Undocumented Migrants

Lord Hanson of Flint Excerpts

Tuesday 16th September 2025 Lords Chamber

[Lord Massey of Hampstead]

To ask His Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the specific factors driving the increase in the number of undocumented migrants leaving France to enter the United Kingdom.

[The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Hanson of Flint) (Lab)]

The Government are committed to tackling illegal migration and the criminal networks that are behind it. There is no single universal push or pull factor independently driving irregular migration to the UK. In many cases, migrants are directed or coerced by organised criminal networks. That is why the Government’s focus is on tackling criminal gangs and securing ground-breaking co-operation with international partners while keeping all issues under review.

[Lord Massey of Hampstead (Con)]

The Home Secretary recently issued a statement with positive plans to deal with the crisis in relation to small boats. But, as we witnessed yesterday, even the deportation of a very small number of people back to France proved impossible. The focus of successive Governments on the criminal gangs and attempts to reach agreement with France has not impacted on numbers at all thus far. We are perceived quite widely as a soft touch, and our compassion is being exploited. So what further plans do the Government have to address the specific issues that make the UK so attractive relative to France? Does the noble Lord share my concern that the problem could get worse as European countries tighten their own immigration rules?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I reassure the noble Lord that the UK Government are not a soft touch. He will know that, through the immigration Bill, we are putting in place a Border Force command. We have employed 200 staff since last year to up our efforts on that. We have put an extra £150 million into Border Force funding. We have signed the agreement with France, and I can tell the noble Lord that returns are imminent and that that agreement is in place, delivering detention of individuals for return to France. Irrespective of that, we are also tackling some of the illegal migration and putting extra efforts into focusing on that undercover activity that allows people to work. I can give the noble Lord, outside the Chamber, a great deal of statistics on that result. We are not a soft touch; we are taking action and intend to reduce that flow over time.

[The Lord Speaker (Lord McFall of Alcluith)]

My Lords, I call the noble Lord, Lord Campbell-Savours, who is participating remotely.

[Lord Campbell-Savours (Lab) [V]]

My Lords, surely if we really want to reduce undocumented migrant movement pull factors, we should stop the emphasis on the resolution of conflict through costly military interventions that provoke worldwide population movements and plunder our development aid budgets. Is not the answer, in part, to more greatly resource third-world development, with measures to de-escalate conflict and—the holy grail—to re-examine the world’s commitment to the principle of prohibited intervention in failing states, as defined by the ICJ?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I will share part of my noble friend’s analysis, in that factors of war, poverty and starvation are driving migration from many parts of the world into western Europe. He will know that my right honourable friend the Prime Minister, and other European countries and international partners, are looking at what those driving factors are. Part of the overall strategy needs to be how we deal with poverty, hunger, starvation and the impact of war. There are times when the UK and other partners need to help and support interventions, but I take the first part of my noble friend’s question extremely seriously, and that is something our international partners are very focused on.

[Lord German (LD)]

The Government’s French scheme has the benefit of giving us a safe route for people to come to this country. However, as the noble Lord has explained, it will not work unless it is ramped up. So would I be wrong in my expectation that the ramping up of the scheme will take place some time before the end of next year? In the meantime, what is happening to those who are now legally going to come to the United Kingdom? How are they being assessed, by whom, and where?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

As noble Lords will know, we have negotiated the French pilot for the first time with the French to ensure that we have detention in the UK and return to France. As I said in answer to the noble Lord, Lord Massey, we intend to have returns under that scheme imminently. That is a pilot scheme; it will be assessed, and the intention, if both parties think it is valuable, is to increase its capacity over time to meet our obligations. In the meantime, there are a number of legal routes that people can apply to. There are asylum claims that individuals can make. We have put in additional support to speed up those asylum claims to determine who can stay and who can go. It is the responsibility of any responsible Government to try to deal with this with constructive solutions, of which I know the noble Lord is supportive. I look forward to his support in evaluating the success of the French pilot.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

Does my noble friend agree that we would be in a far better position to deal with issues like border security, access to services and knowing who is in the country illegally and who is not if the last Labour Government’s identity card scheme had not been scrapped by the Tories and the Liberals?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I am grateful to my noble friend for reminding me that, when I was last a Minister in the Home Office, we had an identity card scheme in place that was scrapped by the then-incoming Coalition Government of 2010-2015. It is an expensive business to re-jig ID cards, but all options are always being examined by this Government. I am genuinely sorry that the Coalition Government took the decision at the time to scrap that deal.

[Lord Davies of Gower (Con)]

My Lords, leading on from the question from my noble friend Lord Massey, this week we were due to see the start of the Government’s much-vaunted one-in, one-out returns deal with France. However, due to the ongoing human rights claims and last-minute legal challenges, no one has yet returned to France, on the flights that left yesterday or today. Does the Minister not think that now is the time to endorse Conservative proposals to disapply the Human Rights Act from immigration and asylum matters to prevent this very issue occurring in the future?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

That was another good effort from the noble Lord to try to get me to say “yes” to an answer to which he knows I am going to say “no”. Amendments can be made to the ECHR, and the Government intend to make those amendments to ensure that we will make changes, particularly in relation to Article 8, and provide better interpretation for judges. On the French scheme, removals are imminent. It is a scheme his Government did not negotiate, and one that, hopefully, this Government and our French colleagues are going to make work to ensure that we have a proper deterrent and return people—unlike the wasteful Rwanda scheme, which achieved absolutely nothing and which the noble Lord supported.

[The Lord Bishop of Chelmsford]

My Lords, Home Office analysis of the factors that influence where people claim asylum highlights that the presence of family exerts a particularly strong effect on decisions on the ultimate country of destination. Given this finding, what assessment have the Government made of how the pause in family reunion applications might impact the level of channel crossings?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I am grateful to the right reverend Prelate for that question. I will certainly drop her a note after Question Time to give her detail on how we are examining the family reunion policy and the impact on children. I am afraid that in a 25-second answer I cannot sum up the detail that I would like to, but I will certainly write to her on that point.

[Baroness Hoey (Non-Afl)]

My Lords, has Minister had any recent discussions with the Irish Government about the fact that there are so many migrants—some illegal, some not so illegal—coming across the border into Northern Ireland and then on into the rest of the United Kingdom? The Irish Government are now stopping people going the other way. Are His Majesty’s Government taking this as something that needs to be looked into very quickly?

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

The noble Baroness raises an important point. The UK Government continually discuss with the Irish Government the impact of a range of matters on the border between Northern Ireland and the Irish Republic, including access to the rest of the United Kingdom via Northern Ireland and Ireland. It is extremely important, and we are focusing on that. I will certainly report back to the noble Baroness on that issue.

[Viscount Goschen (Con)]

My Lords, does one of the principal answers to this question lie in the statistics the Minister was kind enough to give me last week: of the 160,000 small-boat arrivals since 2018, only 4% have been returned? In other words, if you come here illegally in a small boat, you stand a 96% chance of not being returned.

[Lord Hanson of Flint (Lab)]

I did give those statistics to the noble Viscount, but I can also give him some more today if it helps. For example, between 1 January and 1 September this year, nearly 17,000 crossing attempts were stopped by joint action between the French and the British. Those do not show up in the statistics I gave the noble Viscount earlier. I can also tell him that in the past 12 months and in the period just before, 245 years of custodial sentence have been given to people traffickers who have been caught and captured. This is a very extreme challenge—let us not get away from it. We have to accept asylum seekers, we have to speed up the claims of those asylum seekers, and we have to determine who has a right to be here and who has to leave; but we have to stop at source the pernicious trade that is forcing people through illegal migration routes.