Parental Responsibility for People Convicted of Serious Offences

Debate between Mark Tami and Kerry McCarthy

Monday 7th November 2022 Westminster Hall

[Kerry McCarthy (Bristol East) (Lab)]

It is a pleasure to see you in the Chair as always, Mr Hollobone. The hon. Member for Wrexham (Sarah Atherton) made some interesting points; the all-party parliamentary group on kinship care has done a lot of work on these issues, which chimes with some of the points she made.

I thank my right hon. Friend the Member for Alyn and Deeside (Mark Tami) for opening the debate on behalf of the Petitions Committee, and for sharing the experiences of Jade Ward’s family. There are no words to describe the pain that those close to Jade have been through, but my right hon. Friend did an excellent job of articulating their calls for action. It cannot be easy for those of them present here to have to listen to this debate, but I hope they feel some reassurance. People who have been through difficult experiences often get some strength from the idea that something good may come of the pain they have been through.

It is often assumed that when one parent is sentenced for a serious offence, a legal mechanism is automatically triggered to assure the safety and wellbeing of their children and those looking after them. As we have heard, that just does not happen. When a parent goes to prison and they have parental responsibility, they retain it by default. Care givers must consult them ahead of key decisions concerning the children’s names, where they go to school, their religious upbringing and any medical procedures they undergo before their 18th birthday. Where parental responsibility is concerned, the law does not differentiate between parents who commit non-violent offences and those guilty of serious offences, including murder, rape, sexual offences against children, gang-related violence and so on. As we have heard, that is even the case where one parent has killed the other, or where the parent in prison has killed another family member.

Understandably, the petition is focused on parental or interparental homicide, which is where we should start in terms of reviewing the law, but there are many other cases that involve similar scenarios. Far too many parents have to keep in contact with their abusers for their children’s sake. I say “for their children’s sake”, but that is based on a default presumption that it must always be in the child’s interest for the parent in prison to retain contact, and quite often that presumption is wrong.

The only mechanism a child’s primary care givers currently have to challenge the perpetrator’s right to parental responsibility is through the legal system. A court can terminate a father’s parental responsibility on the grounds of their behaviour, but that happens only in exceptional circumstances, where there is proof that the father’s retention of that responsibility—I say “father” as a shorthand—would be detrimental to the child’s welfare. As I understand it, that has only ever happened four times in England and Wales.

Families are not always willing to put themselves through the extra trauma of attending a court hearing and having to relive the worst time of their lives, with their version of events placed under the microscope yet again. Facing the person who killed or abused their loved one—or abused them—and looking that person in the eye is often very difficult. They might also be fearful that the perpetrator will retaliate in whatever way they can if the court removes the rights, especially if they will be released from prison before the child turns 18. It takes a lot of courage to take a violent perpetrator to court while knowing the risks, and it is easy to see why many would be put off attending court at all. As we have heard, spiralling court backlogs and cuts to legal aid make the process more agonising for the families.

The main thing I want to talk about today is the work of the charity Children Heard and Seen, which supports children with a parent in prison. The primary focus—this is what differentiates it from other charities—is on the interests of the child. A lot of the organisations that work with prisoners’ families focus very much on the rights of the prisoner, and there is an assumption that contact with the family is in the prisoner’s interests; because we know, for example, that such contact means far less risk of reoffending.

It often shocks people to learn that there is no system for recording when a child’s parent goes into prison. Sometimes it is picked up in pre-sentence reports, although the parent will not always admit that they have a child because they worry about them being taken into care. Social services might already be involved with the family, or they might become involved if they suspect that the children are the direct victims of the parent’s crime, such as child sexual abuse, but we often find that social services—once they realise the children were not the victims and perhaps other children were—just disappear from the scene.

There is no system for routinely informing children’s services at the council or the children’s school, or for monitoring the children’s wellbeing during a parent’s imprisonment. The data is also hard to come by. One figure is used quite a lot—that 312,000 children are affected from year to year. I think that is probably on the high side, but it is impossible to tell. Many children are off the radar, despite potentially being at risk, or very vulnerable and needing support.

Children Heard and Seen runs a support group for carers who look after children affected by interparental homicide. It also supports families who continue to experience harassment or coercive control, despite the perpetrator being in prison. That includes domestic violence cases. I have heard from the charity about the strategies that domestic abusers use to manipulate their ex-partners while in prison, from using illicit burner phones to breach restraining orders, to refusing divorce papers and getting friends or neighbours to harass and intimidate them.

Services supporting victims might tell them they are safe once their former partner is in prison, but that is not always the case. Children Heard and Seen says that allowing a violent offender parental responsibility gives them the opportunity to control their child, ex-partner or family from within the prison walls. On the Children Heard and Seen website, there are quite a few blog posts by people who have been affected by a parent or a partner going into prison.

To cite one case, a mother applied for passports to take her children on holiday after a difficult few years that led up to the father’s imprisonment. Because both parents had parental responsibility, she needed his signature to complete the application. He was given the paperwork by the prison officers, but refused to sign it, which meant the family could not travel and the mother lost every penny she had paid towards the holiday. Of course, the father would not have been able to join them on holiday, but it was not about the children at all; it was just another way to pull the strings in his family’s life and exercise control over his former partner, despite the physical distance between them.

A perpetrator of domestic abuse might be restricted from contacting their actual victim—such as the mother, in this case—if there is a restraining order in place. However, if they have children together, it is easy for the perpetrator to use that child as a way to stay present in the abused partner’s life. Little can be done to stop them calling or writing to their children. As has been said, family services often encourage prisoners to stay in touch in such situations, as it is seen as being in the prisoner’s interest. There is also a belief that a child must want to see their parent who is in prison and must be missing them dreadfully, despite having witnessed a lot of abuse at home, and actually being fearful of the parent, and, in some ways, relieved that they have been removed from the household.

The perpetrator can use this contact to say that they will only see the children if the mother brings them to the prison, which, if the child wants to see the parent, is a way of exercising control. They can also make veiled threats through written letters. I cannot imagine how chilling it must be for an ex-partner to have to read out letters from their abuser to their children, in which the abuser may say he is getting stronger in prison and counting down the days until he sees their mum again, or which contain drawings of the children’s favourite film characters holding knives. We need a case-by-case approach, where services work with families to take a more active role in determining when contact is appropriate.

As of 2019, men made up 95% of the prison population. A far higher proportion of men are in prison for serious offences, so it is fair to assume that far more fathers are in prison than mothers. The flipside of that is the extra layer of complexity if a mother is arrested for a serious offence. Societal expectations about a mother’s natural role as a primary care giver can lead to the assumption that they should automatically keep parental responsibility. As I understand it, courts cannot legally terminate a mother’s parental responsibility, although it can, in rare cases, be limited.

It is important to remember the key principle of the Children Act 1989, which is that the welfare of the child is paramount. A child’s right to safety and protection from harm overrides all other legal considerations. How can the welfare of the child be paramount if their imprisoned parent can use contact with them to manipulate or control other family members?

[Mark Tami]

My hon. Friend is making a very powerful case. Although she is talking about people in prison, we have probably all seen instances in our casework—thankfully at a much lower level—where relationships have broken down and children are weaponised by one or both partners. I have always found it very strange that a father might not pay towards the children’s upkeep but still has the same rights as someone who does pay. I do not understand that, although I know why it is the case: the two are not seen to be connected. However, I have always had the view that if someone does not support their children, they should not automatically think they should have exactly the same rights as somebody who does.

[Kerry McCarthy]

I entirely agree. I think we have all seen cases where contact with the children will be supervised and the family will have to go to a centre due to the relationship between the ex-partners, because the mother is fearful of being alone in the same room as the father. I have seen so many examples where that has been manipulated and the father does not actually want to see the children, but instead wants to use the visit as a way of putting fear into the heart of the mother, who is bringing the children along.

Until the laws around parental responsibility change, families will continue to suffer. As we have outlined today, suspending parental responsibility for those who commit serious, violent crimes—at least on a temporary basis—would certainly be a start. The right to parental responsibility could then be reviewed and re-established if the families consent and new evidence indicates it would be appropriate.

It is important to re-emphasise that this is not a matter of removing a prisoner’s right to parental responsibility in all instances; it is about protecting children and families caught up in the most extreme circumstances. We need to consider it on a case-by-case basis. Care givers need more input into the process of determining parental responsibility from the start. The police and other authorities need more training in spotting the signs of coercive control within families. Above all, children’s best interests and safety must be put first.

It is difficult to keep up with personnel changes in this Government, but I have had meetings with Justice Ministers and the Minister for Children and Families, and I have raised this issue in various debates. We need data on how many children have a parent in prison. Anecdotally, I know that there is a huge number out there, and unless we can identify how many there are and find a way of recording them, we will never be able to give them the help and support they need.

I again congratulate Jade Ward’s family for fighting for this change. I hope today’s discussion takes us a step further in resolving these issues.

NHS Specialised Services

Debate between Mark Tami and Kerry McCarthy

Thursday 15th January 2015 Westminster Hall

[Mark Tami]

I agree, and that is a fact that few people know. A white person has a 70% to 80% chance of finding a match. For some ethnic groups, the chance of finding a match can be as low as 30%. For those of mixed race, depending on what that mix is, it can be even worse. We need to do much more work in those areas to try to explain that. It is the same with giving blood, where there is also a problem. The two are connected, but there is a big problem there, and we need to do a lot of work on it. Transplants are also being used for sickle cell disease, which is an important area that has already been mentioned.

Many of the graft-versus-host issues appear during the early days, but that is not always the case. Flare-ups can happen many years later. Hopefully they will become less severe as time goes on, but we cannot say that they will stop at a particular time—100 days or any other arbitrary figure. GVH is not the only problem; most transplant patients will contract a series of infections due to their immune system being compromised as a result of the treatment they have to receive to ensure that the transplant is in the best position to take. Those infections might not prove particularly dangerous to the rest of us, but they could prove fatal to a transplant patient. In the longer term, secondary cancers are another issue that has to be faced. However, without the transplant these patients would not be alive even to think about such issues, so we always need to put matters into proportion.

We have talked a lot about the physical impact of a transplant, but the psychological effects are often ignored, and there is perhaps a lack of support. Transplants are a difficult process, particularly for children. My son was in hospital, off and on, for two years, which is a big chunk of a nine-year-old’s life. Even for adults, transplants are a major step. We need to do a lot more to address the psychological effects by providing better counselling. Some support is provided in hospitals, and I have experience of that, but once people leave hospital they have to search long and hard to get support. It is a fact that transplant patients have a higher rate of suicide than the rest of the public.

[Kerry McCarthy]

I visited the cystic fibrosis unit at Bristol, and one of the key problems for people from remoter, rural areas is accessing the ongoing support, or even the drugs, that they need. In the cities there may be a concentration of patients with the same illness or a unit that specialises in treating it, and one of my concerns about co-commissioning is that a CF patient somewhere in Devon or Cornwall will have very few other patients nearby. The problems that such patients already have with being remote from the hospitals that treat them will be exacerbated if there is a local element.

[Mark Tami]

I totally agree. Thankfully, not many people have these conditions, so particularly in rural areas, someone might be the only person with the condition, and accessing support may be much more difficult.

After the 100-day cut off it becomes far more problematic for both the patient and the health provider. The term “postcode lottery” has been mentioned a lot today, and it is certainly the case when accessing support. After such a traumatic procedure, a postcode lottery is the last thing that people need. We must move away from the arbitrary 100 days, which does not fit what the patient actually needs. We need a more flexible approach that focuses on the patient, rather than just some figure that we seem to think may or may not cover the majority of people.

Support should go arm in arm with a proper transplant pathway that addresses how we look after transplant patients after those 100 days, or whatever figure is used, for as long as necessary. I have always been struck by the fact that we spend a vast sum on each transplant on the medical and hospital side, probably hundreds of thousands of pounds by the time we finish, but when the patient leaves that environment, the level of support is very poor. We need a more joined-up approach, particularly for children. A few years ago I spoke in an Adjournment debate in the House on support for children who have had cancer and are returning to the school environment. I was shocked that there are no national guidelines on how we reintroduce children. It is a scary, traumatic process not only for them but for their classmates, particularly if they are very young. Their classmates might suddenly see a child they have not seen for a while looking very different. Some schools are very good and some are absolutely hopeless in the support that they give. I am going slightly off the subject but the Department of Health and the Department for Education must work together, rather than arguing about who is responsible for providing such support.

My last point concerns patients who have had a transplant but unfortunately have relapsed. A transplant is not an easy option, and it is traumatic enough, but when the transplant fails, perhaps a year or two down the road, the patient is faced with a bleak outcome unless another transplant is available. Indeed, when a transplant is first performed, a proportion of the cells will be kept to have another go, if I can put it in those terms, in the event of such an outcome. That will obviously apply only to a limited number of people, but for that limited number of people it is their only hope. In the past we have seen that a second transplant tends to go ahead because the number of people affected is not particularly vast, but in England a second transplant now has to be provided by the NHS England individual funding request process. I understand that in recent months a number of those requests have been declined. I also believe that NHS England does not intend to address the issue until April 2015 at the earliest, although it recognises that there is an issue. When it does, I do not know how long it will take to decide what to do or, indeed, what the outcome will be. That is unacceptable. It is not too dramatic to say that lives are being lost because of that delay and this unnecessary process.