(7 years, 7 months ago)
Commons ChamberRead Hansard Text Read Debate Ministerial Extracts
John Glen (Salisbury) (Con)
The Secretary of State for Defence (Michael Fallon)
The campaign against Daesh is making steady progress. With coalition support, Iraqi forces have freed Fallujah and, as part of preparatory operations for retaking Mosul, have liberated Qayyarah town. The Syrian Democratic Forces have taken Manbij and Turkish-backed opposition forces have taken Jarabulus and al-Rai, effectively denying Daesh its last border crossings into Turkey. As we approach the second anniversary of our military operations, I should like to pay tribute to the men and women of all three services, who work tirelessly to defeat Daesh and to keep Britain safe.
Michael Fallon
As my hon. Friend knows, Russian military activity in Syria has supported the Assad regime, a regime that bombs, tortures and starves its own people. While we welcome the latest ceasefire from tonight, it is Russia that must make it work by stopping Assad attacking Syrian civilians and moderate opposition groups, and by helping to get humanitarian aid into Aleppo and other cities that have been starved of food.
Phil Wilson (Sedgefield) (Lab)
The G20 communiqué last week in China talked about terrorist financing. I know that we have done a lot in our military operations to try to degrade that, but will the Secretary of State say what more the UK can do to degrade the money that the terrorists are getting in from smuggling oil, from extortion and so on? What more can the UK military do to deny Daesh those sources of funding?
Michael Fallon
The infrastructure targets that the RAF has been attacking in recent months have included oil installations to reduce the revenue that Daesh has been getting from oil trading. Sealing the border, too, will help to stop the flow of illicit goods and, indeed, oil across the border. We continue to work with our international partners to reduce the access of Daesh to the financial system.
Jack Lopresti (Filton and Bradley Stoke) (Con)
May I ask the Secretary of State why it took a year for us to supply ammunition for the heavy weapons that we supply to the peshmerga in Iraq? Can he assure the House that such delays will never happen again, and that we are doing everything that we possibly can to help the peshmerga in their fight against Daesh?
Michael Fallon
We have supplied, as my hon. Friend knows, not only heavy machine guns to the peshmerga but ammunition for those heavy machine guns. I announced earlier in the summer a fresh gift from us of ammunition for those heavy machine guns, and I am very pleased to tell him that that ammunition has now arrived and is being used.
Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD)
The US-Russia agreement to tackle Daesh will clearly have an impact on British forces. Is the Secretary of State able to say anything about the deployment of our Air Force there, or indeed of our special forces?
Michael Fallon
We do not, as the right hon. Gentleman knows, comment in this House on the deployment of our special forces in any country in the world, but he raises an important point about de-confliction of the airspace. At the moment, we are party to the agreement between Russia and the United States, and that agreement ensures that there is minimum risk of collisions or misidentification of aircraft. That, obviously, will continue to be the case after the ceasefire, which we hope will take effect tonight.
Luke Hall (Thornbury and Yate) (Con)
Michael Fallon
I announced in June that we would be sending another 250 British troops to the al-Asad airbase in western Iraq to complement the Danish training programme, as part of what is called the building partner capacity effort. I am very pleased to tell my hon. Friend that the advance party from 4 Rifles arrived in the last few days at al-Asad airbase.
Brendan O’Hara (Argyll and Bute) (SNP)
This is indeed a critical time for the future of Syria. May I add the voice of Scottish National party Members to those from across the Chamber in wishing the proposed ceasefire in Syria well? We echo the call for all sides in this awful conflict to observe the ceasefire.
Given that the ceasefire is vital to the campaign to defeat Daesh, may I ask the Secretary of State what discussions the UK Government have had with both the United States and the Russian Federation, and what role the UK Government played in helping to broker this ceasefire?
Michael Fallon
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for his earlier remarks. The UK Government have been involved in promoting this ceasefire all the way back from the original cessation of hostilities, which was announced at the Munich security conference. We have been part of the intense efforts to get and to keep moderate opposition groups around the table to negotiate a future settlement for Syria, and we have also been part of encouraging the ceasefire as well.
Brendan O’Hara
Talking of the moderate forces, what discussions have the UK Government had with the representatives of the 70,000 moderate troops, whom we were led to believe we were discussing ahead of last year’s decision to bomb Syria? Will the Secretary of State tell us what contact has been made and what assurances have been given by those moderate forces that this ceasefire will stick?
Michael Fallon
We have been in contact with exactly those moderate forces. Indeed, representatives from the different opposition groups in Syria were in London last week for precisely those kinds of discussions. We very much hope that the ceasefire will stick now. A large part of that will depend on Russia persuading the Syrian regime to back the ceasefire, but it is also important that it is properly respected right across northern Syria as well.
Nusrat Ghani (Wealden) (Con)
Challenging the death cult ideology of Daesh is vital if we are to tackle this type of terrorism. Will the Secretary of State update the House on the progress being made by the 34 Muslim nations, co-ordinated by Saudi Arabia, to defeat Daesh?
Michael Fallon
Yes, we welcome the efforts that are being made, led by Saudi Arabia. I visited the centre it has established in Riyadh to lead this effort to make it very clear that Islam is a religion of peace and to co-ordinate the various programmes of de-radicalisation that are already in force across the Arab world.
Clive Lewis (Norwich South) (Lab)
We all very much welcome the recent announcement of a ceasefire in Syria. As well as providing an opportunity for all sides to focus on defeating Daesh, it creates a space for further negotiations aimed at ending the conflict once and for all. The need for a negotiated settlement in Syria is as urgent as ever, particularly in light of horrifying reports of yet another chlorine attack in recent days. Will the Secretary of State tell the House a little more about the implications for the delivery of humanitarian aid to civilians in Syria under the ceasefire details?
Michael Fallon
I am grateful to the shadow Defence Secretary for what he has said and for his support. Getting humanitarian aid into Aleppo and some of the other towns and cities that have suffered is a key part of the ceasefire. I think one of the tests of the ceasefire will be whether the regime is really prepared to allow in these much-needed convoys.
Kevin Foster (Torbay) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mark Lancaster)
Since the extremely generous offer by President Hollande to confer the Légion d’Honneur on surviving veterans of the campaigns to liberate France in 1944, we have had a number of discussions with representatives of the French Government about the criteria and process for making the award. As a result, the French Government have presented more than 3,500 medals to British veterans. Officials in London and Paris remain proactively engaged to make the process as smooth as possible.
Kevin Foster
Three 94-year-old south Devon Normandy veterans—Ferneley Nankivell, Alan Carncross and Robert Barbour DFC—are still waiting for the award of their Légion d’Honneur, and other veterans have passed away during the past year without receiving it. Will the Minister join me in calling on the French authorities to resolve this issue as a matter of urgency, and to look at whether the honour can still be awarded to those who have passed away since July 2014?
Mark Lancaster
The Légion D’Honneur is established by law in France, with set requirements for scrutiny and approval. Within those limits, the French authorities have done their utmost to expedite the issue of the awards. As in the UK, such honours and awards are generally not made posthumously. I can confirm that the cases of Mr Barbour and Mr Nankivell have been submitted to the French authorities. Unfortunately, there is no record of an application for Mr Carncross, but if one is submitted, I will ensure that it is expedited.
Mr David Hanson (Delyn) (Lab)
I do appreciate the efforts of the Minister and the Department to ensure that individuals get their Légion d’Honneur medals, but like the hon. Member for Torbay (Kevin Foster), I still know of a large number of people who are qualified for the medal and have applied for it but have not received it. Is it possible for the Minister to carry out an audit of how many applications are outstanding in the United Kingdom, so that he can chase them up?
Mark Lancaster
The French have awarded approximately 3,500 medals, and we have sent the French about 4,300 applications. At the moment, the process is taking between six and eight weeks. I appreciate that that is still a significant period given the age of the cohort in question, but I can assure the right hon. Gentleman, who has pursued the issue persistently over the past year, that we have done everything we can to make the process as quick as possible given the circumstances and the age of the veterans involved.
Sir Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con)
Through you, Mr Speaker, may I say as chair of the all-party France group that the French embassy is doing its best in difficult circumstances, and that if anybody has a constituent who has a problem, they should write to me and we will get the Légion d’Honneur to them straight away? These people deserve better, and we will do our best for them.
Mr Speaker
Of course, the hon. Gentleman is too modest to reveal to the House that although he is not himself a Normandy veteran, as is demonstrably apparent, he does hold the honour.
Mark Lancaster
I am grateful to my hon. Friend for the support that he offers. I can only repeat that we are keen to get applications expedited as quickly as possible. Although all of the cohort are of a certain age, if any hon. Member has a constituent about whom they are particularly concerned, I ask them to contact us and we will endeavour to get the Légion d’Honneur to them as quickly as possible.
Victoria Prentis (Banbury) (Con)
Alberto Costa (South Leicestershire) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Harriett Baldwin)
Small businesses are crucial for growth and innovation in this country, and we want them to take an increasing share of our growing defence budget. We are committed to achieving 25% of our procurement spend being with small and medium-sized enterprises by 2020. That target is 10% higher than the one set during the last Parliament.
Victoria Prentis
May I say how nice it is to see my hon. Friend in her place? May I drill down a little and ask her what steps she can take to ensure that the Ministry of Defence’s largest customers use small firms to deliver their contracts?
Harriett Baldwin
My hon. Friend is absolutely right that it is essential that we work on that not only in our direct defence procurement process but with our supply chains. I am delighted to be able to let the House know that the supply chain advocate network and the supply chain champions, which my predecessor announced, are well under way, and that last year the Ministry of Defence was able to have direct spend with almost 5,000 different companies.
Alberto Costa
What measures can the MOD take to reduce the regulatory burden on small firms such as those in my constituency when they make applications for defence equipment procurement?
Harriett Baldwin
My hon. Friend is right to highlight ways in which we can make the process easier for small and medium-sized businesses. For example, this year we removed the turnover requirement in the pre-qualification process, and we are working towards simplifying the contract terms and reducing them to just three pages.
Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op)
I welcome the Minister to her new position. Will she take notice of what happens in Huddersfield, where we have David Brown Gear Systems and many other fine companies making things that our defence forces want? Will she dissociate herself from the term “fat and lazy”, which was used about British businessmen? We have no fat and lazy businessmen in Huddersfield.
Harriett Baldwin
Those were certainly not my words, and I pay tribute to the many businesses in Huddersfield and South Yorkshire that do such wonderful work in supplying the Ministry of Defence.
Richard Arkless (Dumfries and Galloway) (SNP)
On Wednesday I raised the issue of an engineering company in my constituency that had gone into administration. I place on record my appreciation of the Minister, who, at very short notice, scrambled around and rearranged her diary to meet the administrators, who are in the Gallery today. We thank her very much. In advance of that meeting, will she agree to work with me and the administrators to leave no stone unturned, so that we can do our best to save valuable jobs and engineering experience at Penman?
Harriett Baldwin
The hon. Gentleman is working hard to represent the interests of his constituents; not only did he raise this case last week at Prime Minister’s questions but I am pleased to say that we will be able to meet him and the administrators later today.
Mark Pawsey (Rugby) (Con)
In Rugby we are very proud of the contribution that GE Power Conversion is making to the Type 26 global combat ship programme; it is also important to recognise its contribution to the local economy through the orders it places with subcontractors and through local small businesses.
Harriett Baldwin
My hon. Friend is absolutely right to highlight that earlier this year we were able to announce contracts for some of the long lead-time items as part of that programme, and also to highlight the way in which small and medium-sized businesses play such an important role in that supply chain.
Kate Hollern (Blackburn) (Lab)
It is interesting to listen to the Minister. I greatly support the aim of 25% of defence expenditure being with small and medium-sized enterprises by 2020. However, figures published last month showed clearly that only 2% of spending went to companies assessed as SMEs. The SME status of suppliers is determined by independent verifiers. Why has there been no assessment of new MOD suppliers since 2014? Is the Department resorting to creative accountancy?
Harriett Baldwin
I do not recognise the figures that the hon. Lady cited. I can confirm that in 2014-15 we spent 19% with small and medium-sized businesses. She will be aware that, as she highlighted, the contract with Dun and Bradstreet for evaluating the characteristics of different firms, which is a Cabinet Office contract, ended in 2014. We are in the process of discussing with Cabinet Office colleagues what the successor framework will be like.
Mr Dominic Raab (Esher and Walton) (Con)
Chris Davies (Brecon and Radnorshire) (Con)
The Minister for the Armed Forces (Mike Penning)
We are determined to meet our manifesto commitment to ensure that our armed forces overseas are not subject to persistent legal claims that undermine their ability to do their job. I am continuing to explore the work that my predecessor did, working across Government to bring forward proposals in the very near future.
Mr Raab
I welcome the Minister’s statement and urge him and the Government to press ahead with reforms in this area, in particular with regard to the extraterritorial jurisdiction of human rights laws and civil law limitation periods, so that we have accountability for rare acts of wrongdoing, but do not subject those risking life and limb for their country to vexatious litigation by ambulance-chasing lawyers.
Mike Penning
My hon. Friend was in the same Department as me before I had the honour of taking on this role. It is very important that those who have done wrong are dealt with, but it is really wrong that tax-paid lawyers are chasing around the country trying to prosecute other people.
Chris Davies
Our armed forces are the best in the world and we must do everything to protect them, both on and off the battlefield. Many soldiers are based in barracks at Sennybridge and Brecon in my constituency; will my right hon. Friend assure them and me that the Iraq historic allegations tribunal will look very carefully at the claims made against British forces personnel and whether to reject those allegations, particularly following the demise of Public Interest Lawyers?
Mike Penning
I think we all welcome the demise of Public Interest Lawyers. It is for the regulatory authorities to look closely at what it did and how it earned its income. I trained at Sennybridge many years ago. I assure everyone in the armed forces that these Ministers and this Government are behind them and will make sure that we protect them as much as possible.
Mr Julian Brazier (Canterbury) (Con)
I welcome my right hon. Friend to his place, and especially welcome his stance on this matter. He may have to spread his net even wider than he thinks. Is he aware that Phil Shiner, who has made so much money out of this situation, is trying to conceal his ill-gotten gains by threatening those editors who are threatening to expose him with recourse to the Independent Press Standards Organisation on the basis of so-called mental health problems?
Mike Penning
First, I pay tribute to my hon. Friend for his work—not just as Minister for the Reserves but ever since he came to the House—for the reserves, in which he has served honourably, as well. Let us let the regulatory bodies do their work first and see what comes out of the other side, and then see whether any other processes, including perhaps even legal action, are needed.
Christina Rees (Neath) (Lab/Co-op)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Harriett Baldwin)
We positively encourage bids from British companies to ensure they are in the best possible position to win future steel contracts. We have issued new policy guidance to address the barriers which might prevent UK steel producers from competing effectively in the open market.
Christina Rees
Now that Government Departments are mandated to provide information about the proportion of UK steel used in the Crown Commercial Service, will the Minister please tell the House what percentage of UK steel is used in current defence projects and what percentage will be used in future?[Official Report, 11 October 2016, Vol. 615, c. 4MC.]
Harriett Baldwin
The hon. Lady rightly speaks up for steel production in her constituency. She will be very pleased to know that, for the largest project that the UK Government have ever procured that uses steel—she will be aware that that is the carrier programme currently under construction on the Clyde—the vast majority comes from Tata Steel. I believe it is 94%.
Tom Pursglove (Corby) (Con)
I wholly support the increasing use of small firms for defence procurement, but will the Minister undertake to encourage those small firms to use British steel wherever possible?
Harriett Baldwin
My hon. Friend is absolutely right that it is a process of encouraging competition not only within the procurement process, but where there are long lead-time items. In our strategic defence and security review, we clearly set out the largest programme of investment in ships for some time, and there will be a lot of long lead-time items. Small business and producers will be able to work with those who are procuring contracts with prime contractors to find a place in that supply chain.
Kate Hollern (Blackburn) (Lab)
Recent defence procurement decisions have failed to take into account the benefits to the UK economy gained by manufacturing domestically. A growing number of products, particularly steel, are procured abroad. Will the Minister therefore commit to assess the wider economic and social benefits derived from building the three new solid support vessels in the UK with British steel, and to share that information with the House?
Harriett Baldwin
The hon. Lady is right again to highlight the fact that, in our strategic defence and security review, we set out a programme in which we are investing in more ships and more aeroplanes, and there is more cyber-investment. She mentions the solid support ships. They will not be procured until later in the Parliament, but I assure her that we will do everything we can with those long lead-time items and the programmes that have been set out in advance to ensure that British companies, including British steel companies, have all the information they need to be successful.
Nigel Mills (Amber Valley) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Harriett Baldwin)
Competition remains the best way of securing value for money but sometimes we need to place single-source contracts. We therefore established a new regime backed by statute with an independent regulator to ensure contract costs and profit rates are both reasonable and transparent.
Nigel Mills
I thank the Minister for that answer. If the Single Source Regulations Office to which she refers seeks to proceed with its current proposal to reform the profit rates on those contracts, will she commit that those changes will this time have the Government’s support?
Harriett Baldwin
Yes, in March this year we reduced the profit rate on single-source contracts from 10.6% to 8.95%. The regulator will then recommend a rate for 2017, which we will consider carefully, along with its recommendation on multiple profit rates.
Mrs Madeleine Moon (Bridgend) (Lab)
What steps will the Minister take to ensure that, where single-source contracting is placed abroad with, say, American companies, there are appropriate levels of set-aside, so that apprenticeships and the seed-corning for future capability in British defence companies are protected and facilitated?
Harriett Baldwin
The hon. Lady will be aware that that is an ongoing subject of discussion, and of the commitment that General Dynamics has made in Wales in the part of the world she represents to create 250 jobs in the supply chain for the Ajax vehicles.
Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)
Whether contracts are derived from single source or open competition, unnecessary costs can be incurred when design specifications are changed after the contract has started, for example with the Type 45s. What steps is the Minister taking to ensure that late changes after contracts have started no longer occur?
Harriett Baldwin
My hon. Friend is right to highlight one of the major themes that came out of the review into how we can improve defence procurement. As he rightly points out, there were problems with the design of the Type 45, which was ordered at the beginning of the previous decade, that have subsequently been costly to rectify. That is why we now take such care on design: to prevent such things from happening in future.
Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab)
I welcome what the Minister said in answer to an earlier question about targets that are in place to ensure small and medium-sized enterprises in the UK benefit from defence procurement. When she is considering value for money and single-source contracts, can she assure the House that value for money includes British jobs, British skills and, as my hon. Friend the Member for Bridgend (Mrs Moon) said, investment in apprenticeships?
Harriett Baldwin
I thank the hon. Gentleman for mentioning apprenticeships and our commitment to continuing to work with our single-source suppliers. We can clearly see that they are some of the lead providers of apprenticeships across the defence procurement area.
Tristram Hunt (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab)
The Secretary of State for Defence (Michael Fallon)
We aim to maximise the benefit for the UK from new technologies and know-how developed through defence research. Our science and technology organisation, the Defence Science and Technology Laboratory, DSTL, exploits those results through its technology transfer company, Ploughshare Innovations Limited, which we estimate will have contributed over £200 million to export value by 2018 and generated over 500 jobs. On Friday, I will launch our plans for a new approach to further exploiting innovation in defence.
Tristram Hunt
During the recess, I spent some special time with the Government Chief Whip, the right hon. Member for South Staffordshire (Gavin Williamson), and the hon. Member for Stafford (Jeremy Lefroy) visiting the Signal Regiment at Stafford barracks. As we continue to draw down from Germany, Stoke-on-Trent and Staffordshire are enjoying an influx of highly trained personnel and, with them, the potential growth of telecoms businesses. May I urge the Secretary of State to hold a meeting with the Stoke and Staffs local enterprise partnership to see how the Ministry of Defence can help to ensure that local businesses enjoy some input to their growth from the arrival of highly trained personnel and their military research at Stafford barracks?
Michael Fallon
I am happy to help to facilitate that meeting with the defence procurement Minister. I am aware there are a number of companies in the hon. Gentleman’s constituency that have already submitted proposals to the Centre for Defence Enterprise. I think they have received some feedback. We are as anxious as he is that we capture that know-how for the future.
Marcus Fysh (Yeovil) (Con)
I welcome the Government’s recent partnership agreement with Leonardo’s helicopters division on research into unmanned aerial vehicles. Will Ministers work with me to help to maximise the effect this will have on supporting design and engineering jobs in Yeovil?
Michael Fallon
We are very happy to do that. My hon. Friend will recall that at Farnborough we announced the signing of a 10-year strategic partnering arrangement with Leonardo, one of the most important defence companies based in Britain. I hope that that will help to enhance jobs in his constituency through further export success, and through the right technology and innovation that also meet our defence requirements.
Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)
The Minister for the Armed Forces (Mike Penning)
We continue to invest in recruitment to attract the diverse and talented workforce we need now and in the future for our armed forces. Over 8,100 new recruits joined the regular Army last year, an increase on the previous year. In July, the trained strength of the Army reserve was 23,400, which is very close to matching the 30,000 we need. We will continue to work very closely with all parts of the country, in particular Northern Ireland.
Jim Shannon
I thank the Minister for that response. I understand that this is the first time that a boy soldier or someone from the ranks has risen to the position of Minister of State. I think that that is worthy of note in the House. As a help to Army recruitment, reserves in Northern Ireland have met their targets. Can the number of reserves in Northern Ireland be increased to take into account our positive recruiting environment?
Mike Penning
I thank the hon. Gentleman for his kind comments. We were close when I was a Northern Ireland Minister, and I visited his constituency on more than one occasion. I shall visit the Province in the near future when I meet 38 Brigade. The ceiling we have is not a ceiling in the sense that we do not want any more people from Northern Ireland; it is a question of whether the operational units are able to take them. I shall look closely at whether Northern Ireland can take more, and I would like to congratulate Northern Ireland on serving the Crown so well over so many years.
Mrs Flick Drummond (Portsmouth South) (Con)
What steps is my right hon. Friend taking to address the shortfall to the Royal Navy, particularly among engineers? Has he had any discussions about providing short-term secondment to engineers from industry to serve on Navy ships?
Mike Penning
That is exactly what we are trying to do—to be as flexible as possible with the contracts to allow short-term and long-term secondment from industry. We are also talking closely with other navies, and particularly the American navy. There is a shortfall in specific areas. What we need to do is make sure that the offer we make, whether it be for marine engineers or any other part of the armed forces, is suitable for the 21st century. That is something I am determined to do.
Toby Perkins (Chesterfield) (Lab)
I welcome the Minister to his post. One big issue he is taking on is how to assist the Government to achieve the Conservative election manifesto pledge for the Army not to fall below 82,000. He has spoken a bit about recruitment, but does he also recognise the huge issue of retention in the British Army? Does he think that what he is saying recognises the scale of the challenge the Government face in achieving that manifesto pledge? At the moment, it looks unlikely that they will achieve it.
Mike Penning
We are determined to fulfil the manifesto pledge, not only because it is a manifesto pledge, but because it is right for the Army in particular. I know how difficult retention can be because I purchased my discharge from the Army myself. I shall be looking carefully at what is making people leave. Are we offering them the right sort of service? Are we being as flexible as we can? For instance, when I left the Army all those years ago, I received a letter a couple of months later asking me whether I wanted to re-enlist. Let us make sure that that sort of thing continues to happen—when we have people in uniform, let us keep them in uniform.
James Cleverly (Braintree) (Con)
I welcome the Prime Minister’s commitment to an inequalities audit across the public sector. Given that the younger demographic from which the Army recruits is increasingly ethnically diverse, will my right hon. Friend the Minister commit to pay special attention to the recruitment, retention and promotion figures for black and minority ethnic service personnel?
Mike Penning
I would like to pay tribute to my hon. and gallant colleague for his service to Her Majesty when he was in uniform. If the armed forces are to work in the 21st century, they must represent the community from which they come. Whether we are talking about more BME people or more women in the armed forces—we have a 15% target for women, which is a very high level—we must be careful to make sure that we promote the armed forces to those people, whatever part of the community they come from, so that they feel comfortable working in the armed forces. That is something I am absolutely determined to do.
Clive Lewis (Norwich South) (Lab)
I add my voice to those who have welcomed the Minister to his post. He is, I think, in the hot seat on this particular issue. This Government might not be very good at meeting their own targets, particularly on Army recruitment, but Ministers at least deserve points for creativity. Their plan to grow the trained strength of the Army by changing the definition of “trained” might help with cooking the books, but it will not do a thing to address the actual problem. Will the Minister tell us whether he believes it is appropriate for personnel to be deployed on operations before completing their full training and, if so, how he can be confident that they will be adequately prepared?
Mike Penning
Let me say that I know from experience that some duties can be done once people have passed their phase 1 training. That certainly was done back in my time in 1974 when there was a Labour Government. If we are trying to recruit people, we need money, but Labour wants to cut money, and we need to be part of NATO, but the Labour party leadership wants to take us out of it. That is something that we would never do, but if they want to undermine our armed forces, they should do just that.
Richard Drax (South Dorset) (Con)
I welcome my right hon. Friend to his place, and I would like to touch on Navy recruitment, if I may. Will he quash these rumours that we will not have enough trained sailors to man both our aircraft carriers when they are launched?
Mike Penning
We have not hidden the fact that it is very difficult to make sure that we do everything we possibly can, but we will do that. I was on the Queen Elizabeth only the week before last and I watched our other aircraft carrier being built. When the particular moment comes, we will have the crews and these carriers will be the pride of the Navy.
Mr Douglas Carswell (Clacton) (UKIP)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Harriett Baldwin)
While we must maintain the UK’s freedom of action to operate independently, interoperability with our NATO allies is fundamental to virtually all UK defence capabilities. For the general purpose frigate, the Royal Navy is already exploring how that could be delivered, and considering how the ship will operate within NATO.
Mr Carswell
Does the Minister agree that opening up more of the procurement process to a broader range of suppliers, and avoiding any hint of protectionism, may make it possible to keep the cost of replacing our frigates low?
Harriett Baldwin
The hon. Gentleman takes a close interest in defence procurement issues, and I know that, like the rest of the House, he will be eagerly anticipating Sir John Parker’s national shipbuilding strategy, which he has committed himself to publishing before the autumn statement. In that context, the hon. Gentleman will obviously be aware that complex warships can only be built in the United Kingdom.
Douglas Chapman (Dunfermline and West Fife) (SNP)
When can we expect an announcement on the building of the Type 31s? We have the capability, we have the skills, and presumably we have the budget. Scotland expects!
Harriett Baldwin
Let me gently remind the hon. Gentleman that we are building these ships because we all decided to remain part of the United Kingdom. We are in the process of providing our armed forces with more ships, more aircraft and more equipment than ever before. As soon as we have a concrete timetable to announce to the House, we will do so.
Margaret Ferrier (Rutherglen and Hamilton West) (SNP)
The Secretary of State for Defence (Michael Fallon)
The cost and production schedule for the Type 26 global combat ship will be decided at the “main investment decision” point of the programme. Negotiations are ongoing with BAE systems to deliver a contract that will give value for money to both the Navy and the taxpayer. The general purpose frigate programme is in its very early stages. Decisions on build location and timetable will take advantage of the recommendations of the national shipbuilding strategy.
Margaret Ferrier
The Secretary of State is well aware that his Department promised 13 frigates on the Clyde in 2014, and a huge part of the Scottish independence referendum case for the Union rested on that promise. Given that the number has already dropped to eight, why can the Secretary of State not answer a simple question: when will the Type 26 design be approved?
Michael Fallon
There will still be a large number of new frigates, but there will specifically be eight new anti-submarine warfare ships, designed to protect the deterrent that the Scottish National party voted against just a few months ago. I hope that the timetable will be set out shortly, when the design continues to mature and the negotiations with BAE Systems have been completed.
Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)
Is it not a fact that BAE Systems is ready to start cutting steel right now, and all that is holding things up is a lack of funds in the MOD’s budget? If we do not start building these ships on time, we will doubtless end up with the same old story: we will drop below the already inadequate total of 19 frigates and destroyers, or else we will have to pay a lot more money to keep old ships in service for longer than they should be kept in service.
Michael Fallon
Let me reassure my right hon. Friend. We have already invested more than £1.8 billion in the Type 26 ship, and I announced a further £183 million in July for the guns to go on the ship. Much of the design work has been completed, but I am not prepared to sign a contract with BAE Systems until I am absolutely persuaded that it is in the best interests of the taxpayer and, indeed, the Navy, giving value for money to both.
Chris Stephens (Glasgow South West) (SNP)
The Secretary of State will be aware that the shipyards are in my constituency. The clear message from the workforce might best be conveyed by my paraphrasing Darth Vader: we want these ships, not excuses. Will the Secretary of State explain why, although the original timetable for the cutting of steel was May this year, it has not yet happened? May I ask him to speed up the process, so that ships can be built on the Clyde?
Michael Fallon
We would not be ordering any ships from the Clyde if Scotland had become independent last spring, because complex warships are only built in the United Kingdom. Let me be clear: this contract must be in the best interests of the taxpayer. I am aware of the need to sustain employment on the Clyde, which is why, last December, the strategic defence review announced the construction of two further offshore patrol vessels, in addition to the three that are currently being built on the Clyde.
Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con)
Is it possible for the MOD to consider positioning Gibraltar as a home port for at least one of the Type 26 offshore patrol vessels, where the facilities are superb for them and they are in a very good position to operate?
Michael Fallon
That is a suggestion I will certainly consider. Gibraltar is a key base for the Royal Navy. I think last week we had two, possibly three, ships from the Royal Navy calling in on Gibraltar, and Gibraltar of course retains its affiliation to the Crown despite the recent referendum.
Bridget Phillipson (Houghton and Sunderland South) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mark Lancaster)
The MOD is proud to be one of the largest providers of quality apprenticeships in the UK, and indeed the largest in Government, having delivered over 150,000 apprenticeships. We work closely across both Government and industry to develop apprenticeship standards, helping to build and maintain key defence skills across the country.
Bridget Phillipson
With major defence and infrastructure projects on the horizon, now is the wrong time for the Government to be cutting funding for apprenticeships. What guarantees can the Minister give that quality apprenticeships will be protected by his Department going forward?
Mark Lancaster
We stand by our record. We have delivered over 150,000 apprenticeships. Any new recruit joining the armed forces is enrolled on an apprenticeship scheme, and that will continue.
Dr Tania Mathias (Twickenham) (Con)
The Minister knows that logistics is an incredibly important area for the military and armed forces. It is also vital for other parts of the economy, and essential in refugee work. Will the Minister increase apprenticeships in logistics and ensure their quality?
Mark Lancaster
The MOD offers a number of logistics apprenticeships including driving goods vehicles, roadside assistance and recovery, and international trade and logistics. However, I recognise the importance of logistics to the armed forces and efforts to address skills shortages in this area need to be balanced with other areas, but I will certainly look at what my hon. Friend says.
Chris Bryant (Rhondda) (Lab)
Mark Lancaster
I am sure the hon. Gentleman will support this Government’s programme to extend cadet forces to 500 by 2020. Equally, he will appreciate that we have very strict rules when it comes to the disposal of defence property, but I am happy to look into what he says.
Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP)
The Secretary of State for Defence (Michael Fallon)
My immediate priorities remain success in our operations against Daesh and implementing our strategic defence and security review. Last week I hosted the first ever United Nations peacekeeping ministerial, the largest meeting of Defence Ministers in Britain since the Wales summit, where I underlined that the UK is stepping up its global commitments, backed by a rising defence budget and including additional troops to peacekeeping in South Sudan.
Patrick Grady
I am tempted just to ask the Secretary of State if he can name the French Foreign Minister and the South Korean Prime Minister, but can he confirm that, contrary to what he told the “Today” programme last week, it does in fact matter which budget conflict and security spending comes from, and if he is so strapped for cash perhaps he should be scrapping Trident rather than raiding the Department for International Development’s aid budget?
Michael Fallon
The French Defence Minister is Monsieur Jean-Yves Le Drian, whom I met last Thursday—I think it was the 21st time I have met him in two years—and the South Korean Prime Minister is Madam Park, whom I met during her most recent visit. The difficulty facing the shadow Defence Secretary is that none of my Defence Ministers know who he is.
However, on the budget, this is an increasing defence budget; we are committed to meeting the 2% target and the defence budget will also rise in real terms for every year of this Parliament.
Alec Shelbrooke (Elmet and Rothwell) (Con)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mark Lancaster)
The Ministry of Defence takes the health and wellbeing of its personnel seriously and acknowledges its duty of care to provide the best possible support to them. I am delighted to be able to confirm today that, as part of that care, we have introduced a single point of contact providing information on mefloquine and signposting a range of services to help those who have concerns having taken Lariam. Further details are available on the gov.uk website.
Clive Lewis (Norwich South) (Lab)
I am sure that Ministers are fast learners and will get to know my name soon enough. Last week the MOD was accused of a terrifying error after accidentally publishing the details of 20,000 people online. Following a number of recent high-profile security breaches including the attempted abduction of an RAF airman based at Marham, many service members will understandably be concerned about their personal safety. What reassurances can the Secretary of State provide to those men and women in regard to the security, particularly online, of any personal information about them?
The Minister for the Armed Forces (Mike Penning)
We have been doing everything we possibly can to protect people’s personal details online. I went to Marham myself two days after that incident took place—the police investigation there is ongoing—to give reassurance not only to the serving personnel but to their families that we will do everything we possibly can to protect them.
Clive Lewis
British military personnel in Saudi Arabia include a number of liaison officers stationed within the military headquarters of Saudi-led operations in Yemen. According to the Government, those officers are deployed to gain insight into those operations and to advise the Saudis on how to comply with international humanitarian law. Will the Secretary of State tell the House whether any communications from those British officers—as opposed to reports from the Saudi authorities themselves—have revealed any concerns about the conduct of operations in Yemen, including the possibility that humanitarian law has been violated?
Michael Fallon
Let me make it clear that the United Kingdom is not a member of the Saudi-led coalition, and UK personnel are not involved in directing or conducting operations in Yemen or in the target selection process. We have not assessed that the Saudi-led coalition is targeting civilians or is in breach of international humanitarian law.
Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con)
Michael Fallon
My hon. Friend will know that the defence budget is increasing in any event, and it will go on increasing in each year of this Parliament because of our commitment to meeting the 2% target in NATO. I know that he will join me in reminding our allies that although we are exiting the European Union, we are not abandoning our commitment to European security, which is why we are leading a battalion in Estonia next year, why we have committed extra troops to Poland, why our Typhoons were policing the Baltic airspace this year and why we will be leading the very high readiness taskforce next year.
Tristram Hunt (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab)
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Harriett Baldwin)
The hon. Gentleman is a doughty champion of businesses in Stoke-on-Trent. I know that the Secretary of State has already offered a meeting with businesses in that constituency, and I look forward to hearing more about the particular one he mentioned in his question.
Robert Jenrick (Newark) (Con)
Mark Lancaster
The Government have committed £50 million of LIBOR funding to increase the number of cadet units in schools to 500 by 2020. That manifesto commitment will establish some 150 new units in state schools across the UK and we have made it a priority to focus on cities and areas of high deprivation. I welcome my hon. Friend’s championing of the cause. Any school that wants to open a cadet unit through the cadet expansion programme should submit an expression of interest through the gov.uk website.
Drew Hendry (Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey) (SNP)
Mark Lancaster
The MOD continues to review its estate to ensure that it is smaller and more sustainable, allowing us to focus on delivering future defence capability and enabling considerable investment in sites such as Lossiemouth and Faslane. While no decision has been made on Fort George’s future, Scotland will continue to be a vital home for our armed forces. However, Scotland, like the rest of the UK, must expect some sites to close and some investment in other locations.
Owen Thompson (Midlothian) (SNP)
Michael Fallon
I certainly can. Scotland is getting additional investment at Faslane, and Lossiemouth will be the home of the new Typhoon squadron. Faslane will continue to be the base for all the Royal Navy’s submarines. Scotland is playing a key part in the construction of our new Navy with the new aircraft carriers, the Type 26 global combat ship, and the offshore patrol vessels, all of which will contribute to more jobs in Scotland.
Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con)
Michael Fallon
My hon. Friend is right that the situation is complicated, in particular in north Syria. We continue to urge the opposition groups in Syria to combat Daesh—although they are of course also under pressure from the regime. As a result of the ceasefire coming into force tonight, I hope that all the moderate armed groups in Syria can now concentrate their fire against the murderous ideology that is Daesh and allow humanitarian aid into the towns and cities that have been so long denied it.
Danny Kinahan (South Antrim) (UUP)
Mark Lancaster
I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for highlighting the success of recent LIBOR funding bids from Northern Ireland. The issue he raises is of course important and I would be delighted to meet to discuss it.
Byron Davies (Gower) (Con)
The Royal Air Force has a long and illustrious history in Wales and the connection has been fostered and maintained by volunteer gliding schools. The MOD’s decision to denude Wales of such schools and make air cadets travel many hours to England has had nothing less than a devastating effect on young people and adult volunteers. What steps are being taken to return such schools to Wales?
Mark Lancaster
I commend my hon. Friend’s tenacity in pursuing this issue. He knows that significant challenges surround the viability of aerodromes and former aerodromes in south Wales for future cadet gliding, but following his persistence and that of the hon. Member for Bridgend (Mrs Moon) I am looking to see whether other sites are financially viable. I hope to be able to update them shortly.
Christian Matheson (City of Chester) (Lab)
Does the Minister welcome the establishment of veterans’ breakfast clubs up and down the country as a way of providing support from veterans to veterans? Will the Minister ask his officials why these clubs have been denied the right to use the veterans’ logo on their official literature, as the only person who ever turns up to the Chester veterans’ breakfast club who is not a veteran is me?
Mark Lancaster
I am a great fan of veterans’ clubs and I have visited several. They are a fantastic thing, which I am keen to encourage, and I am happy to look into the matter the hon. Gentleman raises.
Oliver Colvile (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) (Con)
As my hon. Friend knows, last week it was announced that the MOD was going to dispose of Stonehouse barracks in my constituency. Can he clarify the criteria to keep 3 Commando Brigade and the Royal Marines in my constituency?
Mark Lancaster
The decision to close up to 30% of the defence estate is based on military capability; it very much is a military decision, but I am happy to meet my hon. Friend to discuss it, if he would like to do so.
Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)
May I thank the veterans Minister for meeting Hull resident Dereck Johnson, who set up the Hull veterans’ breakfast club, and may I ask what progress has been made in rolling out these breakfast clubs across the country, as they meet such a real need in that community?
Mark Lancaster
I thoroughly enjoyed meeting the hon. Lady’s constituent and I thought it was an excellent breakfast club. I have also met the national chairman and we are in discussions about how the Department can support this excellent initiative.
Several hon. Members rose—
Dr Julian Lewis (New Forest East) (Con)
Thank you, good Speaker. Will the Secretary of State confirm that the service provided by BBC Monitoring to open-source intelligence is of vital interest to the MOD? Does he agree that it would be totally unacceptable if the BBC inflicted swingeing cuts in the Monitoring service, as is proposed, including the closure of Caversham Park?
Michael Fallon
It is always good to be able to find common ground with my right hon. Friend on a defence matter. I certainly confirm the first part of his question, and I will do what I can to convey the gist of the second part to the BBC, too.
Steven Paterson (Stirling) (SNP)
An article in The Times today on the welcome news of the ceasefire in Syria states:
“The US and Russia have agreed to work together to target Islamic State and the FSF”.
Will the Secretary of State provide more detail on how that would work in practice, how the UK will be involved and how we can ensure that such co-operation results in no civilian casualties?
Michael Fallon
I hope the hon. Gentleman will welcome the ceasefire, belated though it is, that we hope will come into force tonight. The situation in Syria is complex and we have continued to urge Russia to use all its influence on the Syrian regime to get humanitarian aid in and to stop the regime targeting particular opposition groups. As he knows, we do not have combat troops deployed in Syria, but the strikes we carry out on behalf of the coalition will, obviously, also now have to reflect the new reality on the ground.
Mrs Madeleine Moon (Bridgend) (Lab)
The British Royal Navy is now smaller than the flotilla that we sent to take back the Falkland Islands. When will we have a date for Type 45 destroyer engine repairs and replacements, which are desperately needed, so that we can at least maintain the 19 ships of the line that we currently have?
Michael Fallon
I hope that the hon. Lady, who knows a lot about this, is not confusing number with quality or power. The ships we are now deploying—the aircraft carriers, the Type 45 destroyers and the forthcoming Type 26 frigates—are of course much more powerful than the ships that sailed to liberate the Falkland Islands. I know she will join me in welcoming the new missions of the two Type 45s, HMS Diamond and HMS Daring, which sailed in the past few weeks.
Martin Docherty-Hughes (West Dunbartonshire) (SNP)
A serious issue for recruitment policy is service family accommodation, and I am sure the Secretary of State and the Department agree with the recommendations of the Public Accounts Committee report on service family accommodation. Will he update the House on how they are dealing with CarillionAmey and its dubious failings for service personnel, and on how we make sure that this does not happen again?
Mark Lancaster
I am delighted to say that as a result of the recent “get well” plan, CarillionAmey is now meeting all but two of its key performance indicators. However, let me assure the House that I do not take this recent improvement for granted. I am utterly determined that the poor standard that our service personnel received in recent years will not be repeated.
Mr Speaker
I do not want the hon. Member for Chesterfield (Toby Perkins) to be sad or to feel isolated or excluded. Let him have a go.
Toby Perkins
Thank you; very kind. A few moments ago the Under-Secretary of State for Defence, the hon. Member for West Worcestershire (Harriett Baldwin), said that we were procuring more warships and aircraft than ever before. That is far removed from reality. In setting the record straight, can she confirm whether such information is part of the induction into the Ministry of Defence team, or did she come up with it all by herself?
Harriett Baldwin
I recommend that the hon. Gentleman read the strategic defence and security review. He can see that we are increasing defence spending every year and we are investing in more ships, more planes, more troops who are ready to act, better equipment for our special forces and more for cyber, in contrast to the Labour party, which wants to scrap our nuclear deterrent, withdraw from NATO and abolish our Army. Labour cannot be trusted with our security.