Carbon Capture, Usage and Storage

Judith Cummins Excerpts

Monday 7th October 2024 Commons Chamber

[Ed Miliband]

I thank my hon. Friend for his question; he makes a really important point. Some people are sceptical about the use of carbon capture and storage. The truth is that for hard-to-abate industries—cement, for example—unless we have CCS technology, either there will be no future for these industries or they will not be able to decarbonise. Yes, it is an investment, but it is absolutely crucial, and I am struck by what the IEA said. We are talking about probably 20% of industry, and we are doing the right thing for Britain and setting an example to the world.

I always say on these occasions that, when it comes to blue hydrogen and gas with CCUS, we need all the technologies at our disposal on this decarbonisation journey. It is going to be a primarily renewables-based system, but nuclear has an important role and we need dispatchable decarbonised or low-carbon generation as well. All these things have a role, and the pathway will become clearer over time, but this issue is so urgent that I want to have all the technologies at our disposal.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

I call the Lib Deb spokesperson.

[Pippa Heylings (South Cambridgeshire) (LD)]

I thank the Secretary of State for his statement. The Liberal Democrats are committed to supporting British industries in cutting carbon emissions and getting the country back on track towards meeting our climate targets. It cannot be emphasised enough how significant it is that this announcement comes at the same time as we hear about the UK being the first industrial nation to close its last coal-fired power plant. We had been dependent on coal for 150 years, so that is absolutely key.

It is clear that the future lies with renewables and clean energy, where we need to bring urgency and the necessary scale of investment. The Conservative Government’s irresponsible roll-back from key climate pledges, and their failure to invest properly in renewable energy and home insulation, has left thousands of households vulnerable to fuel poverty as another winter approaches. The failure to move forward at pace in decarbonising our industries, our transport and our homes has left us needing to take difficult decisions. We support the need, recognised by the Climate Change Committee, for at-scale, long-term investment in CCS, particularly for hard-to-decarbonise industries such as chemicals, cement and steel manufacturing. We would like to see investment in existing industries, and we want it to meet environmental requirements.

While we are discussing history, I should mention that it was my right hon. Friend the Member for Kingston and Surbiton (Ed Davey) who launched carbon capture and storage, which was yet again cancelled by the Conservatives. However, although carbon capture and storage is a key tool in reaching net zero, it is also very expensive and complex, and evidence of its efficacy is still scant. Understandably, as the Secretary of State mentioned, there is much concern about the focus on incentivising industries to invest in CCS as an alternative to radically reducing their emissions. Therefore, it is important that the Government set out clearly and transparently the path to delivery for any CCS they invest in and show the milestones for progress. What will the Secretary of State do to increase investment—

[Madam Deputy Speaker]

Order. I call the Secretary of State.

[Ed Miliband]

May I begin by welcoming the hon. Lady to her place, and thanking her for the tone and substance of her remarks? She is right to underline the fact that we are marking a new era but also marking the passing of an era, and it is right to pay tribute to all the people who worked in our coal-fired power stations and, indeed, who worked underground to dig coal for our country. It is a big moment of change and the passing of an era.

On the hon. Lady’s broad points about CCS, my philosophy is that we want zero-carbon power where possible, but we also need carbon capture, particularly for hard-to-abate sectors and so that we can have not unabated gas, but gas with CCS or hydrogen power. She raises the question of cost. Imagine if we had had this conversation 15 years ago, when I was Secretary of State and much younger—15 years younger, to be precise. [Interruption.] Yes, I am good at maths. Some people were saying at the time, “Why are you subsidising offshore wind? It can never be competitive with fossil fuels.” Now, it is among the cheapest technologies to build and operate. That is what deployment does for us, and that is what the combination of public and private sectors working together does for us. Yes, there is an investment here, but a far-sighted, forward-looking Government have to make such investments, and I welcome the hon. Lady’s support.

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[Ed Miliband]

I am all in favour of big tomatoes and improving our food security. The hon. Gentleman makes an important point about the potential uses of CCUS. On Friday, we were at a glass factory that will be using hydrogen from a new project and will be the beneficiary of a decarbonised supply. I look forward to further discussions with the hon. Gentleman.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

And the final word goes to Jim Shannon.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Maybe not the final word, Madam Deputy Speaker, as that will be for the Secretary of State. I welcome the statement, in which he rightly underlined that anybody who ignores carbon capture, use and storage does so at their peril, and the Government’s commitment to carbon capture. While the amount set aside is incredible, so too is the requirement that every penny brings an achievement. How will the Secretary of State ensure that each region of the United Kingdom is involved in this net gain? I say to him gently that Northern Ireland is not mentioned in his statement; I am sure he will address that issue. There must be accountability to ensure the realisation of environmental goals, rather than simply the aspiration of achieving them.

Making Britain a Clean Energy Superpower

Judith Cummins Excerpts

Friday 26th July 2024 Commons Chamber

[Deirdre Costigan (Ealing Southall) (Lab)]

Many of my constituents in Ealing Southall are incredibly excited by the Minister’s plans for Great British Energy, for taking back control of our energy system and for lowering the bills of hard-pressed families, but does he agree that the Conservative party will have confused many of my residents with its support for public ownership of energy infrastructure only by foreign Governments, and not by the British Government? Taking into account his great plans to make this country an energy superpower, does he agree—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

Order.

[Michael Shanks]

I thank the hon. Lady for her helpful intervention, and I am very happy to agree with her. There is confusion at the heart of the Conservative party’s plans. They have been very happy to hand over key parts of our national infrastructure to foreign Governments, for the profits go to the public in those countries, but they have been ideologically opposed to any suggestion that the British taxpayer should have any stake in those futures. That is something that we will turn around.

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[Michael Shanks]

I will carry on, if that is okay.

We will ensure that we have a regulator that fights for consumers as well. We have seen repeated failures in recent years, including the scandal of the forced installation of prepayment meters, poor customer service, and consumers picking up the cost when companies go to the wall. The Government will overhaul the mandate, powers, remit and redress of Ofgem, and we will reduce the burden of standing charges, which have risen by £150 since the start of 2022. We will hold companies to account for wrongdoing and ensure that there is automatic compensation for those failed by their energy supplier.

Finally, the next 18 months in the run-up to COP30 are critical to ramping up and delivering on our global climate commitments. Britain must and will regain its influence on the international stage, so we will work with international partners to raise ambitions, including by leading a clean power alliance that brings together a coalition of countries to accelerate the clean energy transition.

The Government’s clean energy mission and our wider energy agenda are critical, not just for that international leadership, but as a route to lower bills, energy security and good, long-term jobs. There is no doubt that we are playing catch-up. If we succeed—and success is vital for all of the reasons that I have outlined—the benefits will be substantial and felt by everyone long into the future. We have wasted no time as a Government getting started in pursuing this mission and I look forward to the contributions of hon. Members across the House, so that together we can deliver this critical agenda for the future of our country.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

I call the Opposition spokesperson.

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[Mary Glindon]

That is exactly what the companies are telling me and, as a member of the former all-party parliamentary group on oil and gas, I know it has often been said.

The people working in these industries are worried about how their lives will change if they are not able to adapt to new industries. These are important jobs in our communities, where sweeping job losses are still in people’s memories. In Newcastle upon Tyne East and Wallsend, it is not uncommon to speak to people who were affected or know someone who was affected by the de-industrialisation of the 1980s. The closure of the pits, shipyards and factories ruined people’s faith in politics and the economy for a generation.

The offshore energy sector includes independent oil and gas producers, large integrated energy multinationals, renewable energy companies and a supply chain that we need to keep here in the UK. That includes companies in my constituency, such as Baker Hughes and Peterson, which operate right across the UK and, indeed, the globe. These companies have the vision and ambition, which we all share, to deliver a home-grown energy transition and net zero. Almost £200 billion will potentially be spent over the decade, but the companies investing in nascent opportunities such as floating offshore wind and carbon capture and storage will require the cash flow from a stable and predictable oil and gas business to fund these opportunities.

I welcome Labour’s manifesto commitment to manage the North sea in a way that does not jeopardise jobs. However, I would be grateful if the Minister could set out, in practical terms, how he will safeguard important jobs and investment in communities like mine. Britain’s potential to become a clean energy superpower is not only exciting but necessary. As the Government accelerate this journey, I urge Ministers to ensure that no one is left behind.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

I call the Liberal Democrat spokesperson.

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[Wera Hobhouse]

Indeed, there are not easy answers to all these questions. We need to look at the fine balance of cost versus getting community buy-in. There is going to be a transformation of our landscape, and we need to be aware of that. We must also make a good case for why it is urgent that we get to net zero, and in my view that balance in the argument was not struck properly by the previous Government. It is important that communities buy into our big landscape transformation, but it is also important that we do this at an affordable cost for the whole of the UK.

We Liberal Democrats are calling for all new homes to be net zero immediately. It is crazy that we are building homes today that will need upgrading in a few years’ time. We are proposing a 10-year emergency upgrade programme for homes, starting with free insulation and heat pumps for those on low incomes. That will not happen without incentivising private landlords and having tougher energy efficiency targets. The private rental sector has the most energy-inefficient homes. Nearly half of households living in these properties are in fuel poverty, but local authorities have taken limited action to enforce minimum energy efficiency standards.

Whether it is tighter regulation on private landlords or further sanctions to ensure that they comply, the Government must put their mind to the private rental sector. We will ensure that energy efficiency for rentals is not brushed under the carpet. That includes incentives for the private rental sector. From discussions in the previous Parliament, I know that the Labour party is relatively reluctant to give money to private landlords, but without incentivising the private rental sector, I do not think that a home insulation programme will happen, particularly for low-income families. I urge the Government to think about that.

As well as landlords, businesses must be incentivised to invest in the green transition. The U-turning of the Conservative Government sparked immense distrust from industry, with the UK chair of Ford warning that her business needs three things from the Government: ambition, commitment and consistency. That is exactly what they must deliver. Years of stop-start investment have left the energy sector reeling. Businesses and trade organisations have long been calling for a detailed plan of action that offers the clarity and certainty that will make the UK an attractive country to invest in. I hope that this Government can finally deliver the certainty that the country so badly needs.

Climate change is happening, but every cloud has a silver lining. Seizing the economic opportunities of net zero will help us spread wealth and opportunity to every corner of the UK. From insulating homes to providing thousands of new jobs in the energy sector, it is clear that everyone can benefit from a thriving green economy. I look forward to working constructively with the new Government to combat climate change, reduce energy bills and be a leader in the journey to net zero.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

Due to the large number of maiden speeches, and the fact that I want to get everybody in, I am now imposing a six-minute time limit—with the exception of maiden speeches. I call Jess Asato.

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[Seamus Logan (Aberdeenshire North and Moray East) (SNP)]

It is my pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Bathgate and Linlithgow (Kirsteen Sullivan). I congratulate her on her eloquent and passionate speech, and particularly on her call for gender balance. I am sorry to tell her, though, that her use of the native tongue appears to have brought the hon. Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Torcuil Crichton) back to the Chamber. Whether that is to congratulate her or correct her, I am not quite sure.

Moving swiftly on, the area that I am privileged to represent has been at the heart of the UK’s energy production for 50 years and more, and it is now poised to be at the forefront of a renewable energy revolution. Frankly, we could and should be much further along the road to energy transition, but we are where we are. The Government have said that they want us to become a clean energy superpower, but I regret that they have scaled back on their original ambitions to invest £28 billion in order to realise that goal. Nevertheless, I hope that they will chart a pragmatic and constructive way forward.

The journey to net zero is well under way in Scotland, with estimates suggesting that the renewables sector already supports around 42,000 jobs. The UK, though, is behind schedule when it comes to investing in the infrastructure, including the grid infrastructure, that those projects will require. The unrealistic pricing of contracts for difference has held back the development of offshore wind. The new Government need to address that issue with the same urgency with which they are moving on other matters.

The north-east of Scotland has been the European capital of oil and gas for many decades. Now we have the opportunity to be the net zero capital. We have enormous potential to capitalise on offshore wind generation and the development of green hydrogen. These are time-limited opportunities, especially as we have ambitions to develop lucrative supply chains, as well as technologies and manufacturing that have significant export potential. In the longer term, that would be the prize for our economic future.

I want to impress on Ministers today the case for bringing the HQ of GB Energy to the north-east of Scotland. Just look at a map: the bulk of offshore renewables production will be within a 100-mile radius of Aberdeen. The ports that will be essential to servicing the sector, most notably Peterhead and Fraserburgh in my constituency, are on the east coast, close to the Moray Firth. There are also important potential roles for smaller ports. We already have a workforce with relevant skills and unrivalled experience. We also have the most to lose; according to research published last year by Robert Gordon University, around one in five jobs across north-east Scotland is in the oil and gas sector. I do not want to see a repeat of what the Thatcher Government did in mining and steelmaking communities across Scotland and elsewhere. Perhaps as much as 80% of skills in oil and gas are crossover skills. We must support that crossover.

Successive UK Governments have used the North sea as a cash cow. Some £10.6 billion flowed into the Treasury coffers in 2022-23, but there has not been a great deal to show for it in Aberdeen city or Aberdeenshire, in terms of infrastructure or investment in that crucial transition. I hope that can change going forward.

As we debate the need to address climate change, improve energy security and deliver a fairer deal for consumers, it is important to acknowledge the reality: we will continue to need oil and gas for some time to come. Many of us are still using gas to heat our home. Fuel poverty is very real. High standing charges and a cold climate is a brutal combination that pushes thousands upon thousands of households into energy poverty. Most of us still use cars that run on petrol or diesel. In areas like mine, where distances are greater, public transport is more limited. Colder winter temperatures mean electric vehicles work less well and the use of traditional vehicles is accentuated. Our reliance on fossil fuels is falling, but it is not about to disappear. Oil and gas will continue to be part of our energy mix for some time, which is why it is important that ongoing production is in line with climate compatibility criteria, and is managed in a way that does not lead to a premature winding down of production in the North sea. However, the current fiscal regime for North sea production has created a very real and present risk. It has the potential to cost thousands of jobs and saddle the Treasury with cumulative decommisioning costs.

I ask Ministers to look at the impact that the energy profits levy has had on jobs and productivity, consider the role of the energy security investment mechanism, and acknowledge the importance of investment allowances. Why? Because the fiscal regime in the North sea is holding back investment in energy transition. We need to recognise that North sea operators are, in many cases, those who are making the biggest investment in renewables. If the Government really want to unlock the potential of the renewable energy sector, they need to work with those who can invest on the scale required and over the necessary timeframes, and who already have an experienced, expert workforce at their disposal. I would welcome the Minister’s comments, in his summing up, on the Government’s plans for a fairer fiscal environment across the energy sector.

I will make one final point, on carbon capture and storage. We need to press on with projects such as the Acorn project at St Fergus precisely because they are cutting edge and have tremendous potential to create new technology, knowledge and expertise. We have a globally competitive subsea supply chain in the north-east of Scotland. We excel in developing solutions to technical challenges. We see challenges as opportunities, and we seek to be leaders in innovative new technologies. There is the potential to deliver fair energy prices for consumers, improve energy security and help us to meet our international climate obligations. The north-east of Scotland and communities in my constituency in particular will be at the centre of the changes ahead. I urge Ministers to make good on their promises, and deliver a managed and just transition for those workers and communities on the frontline.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

I call Douglas McAllister to make his maiden speech.

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[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

Order. I will start the Front-Bench wind-ups at 2.10 pm. I call James MacCleary to make his maiden speech.

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[Olivia Blake (Sheffield Hallam) (Lab)]

Not a day goes by when the consequences of our inaction are not hideously illustrated. The wildfires in Canada today should shock us all into action, with 25,000 people having been displaced from their homes. The previous Government continually poured fuel on the fires of the climate crisis, entrenching our reliance on volatile international markets, but this Government have plans to totally turn the corner.

Our journey to becoming a clean energy superpower is not only an environmental imperative but a chance for economic growth and to address the cost of living crisis while making Britain energy-independent. That is why I welcome the Government’s plan to launch Great British Energy, a publicly owned company funded by making big oil and gas pay their fair share from the incredible windfalls they have been receiving. This initiative demonstrates a strong commitment to cutting carbon emissions and embracing renewables. It is a crucial step to lowering our bills through a zero-carbon electricity system.

It is so important that we ensure that this step is co-ordinated, working with new initiatives such as Skills England to ensure that across the board we are increasing training opportunities, especially in key areas such as maritime apprenticeships, which will help with our offshore wind efforts. It is also incredibly important that we unlock the potential of community energy, which has a vast untapped potential for smaller scale renewable schemes that could be owned and operated by local communities, building that resilience into our communities directly. Realising that potential would bring clean, affordable and secure energy to local people.

I very much look forward to working with the Front-Bench team on these issues, and supporting the Bill as it makes its passage through this House. I congratulate the Minister on his appointment.

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

I call the Opposition spokesperson.

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[Carla Denyer]

The hon. Member for Mid Buckinghamshire (Greg Smith) raised a concern about solar threatening our ability to grow our own food in this country. I respectfully suggest that he checks out the recent research by Exeter University, which shows that we could increase the amount of renewable energy we generate in this country 13 times over using, I believe, less than 3% of the UK’s land, and none of the highest-grade agricultural land—

[Madam Deputy Speaker (Judith Cummins)]

Order. I call the Minister.

[Michael Shanks]

That is a helpful contribution, and I thank the hon. Lady for it. Even if we reached our solar target by 2030, it is a very small amount of land that would be used for what is an important part of our energy infrastructure.

A number of other points were made in this debate that underline how complex some of these decisions are going to be, but also the huge opportunities we have. A number of Members spoke about the industrial opportunity that will come from this green transition, and a number offered up examples from their own constituencies relating to the role of skills, which is going to be so important. The sense that this is the mission that we need to be on together as a country is also important, because it will take all of us—with all of our expertise, and the challenge that comes from the Opposition—to make the right decisions so that we can have a long-term plan that delivers the net zero future that we need.

Before summing up, I will return to some of the maiden speeches. In particular, taking advantage of being at the Dispatch Box, I want to highlight my colleagues from Scotland who have been returned to this Parliament, who made some fantastic speeches. It was brilliant to hear my hon. Friend the Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar (Torcuil Crichton) speak in Gaelic during his contribution, which was fantastic. I am disappointed that more of our Lobby colleagues were not in the Chamber to hear him do that, but I am sure they will catch up. The point he made about the importance of involving communities in this future was also made by a number of hon. Members. That needs to take two parts: it needs to be consent and consultation, but it also needs to be a recognition of what the rewards for those communities should be. There are a number of options, because not all communities are aligned on what they think that reward should look like, but it is going to be a critical part going forward.

There were a number of quotes that I will look up in Hansard. My hon. Friend the Member for Na h-Eileanan an Iar talked about being seasoned with salt, which was wonderful. My hon. Friend the Member for Glasgow South West (Dr Ahmed) spoke about seeing the world through the long lens: having the discipline to look at some of these difficult, challenging public priorities and recognising that some of the benefits of what we are doing now will not be seen in the next five or 10 years, but it is none the less important to start the work, is something that we in this place can all bear in mind.

To conclude, since the summer recess is fast approaching, I could not help but notice that as a result of all the maiden speeches, we have produced something of our own staycation guide as we have gone around the House. Very quickly, I will just mention my hon. Friend the Member for Lowestoft (Jess Asato), the lido and the safari; the Turner art gallery in East Thanet; Barra, the jewel of the Hebrides with its whisky and salmon in Na h-Eileanan an Iar; the Norman castle in Waveney Valley; Bellahouston park in Glasgow South West, which I know well; one of Becket’s miracles—fantastic; I am going to see the hon. Member for South Northamptonshire (Sarah Bool) about that, and also because I now know that she is the one in the Chamber with sweeties, which is very helpful—and the Open championship in Central Ayrshire. My hon. Friend the Member for Central Ayrshire (Alan Gemmell) has the privilege of representing the constituency that I was born in, and he made a wonderful speech today. I will also mention Aldo’s chippy in Bathgate, Dumbarton castle in West Dunbartonshire, and the delight of being burnt as an effigy in Lewes. I thank the hon. Member for Lewes (James MacCleary) for concluding the debate.

With the 15 seconds that I have left, I thank all right hon. and hon. Members who have participated in the debate. I hope that this is the first of many for them, and that there continues to be a genuine exchange of ideas across the House.

Question put and agreed to.

Resolved,

That this House has considered the matter of making Britain a clean energy superpower.

Cavity Wall Insulation: Government Support

Judith Cummins Excerpts

Wednesday 21st February 2024 Westminster Hall

[Hywel Williams (Arfon) (PC)]

I beg to move,

That this House has considered Government support for cavity wall insulation.

It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Henderson, in this debate on cavity wall insulation. I might even say that this is yet another case of déjà vu, given that I have been here before with similar debates, in 2014 and 2017. Alas, some of the problems have not been remedied.

I will explain very briefly for those who may not be familiar with cavity wall insulation that it fills the cavity between the exterior and the internal skin of a house with a material that insulates the house and keeps heat in, and it is a commendable way of doing things, if circumstances allow. Unfortunately, in most of western Britain, where there is wind-driven rain and high rainfall, the wind drives rain in through any cracks or faults in the exterior coating of the house, and the cavity wall insulation acts as a bridge, transmitting the water into the house, which leads to damp, mould and a host of other problems. I will not go into that any further, although I have become slightly expert in the functioning of cavity wall insulation, given the number of times that I have looked at the issue.

The cavity wall insulation scheme was financed with money from the green initiatives that the Government had at the time. It seemed to be particularly targeted at people of modest means, including people who were older or disabled. In fact, I have heard many people who have had damp problems say that a man came to the door and said, “This is a Government scheme. It will save you £350 per year and it’s free. Can we put it in?”, whereupon most people said, “Yes, of course,” because they imagined that it was guaranteed, certain to work, and suitable both for their premises and for the area they lived in. Cleary, it would also better their living conditions and allow them to save energy and to do their bit on climate change.

My area is one where cavity wall insulation is clearly unsuitable; as I said, it has westerly winds, wind-driven rain and heavy rainfall. Many properties actually face the sea. In fact, in the very first case of cavity wall insulation problems that I came across, when we looked out of the front window, where the damp was coming in, we could actually see the sea. That was one of the reasons why that house had so many problems.

The system failed in many ways. I will briefly address several points; there is no point in rehearsing them, because the Minister and others are already familiar with them. When places were allegedly assessed, in too many cases cavity wall insulation was installed where clearly an assessment would have contraindicated it, for example in places where the rendering was very poor.

I do not intend to go into individual cases, because the Minister clearly cannot take them up now—they are historical—and I would be here all day if I did, but I will give some examples. I saw one house, a former council house that had been bought by the tenants, that had a piece of the front rendering about the size of a fireplace missing from the front of the house. The house was on an upland site, facing the sea, and rain was being driven at the bricks where the pointing was faulty and going straight through into the house, causing huge amounts of damp. That case was fairly typical. I asked them whether they had been assessed and they said, “No. They just came here and offered to do it, and we took it.”

Often, the installation was of poor quality. Again, I will just give a quick example. An elderly lady told me that some men came to her door late at night and said that they had one installation to do during the day, and that they were very keen to help her and so on. She was very keen to have the insulation, so they put it in for her. She said, “They were so keen—very nice lads. That they put it in using torches”—they had no lights. When people chased after the installers subsequently, they found that many had gone bust—they had closed down, or become insolvent.

[Judith Cummins (Bradford South) (Lab)]

The hon. Member is making a compelling argument. I commend him for his steadfast work on the issue over the years. Several of my constituents have contacted me after an insulation company canvassed and encouraged them to have insulation installed in the cavity walls of their homes through the green homes grant. They have since discovered that the insulation installed was entirely inappropriate for their properties, and they are now experiencing damp and mould. One constituent told me that CIVALLI—the Cavity Insulation Victims Alliance—has estimated the cost of damage to her home at about £120,000, which is substantial considering that the average cost of a home in my constituency is around £180,000.

In pursuing compensation for damage, several of my constituents engaged the services of a law company called SSB Law on a no win, no fee basis. After SSB Law fell into administration, the lawyers of the insulation company sent letters to my constituents demanding that they pay legal fees that could amount to tens of thousands of pounds. This is, quite frankly, a scandal and a disgrace, as not only do they now have considerable damage to their homes, but they have to pay the additional legal costs on top. With cowboy companies using Government grants and public funds to install unsuitable insulation that causes damage to homes, does the hon. Member—and, indeed, the Minister—agree that there must be an urgent investigation by the Public Accounts Committee into the misuse of public funds by these insulation companies?

[Hywel Williams]

I am grateful to the hon. Member for that point; she makes the case succinctly. My area and other areas in Wales are known as legal aid deserts, and that encourages people to seek out no win, no fee companies. In my area, we tend to go to Merseyside, Manchester, Birmingham and even London—these companies are uncontrollable. The circumstances she outlines are tragic and costs of £120,000 are quite extraordinary, but the damage can be very large scale indeed.

I have asked in the past about the review of installations—whether they were inspected. Allegedly, 5% were, but to be frank, I have scarcely come across a single case where an installation has been inspected, found to be defective and resolved. I am not saying that that does not happen, but I am sure it could be done much more effectively.

There is so much that I could say. Another interesting point is that cavity wall insulation was specifically excluded from building standards when it was brought in under the scheme, so given that local authorities are not responsible, people cannot get redress in that way either.

Members might know that there is a guarantee scheme, but many of my constituents who have tried to claim have found the process quite difficult. The victims groups CIVALLI tells me that there have been rumours, although it has not been officially confirmed, that the main guarantee provider, the Cavity Insulation Guarantee Agency, has had financial difficulties because of the number of claims. Perhaps I will talk about that later if I have time. One complaint is that the small print of the guarantee says that the place in question must be properly maintained, but many people who had cavity wall insulation installed were older or suffered some disability, so were scarcely in a situation to climb up ladders to look for micro-cracks in the rendering of west-facing walls. That maintenance clause became very prominent in the refusal to take matters further. As someone once said, the large print giveth and the small print taketh away. That has certainly happened for some people.

Let me turn to removal and repair. CIVALLI says that installation and extraction should be done by separate providers, each with proper accreditation, for example by TrustMark or Oscar. The scheme was set up with insufficient supervision, which allowed in what I can only call cowboy installers—those who sensed that there was money here, but who subsequently disappeared or went bust. Removal is not easy. For example, I have had cases of people having stuff removed twice, and in one case it caused dry rot as well. The dry rot was attended to twice, and when the owner came to sell the house, although the probable price was about £180,000, I think she got about £50,000, because the problems were still there.

CIVALLI has done heroic work to try to get something done, but outstanding cases remain, as I outlined in my speech on 19 April 2017. The Minister at the time told me that CIGA said that there were 3,663 recorded cases, of which it had resolved 2,939, while 724 had been resolved by installers. I am interested in the number and prevalence of cases, because although I have come across a great many in my constituency, I have seen no official estimates of how many installations were carried out in the first place, how many people then found them to be faulty, how many have sought redress through the guarantee schemes, or how many of those cases were successful. Those basic facts would be useful.

My researcher found that CIGA says that the number of claims under that scheme are declining, from 4,806 in 2018 to 2,300 in 2023, but obviously there are many claims left, and there is a question as to whether they have been settled satisfactorily. I would be interested to hear any assessment by the Government of the number of remaining cases or of the cost of remediation. The hon. Member for Bradford South (Judith Cummins) mentioned the figure of £120,000. I have no idea how much the cost will be, but even £10,000 is a great deal of money, and the victims are probably in no position to pay.

I would also be interested in the demographic make-up of the group of victims, so that we can get a grip on the size and nature of the problem. Are they, as I suspect, older and disabled people—poorer people, actually, some of them? One must also ask what the victims actually want. I am in no position to say, but I would guess that they definitely want the damp fixed, the dry rot fixed, if there is any, their homes restored to their previous standard, and an acknowledgement of fault—an acknowledgement that they are victims and that they have done something that should not have led to this situation. As I said, people subscribed to the scheme thinking that it would save them money and that they would be doing something about climate change.

I have asked the Minister a number of practical questions that I realise she cannot answer today, so I would be glad to hear from her in writing on some of these points. However, I think that ultimately the Government should shoulder what is their own responsibility. That would be the right thing to do and would also counter any lack of confidence in other green schemes in the future, which is obviously a potential problem. CIVALLI is calling on the UK Government to take direct control of CIGA and ensure that it offers proper remediation to victims, not cash compensation. People want their houses fixed; it is not a matter of money. CIVALLI also says that victims should be able to have an accredited surveyor visit their homes to do a proper audit, and that if they have been identified as victims of improper cavity wall installation, they should have access to Government funding.

As I said, I have no idea how long this piece of string is—how big the problem might be—but I was interested to see the case of Fishwick in Preston, where external insulation was fitted with damage to homes and danger to residents. The cost of remediation was huge, but the installers have disappeared. I understand that National Energy Action was able to get involved in that case and put in the appropriate work. I will not go into the report that I have had, which is rather long, but the case of Fishwick might set a precedent for residents not being held responsible. I would be glad if the Minister could say something about that now or in writing.

I do not know if any of this is possible. Whatever is done is long overdue. Is it not time to establish a quick independent inquiry into the botched CWI scheme, and for that to be the basis for early and full remedial action, whatever that might be? People are still suffering. As I said, I made my first speech in this place on the issue in 2014 and, though things have changed to some extent, there are still victims, and I think they are the people least able to fight their own cause. Somebody needs to take responsibility.

Green Energy: Ports

Judith Cummins Excerpts

Wednesday 18th October 2023 Westminster Hall

[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Judith Cummins (in the Chair)]

Order. I remind Members that I am planning to start Front-Bench speeches at around 3.28 pm.

--- Later in debate ---

On resuming—

[Judith Cummins (in the Chair)]

The debate may now continue until 4.15 pm.

[Stephen Kinnock]

Thank you, Mrs Cummins. I will try to pick up where I left off.

On the planning side, the Government need to find a solution to the national grid’s capacity issues. The National Grid says it has to develop up to five times as much energy infrastructure over the next seven years as it has developed over the past 30 years, such is the clamour for net zero projects, in terms of both energy generation and demand. How will the UK Government and, more specifically, the Minister work with the National Grid to end the gridlock, and how will they send a clear message to developers that these problems are going to be fixed?

That brings me to my next point, which is about the administrative strike price. Allocation round 5 was a shambles, with no bidders for offshore wind. We need the UK Government urgently to reshape the contracts for difference for AR6 and make them more attractive to developers if we are to realise Britain’s potential to become a world leader on FLOW.

Finally, the UK and Welsh Governments must work collaboratively. We cannot allow bureaucracy to slow us down. Planning and consenting for major infrastructure is devolved. We need the UK Government to look for ways to support the Welsh Government to ensure that current capacity and resource blockages for planning and consenting are resolved to ensure that the seabed licensing is accelerated and that port infrastructure in Wales is ready in time. We also need strong cross-Whitehall co-ordination. I worry that the large number of Government Departments involved means that the process is not as streamlined as it should be. Perhaps the Minister could say what he will do to knock heads together to unlock all of the blockages.

This is a huge, game-changing opportunity for Aberavon, Wales and the entire United Kingdom. Ports play an absolutely crucial role in this opportunity. I look forward to the Minister’s comments so that we can find a pathway towards maximising the opportunities before us.

[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Judith Cummins (in the Chair)]

Order. Before I call the next speaker, may I gently ask Members to make contributions of about four minutes so that we can get everybody in?

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[Graham Stuart]

I think I am about to be cut off. Are we finishing at 4 pm?

[Judith Cummins (in the Chair)]

No, we have until 4.15 pm.

[Graham Stuart]

Then I would be delighted to give way.