and as Baroness Hunt of Bethnal Green reminded us, gay people who were all persecuted by the Nazis, as were trade unionists.
This must not be forgotten, and the government will do everything to ensure the present and future generations remember throughout continued support the Holocaust Memorial Day Trust and the Holocaust Memorial adjacent to Parliament. Lord Wallace of Saltaire rightly highlighted the importance of younger generations living about more and the role of schools and museums including the Imperial War Museum in doing this. And Lord Farmer also highlighted the Farmer also highlighted the In relation to the curriculum review referred to by Lord Boateng and Earl Attlee the curriculum review and the importance of educating our young people, as noble Lords are aware that the DNP is seeking to deliver broad curriculum.
The intergenerational storytelling highlighted the importance of such a review in its place to ensure young people learn from our shared past. Lord Berkeley noted that not everything in our country's history is palatable. I wanted to assure my noble friend that I learned about the Boer War and British concentration camps at school and it is right that we do tell a rounded story. At the heart of this week's events has been veterans and this government is determined to support veterans both now and in the future.
I would like to echo Baroness Hunt in paying tribute to the memory and work of Lord Etherton in particular in this context his independent review into the service and experience of LGBT veteran serving between 1967 and 2000. The fight for freedom is a constant fight highlighted by the illegal invasion of Ukraine, this aggression cannot be tolerated in this government stands with Ukraine as they defend their freedom as the previous government rightly did too. As Lord Howell of Guildford said what has changed and is now almost entirely aimed at civilians.
It's also true as the noble Lord said that peace is not built on temporary foundations. All Dundee also highlighted current conflict, I would like to ensure the noble Earl that the government will do everything we can to resolve conflicts. In relation to Sudan which the noble Earl mentioned in particular that the UK continues to work with UN Security Council partners to galvanise council action on Sudan. This includes securing a UN price -- press statement on 17 April calling for the end of hostilities and full implementation of resolution 273.
A number of noble Lords raised the importance of defence spending including Baroness Porter, Lord Wallace, Lord Stirrup, Lord Shinkwin, Earl Attlee and others. There is clearly danger of not rearming and this government is very aware of that and is taking action. As noble Lords will be aware the promise to set out his commitment to increase spending on defence to 2.5% of GDP from April 2027 with an ambition to reach three% in the next Parliament. UK is determined to step up and meet this pivotal moment of global instability had on.
With a commitment we will see the biggest sustained increase in defence spending since the Cold War. Nobody could have been left unmoved by the stories from members across the logic tousled stories that bear repeating and remembering although I won't be able to repeat all of them are nor should I full stop I was particularly struck by Lord Davies of Brixton's point about how many people didn't want to talk about their experience. So it is right that we use our voice to tell their story. It was particularly moving to hear from Lord Griffiths that not all relationships survived reunion.
I think we forget that at our peril. Having known Lord Coaker for 25 years I have never before heard about his uncle's death, one of all too many young men lost all of all too many young men lost all too early. Lord Dobbs taught -- spoke movingly about his experience of the day in Manchester, has experience of the ATS women marching in Hyde Park and the horror of experiencing the camps Walti familiar no doubt to the father of my noble friend Baroness Ramsay.
I agree with Lord Dubs that we should give credit to Germany for how they faced up to their past, I would like faced up to their past, I would like to thank... I found particularly moving Lord Carter's final point in his contribution about his mother's friendship with a German mother who had lost a child. Someone with very close in recent connections I was grateful to Baroness McIntosh for speaking about the role of the UK in supporting occupied Scandinavian countries in their resistance efforts and in the liberation of Scandinavian countries that were occupied, clearly Denmark and Norway actually still feel that gratitude actually still feel that gratitude to this country.
I would like to thank Lord Lemos both for his work at in which heritage and for reminding us of the history of the Cenotaph making sure we remember the fallen and I look forward to him and his work will meet in the near future I enjoyed Lord Howell's recollection of his father's role and his desk in the war rooms, particularly my noble friend Lord Bassam is highlighting the role of auxiliaries in the fire service and this gives me the opportunity to say I had the privilege to meet a number of these women in London.
Really important reminder from Baroness Ramsay of the role of women in munitions fact -- factories and how much it is clear from her and from others that all noble Lords and all those who have treasured artefacts, family stories and family memorabilia. Very sobering to hear Lord Shinkwin's alternative vision of what might have been and important to remember how close this country came to defeat what rights and what people may have been lost as a result.
In preparing for this debate I spoke to my mother who was born shortly before the start of the war in 1939, she reminded me of how my father described sheltering under the dining hall table during air raids in Nottingham. My dad also had a Mickey Mouse gas mask like Lord Anderson of Swansea. My mum definitely use the phrase have you got any chum done when trying to get during gum from US soldiers. Both my parents shared Lord Hacking's recollection of the blackout.
My mother also remembered the sound of laughter and the piano downstairs as her parents opened up their home in Kirkwall to Armed Forces based in Albany some guests became friends for life but on occasions these were fleeting friendships with their many particular pains return despite the song we meet again being hugely iconic and popular refrain play through events this week all too often people did not meet again. My grandfather was a civil servant in a protected position and I understand he was felt guilty for not fighting.
From my perspective I appreciated the focus during this debate on the work of those who contributed at home and as Baroness Warwick highlighted, on the homefront this week from, and Baroness Hunter reminded us of the invaluable role of women in the SOA behind enemy lines and the Right Reverend Prelate the Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham reminded us of the role of army chaplains and Lord Lingfield highlighted rightly the role of the We have heard the importance of marking the 80th anniversary of VE Day and VJ Day.
We are clear and united across the House, we must ensure the legacies of those who survived in jaw. I would like to thank all noble Lords here today and all those who have taken part this week including the Parliament Choir performance on Wednesday which was highlighted by my noble friend Baroness Warwick. It has been a huge contribution by many people across your Lordships House and beyond cross-country to the commemoratives events. I think it is right to conclude by thanking the veterans who are still alive today, and to the soldiers, civilians, all those who fought to secure peace between 1939 and 1949, and to our Armed Forces for what they continue to do today to keep us free, to keep us safe, and to keep us being able to
**** Possible New Speaker ****
have debates of this type. The question is that this motion be agreed to. As many are of that opinion say, "Content". Of the contrary, "Not content". The contents have it.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
contents have it. I beg to move that this house do now adjourn.
I would like to join others in congratulating the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Peterborough on her powerful Maiden speech focusing both on this week and on the wider significance of remembrance. This week has seen some fantastic events to commemorate VE Day across all parts of the UK. Rightly, veterans have been at the heart of the commemorations, with their voices and their stories being central to events. As Baroness Amos said, they are now frail but still resolute. I particularly enjoyed meeting veterans at yesterday's concert including Prince Albert Jacob, originally from Trinidad.
As Baroness Smith of Newnham said, there are increasingly few veterans with first-hand accounts of the war. I would like to join Lord Parkinson in recognising and accepting this is one of our final opportunities to say thank you and say thank you we do indeed. I agree wholeheartedly with the noble Lord about the power of the stories we have been hearing. It has been great seeing young people across the country engaging with the impact of the Second World War and to see out uniformed youth groups ably supporting events through the week, as highlighted by Lord Lingfield.
I want to thank the huge number of people who have worked tirelessly to enable this week to take place. I have no doubt would have been a mammoth effort to pull off such a spectacular program of events stop from televised events to local community commemorations, everyone involved should be particularly proud of what they have delivered as part of a nationwide program of events. I want to thank Lord Parkinson for his recognition of the work the teams including the team at DCMS. I would also like to thank colleagues and civil servants at the Ministry of defence as well as those working for Westminster City Council and Royal Parks who are clearing away the barriers and debris overnight immediately after last nights fabulous concert at Horseguards Parade.
Like many noble Lords, I have found pertinent accounts particularly moving this week including from many of us today. I have not seen the knitted tank Lord Parkinson mentioned but I am now going to look out for it. I would however urge all noble Lords who have quoted from family letters to make sure they submit them to the "Letters to loved ones" campaign. We are keen to get full recognition and reflection of those stories from across the country. So that we can remember.
I am sure that, like me, everyone who saw yesterday's service at Westminster Abbey, which I was hugely privileged to attend, was moved by the sight of Alexander Churchill lighting a candle and speaking so poignantly. And of course we are privileged to serve alongside two grandson to our great wartime leaders, Lord Attlee and Lord Soames, whose grandfather played a central role in our nation's victory was the I know Lord Soames is in the Channel Islands today as part of the liberation event as well as Minister Peacock who has had ministerial oversight of the commemorations.
It was moving to hear from my noble friend of Camden, his account of the family experience of the islanders being occupied. And their unwavering resolve. There has been significant unity across this house during this debate. We must always remain united in defence of our country and our values against fascism and against Belize. This was reflected in the words of His Majesty The King last night, it has been 80 years to the day since his own grandfather spoke to the nation.
His own mother spoke at the 75th anniversary, which fell during the difficult days of COVID. And to hear her words from the wartime diaries smoke alongside ordinary people, extraordinary ordinary people, veterans as well as those left behind. An instant point on preparedness was made by Baroness Rafferty, that I will write to her in response to that point. On 8 May 1945, Lord Coaker has said that the nation listened as were Winston Churchill stood on the balcony declaring the end of the war in Europe.
It was clear that while one victory had been secured that the war was not over. He vowed to go hand in hand without allies of the US to end the war that continues to wage in the far east. We should never forget that many continued to fight long after VE Day until 15 August 1945, when we saw Victory over Japan Day. From Britain to India to Australia and throughout the Commonwealth, the war continued to wage for many. We will remember this beyond this week's comparative events as we look to the 80th anniversary of VJ Day this summer.
It was moving to hear the account of my noble friend Baroness Hunter's parents in the Far East including the extract from her father's letter, and to hear of Lord Parkinson's uncle Bob. As Baroness Coffey said, VJ Day came after the deployment of atomic bombs which, she said, we fortunately never had to deploy subsequently. And the noble lady spoke movingly of her father's reluctance to speak about his experience in a Japanese camp. In answer to her point on remembering, the government is doing a lot of work with the Commonwealth War Graves Commission and my noble friend Lord Coaker has recently met them.
I agree with Lord Ricketts, both that we must also remember VJ Day, but that we should particularly remember the noble Lords point on the continued oppression for many decades for all too many people in Eastern Europe. This was a war that took the lives of almost 400,000 British soldiers and 70,000 British civilians. Lord Wallace of Saltaire, noble Friend Lord Boateng, Baroness Amos, and Baroness Benjamin, Lord Dubs, Lord Paddick, the Right Reverend Lord Sentamu and Baroness Harris of Richmond, and Lord Sahota rightly highlighted the hugely significant role played by the Commonwealth in the Allied victory.
Over 200,000 Commonwealth troops lost their lives, whether it was the British army fighting the western desert or Gurkhas fighting Italy. These were troops who stood up for Britain and British values. Stood up for freedom and stood up for a world free of fascism. My noble friend Lord Dubs, Lord Craig, reminded us of the part played by the volunteers from the Irish Republic. We must not, and I convert we will not, forget the concretions of all those who fought and sacrificed so much.
There was a strong reminder from my noble friend's that other faiths as well as Christianity played their part in the fight against fascism. And indeed, my father's best friend when I was growing up was a Jewish, Polish refugee to this country who flew planes for the RAF. Particularly powerful comments from Particularly powerful comments from Lord Boateng on the role of soldiers including Joseph Hammond in the 14th Army of Great Britain in Burma. The fight for self-determination free from justice will stop I know noble Lords will join me in both thanking Joseph Hammond and wish you well for his birthday.
My noble friend Baroness Amos highlighted the role of Caribbean people both in volunteering and in fundraising, but also mentioned the racism faced by veterans and the need for us to be honest about the whole of history. The noble Lady Baroness Benjamin spoke powerfully about her three uncles who fought and the two that died. And it is right that we honour the courage and dedication of all those who played their part, and Baroness Brinton my noble friend Baroness Kingsmill mentioned the role played by Anzac forces.
Whilst the subsequent period of history also had its significant challenges and conflicts, I would like to take a moment, like many noble Lords, occluding Lord Stirrup, Baroness Smith of Newnham, and my noble friend Baroness Kingsmill and others, to acknowledge the importance of the post-war order including the stability provided through bodies such as the UN and NATO. And closer European cooperation through bodies such as the Council of Europe mentioned by Baroness Brinton. Not least in bringing together former adversaries to become steadfast allies working intend to preserve the sometimes fragile peace in the later 20th century, and ensuring the horrors of the 1930s and 1940s were not repeated.
The importance of prosecuting war crimes was highlighted by Lord Bates. I will pass on his suggestion to the FCDO. As hugely powerfully outlined by the noble Earl in his opening remarks about the dangers leading up to VE Day, the Holocaust remains one of the darkest chapters in the history of the 6 million Jewish people were murdered was the government's announcement Jewish people today and always. It is important as was noted by other noble Lords to remember that Holocaust also targeted those from a range of minority groups including, as the Noble reminded us, those with disabilities are and as Baroness Hunt of Bethnal Green reminded us, gay people who were all persecuted by the Nazis, as were trade unionists.
This must not be forgotten, and the government will do everything to ensure the present and future generations remember throughout continued support the Holocaust Memorial Day Trust and the Holocaust Memorial adjacent to Parliament. Lord Wallace of Saltaire rightly highlighted the importance of younger generations living about more and the role of schools and museums including the Imperial War Museum in doing this. And Lord Farmer also highlighted the Farmer also highlighted the In relation to the curriculum review referred to by Lord Boateng and Earl Attlee the curriculum review and the importance of educating our young people, as noble Lords are aware that the DNP is seeking to deliver broad curriculum.
The intergenerational storytelling highlighted the importance of such a review in its place to ensure young people learn from our shared past. Lord Berkeley noted that not everything in our country's history is palatable. I wanted to assure my noble friend that I learned about the Boer War and British concentration camps at school and it is right that we do tell a rounded story. At the heart of this week's events has been veterans and this government is determined to support veterans both now and in the future.
I would like to echo Baroness Hunt in paying tribute to the memory and work of Lord Etherton in particular in this context his independent review into the service and experience of LGBT veteran serving between 1967 and 2000. The fight for freedom is a constant fight highlighted by the illegal invasion of Ukraine, this aggression cannot be tolerated in this government stands with Ukraine as they defend their freedom as the previous government rightly did too. As Lord Howell of Guildford said what has changed and is now almost entirely aimed at civilians.
It's also true as the noble Lord said that peace is not built on temporary foundations. All Dundee also highlighted current conflict, I would like to ensure the noble Earl that the government will do everything we can to resolve conflicts. In relation to Sudan which the noble Earl mentioned in particular that the UK continues to work with UN Security Council partners to galvanise council action on Sudan. This includes securing a UN price -- press statement on 17 April calling for the end of hostilities and full implementation of resolution 273.
A number of noble Lords raised the importance of defence spending including Baroness Porter, Lord Wallace, Lord Stirrup, Lord Shinkwin, Earl Attlee and others. There is clearly danger of not rearming and this government is very aware of that and is taking action. As noble Lords will be aware the promise to set out his commitment to increase spending on defence to 2.5% of GDP from April 2027 with an ambition to reach three% in the next Parliament. UK is determined to step up and meet this pivotal moment of global instability had on.
With a commitment we will see the biggest sustained increase in defence spending since the Cold War. Nobody could have been left unmoved by the stories from members across the logic tousled stories that bear repeating and remembering although I won't be able to repeat all of them are nor should I full stop I was particularly struck by Lord Davies of Brixton's point about how many people didn't want to talk about their experience. So it is right that we use our voice to tell their story. It was particularly moving to hear from Lord Griffiths that not all relationships survived reunion.
I think we forget that at our peril. Having known Lord Coaker for 25 years I have never before heard about his uncle's death, one of all too many young men lost all of all too many young men lost all too early. Lord Dobbs taught -- spoke movingly about his experience of the day in Manchester, has experience of the ATS women marching in Hyde Park and the horror of experiencing the camps Walti familiar no doubt to the father of my noble friend Baroness Ramsay.
I agree with Lord Dubs that we should give credit to Germany for how they faced up to their past, I would like faced up to their past, I would like to thank... I found particularly moving Lord Carter's final point in his contribution about his mother's friendship with a German mother who had lost a child. Someone with very close in recent connections I was grateful to Baroness McIntosh for speaking about the role of the UK in supporting occupied Scandinavian countries in their resistance efforts and in the liberation of Scandinavian countries that were occupied, clearly Denmark and Norway actually still feel that gratitude actually still feel that gratitude to this country.
I would like to thank Lord Lemos both for his work at in which heritage and for reminding us of the history of the Cenotaph making sure we remember the fallen and I look forward to him and his work will meet in the near future I enjoyed Lord Howell's recollection of his father's role and his desk in the war rooms, particularly my noble friend Lord Bassam is highlighting the role of auxiliaries in the fire service and this gives me the opportunity to say I had the privilege to meet a number of these women in London.
Really important reminder from Baroness Ramsay of the role of women in munitions fact -- factories and how much it is clear from her and from others that all noble Lords and all those who have treasured artefacts, family stories and family memorabilia. Very sobering to hear Lord Shinkwin's alternative vision of what might have been and important to remember how close this country came to defeat what rights and what people may have been lost as a result.
In preparing for this debate I spoke to my mother who was born shortly before the start of the war in 1939, she reminded me of how my father described sheltering under the dining hall table during air raids in Nottingham. My dad also had a Mickey Mouse gas mask like Lord Anderson of Swansea. My mum definitely use the phrase have you got any chum done when trying to get during gum from US soldiers. Both my parents shared Lord Hacking's recollection of the blackout.
My mother also remembered the sound of laughter and the piano downstairs as her parents opened up their home in Kirkwall to Armed Forces based in Albany some guests became friends for life but on occasions these were fleeting friendships with their many particular pains return despite the song we meet again being hugely iconic and popular refrain play through events this week all too often people did not meet again. My grandfather was a civil servant in a protected position and I understand he was felt guilty for not fighting.
From my perspective I appreciated the focus during this debate on the work of those who contributed at home and as Baroness Warwick highlighted, on the homefront this week from, and Baroness Hunter reminded us of the invaluable role of women in the SOA behind enemy lines and the Right Reverend Prelate the Bishop of Southwell and Nottingham reminded us of the role of army chaplains and Lord Lingfield highlighted rightly the role of the We have heard the importance of marking the 80th anniversary of VE Day and VJ Day.
We are clear and united across the House, we must ensure the legacies of those who survived in jaw. I would like to thank all noble Lords here today and all those who have taken part this week including the Parliament Choir performance on Wednesday which was highlighted by my noble friend Baroness Warwick. It has been a huge contribution by many people across your Lordships House and beyond cross-country to the commemoratives events. I think it is right to conclude by thanking the veterans who are still alive today, and to the soldiers, civilians, all those who fought to secure peace between 1939 and 1949, and to our Armed Forces for what they continue to do today to keep us free, to keep us safe, and to keep us being able to
**** Possible New Speaker ****
have debates of this type. The question is that this motion be agreed to. As many are of that opinion say, "Content". Of the contrary, "Not content". The contents have it.
**** Possible New Speaker ****
contents have it. I beg to move that this house do now adjourn.
15:15
15:25
15:29
15:34
15:42