Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 18th January 2024 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for what he does every week to draw a spotlight on some appalling situations that do not necessarily get a lot of media attention. These have been themes this week. Many Members have spoken in these business questions, but also throughout the week, about the conduct of the Iranian regime. I thank him again for shining a spotlight on the ongoing situation in Sudan. As he knows I always do, I will make sure that the Foreign, Commonwealth and Development Office has heard his concerns.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Leader of the House for responding to questions for more than an hour.

May I say that Sir Tony Lloyd, a north-west MP— I called him Mr North-West—was caring, honest, decent and a gentleman? Everybody got on with him. He worked with everybody. He was a fantastic man. I was on the Council of Europe with him. He was a true internationalist. We worked hard together. We had the odd pint together in Strasbourg. Politics and Parliament are the poorer for his passing.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 30th November 2023 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt]

First, may I wish everyone a happy St Andrew’s day? I am sure I speak for the whole House when I say that our thoughts are still with the hostages who are still in Gaza and their families. We hope that situation can be resolved quickly.

First, the hon. Lady raises the issue of the Foreign Secretary being answerable to this House. She will know that a senior Foreign Office Minister is available to lead on matters, and on very serious issues the Prime Minister would speak from this Dispatch Box. The Foreign Secretary has been forward-leaning and suggested a number of things that he thinks would be highly appropriate for how he could be held to account in this place and directly by Members of this House. No decisions have been taken yet, because we are waiting to hear from the Procedure Committee. It is right that matters for this House are dealt with by the Committees of this House.

The Foreign Secretary has been forward-leaning. I know that many Members have been concerned in particular about liaison with Members of this House who have hostage families living in their constituencies, whether they are British nationals or have a connection to Britain. The Foreign Secretary is meeting and has offered to meet all such families, and he is in touch with hon. Members who are in that situation. When the Procedure Committee brings forward measures—it is always sensible in its deliberations—I am sure those measures will be put in place.

The hon. Lady criticises us for not allowing scrutiny of legislation. Her point might have had more traction if in yesterday’s sitting we had not finished an hour early. Part of the reason for that was that only one Opposition Back Bencher spoke in the debate. I think we were having votes when Report should have been concluded.

The hon. Lady talks about the Leasehold and Freehold Reform Bill. She will know that Bills can be amended during their passage through the House, and we have committed to including a ban on new leasehold houses during the Bill’s passage, despite what has been reported. That commitment has not changed.

The hon. Lady talks about migration and emergency legislation, and I will put that in context. It is slightly ironic that Labour is eagerly awaiting further legislation from us on these matters when Labour Members have opposed all the new powers that we have brought in to protect our border. They fought against us in ending free movement and deporting foreign criminals, they would wish to take an extra 110,000 people every year from Europe, and Labour in Wales is giving asylum seekers £1,600 a month. The legislation will be brought forward shortly, but I am not holding my breath on the Opposition supporting it. Further business will be announced in the usual way.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call the Father of the House.

[Sir Peter Bottomley (Worthing West) (Con)]

I welcome the news that the Leasehold and Freehold Reform Bill, which will bring in modern housing terms, will have its Second Reading in a week or so. Through my right hon. Friend, may I say to the Government that even if we have to add things to the Bill as it goes along, that is better than having to wait another year for this overdue opportunity to reform effectively the scandalous abuses within leasehold, which are loaded so much against 6 million home occupiers—the tenants of leasehold homes?

I draw my right hon. Friend’s attention to the named day question I tabled for the Foreign Office about the acid attack on Shahzad Akbar on Sunday in England. If Ministers think it is appropriate to make an oral statement, will she please encourage them to do so? It is just as shocking to have a Commonwealth country suspected of an acid attack on one of its nationals—a human rights lawyer—in this country as it was to have the Russian attack in Salisbury and the alleged Indian attack in Canada.

May I ask my right hon. Friend to draw to the Home Secretary’s attention the letter he will have received today from the human rights lawyer Clive Stafford Smith, asking whether the police force in the relevant area was right to assess the risk to this man as low when in fact it was high, and whether is it true that the local police had switched off the automatic number plate recognition system for some reason, when that might have helped to detect the culprits of this terrible acid attack?

--- Later in debate ---

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank my hon. Friend for all her work to champion that brilliant local community initiative. We expect to be able to inform applicants to the third round of the community ownership fund by the end of December. She will know that Levelling Up, Housing and Communities questions are on Monday, where she may wish to make the case again.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call the Chair of the Backbench Business Committee.

[Ian Mearns (Gateshead) (Lab)]

I thank the Leader of the House for announcing the Backbench Business debates for Thursday 7 December. Let me give her early notice that if we are awarded time on Thursday 14 December, the Committee will intend to schedule debates on knife crime and the potential merger of Vodafone and Three. Is the Leader of the House considering giving the Backbench Business Committee any time in the week beginning Monday 18 December? If she is, we would love to know as soon as possible so that we can allocate debates and let Members know. I am glad to say that the Committee was re-established this week and is up and running, but we already have a backlog of debates, with 13 on our waiting list. It is good that we have plenty of business to come.

The Go North East bus industrial action continues, with very few buses running for weeks and, on many routes, not at all. That is having a huge detrimental impact on our local economy and jobs, and on the learning of students who cannot get to their local further education colleges such as Gateshead College in my constituency. Students who struggled to make up the learning lost during covid are being hit again, since they are unable to attend at all without incurring massive additional expense. Can we have a debate in Government time about introducing a compensation scheme from public transport providers that are singularly failing in their service delivery obligations?

--- Later in debate ---

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank my hon. Friend for all she is doing to make sure that the views of her constituents are heard in such matters. She will know that the next Levelling Up, Housing and Communities questions will be on 4 December. I invite her to raise it directly with the Secretary of State. I will also make sure that he has heard what she has said today.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call Jim Shannon. [Hon. Members: “Ooh!”]

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

You caught me off guard there, Mr Deputy Speaker. Thank you very much for bringing me in early.

In every one of our constituencies, across the whole of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, we have girlguiding groups, which we greatly support as they do wonderful work with girls of all ages. It is therefore with much concern that I ask the Leader of the House, very kindly, whether we may have a debate in Government time on the Floor of the House on the proposed devastating decision by Girlguiding UK to sell off its UK activity centres and to stop direct delivery of girlguiding in British overseas territories and on UK military bases. It will have a catastrophic impact, not just here but across the seas, on young women in the British family, which we all want to preserve and retain.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 29th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Leader of the House for responding to questions for almost an hour.

Bills Presented

Northern Ireland Budget (No. 2) Bill

Presentation and First Reading (Standing Order No. 57)

Chris Heaton-Harris, supported by the Prime Minister, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, Secretary Michael Gove, Secretary Alister Jack, Secretary David T C Davis, John Glen and Mr Steve Baker, presented a Bill to authorise the use for the public service of certain resources for the year ending 31 March 2024 (including income); to authorise the issue out of the Consolidated Fund of Northern Ireland of certain sums for the service of that year; to authorise the use of those sums for specified purposes; to authorise the Department of Finance in Northern Ireland to borrow on the credit of those sums; and to repeal a spent provision.

Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time Monday 3 July, and to be printed (Bill 338).

Thames Water (Public Benefit Corporation) Bill

Presentation and First Reading (Standing Order No. 57)

Tim Farron, supported by Sarah Olney and Munira Wilson, presented a Bill to establish a new model of company structure for Thames Water, to be called a public benefit corporation; to require that public benefit corporation to consider public policy benefits, including reducing leaks and sewage dumping, as well as returns for shareholders; to limit the payment of dividends until a plan is in place to cut the corporation’s debt; and to require membership of the corporation’s board to include representatives of local environment groups.

Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on Friday 24 November, and to be printed (Bill 339).

Royal Assent

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I have to notify the House, in accordance with the Royal Assent Act 1967, that His Majesty has signified his Royal Assent to the following Acts and Measure:

Shark Fins Act 2023

Co-operatives, Mutuals and Friendly Societies Act 2023

Child Support Collection (Domestic Abuse) Act 2023

Offenders (Day of Release from Detention) Act 2023

Supported Housing (Regulatory Oversight) Act 2023

British Nationality (Regularisation of Past Practice) Act 2023

Retained EU Law (Revocation and Reform) Act 2023

Financial Services and Markets Act 2023

Diocesan Stipends Funds (Amendment) Measure 2023

Privilege: Conduct of Right Hon. Boris Johnson

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Monday 19th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Bob Seely]

It is a debate worthy of parliamentary time, but when I held a debate on the use of Imperial modelling, not a single Labour Member turned up apart from the shadow Minister. The point I am trying to make is that there were scandals and other important things about lockdown. One of the things we are criticised for, as the shadow Leader of the House will know, is having an obsession with ourselves when there are other great and important things to be discussed about covid and lockdown, not only whether Downing Street had—

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Order. We have to remember what we are discussing today, without going too wide, because there are 14 other Members who want to contribute to the debate, and I think they want to talk about what is in the report.

[Bob Seely]

Mr Deputy Speaker, I will wind up if you think I am speaking out of turn or too widely. However, I was going to say that our mental health crisis is a scandal worth reporting. The fact is that this cost £400 billion, and the fact is that science was misused and trust abused. Lockdown was an experiment, and I do sometimes think that focusing the lockdown debate on the behaviour of the then Prime Minister is too narrow and does not do this House a service.

I will vote to support the Privileges Committee report, but I do wish that the same level of interest, especially from the Opposition, would sometimes focus on the stuff that actually made a difference in lockdown, not just on vindictively going after Boris Johnson.

[Andrew Bridgen (North West Leicestershire) (Reclaim)]

All that glitters is not gold. The Overton window is framed by a vignette of deceit, and right hon. and hon. Members seem intent on paying homage to it above all else. Some will say and some have said that Boris Johnson misled the Committee and misled Parliament, and others that the Committee set out to achieve its predetermined goal of finding him guilty on all charges. Many of the public hold both views at once, and they are not mutually exclusive, so this pantomime staggers on.

The reality is that Parliament and the public are about as far out of lockstep with each other as they have ever been. I am not sure that the public in the real world care too much about this any more. I think very few people out there in the real world trust Boris Johnson. Sadly, through the process we have seen and the collateral damage to the reputation of this House, I think the Privileges Committee itself has been damaged and may be damaged further by revelations.

The public concern is very much to say, “a plague on all your houses”. What has caused this loss of public confidence in the procedures of the House? Well, the evidence is damning: Boris Johnson and his Government used behavioural scientists and spin doctors to clinically instil unreasonable fear to scare the public into ceasing their normal lives under the guise of a biological threat so deadly that they dared not go outside to see another person.

We all remember the relentless, day in, day out, informing of the public by Ministers in No. 10 about death rates and horror stories. We remember the signs everywhere we looked, we remember the adverts on the television and we remember the supermarket car parks filled with masked citizens each forced to stand in their own car parking bay. The relentless messaging from No. 10 was, “Stand on the stickers, follow the signposts, wash your hands, don’t see your loved ones”. The Government decided it was their job to be that of a parent and they saw the country as a toddlers playgroup, turning our police into teaching assistants, au pairs and, dare I say it, nannies. On every single account, they robbed the public of their dignity. It was nothing short of unacceptable. Our ancestors would be rightly ashamed of the situation.

During that period, the public yet again showed that their natural inclination, as fellow Brits, was to good-natured compliance and community spirit. We saw some of the largest demonstrations of kindness I have ever seen and those demonstrations, under immense pressure, showed the real spirit of the British people. Their altruism held up a mirror to the true nature of the appalling behaviour at No. 10. Any contention the public had that, in No. 10, “They have the latest, most accurate scientific data in front of them, and therefore these measures were justified in the face of the extreme risk” now has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the truth. The fact is that the same people who took the unprecedented powers to suspend our freedoms knew that these measures were nothing short of political posturing. They knew they were pointless. If the risks were really what they said they were and the science of the effectiveness of the lockdowns was that demonstrable, surely they would have been the most strident adherers to the rules—

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Order. Mr Bridgen, you heard what I said to Mr Seely. We are talking about the contents of the report and you are going way wider than that now.

[Andrew Bridgen]

Well, I think the behaviour of No. 10 was—

--- Later in debate ---

[Several hon. Members rose—]

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

A gentle reminder: we are talking about the report and its findings. If Members have speeches that they wrote two or three days ago and it contains things that are not relevant to the report, please could they lose those pages and concentrate on this debate? Jess Phillips is going to show us how to do it.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 8th June 2023 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank the hon. Lady for raising this topical matter, because there are some figures and a report out today specifically looking at radiology. She will know that we are increasing the size of the workforce. It is one of our priorities and a manifesto commitment. As I said in my opening remarks, in primary care we have already hit our manifesto commitment of recruiting an additional 26,000 people into the workforce; indeed, we have exceeded it—it is close to 30,000 as of today.

Specifically on radiology, this has long been an ongoing issue and it predates Brexit. It is about people with particular individual qualifications. We can take the workforce from other nations, as the hon. Lady knows. I do not think her linking this specifically to our leaving the trading bloc of the EU is correct, but I know the Secretary of State is very focused on the issue.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Leader of the House for responding to business questions for an hour and 10 minutes.

Points of Order

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 18th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Mr David Davis (Haltemprice and Howden) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. Next week, the BBC’s economics correspondent will publish a book and release whistleblower testimony, telephone recordings, emails and documentary data on a number of serious miscarriages of justice in the LIBOR scandal that emerged in 2012. It will show that British and US authorities covered up state involvement in LIBOR rigging, and the scapegoating of 37 low and middle-ranking bankers, some of whom spent years in jail.

In this evidence, there is a prima facie case to believe that state agencies coerced individuals into perjury that led to false evictions. I will write to the Metropolitan police asking them to investigate any potential perjury, but, more importantly in this context, I am also greatly concerned that the Treasury Committee may have been misled by state agencies about the knowledge and involvement of the state in setting false rates.

This is a big and complex issue with hundreds of pages of evidence. I have written to the Chair of the Treasury Committee suggesting that the Committee might want to look into the issue. Can you confirm that that is the appropriate mechanism to deal with this serious matter, Mr Deputy Speaker?

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the right hon. Gentleman for his point of order and advance notice of it. It is a very serious issue that he has raised. He has put his point on the record and shown that he is experienced enough to take appropriate steps even without any advice from the Chair.

[Dame Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab)]

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker, I know that as a Parliament we are keen for members of the public to come to this place and see us at work. However, yesterday the Home Affairs Committee was interrupted by protesters and the session had to be suspended while the protesters were removed from the Committee Room. I just wondered whether, through you, Mr Deputy Speaker, I as the Chair of the Committee and the Members could thank the Clerks, the security staff and the police, who acted very quickly to ensure that the Committee was able to resume its very important work of scrutinising the policing of protests without much delay? I just wanted to put that on the record.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

I thank the right hon. Lady for her point of order and for giving notice of it. I join her in thanking all the staff involved for their swift action yesterday, which enabled that important Committee sitting to continue after the disruption.

[The Leader of the House of Commons (Penny Mordaunt)]

Further to that point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker, I would like to thank the right hon. Lady for raising the matter and inform the House that the protest that was going on outside this building and outside a major hospital yesterday, preventing traffic from moving freely, was resolved within 15 minutes by the Metropolitan Police.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

I thank the Leader of the House for that point of order further to the previous one. We too thank all the authorities for enabling people to get on with their normal daily lives and indeed with the process of democracy that people have elected us to come here for.

[Bob Blackman (Harrow East) (Con)]

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker, on the Order Paper today is the matter of the Holocaust Memorial Bill Second Reading. Indeed, I understand that the Joint Committee on Examination of Bills is considering today whether this is a hybrid Bill. I declare my interest as co-chair of the all-party Parliamentary group on holocaust memorial, but could you use your good offices, Mr Deputy Speaker, to inform us how the result of that Committee will be communicated to this House so that we can get on with this very important project? The project is welcomed across the House, apart from a small numbers of Members of both Houses, but the key point is that we need to know what is going to happen, because the current projections are that it will take a very long time indeed.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his point of order and advise him to go to the Table Office and put the question to the Clerks, because I think they will have a better idea of the timetabling of any announcements that will be made either today or later on.

[Alison Thewliss (Glasgow Central) (SNP)]

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker, I apologise for not giving you prior notice, but I have only just received the email that I wish to raise. The email is from UK Visas and Immigration on a constituent’s case. My constituent claimed asylum in December 2020 and the email I have received from them today says that,

“your client may expect to receive their asylum decision by 31 December 2023”.

That is quite a long time to wait in limbo for a decision, as I am sure most hon. Members would agree. Have you received any notification from Home Office Ministers about any statements to the House with an update on the asylum backlog, which is having a serious impact on the lives and wellbeing of so many of my constituents?

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

I thank the hon. Lady for her point of order. This is a very serious issue, and people being left in limbo is clearly not acceptable. I have not received any notice that there will be any statements today, but should that alter, people will be informed in the usual way. Those on the Treasury Bench will have heard the point she has made and will make sure it is passed on to the Home Office.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 18th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt]

I am sure that all Members of this House would want to send our best wishes to the hon. Lady’s constituent for a full and speedy recovery. I am very sorry to hear that that has happened to them. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Rugby (Mark Pawsey) on his ten-minute rule Bill and also thank the hon. Lady for raising awareness of the importance of wearing helmets.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

That finishes business questions. I thank the Leader of the House for responding to questions for more than an hour.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 11th May 2023 Commons Chamber

[Christine Jardine (Edinburgh West) (LD)]

rose—

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I did toss the coin, Mr Stephens, and you won.

[Chris Stephens]

Tails never fails, Mr Deputy Speaker.

The Leader of the House will be aware of the rocketing food price inflation, which is squeezing living standards across these islands. That includes, I am sad to say, many workers in the food industry itself, with a recent published survey of the Bakers Food & Allied Workers Union showing that 40% of workers in the food sector are skipping meals and that one in five are using food banks. Can we have a debate in Government time on how we can pay food workers fairly without price rises for consumers and rampant profiteering of some of the large supermarkets? Can she confirm whether trade union representatives of food workers will be invited to the Government’s national food summit next week?

[Penny Mordaunt]

I thank the hon. Gentleman for raising that matter. He will know that the next relevant questions will be on 25 May, and he may like to raise those matters there, but, given the timeliness of the event next week, I shall ask the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs to get in touch with his office to answer his question about delegates.

[Mr Deputy Speaker]

Last, but definitely not least, I call Christine Jardine.

[Christine Jardine]

Thank you very much, Mr Deputy Speaker, although I do find my concerns about gambling now reinforced.

May I add my congratulations to the Leader of the House on the manner in which she conducted her role in the coronation last weekend? I also welcome the reassurances that she gave earlier on the Government’s commitment to animal welfare. However, the lack of progress of the Animal Welfare (Kept Animals) Bill has provoked a lot of concern both from my constituents and the Dogs Trust, which was here just this week. I raised the timescale that we now face and this lack of progress in Environment, Food and Rural Affairs questions back in February. Can the Leader of the House give us any reassurance today that the Bill will come back in time and be heard?

[Penny Mordaunt]

The hon. Lady knows that I will say that I will announce forthcoming business in the usual way, but I can reassure the House that the Government remain committed to those measures. They were in our manifesto and we have every intention of delivering them.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Leader of the House for responding to questions for well over an hour.

I have been an MP for 31 years, and it is very rare to see such unanimity in the House of Commons. There are normally discordant voices, but none today in paying tribute to the Leader of the House for the role that she played on Saturday. I texted her straight away to say how proud I was of her. When I spoke to her, I said, “I could not even hold an umbrella up for an hour, and you held that sword for two hours.” So Penny let me know that she had been doing some exercises to make sure that she was able to do it. When I told her that I could not hold the umbrella up, she said, “Nigel, if ever you want any furniture moving, just give me a call.” Thank you very much. You did the country proud.

Business of the House

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 16th March 2023 Commons Chamber

[Penny Mordaunt]

The question the hon. Lady should be asking is why life expectancy in Scotland is falling. That is what needs to be addressed, and it will be done by a combination of better healthcare, better diagnosis and better opportunities for communities. We very much want people to be able to enjoy their retirement. That is one reason why we introduced and have kept to the triple lock on pensions, and we are always keen to ensure that people are accessing pension credit and all the other assistance that they are entitled to.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I call Jim Shannon.

[Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP)]

You caught me off kilter there, Mr Deputy Speaker—I was going to do my usual bobbing up and sitting down, but thank you for calling me.

Yesterday North Korea fired yet another long-range missile using money that was meant to support the people of North Korea, who really need that money. At the very bottom of the ladder in North Korea are Christians, who face isolation, starvation and, in some cases, arrest and execution in prison camps. North Korea is No. 1 on the world watch list for persecution of Christians—it is the most dangerous place anywhere in the world to be a Christian. Will the Leader of the House join me in making a statement of solidarity with this often forgotten but much supported group?

--- Later in debate ---

[Penny Mordaunt]

The hon. Lady raises a very interesting and important point. I will certainly raise this with the two prime Departments concerned and discuss good practice guidelines that they may know about. She knows how to apply for a debate, which I think would help to raise awareness about these issues, which will be a concern to half the population.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

I thank the Leader of the House for her business statement and for responding to questions for one hour and eight minutes.

Parliamentary Services for MPs

Nigel Evans Excerpts

Thursday 9th February 2023 Commons Chamber

[Sir Charles Walker]

I absolutely thank my right hon. Friend for that. He and I have been friends since I got here, and that means a huge amount to me. I thank him.

This is what I want to conclude with. We will never in this place struggle to attract the shrill, the loud and the raucous. We will always be inundated with the practitioners of the clear thinking of the totally uninformed. That is what makes this Parliament so wonderful. There are those who believe there are simple solutions to complex problems. If there were, we would have found them, Mr Deputy Speaker. I promise you that we would have found them. There is always space for that, and at times I have been one of the raucous, the loud, the shrill and the emotional—I celebrate that. But we also need the thoughtful, the considered and the intellectually inquiring. Their numbers really are thinning, and we in this place have a duty to reach out to them.

We have a duty—not just to ourselves, but to future generations of Members of Parliament—to make this place the greatest Chamber with the greatest vocation someone can pursue in this country. A President came yesterday, welcomed by literally thousands of people, and he referred to our Parliament as the greatest in the world. I take great comfort from that, and I want to prove him right day in and day out.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Before I call Dame Maria Miller, may I too put something on the record? Many of you will not know this, but when I was a rookie Member of Parliament, I employed a young Charles Walker as my researcher. I knew then that he was a bright lad, and I was thrilled when he became a Member of Parliament. He has been an outstanding Chair of the Administration Committee. I salute your bravery, Charles, in the way you have promoted mental health issues at a time when it was a taboo. You have been remarkable. I am so proud of you.

[Dame Maria Miller (Basingstoke) (Con)]

On my very first day in Parliament, I decided to sit next to this blond-haired man whom I had never met before in my life. He stood up, and I will not repeat what he said to the assembled masses because it would embarrass him, but my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne (Sir Charles Walker) was entertaining, informed and, above all, principled right from the start. He has been a great colleague for the last 17 years, and we will miss him.

It is therefore a great privilege to follow my hon. Friend, who has clearly set out how parliamentary services must change to help our democracy, and particularly to recruit the brightest and the best to Parliament. I would like to take that one stage further and talk about how we can broaden the debate to consider how parliamentary services must work even harder to ensure that this place functions in a way that can protect our democracy into the future. We have already mentioned that amazing visit yesterday from Volodymyr Zelensky, who is fighting for democratic freedoms for his nation, and the way that he talked so affectionately about our own Parliament. It made me feel, even more than ever, that we cannot take these things for granted, even in western Europe. That is why I am so grateful to the Backbench Business Committee for granting this debate, and to the staff of the Administration Committee for all the work they do in helping us with the running of this House.

I also pay tribute to those who sit in the Chair you sit in, Mr Deputy Speaker. It is easy in this place to come in, be important and talk about important things that happen to our constituents and to the nation, but very few people take the time to think about how this place runs, and how they can play their part in making it better. Too few come forward to sit in that Chair and do the sorts of things that you do, Mr Deputy Speaker, and that your colleagues do in the Speaker’s Office. It is important that we acknowledge that. It is always behind the scenes, but it is what makes one of the most important and central institutions of our democracy work. Probably the people sitting in front of you also have a bit of a role in that, but we won’t go there.

The last two Speakers of this House were appointed at times of crisis, which is an interesting thing to reflect on. Our current Speaker—I will not refer to the previous one—was recruited to the role in the midst of a behavioural and cultural crisis in this place. I think that our Mr Speaker’s focus on security, culture and behaviour change has been exemplary, and led to a rapid change in a way that many people would not have foreseen. We also saw the way that the Speaker and staff rapidly changed the way our Parliament worked during the coronavirus pandemic, and the way that Mr Speaker has changed attitudes towards the security of Members of Parliament. We know that individuals in the Chair you are sitting in, Mr Deputy Speaker, can change the way this place works, but I suggest that we cannot rely on individuals alone, not least because we have had some recent Speakers who have not been entirely unflawed characters. We have to think about the governance of the institution, and the way it creates the right framework for the running of this important place.

The services provided by Parliament are crucial to MPs being effective. We are elected to come here, to scrutinise, and to get things done for the people we represent. We do that with the support of the House of Commons; we cannot do it ourselves. There is an army of literally thousands of people, from cleaners to Clerks, police to chefs, and subject experts in the Library to dedicated constituency staff, who are all there to help us be effective. Being effective MPs requires the right services to be in place—not just the same services that were there 40 years ago, but the right services for today. Even the most time-poor manager of a small business ensures that they have the right services in place for their business, and that is why this debate is important.

It is important that we discuss these things to explore whether parliamentary services are delivering in a way that helps MPs to be effective, and delivering for the way that we need Parliament to run. Effective MPs are not just a good thing in their own right; effective MPs help to build trust in the House of Commons; they help to build trust in Parliament and so they help to build trust in democracy. It could not be more important, particularly for those who believe that we have a responsibility to strengthen democracy in our time here.

Let us also remember that the staff of this place, whether they are extremely specialised, highly intellectual people drafting bits of legislation, the people who keep us safe as we enter this place or the people who service our meals when we are here late into the night, choose to be here. They choose to be in Parliament, not because it is just another place to work but because they want to be part of the democratic function of this country—what makes it so special.

Like much of Parliament, the provision of services is organised through Committees, predominately the Administration Committee, which my hon. Friend the Member for Broxbourne chairs incredibly well. Unlike other Committees, these are House Committees and, for the most part, they are advisory. When members of the Committee, including a number of Members present, raise issues around how this place is run or that they would like to see done differently, such as the quality of the wi-fi, the availability of mobile phone chargers in the Tea Room, as I was reminded a few minutes ago, or concerns about the perimeter security, these concerns can be voiced and they will be heard. However, we have absolutely no power whatsoever to get any action taken. We only usually get action taken because of the vivacious character of our Chair. That cannot be enough; things need to be more structured than that. Only the Commission has oversight of all these issues and can take action—a Commission, I remind everybody, that has no process to elect its members.

When it comes to planning ahead and the issues that the administration might want to consider because there are problems on the horizon, we have no ability to do that effectively either. The Administration Committee is strictly limited in what it can do. Of course, when it comes to the provision of services, the Procedure Committee and our Finance Committee are also crucial, but there is no structure in place for these Committees to work together. For example, if we have something like the uncertainty of sitting hours, which can go late into the night, there is no way of viewing how that might affect members of staff who are employed to run the services in this place.

The Leader of the House has been clear in her vision, such as in her recent speech to the Institute for Government, that the House of Commons should be the best legislature in the world. I could not agree more with her sentiment, but to achieve that not just noble but essential ambition, our parliamentary services also need to be the best in the world. They need to fit into that vision of a modern workplace, with modern procedures, adequate finance and accountability, and an ability to plan for the future and to respond to events. We have made huge strides under Mr Speaker’s leadership, but I am concerned that our governance and structures have changed very little, that they are not as good as they should be and that we need to look at them more. Indeed, some experts would say that the governance of the House of Commons is opaque, lacks accountability and is complex to understand. Those are not the attributes of an organisation that I would like to work for. To make provision for parliamentary services for MPs to be their most effective, Parliament needs to look at these things in detail. It needs to look at the governance and structures of how we can be a trusted institution into the future that reflects an organisation not of yesterday, but of tomorrow.

There are some notable examples, of which I am sure other Members will be aware, of where the inability to change things and evolve the way we work have received the full glare of publicity. Not least of them is the recent example of where we tried to set up a nursery in this place, which took three debates, two papers and a lot of behind-the-scenes work. Some of the hon. and right hon. Members involved have been in this place even longer than I have, and they still could not work out how we could effect that change. That is a salutary lesson; it shows that we cannot evolve services to meet the needs of Members. The result will be that we cannot attract the right Members to this place. We cannot then expect this place to be the world-class legislature that my right hon. Friend the Leader of the House would like it to be.

How do we make sure that parliamentary services are effective, and are what our MPs, and our democracy, really need? Some straightforward changes could easily be made that would make a real difference. It would be quite a revolution if we ensured that House Committees could work together and take a common look at how this place is run. We should evolve their role from a “take note” or advisory role, to a strategic one of the sort that Select Committees perhaps already have, so that they do not merely rubber-stamp decisions after the event, which, as colleagues on the Administration Committee will remember, was what happened in the case of the removal of the trees in the atrium of Portcullis House.

We should make the House Committees, which are fundamental to how the place runs, accountable through elections. They are the last area of Parliament in which Members are not elected to posts. We are appointed to our posts, and that simply does not pass the sniff test. We need to change that; the way that people gain positions on those Committees should be similar to the way that Select Committee members gain theirs. That would increase accountability. Our meetings are already transparent, but let us look at ways of opening them up even more, if they are so fundamental to democracy.

Scrutiny of the House of Commons Commission should be firmly in the remit of the House Committees. Just as Select Committees scrutinise Government, House Committees should scrutinise the Commission. That would be a very simple change of our role, but it might increase transparency about how the Commission runs, so that more Members can understand it, and can understand how decisions are taken. For too long it has felt as though the House of Commons is run from behind closed doors. Perhaps it is easier that way; that is what I have been told when I have asked why that is. There are concerns that scrutiny will undermine trust in this organisation. My argument is that a lack of scrutiny has already done that job for us, so let us have that change.

We cannot continue to rely on individuals, rather than governance, structures and systems, to ensure that this place is run well. I am told that it is Members who decide, when it comes to the running of this House, but I am afraid that those are hollow words to me when I think back to the debacle over the establishment of a nursery in this place. “It is for Members to decide!” No, it really was not, because there was no way for us to crystallise the decision and ensure action.

As a result of this debate, I hope that people not just in this Chamber, or listening in Parliament, but from outside start to call loudly for the changes that I have outlined. It has taken a year to get this debate, so I can already feel that this is not necessarily a debate that people in this place want to have. The issue is important because we need to support MPs, so that they can be their most effective. We need this to be a modern workplace, where both MPs and their staff can function at their best. We must attract a diverse cross-section of society to stand for election. We will not do that unless this place works better, and we have to start taking that far more seriously.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

Thank you, Maria, for your very generous and kind words. I will make sure that Sir Lindsay hears them. Those thanks are on behalf of Sir Lindsay, his entire team, and the Clerks. Thank you very much for your generosity.

--- Later in debate ---

[Michael Fabricant]

I have an answer to that question, deep as it was. Stop watching Prime Minister’s Question Time; instead, watch parliamentlive.tv, and see the work that goes on in Committees and in debates like this, among others. Often there is huge consensus and co-operation between the parties on either side of the House.

The other day, I was present when some legislation was going through Parliament. The Liberal Democrats had tabled an amendment, and it was not a bad amendment, and we accepted it. I was rather amused, I have to say, that the Liberal Democrats looked more shocked than we were. They all started waving their Order Papers as if it were a victory—but the victory was that they had come up with a good idea and the Government had said, “Yes, it is a good idea. We will incorporate it in law.” And they did. That is the sort of thing that people need to see: that Parliament is a thoughtful place, and that on the whole, as my hon. Friend has just said, we strive to work together, and we strive to do what is best for the British people, and indeed for others, too, outside the United Kingdom, whether it be in war-torn Ukraine or in developing countries elsewhere in the world.

Nevertheless, the House has a duty of care to ensure that Members of Parliament can do their job as best they can by restructuring the existing systems, as my right hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke so marvellously explained, and by attracting people here by showing care for the time when they will eventually leave this place. The Daily Mail, and one or two other newspapers and one or two broadcasters were saying, “This report says we should be giving hundreds of thousands of pounds to Members of Parliament when they leave.” No, the report does not say that. But redundancy rules do exist for ordinary companies and for those who work in the civil service. For all the reasons I have explained, our job is far more volatile than those careers, because we can lose our job for reasons that have nothing to do with our own ability, or lack thereof.

Our redundancy payments should be the same as those in other sectors. Is that unreasonable? The press might say so; I would say it is just natural justice, and that is all the report asks for. I hope that people will read it and that the House of Commons Commission—we do not know what exactly it gets up to—reads it. I hope that Mr Speaker, who is very imaginative and for whom I have the highest respect, reads it. More importantly, though, I hope that something is done about it.

[Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans)]

We come now to the Front-Bench contributions, starting with Deidre Brock.