Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Consideration of Lords message
Wednesday 6th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon]

In several of the Secretary of State’s answers to questions from Opposition Members, he has said, “If there is extra evidence”. Has he or the British Government had the opportunity to speak to the Irish Republic Government about their role? I believe the Irish Republic Government, through the Garda Síochána, have an evidence base on the murders that were carried out by the IRA along the border. I am very conscious of Chief Superintendent Harry Breen and Bob Buchanan in 1989, Lexie Cummings in 1982 and Ian Sproule in 1991. The people who did that escaped across the border, and the Garda Síochána has indicated—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am very conscious of time. You are down to speak, and you have made your speech already. Other people need to get in. This is a very important issue, and I want to make sure that people can make their speeches.

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

Forgive me, Mr Speaker; I was trying to take as many interventions as possible.

[Mr Speaker]

I know. We all know that Mr Shannon is very good, but it is the amount of time. Interventions have to be short and punchy, not speeches. He is going to make a speech later.

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I can assure the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) that I have been speaking to the Irish Government about elements of what he mentioned.

The commission will grant immunity from prosecution only if an individual provides an account that is true to the best of their knowledge and belief. We have developed a robust test for immunity, in which their account must be tested against any information that the commission holds. If an individual does not provide a truthful account of their actions that could be passed to families, or if they do not participate in the immunity process at all, immunity will not be granted and they would remain liable to prosecution should evidence exist. Where a prosecution takes place, and should a conviction be secured, an individual will not be eligible for the early release scheme under the Northern Ireland (Sentences) Act 1998. Again, that is a result of amendments made in this House.

Similarly, although I acknowledge the sentiment behind introducing licence conditions under Lords amendment 44E, I respectfully suggest that the Government have sought to address these issues through amendments that were adopted on Report in the other place. These amendments send a clear message that, once immunity is granted, individuals who are convicted of offences that could impede reconciliation will lose that immunity. In the Government’s view, this approach strikes the right balance between providing sufficient certainty as to the effect of a grant of immunity necessary to encourage participation and ensuring that there are appropriate consequences for those whose behaviour after being granted immunity is not compatible with the fundamental aims of the Bill.

The alternative proposed by the Opposition would not support an effective information recovery process, and I therefore ask that the House joins me in disagreeing to amendments 44D, 44E, 44F, 44G, 44H and 44J.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

May I take this opportunity to welcome my hon. Friend the Member for Putney (Fleur Anderson) to the Front-Bench team, and to express my thanks to my hon. Friend the Member for Gower (Tonia Antoniazzi) for all the service she gave during her time as part of the shadow Northern Ireland team?

As the House will be aware, we do not support this Bill, but I do not understand why the Secretary of State is seeking to overturn the amendments tabled by Lord Murphy and passed in the other place yesterday. I listened very carefully to the arguments advanced by the Secretary of State, but I do not think they stand up, because the Lords amendments would not take away the commission’s ability to issue immunity to an individual who comes forward and gives truthful evidence about what happened. Lords amendment 44E is not a veto, but it would allow the families of those who were killed or seriously injured in the troubles to have some voice in the process—I understand that relatives of those who were murdered are with us in the Gallery, and they are still seeking justice.

Let me turn to the other provisions, relating to licence conditions that would apply to the person seeking immunity. I acknowledge what the Secretary of State just said about other changes having been made to the Bill, but these provisions seem very sensible and reasonable to me. I include in that the requirement that the individual in question should not approach or otherwise communicate with a victim, in the case of an injury, or with a victim’s family, in the case of a death, unless they consent. So we will vote against the Government’s motion to disagree with the Lords amendments today.

The Secretary of State has talked quite a bit about a disincentive to people coming forward, but I say to him that it is not entirely clear that immunity will achieve the purpose that the Government have for it. Given that every other means of justice is to be closed down, and given that the commission appears to have a lifespan of only five years, those who have committed dreadful crimes only need to sit it out. I say to the Secretary of State that if that were to happen and after the five years are over those individuals start to talk about, boast about or write books about what they have done, how will he explain to the families of those they murdered why the Government allowed that situation to arise? That would be the consequence of taking away from people, as this Bill does, the means of justice, however hard, however long, however uncertain. I acknowledge the point that the Secretary of State made about that.

This is the last occasion on which we will debate this highly controversial legislation, which concerns how we come to terms with the terrible legacy of violence and brutality during the troubles in a way that enables those most affected—the families—finally to know what happened to the person they loved and to ensure that justice is done; to hold those responsible to account. This is the first time I have talked about this, given that I was appointed only on Monday, but I recognise how hard this is and I acknowledge the changes that the Secretary of State has made to the Bill during its passage, including his comment that when he inherited it he was not happy with it. However, he must accept that this legislation does not command the confidence of the people to whom he is trying to offer reassurance and comfort.

The most important word in the title of this Bill is “reconciliation”. We all want that to happen, but the Bill has self-evidently not achieved its aim, because all the communities in Northern Ireland are clearly not reconciled to its contents. It is so striking to see the extent to which the Government have failed to win support for their approach. The list of people and organisations opposed to this Bill is frankly astonishing: all of the political parties in Northern Ireland; the Churches in Northern Ireland; victims’ groups; the Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission; the former Victims’ Commissioner; the Irish Government; the Council of Europe; and the United Nations. Most extraordinary of all, it is reported that the person who has been appointed as the commissioner-designate, the highly respected Sir Declan Morgan, said recently that he would expect legal action by the families of victims of the troubles to try to challenge the Bill on whether it is compliant with the European convention on human rights.

That is the scale of the coalition that the Government have managed to range against themselves, but instead of reflecting on that, their approach has been to put their head down and plough on regardless. That is why, for all the Government’s good intentions, they have failed to win public confidence, even though the Government said in 2018:

“In order to build consensus on workable proposals that have widespread support we must listen to the concerns of victims, survivors and other interested parties.”

Doing the wrong thing is not a justification for this Bill, and if there is one lesson we must by now have learned about how to make progress in Northern Ireland, it is that it can only be achieved patiently, slowly and carefully, so as to build a consensus. I am sorry to say that the Bill does not do that and it will not achieve the purpose Ministers claim for it. That is why we are committed, as the Opposition, to repeal it, if we get the opportunity.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Scottish National party spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

I am well aware that time is limited; you will be pleased to hear, Mr Speaker, that so too is my capacity for repeating arguments that I have made many times previously. My party believes that this Bill is wrong in principle and that in practice it will not achieve the aims that the Secretary of State believes, no doubt with great sincerity, that it will. We will therefore be joining the official Opposition in voting to support the Lords amendments.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Wednesday 6th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I had a number of conversations with the former chief constable about this issue. The budget for 2023-24 gives the Department of Justice a total allocation of £1.2 billion. Obviously, recognising the unique security situation in Northern Ireland, the UK Government make additional contributions to the PSNI’s counter-terrorism work through the additional security funding. The UK contribution for 2022-23 is £32 million. I am fully aware of the obvious issues that we talked about in the recent urgent question, and I am sure that we will get on to those a bit later in questions.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee.

[Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)]

I wish my right hon. Friend a happy anniversary. I also thank, as he did, the outgoing shadow team and welcome the new. He is right to reference the recent data breach, which will have very much changed the backdrop of the morale of the police in Northern Ireland—and not just officers, but those in support services. Budgets are under pressure, as we know, but the security and safety of serving officers and those who work for the PSNI is always important, particularly post the data breach, given the potential risks from dissidents that that creates. Can he assure me that he will do all he can to deliver safety equipment, protection and security for those who are feeling most vulnerable at this time?

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[Mr Baker]

We will continue to work for the people of Northern Ireland, respecting the devolution settlement. For example, in recognition of the cost of living pressures faced by workers across the UK, the Government increased the national minimum wage rate by 9.7%, to £10.42 per hour for workers aged 23 and over, at the spring Budget. We will continue to be seized of the need to help those least well off.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Scottish National party spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

The cost of living crisis is clearly continuing to bite hard in Northern Ireland, with footfall at stores across Northern Ireland falling by 5% throughout August. What steps is the Department taking to enable people to take full advantage of the highly privileged economic status and market access that Northern Ireland now has, which this Government have deprived to the rest of the UK?

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[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I thank the former Secretary of State for that question; he is absolutely right. We have been listening in great detail to the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Sir Jeffrey M. Donaldson), the DUP leader, and his team of negotiators over the course of the summer. We have had very detailed negotiations and I believe we are homing in on what is actually required. That might well mean we need conversations elsewhere, but let us see where we get to in the course of the next couple of days.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

The Windsor framework, which was agreed seven months ago, was a great achievement, but it was also intended to enable the restoration of power sharing in Northern Ireland. That has not happened. What is the Government’s plan? The Secretary of State refers to the conversations he is having, but what is the plan to get Stormont back up and running?

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[Mr Speaker]

Let me welcome the shadow Minister.

[Fleur Anderson (Putney) (Lab)]

Early years services are vital for children to reach their potential, but they are underfunded and at risk in Northern Ireland. Northern Ireland is the only part of the UK without a childcare strategy. According to the Department for Education, it was delayed again because early years faces potential significant budget reductions. When can hard-pressed families in Northern Ireland expect the childcare strategy? Will the Minister commit to early years services receiving the increased multi-year funding that is needed to invest in children?

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The Prime Minister was asked—

[Mr Speaker]

I welcome everybody back to Prime Minister’s questions.

[Mr Louie French (Old Bexley and Sidcup) (Con)]

Q1. If he will list his official engagements for Wednesday 6 September.

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[The Prime Minister]

I agree with my hon. Friend. It is disappointing that last week the Labour leader allowed the Labour Mayor to introduce ULEZ, charging hard-working people £12.50 every time they start their car, adding to the burden of the cost of living. All I can say is that while we focus on helping hard-working families, all the Labour leader does is punish them.

[Mr Speaker]

We now come to the Leader of the Opposition.

[Keir Starmer (Holborn and St Pancras) (Lab)]

I join the Prime Minister in congratulating the Lionesses, and also in his comments about Sergeant Saville; I think we speak for the whole House when we speak on that subject.

I also extend the warmest welcome to my hon. Friend the new Labour Member for Selby and Ainsty (Keir Mather). He has already made history for the Labour party by overturning the largest Tory majority ever in a by-election. I also welcome the hon. Members for Uxbridge and South Ruislip (Steve Tuckwell) and for Somerton and Frome (Sarah Dyke).

The roof of Singlewell Primary School in Gravesend collapsed in May 2018. Thankfully, it happened at the weekend and no children were injured. The concrete ceiling was deemed dangerous and liable to collapse, and everyone knew that the problem existed in other schools, yet the Prime Minister decided to halve the budget for school maintenance just a couple of years later. Does he agree with his Education Secretary that he should be thanked for doing a “good job”?

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[Hon. Members]

More!

[Mr Speaker]

Order. We do not want to start off with somebody leaving early, because that is what will happen.

[Keir Starmer]

Well, Mr Speaker, Conservative Members want more, so let me continue. Ferryhill School in County Durham was on Labour’s building list in 2010. The Government scrapped that, and now children there are in a crumbling school. The truth is that this crisis is the inevitable result of 13 years of cutting corners, botched jobs and sticking plaster politics. It is the sort of thing you expect from cowboy builders: saying that everyone else is wrong and everyone else is to blame, and protesting that they have done an effing good job even as the ceiling falls in. The difference is that in this case, the cowboys are running the country. Is the Prime Minister not ashamed that, after 13 years of Tory Government, children are cowering under steel supports stopping their classroom roof from falling in? [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Seriously, calm down. I understand that this is the first session and people are excited to be back at school, but we expect better behaviour.

[The Prime Minister]

This is exactly the kind of political opportunism that we have come to expect from Captain Hindsight here. Before today, he has never once raised this issue with me across the Dispatch Box. It was not even worthy of a single—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. The same applies to those on the Labour Benches. We will have a calmer Question Time going forward, because I want to hear the questions and the answers, just like your constituents.

[The Prime Minister]

Before today, the right hon. and learned Gentleman never once raised this issue with me in Parliament. It was not even worthy of a single mention in his so-called landmark speech on education this summer. If we had listened to him, our kids would have been off school and locked down for longer—it is as simple as that. He talks about 13 years; well, let us see what has happened. When we came into office, two thirds of schools were rated “good” and “outstanding”; now, it is 90%. We introduced the pupil premium to get more funding to the most disadvantaged pupils. Today, they are 75% more likely to go to university. And, as a result of our reforms, we now have the best readers in the western world. That is what 13 years of education reform gets you, all of which was opposed by the Labour party.

[Keir Starmer]

The Prime Minister claims to be a man of detail, but there have been 100 parliamentary questions from the Opposition on this issue, and an Opposition day motion. Let us continue: Holy Family Catholic School in Bradford was on the Labour building list in 2010. The Government scrapped that, and now children there too are in a crumbling school—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Mr Holden, I have heard enough. This is the last time; make up your mind. Either you go now or you are quiet for the remainder.

[Keir Starmer]

If you can believe it, Mr Speaker, in April this year, the Education Secretary signed a contract for refurbishment of her offices. It has her personal stamp of approval on it. It cost—I cannot quite believe this—£34 million. Can the Prime Minister explain to parents whose children are not at school this week why he thinks that a blank cheque for a Tory Minister’s office is better use of taxpayer’s money than stopping schools from collapsing?

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[The Prime Minister]

I know that the right hon. and learned Gentleman comes here with prepared scripts, but he has not listened to a single fact, over six questions, about the record amounts of funding going into schools, or the incredible reforms to education impacting the most disadvantaged children in our society—a record that we are rightly proud of. Yes, we can name the schools: that is because we are reacting to information and publishing it so that we know where the issues are—something that we are still waiting for from the Welsh Government.

Of course the right hon. and learned Gentleman wants to score political points from something that we are dealing with in the right and responsible way, but I note that he has not mentioned a single other thing that has happened since we last met at the Dispatch Box. He talked about hard-working families across Britain, but what has happened to energy bills? Down. What has happened to inflation? Down. What has happened to small boat crossings? Down. And what has happened to economic growth? It has gone up. The right hon. and learned Gentleman tried time and again to talk down the British economy, but thankfully, people were not listening. His entire economic narrative has been demolished, and the Conservatives are getting on delivering for Britain. [Hon. Members: “More!”]

[Mr Speaker]

There will be more. I call Nicola Richards.

[Nicola Richards (West Bromwich East) (Con)]

Q2. Against a backdrop of improving economic news, inflation falling, energy bills coming down and growth up, people in the west midlands are disappointed to see that Labour-run Birmingham City Council has gone bankrupt. As a Sandwell resident and a West Bromwich MP, I am no stranger to Labour incompetence. Does the Prime Minister agree that Labour have demonstrated yet again that they always run out of other people’s money?

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is exactly right. We started by hearing how Labour in London are charging hard-working people with ULEZ, and now we are hearing about how Labour in Birmingham are failing hard-working people, losing control of taxpayers’ money and driving their finances into the ground. They have bankrupted Birmingham; we cannot let them bankrupt Britain.

[Mr Speaker]

We come to the SNP leader.

[Stephen Flynn (Aberdeen South) (SNP)]

The public need no reminding that today marks a year since the Prime Minister’s predecessor, the right hon. Member for South West Norfolk (Elizabeth Truss), took office. Upon her speedy departure, they will have thought that things were going to get better, but unemployment figures are higher, food prices are higher, mortgage rates are higher, and economic growth is stagnant. When is the Prime Minister going to get off his backside and do something about it?

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[Chris Law (Dundee West) (SNP)]

Q15. Every year the SNP Scottish Government mitigate against the cruellest of Westminster policies by spending £84 million on supporting hard-working families against the brutal bedroom tax and over £6.2 million on covering the two-child benefit cap. Astonishingly, we have learned over the summer that the Leader of the Opposition is an enthusiastic supporter of these Tory cruel welfare policies, with U-turn after U-turn from the Labour party. Given that the Tories and Labour are two cheeks of the same arse—[Hon. Members: “Oh!]—offering no change, no vision and no hope, does the Prime Minister agree that the only way Scottish voters can rid themselves—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I am not going to have us both stand up; one of us is going to give way, and it will not be me. Let us think about language. Let us be more temperate and make sure that the pride of this Parliament shines through—that certainly will not be by using such language.

[Chris Law]

I am happy to change the offending word to “bottom”. Given that the Tories and Labour are two cheeks of the same bottom, offering no change, no vision and no hope, does the Prime Minister agree that the only way for Scottish voters to rid themselves of these heinous policies is to vote for the SNP to leave Westminster forever?

Police Service of Northern Ireland: Security and Data Protection Breach

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Monday 4th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Speaker]

Before I call the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Sir Jeffrey M. Donaldson) to ask the urgent question, I wish to make a short statement about the sub judice resolution. The matter of the data breach is not sub judice, but I have been advised that an individual has been charged with terrorism-related offences following the data breach. While I am content to waive the sub judice resolution in this and other proceedings to allow simple reference to the fact of the arrest, any further discussion of the circumstances of that case would not be in order.

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[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I think that the right hon. Member for Lagan Valley (Sir Jeffrey M. Donaldson) referred to it in his question as a “self-inflicted” wound, and it surely was. To be frank, checks and balances should have been in place. I completely agree with my right hon. Friend, and we will do what we can to assist the PSNI and the Department of Justice, as she would expect. We keep abreast of these matters, as I hope I detailed in my answers, but this is a really significant breach. As one police officer put it to me, “When I joined the police service, I used to think when I went to work that maybe people knew what I did for a living, but now that has completely flipped—I feel that they absolutely know what I do for a living.” That has changed the psychology around the whole piece. I know that a lot more assurances need to be given for us to get to the place that my right hon. Friend wishes to get to.

[Mr Speaker]

I welcome the new shadow Secretary of State.

[Hilary Benn (Leeds Central) (Lab)]

May I say that I look forward to working with the Secretary of State in the interests of peace, prosperity and progress in Northern Ireland?

The release of the names and workplaces of thousands of PSNI officers and staff was doubtless inadvertent, but its consequences could not be more serious. That has now been recognised by the chief constable, Simon Byrne, who is resigning—I join the Secretary of State in thanking him for his service. Those who serve in the PSNI confront great risks every day in their job to keep the public safe, and we thank them. But they already knew that dissident republicans were targeting them and their families, and now they know that those who would do them harm have this list. The damage to morale and confidence should not be underestimated. They are asking urgently, “What will be done to reassure and protect us?”

Does the Secretary of State agree that the inquiry needs to be completed as quickly as possible? Can he confirm that he will approve the appointment of the new chief constable in the absence of a Justice Minister in Northern Ireland? Does he intend to review the operation of the Northern Ireland Policing Board and how it functions? Does he recognise that there will be additional costs in protecting staff, as well as responding to potential civil claims? There were already great pressures on the Northern Ireland policing budget, and the cuts it now faces will, in the words of the PSNI, leave the service “smaller…less visible, less accessible and less responsive”.

Finally, the whole House wants to ensure that the staff get the support, protection and reassurance they need, but to succeed in doing that we need leadership from the Government and the political parties in Northern Ireland, to get the Assembly and the Executive up and running again as quickly as possible.

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[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I like to feel that I have considerable influence in Government, but I am not sure that is completely correct. However, I will use the influence I have to do the right thing by all those who work for the PSNI. All sorts of issues have come up over the past 25 years and since policing was devolved, but policing in Northern Ireland certainly seems to look and feel better, and it is beginning to get good outcomes for those who are being policed. I can only praise the officers and say that I will do everything in their support.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

I join the Secretary of State in offering my thanks to Simon Byrne for his service. I believe his decision today, however, is the right one. This represented a shocking breach of confidentiality not just in relation to people’s personal data, but a shocking breach in the confidence that PSNI officers and staff can have in the organisation. I pay tribute to the dedicated PSNI officers and staff who daily protect and serve the people of Northern Ireland.

The PSNI, as has been alluded to, is already suffering a crisis of funding and therefore resourcing. The officer complement is lower than it has been in the police service serving Northern Ireland than at any point since 1979. The UK Government pay £30 million a year in additional funding to meet the security challenge, but that funding was inadequate even before the breach and is surely even more inadequate now. Will the Secretary of State be a little clearer on exactly how he will give funding guarantees to the PSNI going forward, because I do not believe this is something where the buck can be passed entirely to those who are currently charged with administering devolved budgets?

Northern Ireland Budget (No. 2) Bill

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Committee of the whole House
Monday 4th September 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mary Kelly Foy (City of Durham) (Lab)]

I welcome my right hon. Friend the Member for Leeds Central (Hilary Benn) to his new role. It should be the concern of the whole House that a Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, rather than a Minister of Finance in Stormont, is delivering yet another budget for Northern Ireland. This has been happening for far too long. It should concern us, because it reflects a peace process that has become increasingly precarious.

I am a member of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee, which since February has been inquiring into the funding and delivery of public services in the north of Ireland. We have received evidence from a wide range of stakeholders throughout Northern Ireland. We have focused on the financial situation in areas such as education and health, and how the lack of a functioning Executive in Stormont is affecting those public services. To be clear, these are my views and not those of the Committee as a whole. My personal view is that the absence of an Executive in the north of Ireland, coupled with an austerity budget from Westminster, is a toxic mix, both politically and socially. For instance, we heard from the British Medical Association in Northern Ireland that health services are operating in “crisis mode”, which has taken its toll both on patients and on workers. Underlying that is a

“crumbling estate, with spiralling maintenance costs”.

The Royal College of Nursing argues:

“The health and social care system…is now beyond the point of crisis and is…visibly collapsing.”

It argues that that is due to “years of systematic under-funding”, compounded by the absence of accountability and leadership in Stormont. In addition, the Royal College of Surgeons has stated that one in four people in Northern Ireland are on a waiting list, either for a first-time appointment with a consultant or for surgery or treatment. The health and social care system needs stability, much like it does in Britain. Prevention is always better than cure. In one evidence session, I asked health professionals whether a significant cash injection now would reduce costs down the line. Austerity is never the cheaper option; it always leads to higher costs. I just wish the Government would realise that.

I want to touch on the impact on education, where, as with health, it is unacceptable that cuts are being made. A report in June entitled “The Consequences of the Cuts to Education for Children and Young People in Northern Ireland” argues that

“cuts will increase poverty, widen existing educational achievement gaps”

and “further exacerbate” the mental health crisis in Northern Ireland. Like the healthcare system, as we have heard, special educational needs provision is beyond the brink.

There is also a constitutional issue. My colleagues in the Social Democratic and Labour party have called on the British Government to consult the Irish Government on provisions for this budget as a plan B. That is a very sensible argument, although it is quite surprising that the British Government have not already attempted it. We cannot forget the vital role that the Irish Government played in the peace process. We should not forgo their advice, assistance, guidance and institutional knowledge.

In addition, the pressure on civil servants in Northern Ireland must be commented on. They are working in an extremely difficult environment, and we must recognise that there are unintended consequences. Civil servants are between a rock and hard place. The guidance states that some decisions should not be taken by civil servants, but without an Executive, those decisions must be made. As PCS Northern Ireland has argued, how can civil servants do their jobs effectively when they are worrying about putting food on the table for their families?

Underlying all this is a lack of democratic accountability. At the risk of making an obvious point, it was political parties who were elected in the May elections, not civil servants. If there is no Executive, who will fill those leadership roles in the community? We have heard in the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee that, sadly, some of those roles are already being filled by criminal gangs and paramilitaries. Those gangs are preying on vulnerable people, especially women in deprived communities. They know that there is an absence of statutory childcare, which is a huge barrier to women attaining employment. Those gangs are exploiting poverty. When people have not been able to pay their loans, for instance, they have been forced into transporting drugs and prostitution.

It is a case of austerity affecting services, and a deadlock affecting leadership, leading to cracks in civil society that demand our attention right now. We need the Executive back. To that extent, I must say to the Democratic Unionist party to honour the first word of its name. This boycott is doing real harm. Everyone can see it. I suspect it is not what their constituents want to see. Nothing can be achieved in this deadlock; it only wears people down. But we can achieve something working together. I will never forget the demonstration of cross-party unity that brought peace to an island that means so much to me, my family and so many people in my constituency and beyond. It would be a tragedy if that the spirit of co-operation was consigned to the history books.

[Mr Speaker]

I call Jim Shannon.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

Thank you, Mr Speaker. It is good to see that you and I are the Duracell batteries of Westminster; we keep going when others are starting to lag.

What a pleasure it is to speak on this issue today. Yet again, I come to the House to ask for fairness and equitable treatment for Northern Ireland. I ask for it to be treated and funded the way that Wales is, for the sake of my constituents and all other constituents in Northern Ireland. I ask for our schools to be able to pay for their teachers’ pay rise and for toiletries in school facilities. I ask for a budget that can address the waiting list for hip replacements, and for vital roadworks to be carried out, to provide the bare minimum standard of infrastructure and connectivity. I ask the Secretary of State respectfully to advocate working with us and for the betterment of everyone in Northern Ireland. I believe we can do that together if we all commit to that process.

The people of Ballynahinch and the surrounding areas in my constituency of Strangford have been waiting my entire tenure—I have been an MP since 2010—and long before that for the promised Ballynahinch bypass, which has been deferred yet again. Along with my MLA colleagues Michelle McIlveen and Harry Harvey, I hope to meet the Department for Infrastructure on 6 October to discuss that very issue. It has been on the books for 45 years. And should the hon. Member for South Down (Chris Hazzard) ever decide to take his seat in this place and do his job here, he would be advocating for the same thing: for the funding to be allocated for this vital piece of work. Not to be blunt, but any claim that work can be carried out in whatever way the Department sees fit does not cut it when the current budget does not cover the cost for roads to be resurfaced, never mind major capital projects. Let us be truthful here: the budget allocation for roads is inadequate.

On a slightly more positive note, I highlight Ardglass harbour as a Northern Ireland fishing industry success story. However, the fact is that if we are to build on that success and accommodate the next generation of fishing boats, the harbour needs to be deepened. Kilkeel is also well placed to be a hub for the offshore energy industry. Investment there will see Northern Ireland capitalise on our growing blue economy. The fishing and seafood development programme of the Department of Agriculture, Environment and Rural Affairs recommends investment in all three harbours, and that takes funding. I am delighted to report that funding has been secured for both an enhanced training centre and an improved slipway in Portavogie in my constituency of Strangford. We can build on that and do more. We should have aspirations to grow a powerhouse of a blue economy. Portavogie, Ardglass and Kilkeel give us the building blocks, and the FSDP recommendations give us the tools. What we now need is to add a further budget that has the appetite and ambition to match that of our coastal communities, and that empowers them to meet the next generation of opportunities in the Irish sea and beyond.

We need funding for schools to deal with the substantial rise in special needs assessment and support. The hon. Member for North Down (Stephen Farry) referred to that and he is absolutely right. Every one of us in this House knows that special needs education is under incredible pressure. Funding is needed to create sensory rooms, whose enhancements will give children the opportunity to excel. I have met them in many of the schools in my constituency, and I recognise that that is something we should all sign up to. I sign up to the vision for schools that is operating on the mainland, but I would like our children to be treated the same way as children here and to have the same options. That is not the case because while spending per head is more, so is cost and so is need.

Policies that impact on how our children are taught about religion and sexual issues should not be implemented without a mechanism and space to consult boards of governors or without the opportunity to implement normal practices. Let me be clear: parents and teachers do not consent or comply, and that will be made clear in the days to come. There was a rally where a large group of people came together with some of their elected representatives to make that point.

I conclude with this, because I am very conscious of the long hour. I say this to the Secretary of State and the Minister of State: please, in the interest of fairness and equity, work with us to make changes to the framework that allow us to do what we want to do, which is to take our seats and for our colleagues to be in a working Assembly, with a fit-for-purpose budget and changes in place. That is not only in our hands; it is in the hands of the Government, the Secretary of State, the Minister of State, the Brexit Minister and the Prime Minister. Do the right thing and start to take that action, so we can move forward together in a positive fashion.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Minister.

[Mr Baker]

With the leave of the House, Mr Speaker, given that I made a number of interventions during the debate, and given the late hour and a desire not to repeat arguments that we advanced on Second Reading, I think I should just say, “I beg to move.”

Question put and agreed to.

Bill accordingly read the Third time and passed.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Wednesday 21st June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

It is true, and I am slightly surprised by the element of pleasure that worldwide institutions—other Governments, the European Union and the United States Government, as my right hon. Friend says—have taken in seeing the Windsor framework come to fruition and, indeed, by how we are now talking about all sorts of important other things that seem to have been unlocked by the Windsor framework agreement.

[Mr Speaker]

We now come to the shadow Secretary of State.

[Peter Kyle (Hove) (Lab)]

Today is a day of reflection across Northern Ireland, and I share the Secretary of State’s support for those who are participating. The Secretary of State has said that the Government need to demonstrate that Northern Ireland remains a “strong and integral” part of the United Kingdom to restore power sharing. The problem for him is that his Department still plans to impose immunity for terrorists on Northern Ireland, against the wishes of all local parties and all victim groups there. Does he not see the damage that that could do to the Union?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Baker]

My hon. Friend makes a reasonable point. Integration is central not only to the Government’s policy but to the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. I am rather grateful that there has been some small controversy over the Ulster University report on the cost of division. We must have that conversation. If we are spending £600,000 a day on maintaining a system within which only 7% of children are educated in formal integrated schools and, overwhelmingly, children are educated separately as Catholics or Protestants, we should have a serious conversation about the cost of that system.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister.

[Chris Elmore (Ogmore) (Lab)]

Universities recently wrote a joint letter to the Secretary of State warning that his budget will force them to cut student places and will have a “fundamental and dangerous impact” on the future of Northern Ireland. Will the Minister carry out an assessment of the effect that a loss of student placements would have on Northern Ireland’s economy, so that the House can be fully informed of the long-term impacts of the budget?

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

The hon. Gentleman is wrong in one aspect. The budget is fair and allows for the statutory things to be delivered. I meet with women’s groups very regularly—I met a whole group of them last week. I fully understand the implications of the budget. However, it should be for Northern Ireland Ministers to sort it out.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

Beyond the cost of living crisis, there is a crisis facing public services across Northern Ireland. To give one very pertinent example, the chief constable of the Police Service of Northern Ireland, Simon Byrne, reported to the policing board last month that the force faced a budget gap of some £141 million. That is a gap that can only be met by cutting police numbers further. Given that police numbers are already at 6,500, which is 1,000 below the recommended establishment figure quoted by Chris Patten and the lowest number since 1978, that is clearly a poor situation. Given the severe terror threat, what will the UK Government do to ensure that Northern Ireland has a police force capable of meeting continued security challenges, as well as meeting the needs of the communities the police force is there to serve?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

We are preserving and strengthening the UK’s nuclear fuel production capacity through our £75 million nuclear fuel fund, and I know that Springfields Fuels has benefited from £30 million of funding. My hon. Friend is right to say that our domestic nuclear fuel sector has a critical role to play in supporting the UK’s energy security and independence, and I know that he will continue to be a champion for the industry in the House.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Leader of the Opposition.

[Keir Starmer (Holborn and St Pancras) (Lab)]

I echo the Prime Minister’s comments about the Windrush generation, who have contributed so much to our country, and join him in paying tribute to the armed forces, in this week and all weeks.

Let me also say that Glenda Jackson’s passing leaves a space in our cultural and political life that can never be filled. She played many roles, with great distinction, passion and commitment: Academy award-winning actor, campaigning Labour MP, and an effective Government Minister. We will never see talent like hers again.

One of the Prime Minister’s own MPs says that Britain is facing a “mortgage catastrophe”. Does he agree with her?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

Let’s just look at the facts. The right hon. and learned Gentleman talks about interest rates. Perhaps he could explain why interest rates are at similar levels in the United States, in Canada, in Australia and in New Zealand and why they are at the highest level in Europe that they have been for two decades. That is why it is important that we have a plan to reduce inflation. In contrast, what do we hear from the right hon. and learned Gentleman? He wants to borrow an extra £28 billion a year. That would make the situation worse. He wants to ban new supplies of energy from the North sea. That would make the situation worse. And he wants to give in to unions’ unaffordable pay demands. That would make the situation worse. He does not have many policies, but the few that he does have all have the same thing in common: they are dangerous, inflationary and working people would pay the price. [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Seriously? [Interruption.] Sorry? I don’t think we need any more, do we? No.

[Keir Starmer]

I appreciate that the Prime Minister has a keen interest in the mortgage market in California, but I am talking about mortgage holders here. Whilst his Government are consumed in lawbreaking, chaos and division, working people are paying the price. This morning, I spoke to James in Selby. He is a police officer, working hard to keep people safe every day. The Tory mortgage penalty is going to cost him and his family £400 more each and every month. That is nearly £5,000. He told me this morning—Conservative Members may not want to hear this—that they have decided to sell their house and to downsize, and he has just told his children they are going to have to start sharing bedrooms. Why should James and his family pay the cost of the Prime Minister’s failure?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

No amount of personal attacks and petty point-scoring can disguise the fact that the right hon. and learned Gentleman does not have a plan for this country. He comes here every week to make the same petty points. We are getting on and delivering for this country. Yes, inflation is a challenge, which is why we are on track to keep reducing it. We are reducing waiting lists and stopping the boats, all while he is focused on the past and focused on the politics. It is all talk. Whereas this Government and this Prime Minister deliver for the country. [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Philip, I know you are popular.

[Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con)]

Q5. Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.My constituents continue to be concerned about energy prices and energy security. Can the Prime Minister assure me that he will not cave in to the extremist bullies from Just Stop Oil and their patsies in the Labour leadership and will instead commit to developing new oil and gas production in the United Kingdom, which would be good for jobs, good for the economy and make us less dependent on foreign countries for our energy supply?

[The Prime Minister]

As ever, my hon. Friend makes an excellent point. Putin’s weaponisation of energy has amplified the need for greater energy security, which is why we deliberately launched a new licensing round for the North sea. Official forecasts suggest that a block on North sea oil and gas investment would mean that the UK’s dependence on imports rises substantially. The Labour party’s decision is one that puts ideology ahead of jobs, investment and Britain’s energy security.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP leader.

[Stephen Flynn (Aberdeen South) (SNP)]

In February, the Prime Minister told this House that

“borrowing costs are…back to where they should be”.—[Official Report, 8 February 2023; Vol. 727, c. 904.]

In March, he boasted

“we are on track to halve inflation by the end of this year.”—[Official Report, 22 March 2023; Vol. 730, c. 330.]

In May, he said that “economic optimism is increasing.” Given the dire economic reality of today, is it not now clear that he has taken his honesty lessons from Boris Johnson?

[The Prime Minister]

The hon. Gentleman also fails to mention that it is not just the Bank of England, not just the Office for Budget Responsibility and not just the OECD but the IMF that have all upgraded their growth outlook for the United Kingdom economy this year. While he and others were predicting that this country would enter a recession, the actions of this Government have meant that we have, so far, averted that. We continue to be on track to keep reducing inflation, because that is the right economic priority.

[Mr Speaker]

I want Members to be a little more cautious in what they say. These are questions to the present, serving Prime Minister. There is a danger that the way the question was put could mislead.

[Stephen Flynn]

From listening to the Prime Minister’s answer, I do not think he quite grasps the reality of the economic situation facing households across these isles—how could he? But it does not need to be like this and it did not need to be like this. Because mortgage deals in Ireland are not sitting in excess of 6%—they are at about 4.5%. Inflation in the euro area is not sitting at 8.7%—it is sitting at closer to 6%. Britain is broke. Seven years after the Conservatives’ EU referendum, will he finally admit that it was Brexit that broke it?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

There will be no greater champion for this technology and her community than my hon. Friend. My understanding is that the first stage of market engagement is already under way. The expectation is that the down-selection process will be launched this summer, with an ambition to assess and decide on the leading technologies this autumn. The competition will be open, judicious, fair and robust, and I express all my confidence that we will select the best technology for the United Kingdom.

[Mr Speaker]

Lancashire is welcoming it.

[Stephen Farry (North Down) (Alliance)]

Four months after the welcome Windsor framework, there is still no restored Northern Ireland Executive or Assembly, and we are facing an unprecedented budget crisis. This situation is untenable, and it is getting worse every day. The Government’s approach seems to be to wait to see whether something happens, rather than to lead from the front. So will the Prime Minister confirm that he is willing to work with the Northern Ireland parties on a financial package for a restored Executive? Will he work more closely with the Irish Government to try to drive a process, including putting reform of the institutions on the agenda, so that those who want to govern Northern Ireland can do so?

Northern Ireland

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend. I was also told that this would be an impossible ask. Throughout my time in the European Parliament and, indeed, as chairman of an illustrious body of MPs in this place, I never thought this would be achievable, yet the Government have managed to achieve it.

These regulations could scarcely make things clearer. The overwhelming presumption is that, unless the Assembly says yes, the Government must say no.

Finally, as with any international agreement, if the EU considers that the UK has improperly pulled the brake, it may choose to initiate a dispute, but we need to be clear that any dispute could only arise after the rules have been disapplied in Northern Ireland, and the resolution of that dispute would be for an arbitration panel. The European Court of Justice would have no role in resolving a dispute.

These regulations make the case for functioning devolved institutions in Northern Ireland even more compelling. The measures will become operable only when the institutions are restored. Denying the people of Northern Ireland will not only deny them the basic right to an effective, stable Government but will deny them full democratic input into the laws that apply to Northern Ireland, and that denial cannot be justified.

These regulations give domestic legal effect to this democratic safeguard and restore the UK’s sovereignty. We should consider carefully how we vote on this measure, without which Northern Ireland would continue to have full and automatic dynamic alignment with EU goods rules, with no say for the Northern Ireland Assembly and no veto on amending or replacing those measures. That is an intolerable situation, and I urge all hon. and right hon. Members to vote to end that full and automatic dynamic alignment. I therefore commend these regulations to the House.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State.

--- Later in debate ---

[Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP)]

Let us be clear what we are debating here today: we are debating a lock, or a brake, that is necessary because the Government have allowed the EU to impose its law on part of the United Kingdom. The result is that we now have a border between one part of the United Kingdom and the other part of the United Kingdom, a border that is going to be reinforced very shortly by the building of physical posts that will be used to monitor trade between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Goods that are going into Northern Ireland purely for consumption in Northern Ireland will be checked—100% will be customs checked, and one in 20 will be physically checked. Of course, that can be varied by the EU. What is the Government’s answer to it? That Unionists can make a protest about it and sign a petition of concern. By the way, if there is anything that will destabilise the Northern Ireland Assembly, it is the constant use of the petition of concern. Members from other Northern Ireland parties behind me will confirm that.

First, there is a limit on what can be done and, secondly, despite the Secretary of State saying that he would be bound to listen to petitions of concern from Unionists, in fact he would have no option to. Whole sections of the framework tell us the grounds on which he can refuse a petition. Even if he does accept it, he then has to go to the Joint Committee and exercise a veto, which he knows will lead to material impacts for the United Kingdom, and of that we can be absolutely sure. If it is a choice between disrupting relations with the EU or accepting legislation—ironically, this Windsor framework is presented on the basis that it will normalise relations with the EU—how likely is it that we are going to pick a fight with the EU over the implementation of some EU law in Northern Ireland? The truth is that this is not a Stormont brake; it is a Stormont fake. It should be rejected by this House. It does not protect the Union, it does not protect democracy in Northern Ireland, and it will not get the Assembly back and running again.

[Mr Speaker]

With 20 seconds, I call John Redwood.

[John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con)]

The Government should not put this measure to a vote now. This will not work. It cannot work as a brake, because Stormont will not meet because of it. It gives amazing powers to the European Union—

[Mr Speaker]

Order.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Wednesday 9th November 2022 Commons Chamber

[Mr Baker]

Absolutely. The Government are fully committed to the principle of consent and the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. Indeed, our actions are all guided by that full commitment to the Belfast/Good Friday agreement and its protection.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State, Peter Kyle.

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

Yes, I absolutely understand that point. Everything that we have been doing since I became Secretary of State is about trying to engage and consult more with those who had issues with the legacy Bill. It is never going to be a perfect solution to this particular problem, because no perfect solution exists. However, we will do our best to address all the concerns that people raise with us.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Northern Ireland Affairs Committee.

[Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)]

The Bill is welcome and, obviously, complex. Will my right hon. Friend assure me that the Government will see it through to the end, and will he confirm that this legislative proposal is very much the last-chance saloon? These are very complex, historical issues and this is the one chance that we have to try to resolve them. However, in the spirit of trying to build compromise and consensus, will he and the Government keep an open mind about cross-party amendments in the other place?

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I am quite sure that the Bill is the last legislative vehicle with which any Government will try to address this problem, so it is very important, and it is incumbent on me as Secretary of State, to ensure that we use all the time that we have to improve the Bill, in such a way as my hon. Friend suggests. And yes—I am listening to all parties and all the consultees we talk to, and I am going out to visit victims and victims’ groups in Northern Ireland to try to gauge better what sort of amendments will improve the Bill.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Minister, Tonia Antoniazzi.

[Tonia Antoniazzi (Gower) (Lab)]

The Joint Committee on Human Rights has declared that the Bill is unlikely to be found compatible with convention rights. The Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission has called it “fatally flawed”. Does the Secretary of State dispute that, or will he make changes to it?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Baker]

We are committed to maintaining dual market access. We hope to negotiate a position with the European Union in which that is possible, while preserving the east-west strand of the Belfast/Good Friday agreement. We want to restore the constitutional status of Northern Ireland while ensuring that market access; I very much hope that we will do so by negotiation.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

May I take the opportunity to associate myself and my party with the Secretary of State’s remarks about the 35th anniversary of the bombing in Enniskillen? Our thoughts are with all those who continue, to this day, to be affected by that event.

Maroš Šefčovič has said that

“if there is political will”,

issues around the Northern Ireland protocol could be resolved

“within a couple of weeks.”

Does the Secretary of State understand the political damage that has been caused by the Government’s failure to begin negotiations on the issue earlier in the year? Will he commit to doing all he can to achieve a negotiated settlement before the year is out?

--- Later in debate ---

[Chris Heaton-Harris]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his question. Actually, I think there is a negotiated path where we can completely change how we deal with the protocol, which would mean that it dealt with the issues of governance and trade and all the other practical issues that are causing legitimate concerns to the communities he represents.

[Mr Speaker]

Before we come to Prime Minister’s questions, I would like to point out that the British Sign Language interpretation of proceedings is available to watch on parliamentlive.tv.

The Prime Minister was asked—

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

I praise my right hon. Friend for highlighting the incredible potential of floating offshore wind technology to help us move to net zero. He is right about the opportunities in the Celtic sea, and for Wales more generally, and I can confirm that the Crown Estate’s leasing process is expected to deliver more seabed leases for many more projects.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Leader of the Opposition, Keir Starmer.

[Keir Starmer (Holborn and St Pancras) (Lab)]

May I join the Prime Minister in his comments about Remembrance Day? We remember all those who paid the ultimate price, and all those who have served and are serving our country.

The Member for South Staffordshire (Sir Gavin Williamson) told a civil servant to “slit your throat”. How does the Prime Minister think the victim of that bullying felt when he expressed great sadness at his resignation?

--- Later in debate ---

[Keir Starmer]

There is only one party that crashed the economy and they are all sitting there on the Government Benches. It is a pattern with this Prime Minister: too weak to sack the security threat sitting around the Cabinet table; too weak to take part in a leadership context after he lost the first one; and too weak to stand up for working people. He spent weeks flirting with the climate change deniers in this party and then scuttled off to COP at the last minute. In the Budget next week, he will be too weak to end his oil and gas giveaway, scrap the non-dom tax breaks and end the farce of taxpayers subsidising private schools—that is what Labour would do: a proper plan for working people. If he cannot even stand up to a cartoon bully with a pet spider, if he is too scared to face the public in an election, what chance has he got of running the country? [Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. We want to try to get through on time and I know that some Members want to catch my eye. They are not doing a good job so far.

[The Prime Minister]

The right hon. and learned Gentleman talks about judgment and putting people around the Cabinet table. I gently remind him that he thought the right hon. Member for Islington North (Jeremy Corbyn) was the right person to look after our security. The right hon. and learned Gentleman has said a lot today, but it is clear that he is not focused on the serious issues confronting our country. We are strengthening our economy; he is backing the strikers. We are supporting people with energy Bills; he is supporting the protestors. We are tackling illegal migration; he is opposing every measure. The British people want real leadership on the serious global challenges we face, and that is what they will get from this Government.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

I thank my hon. Friend for his powerful question and his continued work on this issue. I completely agree that antisemitism has no place in our society, and we are taking a strong lead in tackling it in all forms. We became the first country to adopt the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance definition of antisemitism, and the Government’s independent adviser on antisemitism regularly provides advice to Ministers on how best to tackle this issue. May I join my hon. Friend, as I know the whole House will, in praising the work of those survivors who so bravely tell their stories so that we might never forget?

[Mr Speaker]

I call the leader of the Scottish National party, Ian Blackford.

[Ian Blackford (Ross, Skye and Lochaber) (SNP)]

May I associate myself with the Prime Minister’s remarks about Armistice Day? We remember those who paid the ultimate sacrifice and those who continue to serve. We should also remember the nuclear test veterans, who continue to seek justice.

Last night, the Prime Minister suffered the self-inflicted loss of his first Cabinet Minister. A couple of weeks into the job, it turns out that this Prime Minister’s judgment is every bit as bad as his predecessor’s. Speaking of which, we now know that the Prime Minister’s former friend, the former Prime Minister, plans to hand out seats in the House of Lords to at least four Tory MPs, including the current Secretary of State for Scotland. So here is another test of judgment for the new Prime Minister: does he think it right to keep in the Cabinet a man who is clearly far more interested in getting his hands on an ermine robe than in playing by the rules of Scottish democracy?

--- Later in debate ---

[Hon. Members]

Hear, hear.

[Mr Speaker]

It is quite amazing that when a Minister has gone from his post, he gets more cheers.

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

That sounds like an appealing invitation. I agree with my hon. Friend that levelling up has to deliver for communities in every corner of the United Kingdom, including southern coastal communities. He knows that I am a champion of freeports, and I look forward to working with him to see how we can best realise their benefits in his area.

[Mr Speaker]

That completes Prime Minister’s questions. Those who wish to leave, please do so quietly.

[Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Ind)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

[Mr Speaker]

Points of order come after statements.

[Jeremy Corbyn]

rose—

[Mr Speaker]

It cannot relate to PMQs, because you did not ask a question. We will deal with it afterwards.

Identity and Language (Northern Ireland) Bill [Lords]

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

2nd reading
Wednesday 12th October 2022 Commons Chamber

[Jim Shannon]

I thank my right hon. Friend and colleague for his intervention. Yes, there is no doubt that there could be a number of bonfires, not just on 11 July, but at other times as well.

In conclusion, how do I look my constituents in the eye and say that all of this money is spent not to make a difference to the quality of their lives, not to make a brighter future for their children, but as a clear, blatant and horrifyingly expensive sop to a political agenda. I want to look them in the eye and know that I have done all that I can to bring the right legislation through this Bill at the right time and for the right reason. The promotion of culture and heritage is not a bad thing, but the politicisation of language and the use of it as a weapon must be prevented. In its current state, this Bill simply enables that politicisation and therefore requires urgent changes. I look forward to the Minister of State giving us that meeting so that we can make the changes that we all want to see for the people of Northern Ireland, and especially for the people that I represent.

[Mr Speaker]

I will now announce the result of the ballot held today for the election of the new Chair of the Foreign Affairs Committee. A total of 459 votes were cast, one of which was invalid. The counting went to three rounds. There were 441 active votes in the final round, excluding those ballot papers whose preferences had been exhausted. The quota to be reached therefore was 221 votes. The winner is Alicia Kearns elected with 241 votes. She will take up her post immediately and I congratulate her on her election. The results of the count under the alternative vote system will be made available as soon as possible in the Vote Office and published on the internet.

[Alicia Kearns (Rutland and Melton) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Speaker, I thank the Clerks of the House, who ran a very successful election. I also thank all those who stood for election. I hope they know how much I respect them and how I hope to continue working with them as Chair, because I hope we can work together more as a House. I also thank Tom Tugendhat, who is now elevated to far superior places, but was a fantastic Chairman of the Select Committee. Most of all, I say a heartfelt thank you to everyone who gave their support to me. It means everything to me. I hope to do them proud; I hope I can represent all their interests and I am here now to do as they bid. Thank you ever so much.

[Mr Speaker]

Just a gentle reminder that it is not by name; he is the right hon. Member for Tonbridge and Malling (Tom Tugendhat). Do not worry about it. On that basis, let us go to Paul Girvan.

Oral Answers to Questions

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

Wednesday 22nd June 2022 Commons Chamber

[Brandon Lewis]

I am sure that if the hon. Gentleman does a bit of research, he will see that it is actually quite a complicated picture. It is good to see Northern Ireland growing back quickly: with a larger proportion of the economy in Northern Ireland based on the public sector, and with the phenomenal support that the Chancellor has put in, that is to be welcomed. We want to see Northern Ireland’s economy growing; it was struggling before covid. We are making sure to put that support in, but I have to say that that would be even easier were it not for the protocol, which is preventing some of the Chancellor’s measures from benefiting the people of Northern Ireland.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the Chair of the Select Committee on Northern Ireland Affairs.

[Simon Hoare (North Dorset) (Con)]

Given that so much policy that affects and benefits business is devolved, is not the best support that politicians of all stripes could give Northern Irish business to get Stormont back up and running?

--- Later in debate ---

[Brandon Lewis]

My hon. Friend is spot on, as ever. Our legislation will restore the balance inherent in the objectives of the protocol, avoiding a hard border, protecting the integrity of the United Kingdom and safeguarding the EU single market. It is right that we are doing the right thing by the businesses and citizens of Northern Ireland, who are businesses and citizens of the United Kingdom and the UK internal market.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the shadow Secretary of State, Peter Kyle.

[Peter Kyle (Hove) (Lab)]

When the Government introduced the United Kingdom Internal Market Bill, the Secretary of State was quite honest about his lawbreaking, and here we are again. The man who resigned over his actions, the former head of the Government Legal Department, says that the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill is “next-level” lawbreaking. Based on this Government’s track record, why should anyone believe what the Minister claims about this Bill’s legality?

--- Later in debate ---

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Mr Docherty-Hughes, I think those whippets that you own need a little walk. That is where you will be going shortly.

[Brandon Lewis]

I will leave the hon. Gentleman to read the article, so that he can realise just how wrong his question was.

--- Later in debate ---

[Brandon Lewis]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. It is important that we respect the balance in that agreement. It is important because it has given us peace for 24 years, and that is where our focus is.

[Mr Speaker]

I call the SNP spokesperson.

[Richard Thomson (Gordon) (SNP)]

I have to remind the Secretary of State that it was this Government who signed up to the trade and co-operation agreement and the Northern Ireland protocol as it currently stands. It might not be necessary to try to renegotiate had more time been given over to this Chamber to allow Members to scrutinise it before it entered into law. Does the Secretary of State regret the decision taken by the Government to curtail the amount of parliamentary time available to Members to scrutinise that before Brexit was done?

--- Later in debate ---

[Conor Burns]

As almost always, my hon. Friend is absolutely right.

[Mr Speaker]

I call shadow Minister Tonia Antoniazzi.

[Tonia Antoniazzi (Gower) (Lab)]

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Last week, I met Jonny Petrie, chief executive of Ulster Rugby, about the club’s plans to apply for levelling-up funding to improve sporting facilities, including for community clubs across Northern Ireland, that would support the health and wellbeing of local people. Will the Government commit to considering funding development of these facilities so that Northern Ireland can attract major sporting and cultural events that would deliver much-needed tourism, jobs and money to the people of Northern Ireland?

[Conor Burns]

I am delighted—[Interruption.] Thank you for that thunderous welcome back to the Dispatch Box. I am happy to say to the shadow Minister that we will absolutely do that. Only yesterday I was in Carrickfergus with the son-in-law of an hon. Gentleman on the Benches opposite seeing a new 5G pitch. We are absolutely committed to levelling up. As my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister has made clear, levelling up is the mission of this Government. It is not about north-south; it is about improving life opportunities in communities across the whole of the United Kingdom, especially in Northern Ireland.

[Mr Speaker]

That must be the loudest cheer any Minister has had—well done, Minister!

Before we come to Prime Minister’s questions, I would like to point out that British Sign Language interpretation of proceedings is available to watch on parliamentlive.tv.

The Prime Minister was asked—

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend is absolutely right to champion this type of approach, which makes a real difference to people’s lives and people suffering from mental health issues, helping them to find a route back into work. That is why we are commissioning more initiatives through funds such as the life chances fund, helping those people in society who face the biggest barriers to have happy and productive lives.

[Mr Speaker]

We now come to the Leader of the Opposition, Keir Starmer.

[Keir Starmer (Holborn and St Pancras) (Lab)]

Can I join the Prime Minister in his comments about Windrush, and pay tribute to everyone who is serving and has served in our armed forces? Can I also pay tribute to everyone standing for election tomorrow and in particular the plucky Conservative candidate for Wakefield? He is standing, even though his own colleagues think he is so useless that they held a vote of no confidence in him. Does the Prime Minister hold any personal interest in seeing if the public will vote for a Tory who even his own side do not think is up to it?

[Keir Starmer]

The Prime Minister has obviously not been to Wakefield recently. He has crashed the economy and he has put everybody’s tax up. The last Tory he sent up to Wakefield was convicted of a sexual assault. That is not much of a pitch, Prime Minister. Talking of people not up to the job, while the Transport Secretary spends his time working on his spreadsheet tracking the Prime Minister’s unpopularity, thousands of families have had their holiday flights cancelled, it takes forever to renew a driving licence or passport and now we have the biggest rail strike in 30 years. If the Prime Minister is genuine—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Both sides, let us calm down. We have only just started. The problem is, it will go on forever, and nobody wants that, I assure you, whoever is speaking or asking questions.

[Keir Starmer]

If the Prime Minister is genuine about preventing strikes, will he tell this House how many meetings he or his Transport Secretary have had with rail workers this week to actually stop the strikes?

[The Prime Minister]

This is the Government who love the railways and who invest in the railways. We are putting £96 billion into the integrated railway plan. I am proud to have built Crossrail, by the way, and we are going to build Northern Powerhouse Rail, but we have got to modernise our railways. It is a disgrace, when we are planning to make sure that we do not have ticket offices that sell fewer than one ticket every hour, that yesterday the right hon. and learned Gentleman had 25 Labour MPs out on the picket line, defying instructions—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. I want to hear the Prime Minister’s answer, even if some Members do not. I think they ought to show some respect to the Prime Minister.

[The Prime Minister]

There were 25 Labour MPs and the shadow deputy leader out on the picket line, backing the strikers, while we back the strivers.

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[Keir Starmer]

Fifteen tax rises, high tax, low wages, low growth—that sums the Prime Minister’s Government up. Working people are paying more tax under this Government, and now they are told to take a pay cut. He is having meetings about increasing bankers’ bonuses, but he cannot find time for a single meeting to end the strikes crippling the country.

It is Armed Forces Week. Under this Prime Minister, those serving our country are facing a real-terms pay cut. Why are his Government more focused on increasing bankers’—[Interruption.]

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Mr MacNeil, your voice is not quiet—it is like mine; it carries. The best thing to do, if you want it to carry, is to try standing on the Terrace for a while.

[Keir Starmer]

It is Armed Forces Week. Under this Prime Minister, those serving our country are facing a real-terms pay cut. Why are his Government more focused on increasing bankers’ pay than the pay of those who are running the country?

--- Later in debate ---

[The Prime Minister]

My hon. Friend knows exactly of what he speaks, and we are doing just that. We are reforming train driver training to make entry into the sector simpler, while continuing, of course, to make sure that we meet vital safety requirements.

[Mr Speaker]

We now come to the parliamentary leader of the SNP.

[Ian Blackford (Ross, Skye and Lochaber) (SNP)]

May I associate myself with the remarks of the Prime Minister and the leader of the Labour party as we mark Armed Services Week? We thank all our service personnel for the services that they give.

On Windrush Day, we celebrate all those who have made Scotland and the UK their home. My party backs calls for a major commemoration for the 75th anniversary next year so we can properly mark the valued contribution that those who came here have made.

This morning, it was revealed that UK inflation is now at a 40-year high. Families right across these islands are seeing their incomes squeezed as prices rise, bills soar, and Tory cuts and tax hikes hammer home. After 12 years in government, the Tories have left the UK economy in the doldrums and pushed millions of people into poverty, so can I ask the Prime Minister: does he think his Government bear any blame for the fact that the United Kingdom is doing so much worse than our European neighbours?

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[Andy Carter (Warrington South) (Con)]

Q6. My constituents in Chapelford, Penketh, Great Sankey and Appleton all tell me that they want to see more police officers tackling issues such as antisocial behaviour, domestic abuse and burglary. Thanks to the initiatives of John Dwyer, the excellent police and crime commissioner in Cheshire, and sustained recruitment by the new chief constable, the hard work of our police officers is paying off, with an almost 50% increase in arrests for domestic abuse in Cheshire in the last 12 months. Will my right hon. Friend update the House on how many more officers have been recruited in both Cheshire and across the UK since he became Prime Minister? Will he join me in recognising—

[Mr Speaker]

Order. Can I just say that other Members do want to get in and, the longer the question, the fewer of them will get in? Your friendships will dwindle if you carry on like that.

[The Prime Minister]

I can tell my hon. Friend very briefly that it is 13,576 more police officers, with 200 more in Cheshire. They are also cutting neighbourhood crime—already by 31%—and our streets are getting safer as a result.

Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill

Lindsay Hoyle Excerpts

2nd reading
Tuesday 24th May 2022 Commons Chamber

Second Reading

[Mr Speaker]

No reasoned amendment has been selected.