Self-build and Custom Housebuilding (Time for Compliance and Fees) Regulations 2016

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Monday 24th October 2016 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

That the draft Regulations laid before the House on 14 July be approved. Considered in Grand Committee on 18 October

Motion agreed.

Short-Term Letting: Deregulation

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Wednesday 19th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

My Lords, while reminding the House of my interests as declared in the register, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

The Government support the shared economy and monitor trends in private rented housing through the English housing survey. It is right that Londoners should have similar rights as elsewhere in England and be free to sublet their homes where their tenancy, contract or mortgage allows. We do not support the abuse of planning laws, and those in breach face a fine of up to £20,000.

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes]

I thank the Minister for that Answer but, in view of the report in today’s press that Gavin Barwell has just announced a clampdown on rogue landlords and a return of powers to local councils to enable them to deal with crowding in residential lettings, will the Minister confirm that the licensing powers for local councils will also cover Airbnb lettings, which I have reported to the House on a number of occasions, whereby 10 people are routinely occupying one-bedroom flats in some residential blocks for a series of short lets that are not allowed under those leases?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I think that to a degree my noble friend has covered the issue with her last point. Powers already exist for landlords to enforce provisions if they are in breach of leases. There are also planning regulations. The mandatory listing changes in relation to HMOs announced yesterday in another place by Gavin Barwell relate to residences where there are shared facilities. That would not cover tower blocks, which I think is the area on which my noble friend is focusing her attention.

[Baroness Boothroyd (CB)]

My Lords, since councils lost the powers of licensing short lets last year, is it correct that the only recourse that other residents in a block have in cases of threatening behaviour or damage to the property is to call the police?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, that is not the case. There are powers in relation to London. This is only a London issue, too; elsewhere in the country, prior to the change in the Deregulation Act 2015, there was a power to let without limitation. In London there is now a power to let for up to 90 consecutive days, so anything in breach of that is a breach of planning law and it rests with the local authority to enforce it. As I have indicated, there are provisions in leases. There are also of course provisions in relation to statutory nuisance; if litter should be left around or should there be noise, there are existing powers. I do not think we need additional ones.

[Baroness Donaghy (Lab)]

My Lords, what assurance can the Minister give the House that the Government are looking carefully at the health and safety, fire prevention and noise and nuisance aspects of short lets? They seem to be using not very satisfactory existing law instead of looking at the situation as a whole. Can he assure us that the Government have a picture of this developing situation?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness refers to an issue that is London-only, because prior to the change in the Deregulation Act, the position was exactly the same in other areas of England. The recent change in the law brought London to a degree in line with the rest of the country, except that there are more restrictions in London, because there is a 90-day limit. As I said to the noble Baroness, Lady Boothroyd, existing powers on statutory nuisance are and have always been available to other tenants and landlords. Of course we monitor the situation, but there is already a satisfactory range of powers.

[Baroness Eaton (Con)]

My Lords, if short lets such as Airbnb usage become a full-time use of residential property, I believe that it then becomes business usage. Can my noble friend confirm that planning permission is required in such cases?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as I said, there is an existing power. In relation to the change of law in London, if a let exceeds 90 consecutive days, it requires a planning use change. If there is a total change of user, it would also require planning permission under existing law. Also, as I said, powers exist in many leases. Recently, in the so-called Nemcova case in the London Borough of Enfield, a landlord enforced provisions in a lease in just such a situation.

[Lord Tope (LD)]

My Lords, is the Minister aware that according to the Inside Airbnb website, a total of 42,646 properties are listed in London alone? Is he further aware of those 42,646, 17,593 are multiple listings—in other words, the host manages numerous properties? Does he agree that hosts with multiple listings are more likely to be running a business, unlikely to be living in the property—certainly not all of them at the same time—and potentially in violation of the Deregulation Act’s 90-day limit on short-term lettings? Do the Government really think this is satisfactory? If not, what more are they going to do about it?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as the noble Lord said, if it is in excess of the 90-day limit in London, it is in breach of the law. Powers exist with local authorities to enforce that: it is for local authorities to do so as the power rests with them. In addition, as I mentioned, a case came into the department today of a landlord saying to a tenant, “You are in breach of the law. Please take down this listing: it would be a breach of your lease”. The combination of those two things—the power in the contract or lease to enforce a particular provision and the existing powers of local authorities—should meet the cases to which the noble Lord refers.

[Baroness Finlay of Llandaff (CB)]

In light of the previous question about the safety of tenants, can the Minister clarify whether the Gas Safety (Installation and Use) Regulations 1998 apply to landlords with such short-term rental properties and how such regulations can be enforced to prevent carbon monoxide poisoning among residents in places where the gas appliances are old and unsafe?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

I will have to write the noble Baroness on that rather technical issue. It is an important issue but I have no knowledge of that and would not want to mislead her, so I will reply to her in writing and ensure that a copy is placed in the Library.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, at the very least, the Government should take action to ensure that holiday letting company websites are checking that houses on their sites are genuine lets of less than 90 days. Otherwise, there is a risk that statutory regulation, safety requirements and insurance provisions are not being complied with.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, that was an exhortation to the Government. As I said, the power lies with local authorities. There are things that the Government should be doing—I would be the first to admit that—but this rests with local authorities and I encourage them to do that. That is the position under the Deregulation Act. It is also a responsibility of landlords to ensure that the terms of the lease are adhered to. This is not a direct responsibility of the Government. We ensure that councils have the proper powers and landlords have the facility to go to court, but the responsibility rests with local authorities and landlords.

[Lord Naseby (Con)]

I speak as a former chairman of the London Borough of Islington’s housing committee. Does my noble friend recollect the Rachman period and De Lusignan? Against that background, does a local authority today have the legal right to check the status of any property? If, as many of us believe, the worst rogue landlords do not admit to being landlords at all, who has the authority to investigate these situations?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I was still at junior school in the Rachman period, so I have only a vague recollection of it. From the noble Lord’s experience in Islington and since, he is aware of the situation in dealing with rogue landlords and others. We are very keen to do that, which is exactly why yesterday Gavin Barwell in another place announced regulations, which we are consulting on. It is important that we do, as I have indicated, give the proper powers to local authorities as we have done and say, “This is a matter for you”.

Self-build and Custom Housebuilding (Time for Compliance and Fees) Regulations 2016

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Tuesday 18th October 2016 Grand Committee

Moved by

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

That the Grand Committee do consider the Self-build and Custom Housebuilding (Time for Compliance and Fees) Regulations 2016.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, I beg to move that the draft Self-build and Custom Housebuilding (Time for Compliance and Fees) Regulations 2016, which were laid before the House on 14 July, be approved and come into force on 31 October. If approved, the regulations will, first, set out the time provided for local authorities to comply with the duty to grant sufficient planning permission to match demand on their self-build and custom housebuilding registers; and, secondly, provide for local authorities to charge fees for those to enter or remain on their self-build and custom housebuilding registers on a cost recovery basis.

This Government are committed to driving up housing supply, and promoting and supporting self-build and custom housebuilding are integral to delivering on that commitment. Doubling the number of self-build and custom build houses by 2020 will not only create much needed new homes but enable more people to live in homes designed by them to meet their specific needs. It will also provide welcome new business opportunities for smaller housebuilders, support and create new jobs, and drive innovation in alternative building techniques.

To take forward this commitment, we passed the Self-build and Custom Housebuilding Act, introduced in another place last year by the honourable Richard Bacon, and Sections 9 to 12 of the Housing and Planning Act earlier this year. The Self-build and Custom Housebuilding Act 2015, which the noble Lord, Lord Best, took through this House, came into force on 1 April this year. As a result, for the first time all local planning authorities have been required to keep a register of those who wish to build or commission their own home in their area and to have regard to that register when carrying out their housing, planning, land disposal and regeneration functions.

A fundamental barrier to more people building or commissioning their own homes is the lack of suitable available plots for self-build and custom housebuilding. These regulations, together with the Self-build and Custom Housebuilding Regulations 2016 that were laid in Parliament last week, are the final component of our legislative framework to support the doubling in size of the self-build and custom housebuilding sector. If approved, they will be critical to increasing the availability of land for self-build and custom housebuilding in England. They will require local authorities to grant enough planning permissions to match demand on their registers within three years of the year in which those entries are made in the register, ensuring that land for self-build and custom housebuilding is made available in a timely manner. This strikes the right balance between ensuring that authorities have sufficient time to identify suitable land and satisfying the need of those seeking land to build or commission their own home quickly.

The regulations also allow local authorities to charge a fee to those to be entered on their register and, where the number of entrants on the register count towards the number of plots for which an authority must grant planning permission, for them to charge an annual fee in subsequent years while the person remains on the register. It is important that authorities are able to charge fees only on a cost recovery basis. This will ensure that any fees charged are reasonable and reflect the costs incurred by the authorities.

Self-build and custom housebuilding have the potential to play a significant role in securing greater diversity in the housing market, as in other parts of Europe. We are fully committed to doubling the size of the self-build and custom housebuilding sector and we want it to become a mainstream form of housing, enabling more people to design their own homes to meet their specific needs. These regulations will increase opportunities for aspiring self-build and custom housebuilders to realise their ambitions of designing and building their own homes. I therefore commend the draft regulations to the Committee.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, I will start my brief remarks by making my usual declarations that I am an elected councillor in the London Borough of Lewisham and a vice-president of the Local Government Association. I fully support the regulations before us today. They are a welcome boost to increasing the amount of self-build and custom-built homes in the UK. We have a number of self-build plots in Lewisham and I support them. I like the idea of new homes and innovation and it is very good if people are able to build properties themselves if they want to. Being able to double the number of plots and houses available would be very positive.

A week or two ago, we had a very interesting debate on housing. More generally, I hope we now all accept the need to increase the number of houses built for various tenures. It irritates me when people sometimes suggest that it is councils that hold back planning permission for property generally. In fact, we often agree permission for housing and then nothing happens. I hope that, in agreeing these regulations today, and looking for more plots, the Minister will also take a wider look at the whole question of planning and what we can do about plots of land with multiple permissions but on which nothing ever happens. Perhaps we can make some of those plots available for someone else to build more self-build houses. The real problem we need to look at is building more houses of different types. However, these regulations are very good and I am happy to support them.

[Lord Jones (Lab)]

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord, Lord Bourne, for the clear and resonant tones in which he spoke to the instrument. These were, no doubt, honed in the Wales Assembly—where he had a distinguished role and no little success—and a Welsh university.

My first brief question, with which, perhaps, his officials can help, is: how much self-building has occurred in previous years in England? Is there a record of self-builds for England in a recent year? Secondly, what sort of fees are paid individually on a self-build in England in a reasonably modest location? Is it possible for him to respond to those two questions? My third question, which I suspect he will not be able to advance on, is regarding any details concerning Wales.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I thank noble Lords for participating in this debate and for the support that they have given to these regulations. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, for his support and that of the Official Opposition in the House of Lords. I recognise that his borough of Lewisham is doing some innovative work in this area, as are other London boroughs and other areas in England. I will respond to the issues raised by the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, and the noble Lord, Lord Jones. I thank the latter very much for his kind remarks about my honing of skills in the National Assembly for Wales, of which I have very fond memories. I met with the First Minister in the House of Lords yesterday. We were in danger of being in our anecdotage discussing the National Assembly last night, but that is another issue.

Self-builds in England are currently running at about 10,000 a year. They have been somewhat higher than that—it varies from year to year. As I have indicated, our aim is to double that figure by 2020. In the whole of the United Kingdom, they are running at about 12,000 a year. On continental Europe, the figures are much higher. About 7% to 10% of our housing completions are self-build. At the other end of the scale, about 80% of housing completions in Austria are self-build. In Sweden, it is around 63%; in Germany and France, about 60%; in the Netherlands it is also high. We are very different from continental Europe. There is a desire on the part of people in this country to design and build their own home, partly no doubt engendered by television programmes such as “Grand Designs” with Kevin McCloud. One of the side effects of this is it will improve the design of the houses that we have. If people are designing their own homes, they will be keen for that design to contribute to the general ambience and be of a high standard. I do not have an average cost for self-build—that will vary enormously from area to area and from house to house—but it is competitive with normal build, which is obviously in response to the desire people have to build their own home.

On a more general point made by the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, he will know that we are bringing forward a housing White Paper this autumn that will address some of the issues we need to address to build more houses in this country. He will know that the Prime Minister is making this a high priority for the Government, which has already been indicated by the commitment of resources and the recent announcement by my right honourable friend the Secretary of State, Sajid Javid, of £3 billion for housebuilding, £1 billion of which could be directed in this area. Therefore we have committed resources to this and we regard it as important.

Once again, I thank noble Lords for their support and I commend these draft regulations to the Committee.

Motion agreed.

Homelessness

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Monday 17th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, I beg to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper. In doing so, I refer Members to my entry in the register of interests. I am a councillor in the London Borough of Lewisham and a vice-president of the Local Government Association.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, measuring hidden homelessness is inherently difficult, as there is no agreed definition or reliable method of data collection. Therefore, the Government have made no assessment of hidden homelessness.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark]

My Lords, we live in one of the richest countries in the world. Does the noble Lord agree that the increase in homelessness over recent years is nothing short of a national disgrace? What assessment have the Government made of the Homelessness Reduction Bill introduced by Bob Blackman MP in the Commons, which seems very welcome and deserves cross-party support?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I share the noble Lord’s feeling that homelessness is something that we need to take action about. He will know that it is a very high priority for the Prime Minister and the Government. I agree with him that the Bob Blackman Bill is worth serious consideration. He will know that it has gone through pre-legislative scrutiny by the Communities and Local Government Select Committee, and the Government are considering it closely.

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

My Lords, will the noble Lord tell us what he defines as homelessness, and particularly hidden homelessness? Does he include all these young people who are forced to remain in the family home who would dearly love to move on and have property, or at least a small dwelling, for themselves?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, my noble friend has put her finger on the nature of the problem. As I said, it is difficult to define hidden homelessness for the reasons that she just gave. Many people may be staying with friends or relations for six months, perhaps having come down from a village or town to London, before finding permanent accommodation, for example.

[The Earl of Listowel (CB)]

My Lords, does the Minister deplore the fact that 100,000 children are living in homeless accommodation—temporary, insecure accommodation—in this country, the highest level since the early 2000s? When do the Government anticipate that the number of homeless children will begin to decline?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord is right: young people being homeless is a matter of concern. The Government have contributed a significant amount of money to the positive pathways framework—two-thirds of local authorities are benefiting from that—and £15 million has gone into the fair chance fund, helping 1,900 homeless young people with complex needs. Yes, there is a challenge; the Government are rising to it.

[Lord Watts (Lab)]

My Lords, can the Minister explain the increase in people living in our streets over the past few years? What does he think is the driving reason for it?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the last figure taken was taken on a night in the autumn of 2015, when 3,569 people were found to be sleeping rough in England. That is a serious position, there is no doubt; it has been at that sort of level over a period of time. The noble Lord will no doubt be pleased about the £40 million worth of assistance announced today in relation to helping with housing.

[Baroness Bakewell of Hardington Mandeville (LD)]

My Lords, there has been an increase in the number of direct access hostels, resulting in waiting lists. There is a logjam because there is no supported accommodation for people to move on to; even when people manage to find accommodation, it cannot be sustained, because there is no support for them. That results in increased rough sleeping. Does the Minister have statistics for the numbers of people affected?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness will be aware that there is a sum of money— £100 million in this Parliament—to help vulnerable people to move on from hostels and refuges into low-cost permanent accommodation. We are pursuing that with a vengeance, with a view to getting those unacceptable numbers down.

[Lord Bird (CB)]

If the Government are not looking into hidden homelessness, could they look into the predictability of homelessness? There is a situation whereby people are coming out of care, out of the Army and out of prisons. It would be a very interesting exercise to head off homelessness before it becomes entrenched in the lives of our young people.

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord is right. He will no doubt be pleased that £20 million of the £40 million package that has been announced was specifically for homelessness trailblazer areas, which include Southwark, Greater Manchester and Newcastle, to deal with people who are in danger of losing their homes and ensuring that we do it in a preventional way, which is clearly the best way in which to tackle the problem.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

The Minister said that dealing with this problem had a high priority, but will he explain to the House precisely what is meant by “high priority”? In conjunction with his colleagues in other departments, will he put a list in the Library of all those issues considered by the Government to be a high priority?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

The noble Lord is in danger of appearing like a Dickensian undertaker praying for a severe winter. I have indicated that £40 million worth of assistance, which I would think that most people would welcome, has just been announced. That indicates that it is a high priority to deal with the homelessness issue. It is clearly a complex issue—nobody is suggesting that it will be solved overnight. But the £40 million worth of assistance announced by the Prime Minister today is something that we should all welcome.

[Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab)]

My Lords, will the Minister join me in congratulating Shelter on a brilliant new report, published today, entitled Living Home Standard? Will he undertake to meet Mr Campbell Robb, the chief executive, to discuss the specificities of the report?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is right to address our attention to the excellent and helpful role that Shelter performs; we work very closely with it, and of course we will take up the report with it and have an early meeting to pursue its findings.

[Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton (Lab)]

My Lords, will the Minister please take back to his colleagues in government the fact that one of the major problems of underachievement by children is the underachievement of those who do not live in settled homes, who move around and whose education is disrupted? Returning to the 11-plus will not help at all, because those are precisely the children who have failed because the Government of the day have not given a high priority to providing housing, particularly in areas such as seaside towns, where children move all the time and have their education disrupted because there is no permanent accommodation.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness asks something of a pantechnicon of a question, encompassing many different areas—but I can certainly share with her, in relation to housing, that it is clearly vital and that the lack of housing contributes to social problems, ineffective education and health problems. There is no doubt of that.

Housing: Vulnerable People

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Thursday 13th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government how they plan to ensure that there is an increase in the level of supported housing across England so that the needs of vulnerable people are met.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, this Government value the important role that supported housing plays in protecting vulnerable people and are committed to encouraging further development to meet future demand. That is why we are boosting supply, with more than 14,000 new homes in this Parliament.

[Baroness Warwick of Undercliffe (Lab)]

My Lords, I welcome the Minister’s assurance that the Government understand the need to provide adequate support and funding for this vital specialist service. Unfortunately, the Government’s recent announcement has not provided the level of certainty that tenants and the sector need and had been hoping for. It is vital that local authorities receive enough devolved funding and that there is a long-term ring-fence around this money to pay for housing costs. Can the Minister clarify how all vulnerable groups will be protected in a system where priorities will be different in each local authority? How can providers and lenders have the certainty they need to build much-needed new specialist housing, and how can we make sure that money is not lost to services and spent on complicated administration?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is obviously well acquainted with this area. I congratulate her on the role that she fulfils as chair of the National Housing Federation, which we regard as a valuable ally. She will know that we are going out to consultation specifically on the local housing allowance cap, which I think is what she refers to. I hope very much that she and others will engage in that because we are putting the same amount of money in there to ensure that we protect this sector. It will be ring-fenced and we can discuss in the consultation the particular nature of that ring-fence.

[Baroness Bakewell of Hardington Mandeville (LD)]

My Lords, at the Rethink mental health hostel in Somerset people are allowed to stay for only nine months, and then moved on despite their mental health not having improved. Staffing levels are one member of staff to 55 units of accommodation. Can the Minister please reassure the House that he is aware of and working actively to remedy this situation, which exists across the country?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is certainly right to accentuate the fact that there are particular challenges in relation to mental health. We work closely with Mencap and I can provide her with the reassurance she seeks: we are seeking to ensure that that area is protected.

[Baroness Masham of Ilton (CB)]

My Lords, how many of the new houses will have suitable accommodation for people who use wheelchairs—for instance, lavatories downstairs—if they have had a stroke or become disabled, so that they can stay in their own homes?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is right to address the protection of people with vulnerabilities. Eight thousand of the new supported homes are for people who are vulnerable, elderly and with disabilities, so that will be at the forefront of our mind. More than 6,000 specialised homes are being provided by the Department of Health’s care and support specialised housing programme. I am sure that the noble Baroness’s message will be heard very loudly and taken care of.

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

My Lords, while it is good news to hear that we are encouraging more of this, can the Minister assure us that everything is being done to ensure that where a property that has been adapted with special aids is no longer required because the person has died or moved on to long-term care, someone else with special needs gets it and it does not just get lost to this sector?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, noble Lords will appreciate that a lot of these issues are dealt with at a local level, so this is not prescribed centrally. It is for local areas to ensure that their particular needs are taken care of. What my noble friend has referred to appears to be common sense. I will seek to assure her by letter that this is common practice. I am sure it is, but there is diversity and it is a matter for local authorities.

[The Lord Bishop of St Albans]

My Lords, last year Her Majesty’s Government decided to delay the 1% reduction in social rents for supported housing in order to assess the impact it would have on the sector. The move was widely welcomed around this House. Now that Her Majesty’s Government have decided to press ahead with largely the same proposal—there are one or two exceptions, I grant—will the Minister consider publishing the detailed analysis of that assessment to allay fears that the reduction threatens the viability of present and future supported housing schemes?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the right reverend Prelate is right that there are exemptions. They are perhaps more far-reaching than he suggests. They cover refuges, almshouses, co-ops, fully mutuals and community land trusts. On areas that need particular care, we have been working very closely with Polly Neate of Women’s Aid in relation to refuges and Katherine Sacks-Jones of Agenda. I will take away the particular point he referred to, but we are content that we have protected the areas that need protection.

[Baroness Watkins of Tavistock (CB)]

My Lords, will the Minister clarify whether during the consultation stage there will be a thorough analysis of the potential disbenefits to the NHS if there is insufficient supported housing for quick discharge for a range of people who are currently waiting for suitable accommodation and who are therefore dependent on the NHS?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Baroness is right to address concern that this is interactive with the health area. This is something we touched on in a debate earlier this week. The consultation that will open shortly in relation to the cap and the way that we ensure that the additional costs are taken care of will be transparent and collaborative. It will be a very open process, so I ask noble Lords to ensure that they, as well as outside organisations, participate in it so that we get this right and are able to protect the sector and the variations that exist between different local authorities.

[Lord Beecham (Lab)]

My Lords, what discussions have taken place between the noble Lord’s department and the Department of Health about the impact on social care budgets that is now being felt throughout the country? Clearly, the work of social services and adult care is closely related to the conditions under which the residents of sheltered housing live.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord is right to say that there is interaction with the Department of Health. We discuss this with it, as we do with the Department for Work and Pensions. There is interaction across a lot of areas and, as we found earlier in the week when we debated this, this of course has great impact on the health and well-being of tenants, as well as in education and many other areas. We have to take this in the round and have a holistic approach.

Devolution: North-east England

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Wednesday 12th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Beith]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what recent discussions they have had with local authorities in the North East of England about the devolution of powers.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

On 6 September north-east leaders decided not to take forward their devolution deal. Although that deal cannot continue, we stand ready to work with those councils that share our aim to boost jobs, create opportunities and build a stronger northern powerhouse, and this guides our ongoing engagement with councils in the area.

[Lord Beith (LD)]

My Lords, there is general agreement that the north-east needs these powers in order to deal with the region’s problems but the blockages on the road seem to be the inability of the seven Labour council leaders to agree with each other and the stubborn insistence by Ministers on the elected mayor model, putting all the power in the hands of one individual. If the way is open, as the Minister said, to further discussion, will the way also be open to some new thinking about a model for this devolution which leaves room for minority as well as majority opinion, for rural as well as urban areas, and engages everybody in something that we all agree is needed?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord has given distinguished service to the north-east and I agree with him about the importance of the devolution deal for the north-east. As I understand it, the blockage is not about the mayor but elsewhere, but we remain very much of the view that to get the most powers you need the best accountability, and that is delivered by directly elected mayors.

[Lord Beecham (Lab)]

My Lords, regrettable though the failure to reach a devolution deal covering the seven members of the North East Combined Authority is, do the Government realise the significance of its member councils’ financial concerns? The offer of an investment of £30 million a year for 30 years between seven councils—£900 million in total—must be seen in the context of annual budget cuts amounting to some £1.5 billion a year, coupled with huge uncertainty about the working of the business rates system on which councils will have to rely as revenue support grant ends. Is not the best way to revive the devolution concept for the Government to recognise that devolving responsibility without the power conferred by adequate funding undermines their proclaimed objectives?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, other areas—Greater Manchester, Liverpool City Region, Tees Valley—have come to an agreement and are pursuing the need for an elected mayor. It is regrettable that the north-east is not doing so, but we do not impose these things—they are to be bottom-up—but I appeal to the north-east to come together so that we can proceed with this deal, perhaps in 2018.

[Baroness Hollis of Heigham (Lab)]

My Lords, will the Minister not consider detaching the issue of elected mayors from devolution? As we warned when the Bill was going through, the devolution proposals for Norfolk and Suffolk have fallen through, mainly because a mixture of Tory councils and Labour councils were not willing to go ahead with an elected mayor. As a result, some areas, particularly in Norfolk, which are among the poorest in the country, will not get the resources or the powers they need, particularly to provide transport connectivity, because the Government are hung up—stupidly—on the concept of an elected mayor, which may make sense for London and the great conurbations but does not make sense for large parts of the eastern region.

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, whatever else has been happening in the north-east, I do not think there has been a disagreement between Conservative and Labour authorities—I wish that were the case in some ways, but this has all been disagreements among Labour authorities. I remain of the view, as do the Government, that the best way to proceed, as we are in the urban areas where we need this concentration of powers, is to have somebody accountable as a mayor, just as we have in London. We have had other agreements where there is not a mayor—for example, Cornwall—but then you do not get all the necessary powers, so that is not the way forward.

[Baroness Rawlings (Con)]

My Lords, to what extent will the Government be encouraging the British Museum to move from Blythe House to the northern area, which was discussed this week?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, that was not part of my briefing so I will go back and ensure that my noble friend gets a detailed reply on it. I am afraid that I am blindsided on what, I am sure, is a key issue.

[Lord Shipley (LD)]

My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for reminding the House that budget cuts, which were referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Beecham, affect all councils in all mayoral combined authorities, yet other such authorities are going ahead. Does the Minister agree that there has been a serious failure of collective political leadership by the Labour Party in the north-east, in rejecting the opportunities that devolution presents when other parts of England are going ahead and taking them?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as noble Lords will know, I do not wish to be partisan on this issue. Nevertheless, I encourage the councils of the north-east to come together because there is great merit in this deal. I think that there is a widely held view in the House about the importance of devolution in taking advantage of powers over investment, transport and adult education. They should put personal differences behind them and come together, so that we can proceed with a devolution deal which will be in the interests of the north-east.

[Lord Grocott (Lab)]

Was it part of the Minister’s brief to check on the legislation passed in the last Parliament, which provided for referendums in 10 cities in the United Kingdom to determine whether they wanted directly elected mayors? In nine of them, when people were consulted as they have been in other referendums, they decided clearly: no, they did not want them. That included the cities of Coventry and Birmingham. If the Government are determined to persist with directly elected mayors in our region, why on earth does the Minister not at least have the consistency to acknowledge that before they can be introduced—I am opposed to their introduction—there should be a referendum, otherwise the previous referendums might as well never have been held?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord will be aware that those are not combined authorities. We are not comparing like with like here. This is an issue where elected representatives, very often from Labour councils, come together to decide whether it is in the interests of their region, as they have done in Greater Manchester and Liverpool City Region, for example. We believe that, just as in London, we need that accountability of a mayor for devolution to work effectively in the interests of the region. That is why we are pursuing that policy.

[Viscount Ridley (Con)]

My Lords, is my noble friend the Minister surprised or not that those in the Labour Party in the north-east are more interested in fighting among themselves than in representing the region as a whole?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as I indicated, I come to this brief with a genuine belief that it is in the best interests of our great conurbations and of the north-east that this goes forward. As I said previously, I make a plea to the areas concerned to come together to proceed with this. It has to be from the grass roots up—we are not imposing this—but believe that it is very much in the interests of the people of the area.

Housing

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Tuesday 11th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, I thank noble Lords for their contributions to this debate and, in doing that, congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady Bakewell, on introducing it as fairly and forcefully as she did.

This is a very important area and we have had some excellent contributions. I shall open with some general comments and give an undertaking that anything I do not cover in the time available will be covered in a write-round to noble Lords who have participated, picking up all the points made.

As has been rightly said, on entering Downing Street the Prime Minister set out the Government’s ambition to achieve a country that works for everyone and to help those who are just getting by, as the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, said. In doing that, she sought to ensure that the Government address the housing shortage. Doing all that we can to build more affordable quality homes is at the centre of this ambition.

The extent of the housing shortage in this country needs no introduction. The noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, fairly said that we have to see how we address this shortage with a range of tenures at some speed. This did not just suddenly happen. All parties have to answer for this as they have been part of Governments over the period when this problem has been growing. A range of noble Lords referred to demographic changes and population growth, which have exacerbated the issue. The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Rochester, the noble Lords, Lord Borwick, Lord Sharkey and Lord Farmer, and others referred quite rightly to the fact that the problem has become accentuated because of the demographic changes and population growth we have seen, and indeed continue to see.

The consequences of standing still are clear: 50% of today’s 45 year-olds were homeowners by the time they were 30; for those born 10 years’ later the figure is just 35%; and only 26% of those who are 25 today are projected to be homeowners in five years’ time. I realise that we are talking about not just home ownership but a variety of tenures. That is absolutely right, but nevertheless, as the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, correctly said, most people aspire to own homes in their lifetime. Most of us here—I suspect all of us—own our own homes. If we keep building at the current rate, by 2025 the house of the average owner-occupier in the south-east will increase in value by £1,000 a week. Obviously that has a read-across to rental values as well.

The problem is clear. Home ownership is in danger of becoming a preserve of the privileged few, and it is a serious challenge for many, by the same token, to be able to afford to rent. There is little doubt of that. The Government are committed to solving the housing crisis by every means possible; the fundamental solution is simple to state, but complex to deliver. We need to build more homes—and it is correct to say with a variety of tenures. At the last spending review, the Government pledged to invest £20 billion in housing over this Parliament—not a small amount—and we will deliver on these plans. I do not think that noble Lords have mentioned this, but I shall do so: last week, we went further, launching a £3 billion home builders fund and a £2 billion investment in accelerated construction to deliver more housing on surplus public sector land. We also announced additional reforms to make our planning system fit for purpose by supporting development in our cities.

Of course, alongside building more homes, we want to do more to ensure that these are quality homes which people want to live in. Many noble Lords have referred to the interaction between design and affordability and having quality homes. The noble Lord, Lord Patten, talked about the prospect of more acceptance for good design—if it is a good design, it is acceptable to communities. I take that point completely; it is central to what we are doing.

The Government want to ensure that everyone has a safe and secure place to live. Our record to date on housebuilding is a strong one: we have delivered over 704,000 additional homes since April 2010 and we have committed to the largest affordable housebuilding programme by any Government since the 1970s. The noble Lord, Lord Beecham, made many good points, but he talked about Macmillan spinning in his grave. I think Macmillan would actually be rather pleased with Prime Minister Theresa May’s attitude to the public sector and towards housebuilding; he would probably be much more in tune with her than Clement Attlee would be with the current leader of the Labour Party, for example. I do not see many noble Lords opposite me shaking their heads—in fact, I do not see any.

We have taken steps to help people on the path to home ownership. Our Help to Buy equity loan is helping many people to purchase their own homes. But it is absolutely right that we ensure that there is a variety of tenures available. We are pledging to help with homes to rent—we are talking to the Mayor of London and the London Assembly about how we can assist with housebuilding in London. A particularly important sector for London is the private rented sector.

In the time remaining, I shall try to pick up points made by noble Lords. Those that I am unable or do not have time to address I shall ensure are covered in the write-around. This point was made by the noble Baroness, Lady Bakewell—we are taking action to tackle rogue landlords. We have a £12 million programme to help local authorities to enforce action against rogue landlords. She referred, as did many noble Lords, to the interaction with poor health and energy efficiency. The noble Lord, Lord Farmer, rightly said that family breakdown was another factor that has to be looked at in relation to this issue.

The noble Lord, Lord Sawyer, is absolutely right that space standards are central. Building regulations have not been mentioned a lot but they contribute to the quality of homes, as does the National Planning Policy Framework, which has a whole chapter devoted to design—chapter 7—which is important in this context. The Government introduced a national space standard in October 2015, which local authorities can adopt in their local planning policy, subject to establishing need and viability. Now is a good time to see how that is working in practice. We committed to reviewing that standard during the passage of the Housing and Planning Act 2016, and I am currently considering the terms of reference for that review process. We will make a decision on that in due course, and make it public.

The noble Lord, Lord Stoneham, talked about a turning point on housing for this Government, which he very fairly noted was probably happening. As he said, we need to boost the amount of housebuilding and not just by promoting private ownership—although, of course, we need to recognise that it is a valid aspiration, as noble Lords across the Chamber have said. We should certainly regard it as central, although not exclusively so, in looking at this issue.

The noble Lord, Lord Stoneham, also referred to how we address the extra cost of supported housing and the retirement housing scheme. He will know that we are addressing supported housing and will consult on how we do it with a new programme in 2019. I will look at the issue of retirement housing, which he quite fairly brought up, and address it in the letter which I will send to noble Lords.

The right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Rochester talked about population growth. I agree with his point about the quality of the neighbourhood. It is not just about housing: it is broader than that. He talked about the importance of community and I am grateful for his assistance and input on what is happening at Ebbsfleet. We are looking at the design of housing there; we regard that, and the importance of community, as central.

My noble friend Lord Borwick asked me what I was doing about great crested newts. When I took on this post I absolutely insisted that I had authority in relation to great crested newts: this is central to what we are doing. In all seriousness, if he has evidence of a conspiracy to abuse public office by introducing these newts to try and slow down housebuilding and passes this on to me, I will ensure that it is addressed in the appropriate way. He rightly talked about the importance of proper incentives for housebuilding and asked about the future of the new homes bonus. As the noble Lord will be aware, the Government have been consulting on the new homes bonus to see how we can sharpen the incentive to ensure that councils are genuinely incentivised to allow more homes in their area. We will provide further information on our next steps on that in due course.

The noble Lord, Lord Sharkey, asked about starter homes. I can confirm that this remains a central part of the Government’s agenda. The noble Lord will be aware that we are consulting on the necessary secondary legislation to deliver starter homes through the planning measures outlined in the Housing and Planning Act, and progress is on track through engagement with builders and other stakeholders in that issue. He also asked if 1 million homes is still a target. I can confirm that it is. The added incentives and finance that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State, Sajid Javid, recently announced give us extra tools to approach this issue. I know that it is challenging, but we are making these housing goals central to what we are seeking to do.

The noble Lord, Lord Best, also talked about 1 million homes by 2020 and how we could take up the slack. He welcomed the Build to Rent project, though he did, admittedly, say that it has not delivered as much as we need. We have interaction with other government departments here. We have to be aware of the impact of any welfare changes and ensure that we have flexibility of approach to tenures. We will do this. I thank noble Lords for what they have said about my honourable friend, the Minister, Gavin Barwell. He is indeed committed to different forms of tenure, as is the whole department and the Government. That is how we will ensure that we address the housing shortage in a pragmatic way.

My noble friend Lord Farmer asked about the action we are taking. I have already mentioned the recently announced additional £3 billion Home Building Fund and £2 billion for surplus public sector land, as well as additional action on brownfield sites. He particularly asked about the family stability indicator. The Prime Minister has been clear that tackling poverty and disadvantage and delivering real social reform will be a priority for this Government. We will set out more detailed policy in due course. Families provide a firm foundation in a child’s early years and are key to ensuring that they develop into a healthy, happy and successful adult. Furthermore, as the noble Lord rightly said, if families are together and not breaking up, that obviously means the demands on the housing sector are very different, so that is an additional bonus, as it were. I thank him very much for his contribution.

The noble Lord, Lord Beecham, asked about the timetable for regulations under the Housing and Planning Act 2016. I do not have that to hand but, if I can, I will cover that in detail for him. The noble Baroness, Lady Janke, fairly addressed concerns about issues such as the housing of offenders, which we certainly need to address, and domestic violence. I have been working very closely with Women’s Aid on supported housing and pay tribute to what it is doing under its leader, Polly Neate. As noble Lords will know, it was announced recently that supported accommodation would be protected from the 1% reduction in rents, which was welcomed. We are very conscious of the importance of that sector.

My noble friend Lady Redfern talked about her experience and what her local authority was doing. I am very grateful for her efforts and for some of the ideas she has put forward. I look forward to hearing more about how that authority is helping to stimulate housing, which would be very helpful to us in looking at this area.

My noble friend Lady Gardner of Parkes, was, as always, firing on all cylinders. I appreciate very much her welcome for what we are doing. The private rented sector is vital. I mentioned what we are doing with the Mayor of London and the London Assembly to try to help in London. I thank her very much for her trailer for the Question on Wednesday of next week, which means that I will have more and more people bombarding me with these issues. Local authorities already have substantial powers of action where breaches occur, and I encourage them to address that. If breaches of leases occur, it is for landlords to enforce the terms of the leases. Again, I encourage them to do so. However, my noble friend addressed a concern and I look forward to hearing more about that next week.

The noble Lord, Lord Shipley, talked about some of the interacting factors such as family breakdown and correctly addressed the important issue of how we supply more housing. As I say, it is very easy to state that but much more difficult to do, but at least if we identify what we all want to do, we are all kicking in the same direction. The noble Lord talked about my right honourable friend the Secretary of State’s recognition of the moral duty to tackle the housing crisis. He has been very honest about this in saying that successive Governments have not done enough, including the Conservatives. We all share some blame in this and we all must together seek to address it. The noble Lord correctly accentuated the importance of having different tenures.

I thank the noble Lord, Lord Kennedy, for his very fair summing up of the issues—that we need more homes and a variety of tenures to be provided quicker. That probably sums up how we all feel, and we all need to work together to ensure that we do that. The Government have made this a central concern. The Prime Minister identified herself very clearly with those people who are struggling and having difficulty getting by. One thing she hates is unfairness. This issue will be central to what this Government seek to do, and it is certainly central to what the department seeks to do.

As I said, I will ensure that I write to noble Lords covering all the points that were raised, one of two of which I have no doubt missed.

House adjourned at 8.58 pm.

Wales Bill

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

2nd reading (Hansard): House of Lords
Monday 10th October 2016 Lords Chamber

Moved by

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

That the Bill be now read a second time.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, I am pleased to be here today to open this important debate on the Wales Bill. It is an open question when Wales began its devolution journey. Some would begin with the creation of the post of Secretary of State for Wales in 1964 and the establishment of the Welsh Office in 1965, but for many Welsh devolution began in earnest with the referendum in 1997. Parliament has legislated on Welsh devolution three times since then, in 1998, 2006 and 2014, with each Act seeing an incremental change to the Welsh devolution settlement.

I think it is fair to conclude that Welsh devolution has never achieved a settled state. On the one hand this dynamism is positive, and has encouraged an ongoing and open debate about Welsh devolution and Wales’s place in the wider United Kingdom. On the other, the fluidity of Welsh devolution has distracted from focusing on the issues that really matter to people—the economy, jobs and public services in particular.

Back in 2011, the coalition Government established a process to develop a stable devolution settlement for Wales for the longer term. They set up the independent Silk commission, led by Sir Paul Silk, to review the financial and constitutional arrangements in Wales. For me personally, this Bill represents at least in part the culmination of those three years of work that began at the time the Silk commission started in 2011, when I was a member, at the request of the then Secretary of State for Wales, my right honourable friend Cheryl Gillan. Many of the recommendations in the commission’s second report are being implemented in the Bill.

After the commission concluded its work, the former Secretary of State for Wales established the St David’s Day process to identify those recommendations in the second Silk report which commanded a consensus across the parties in Wales. The outcome of that process, the Saint David’s Day agreement, published in February 2015, forms the blueprint for the Bill.

At this point, I thank both my right honourable friend Stephen Crabb, the then Secretary of State for Wales, and the noble Baroness, Lady Randerson, who played a significant part in framing the work that has gone into the Bill and taking it forward.

The Bill delivers a clearer and stronger Welsh devolution settlement and an Assembly and Welsh Government more accountable to the people they serve. Welsh devolution will be clearer by implementing a new reserved powers model, providing a well-defined boundary between what is reserved and what is devolved. It will be stronger by devolving further powers to the Assembly and Welsh Ministers in areas such as elections, the Assembly’s internal processes, transport, energy and the environment. The Bill makes the Assembly and Welsh Government accountable for raising more of the money they spend by paving the way for the introduction of Welsh rates of income tax without the need for a referendum.

The Assembly and Welsh Government have come of age. They are now mature institutions and part of the fabric of Welsh political life. The Bill recognises this new maturity in some key ways. First, the Assembly and Welsh Government are recognised as permanent parts of the United Kingdom’s constitutional arrangements, not to be abolished unless the people of Wales decide in a referendum in favour of doing so. This statement recognises what we all know to be true: that the Assembly and Welsh Government are part of the United Kingdom’s constitutional fabric and are here to stay.

Secondly, the Bill gives important recognition to the body of Welsh law made by the Assembly and Welsh Ministers, forming part of the law of England and Wales. Thirdly, it puts the convention on legislative consent on a statutory footing, as is already the case for Scotland, making clear that Parliament will not normally legislate on devolved matters without the Assembly’s consent.

The constitutional debates of recent years demonstrate the need to reset the devolution settlement for Wales. We all want an end to the incessant squabbles over powers between Cardiff and Westminster and to see Welsh devolution set on a firmer foundation, enabling the Welsh Government to focus on the things that really matter to people—improving the Welsh economy, securing more Welsh jobs and improving devolved public services.

We need to move to a new way of thinking about Welsh devolution based on a reserved powers model. By implementing this new model, the Bill provides for a clearer and more stable settlement that will last for the longer term. Anything not reserved to the UK Government is devolved, and the Assembly will be able to legislate on it.

The new reserved powers model of Welsh devolution has been the subject of a great deal of public debate over the last year since the Government published the Wales Bill in draft. My right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Wales, his predecessor, the right honourable Member for Preseli Pembrokeshire, and I have discussed the Bill’s provisions with many who have an interest in the future of Welsh devolution. We listened to the concerns expressed during that debate about aspects of the draft Bill, and we have acted on them.

The Bill before us today is significantly improved from the one we published in draft. It includes a list of reservations that is shorter, with more precisely drawn boundaries. It contains fewer tests for legislative competence, and it gives the Assembly more discretion to enforce its legislation by being able to modify the private law and criminal law for devolved purposes.

A key part of delivering a clear devolution boundary is defining which public authorities are devolved and which are reserved. The Bill defines those public authorities that are devolved public authorities accountable to the Assembly or Welsh Ministers. It describes those authorities as “Wales Public Authorities” and lists them at Schedule 3 to the Bill. All other public authorities are reserved authorities, accountable to Parliament or United Kingdom Ministers. The Assembly can legislate on reserved authorities only with the consent of United Kingdom Government Ministers. It is surely right that the consent of United Kingdom Ministers is sought in order for the Assembly to modify the functions of a body accountable to UK Ministers.

The Bill, and accompanying secondary legislation, will also provide clarity on how so-called pre-commencement Minister of the Crown functions are to be exercised in future. For those noble Lords unfamiliar with this term, let me explain that “pre-commencement” functions are functions exercised in devolved areas by Ministers of the Crown before the Assembly assumed full law-making powers following the 2011 referendum. We want to be clear how such functions are to be exercised under the new reserved powers model.

Last week, I wrote to noble Lords with an indicative list of those functions we intend to transfer by order. Most functions not subject to transfer will be exercised concurrently or jointly by Ministers of the Crown and Welsh Ministers. The Bill lists those functions at Schedule 4. There remain a handful of functions which Ministers of the Crown will exercise alone. Those are listed at paragraph 11 of Schedule 2.

I shall now say something about the single legal jurisdiction of England and Wales, which was an important part of the debate around the draft Bill. There were some who questioned whether a reserved powers model for Wales could work within the shared jurisdiction of England and Wales. There was a great deal of debate about whether Wales would be better served by a separate legal jurisdiction. Some favoured a distinct jurisdiction with largely autonomous arrangements for Wales, although common agreement on what is a distinct jurisdiction proved elusive.

The Government listened carefully to the concerns raised, but we have been clear and resolute throughout that the single legal jurisdiction of England and Wales has served both nations well for centuries and continues to do so. We do not intend to modify that. The single jurisdiction can readily accommodate a growing body of Welsh law without the need for separation, and there are many reasons why separation would be detrimental to Wales.

Of course, Wales has a distinctive legal identity. I think we would all recognise that. It has two legislatures and a growing body of law made by the Assembly and Welsh Ministers—a fact that this Bill recognises formally for the first time. This recognition is important, but let me assure the House that it is set firmly in the context of maintaining the single legal jurisdiction of England and Wales. The Bill enables the Assembly to modify the private law and criminal law for devolved purposes, enabling the Assembly to create offences to help enforce its legislation, as it does now. The Assembly will not be able to modify a small number of the gravest offences, such as homicide offences and sexual offences, ensuring consistency across the England and Wales single legal jurisdiction.

Of course we need to adapt to the growing body of Welsh law created in the Assembly and by the Welsh Ministers. That is why the Government have established a working group of officials to examine how administrative arrangements for justice in Wales can be improved. I look forward to informing the House of the group’s findings later in the autumn. I should also say that I have written to both the Ministry of Justice and the Department for Education, encouraging action to ensure that law schools throughout England and Wales take account of the growing body of Welsh law and that that devolved element is taught as part of law courses and is carried forward into professional courses as well, such as those for the Bar, solicitors, legal executives, and so forth.

The Bill delivers more accountable, devolved government for Wales. With the coming of age that I have already talked about comes renewed responsibility and a need for the Assembly and Welsh Government to become truly accountable. A key element of this is removing the need for a referendum to introduce Welsh rates of income tax, which will mean that the Welsh Government can take on more responsibility for how they raise money as well as how that money is spent. It gives the Government an interest in ensuring that the economy in Wales is performing well. The reward for that will redound to the Welsh Government, who are being given this power to exercise for a purpose consistent with the mandate of a particular Welsh Government.

Tax-raising powers are a key part of the Assembly truly becoming a Parliament. The Wales Act 2014 devolves stamp duty and landfill tax; we took forward the full devolution of business rates in April last year. The devolution of Welsh rates of income tax—not all income tax, of course, just 10p—will complete the process of fiscal devolution for Wales as set out in the 2014 Act, delivering truly accountably devolved government for the first time.

The Bill makes Welsh devolution stronger by devolving a significant package of new powers to the Assembly and Welsh Ministers. These are powers for a purpose, giving the Assembly and Welsh Ministers the tools to improve the day-to-day lives of people in Wales. The Assembly and Welsh Ministers will have strengthened powers over transport in Wales, including speed limits and traffic signs on Welsh roads; the registration of bus services; and the regulation of taxis and private hire vehicles. We are devolving policy over ports in Wales, apart from Milford Haven, which is of strategic importance to the UK state. Welsh Ministers will decide, too, whether energy projects in Wales up to 350 megawatts generating capacity should be built. Decisions on whether fracking takes place in Wales will in future be made in Wales. We have already devolved all onshore wind consents in the Energy Act—that is without limit. Noble Lords will recall that I took that through this House earlier this year.

On the environment, the Bill will devolve new powers over marine licensing and marine conservation zones, as the Silk commission recommended, and we are continuing to consider the outcomes of the work between the UK Government and the Welsh Government, looking at the devolution boundary for water and sewerage, with a view to taking that forward.

Finally, but significantly, the Bill also gives the Assembly control over its own affairs—something that, arguably, should have happened some time ago—including elections to the Assembly itself, the franchise, and the electoral system for Assembly elections and the number of Assembly Members. Importantly, the Assembly will be able to decide what it should be called. If the Assembly wishes to rename itself the Welsh Parliament, for example, as many would consider appropriate, it will be able to do so. That reflects the maturity of the Assembly, which I spoke about earlier. It is only right that the Assembly should be responsible for these issues in Wales, just as the Scottish Parliament now is in Scotland. These new powers deliver a powerful legislature for Wales, irrespective of what it decides to be called. Welsh Ministers will have new levers to improve the economy and public services in Wales, and important new responsibilities over natural resources and the environment.

I know that many here today will want to speak, and I look forward to hearing an interesting and stimulating debate from people who know a great deal on the subject of devolution in Wales. I will conclude by saying that the Bill sets the course for a stable and lasting devolution settlement for Wales. It builds a new Welsh devolution settlement on the solid foundations of a reserved powers model. It is much improved on the draft of a year ago. I commend it to the House.

Wales Bill

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

2nd reading (Hansard - continued): House of Lords
Monday 10th October 2016 Lords Chamber

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, this has been a debate of rare quality. As has been said, we have had contributions from five former Secretaries of State—the noble and learned Lord, Lord Morris, and the noble Lords, Lord Crickhowell, Lord Hain, Lord Hunt and Lord Murphy—all, obviously, with vast experience of this area. We have also had a contribution of rare quality as a maiden speech from the noble Baroness, Lady Bloomfield. It was truly excellent and I am sure we all look forward to many contributions from her in the future, not only on Wales but focusing very much on it. We have also benefited greatly from the contributions of former Assembly Members, party leaders and former Ministers, from the noble Baroness, Lady Randerson, to the noble Lords, Lord Wigley, Lord Howarth and Lord Elis-Thomas, who also brought their great experience to bear.

I will try to deal with key points that have been made during the course of the debate. Obviously I look forward to engaging in Committee and thereafter on some of the detail. There is a genuine feeling that we want to move forward in a consensual way, as far as possible, and obviously many areas of the Bill have been welcomed pretty much universally—not least in the contribution of the noble Baroness, Lady Gale, on some of the internal workings, elections and so on, which we both agree should have been matters for the Assembly from a much earlier date—probably well preceding 2014.

I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Morgan of Ely, for her kind words in opening. We go back a long way together on devolution matters and I know that she is now adding her wisdom to the counsels of the Assembly. I thank her for what she said and look forward to engaging on some of the issues that she quite fairly set out.

Let me look at some of the key ones. First, on taxation, I can reassure the noble Lord, Lord Hain, that there is no neoliberal assault on the part of the Government. This is a pragmatic approach to an issue that it is high time that the Welsh Assembly—who knows, henceforward perhaps the Welsh Parliament—were able to deal with. It is appropriate that a body of such maturity has the tax powers we are talking about.

It is not, of course, a wholesale tax package. Listening to one or two noble Lords, it sounded as if we were devolving the whole of income tax powers to Wales. That is not the case. We are devolving 10p and there is an ability for the Government of Wales—which is currently the Labour Party, with a Liberal Democrat Minister—to set that at current rates. There is no obligation to vary it. They have to set a rate but they are quite at liberty to set it at the existing rate if that is what they want to do. We have taken away the condition that they are obliged to vary all the rates together. The lock-step has gone, which means that they can be varied quite separately.

That is appropriate now, devolution having come so far. It is nearly 20 years since there was the issue of whether a separate question being put in Scotland should be put in Wales, and a lot of water has flowed under the bridge. We would not be doing Wales any great service by holding things back and saying that there has got to be a referendum on the issue. There is no assault on the state. Listening to the present Prime Minister, it is quite clear that she realises that the state has a powerful role to play. That seems to strike a chord with the electorate because that is where the electorate is, too. That is important. I disagree on this issue with my noble friend Lady Finn. It is appropriate that we move forward on this without greater delay because, in my view, it would hold back Wales.

Moving on to look at that in the wider context of the fiscal framework and the question that the noble Baroness, Lady Morgan, put to me initially about whether we should wait until we have got the legislative consent Motion, I can assure her that I think that that is absolutely appropriate. Although legally we could move this legislation forward without the LCM, that would not be the appropriate thing to do. We are looking for progress from the Welsh Assembly and, as I understand it, discussions between my right honourable friend David Gauke, the Chief Secretary, and Minister Mark Drakeford are going well. I hope that progress continues and that I will be able to give more details to noble Lords as matters progress. That is certainly our intention.

[Lord Hain]

I welcome what the noble Lord said. Could he give some guidance as to whether clarity on the financial framework will be provided before Report in this House?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

I anticipate that it will be, but it does not have to be. Obviously we will want to make sure that steady progress is being made before Report. As things progress it is anticipated that we could have agreement on these issues before Christmas, but I will ensure that the House is updated on this. As I said, I certainly anticipate we will not go to Third Reading without it and probably we will not go to Report—but I will want to make sure we are making the progress to which I referred before we commit to taking it to Report.

I move to the question of the single jurisdiction. I think there was broad support for saying that, certainly at this stage, there is no desire to move away from a single jurisdiction. I have spoken to representatives of every single law school in Wales and that is pretty much their feeling. It is also the feeling of many practitioners in Wales. We would not be doing Wales any great favours by differentiating the Welsh jurisdiction from the English jurisdiction. It is quite possible, even at this stage, to accentuate and overemphasise the differences that exist. Historically, they are not great. It is very different from the position in Scotland, where the Scottish jurisdiction historically has been very different. So parallels there are not appropriate.

There is a body that is looking at the legal arrangements. As I have indicated, I will update noble Lords on how that body is getting on, because there is an appropriate interest in making sure we have Welsh judges—when I say “Welsh judges” I mean judges not necessarily of Welsh nationality but with Welsh experience—deciding issues that are steeped in Welsh law. That is quite appropriate and what the administrative arrangements we are looking at should take hold of.

I move on to look at reservations—another key area which overlaps to some extent with the Welsh jurisdiction issues around the separate position on alcohol. I well remember as a student at Aberystwyth that the time I felt most thirsty and in need of a drink was on a Sunday. Inevitably, the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday in Aberystwyth was the student union because it was membership only. Of course, the queue was about a mile long to get there. The alternative in those days was getting a bus into Montgomeryshire, which was a popular thing to do. So I can understand the strong feelings that exist on that issue.

Some of the points made on reservations were somewhat wrongheaded. The noble Lord, Lord Howarth, mentioned the position on knives in relation to the position on devolution to cities. Of course, cities will not have legislative powers in relation to knife crime, so I do not think it is a perfect analogy—but no doubt we can look at this as things develop in Committee. The noble Lord, Lord Elis-Thomas, said that adopting a reserved model is not a solution to all ills. Hear, hear to that. I never thought it would be. Obviously, the discussion on this will be about what is and what is not reserved. I am sure that we will take different views on some of that, but I look forward to discussing it when we come to Committee.

It is great to see the noble Lord, Lord Elystan-Morgan, in his place, firing on all cylinders as always. I thank him for his kind comments. I do not agree with his position on dominion status. I do not hear that as a great clarion call for something that the people of Wales want, but I understand that he has some material points to discuss in relation to reservations and I look forward to hearing them as we move forward.

The conferred model was silent about many issues that nobody would ever anticipate, as opposed to reserved issues such as defence, immigration, the Crown and foreign affairs. Sensibly, nobody was suggesting that therefore these were matters the Welsh Assembly could deal with. It is quite a difficult manoeuvre to go from conferred to reserved. I am very grateful that noble Lords have recognised that we have made progress on this. I look forward to hearing from noble Lords on some of the remaining issues of concern.

I will touch on one or two other aspects raised by noble Lords that are worthy of further investigation. One, brought forward by my noble friend Lord Crickhowell and echoed by the noble Lords, Lord Murphy and Lord Morgan, was the importance of working with existing institutions—perhaps getting the physics right, not just the chemistry, of the relationship between different Ministers to make sure we have some underpinning for when it is necessary for decisions, policies or interactions to be discussed between Cardiff and Westminster. That is a very good point that I will take away and look at to see what we can do on it.

Without getting into the purely philosophical, another issue that the noble Lord, Lord Elis-Thomas, mentioned was the permanence of the Assembly and the strength of the new clause that says the Assembly is permanent. That was something pushed for very hard by the Plaid Cymru representative on the Silk commission—but, on that issue, just as the India Act could in theory be repealed by the Westminster Parliament, I would not overlook the symbolic importance of including the clause that states that the Assembly is permanent because it perhaps underlines the way it is regarded politically. It is a matter of political realities. I am not suggesting that we can alter the Kelsen Grundnorm of the fundamental basis of the constitution, but it is something that has been widely welcomed.

As I said, this has been a debate of rare quality. I thank noble Lords for engaging constructively and I look forward to that constructive approach continuing. Lastly, air passenger duty is not just an issue of the potential unfairness to Bristol, which clearly was and, in the interim, remains an issue relating to the state aid position. It is also a question of fairness within the United Kingdom and in Wales. There is a great danger that we see this as just a tax, the variation of which can help Cardiff Airport. People in north Wales would not consider using Cardiff Airport; they use airports in England. Likewise, in central mid-Wales they would use Birmingham. It is a much broader issue of whether we do something about air passenger duty—as a Treasury issue, that is well beyond my pay grade—across the whole of the United Kingdom, which remains a possibility.

Once again, I thank noble Lords very much for the constructive way they have engaged. I look forward to Committee and continuing to provide information as it becomes available on the way that discussions are proceeding between the Treasury and Cardiff Bay. I beg to move.

Bill read a second time and committed to a Committee of the Whole House.

Home Ownership

Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth Excerpts

Thursday 15th September 2016 Lords Chamber

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark]

To ask Her Majesty’s Government what action they are taking to reverse the decline in home ownership.

[The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department for Communities and Local Government and Wales Office (Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth) (Con)]

My Lords, the Government have halted the decline in home ownership and are committed to going further. We are supporting first-time buyers who wish to get on the housing ladder through our Help to Buy, shared ownership and starter homes policies.

[Lord Kennedy of Southwark (Lab)]

My Lords, I draw the attention of the House to my entry in the register of interests: I am an elected councillor in the London Borough of Lewisham and a vice-president of the Local Government Association. When does the noble Lord think we will next see the levels of home ownership that peaked around 2005? Does he agree with the comments of the Housing Minister, Mr Gavin Barwell, when he spoke about the need to build homes of all tenures and not focus on one single tenure? What are the implications of those comments for the starter homes programme?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as I indicated, the decline in home ownership has been halted. In fact, there has in the last year been a slight increase in home ownership, though not statistically significant. I agree with my friend in the other place, Gavin Barwell, about the need for homes of all tenures. We are also focusing on helping to rent, as well as helping to buy. Certainly, one thing we are very much focused on is council house building, where our record stands comparison with the Labour Party’s.

[Lord Shipley (LD)]

My Lords, the Economic Affairs Committee’s report in July on housing said:

“The Government’s target of one million new homes by 2020 is not based on a robust analysis”,

and “will not be enough”. The Government turned their target into a commitment to build 1 million new homes by 2020 in the Queen’s Speech, yet last month Shelter reported they would fall short of that commitment by 250,000 homes. What action are the Government planning to ensure that they fulfil their commitment and produce a total housebuilding programme that is fit for purpose?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, perhaps the most significant feature of the housebuilding situation is the budget commitment. We have increased the budget for housing for this Parliament. In fact, we have doubled it to £20 billion, £8 billion of which will help to deliver 400,000 affordable housing starts.

[Baroness Gardner of Parkes (Con)]

My Lords, I must remind the House of my interests in the register, and a tenant of mine has just notified me that he has been able to be helped to buy his first home. Can the Minister assure me that these homes will be freehold and not part of an antiquated leasehold system which really means that people have only a very limited time in ownership of the property?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as I indicated, we are looking at various tenures. I am pleased that my noble friend found through her acquaintance that we are getting on with this policy. We are committed to 200,000 starter homes in this Parliament. As I indicated, that is with a range of tenures. Some leaseholds, such as 999-year leases, should be long enough for most people in this House.

[Lord Clark of Windermere (Lab)]

The Minister mentioned various government initiatives to encourage home purchase. Is the Government’s position clear about the Help to Buy ISA? Can the portion of the finance from the Government’s contribution to top up that ISA at the point of purchase be used towards the deposit for the house?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the Help to Buy ISA is helping many people at the moment: more than half a million people are making use of the scheme and 26,000 have already received the bonus. The bonus of £3,000, which is a considerable amount towards a deposit, is paid at the end of the process so it means an adjustment in the way that finances are organised.

[Lord Best (CB)]

My Lords, would the Minister agree that we will never get to the 1 million homes if the Government insist that housing associations and others stick to home-ownership schemes rather than being allowed to do the affordable rented housing that they have traditionally done? Can we not get back to more of that, as well as the much-needed home-ownership schemes that we have heard about?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, as I indicated, the Government are committed to home ownership. We are making sure that money is provided to encourage that. Also, we are certainly committed to homes to rent, and have committed money to rent-to-buy schemes as well. We committed £661 million to a build-to-rent fund which should, over the life of the Parliament, guarantee about 6,000 houses in addition.

[Baroness Sharples (Con)]

With a proposal for so many new buildings, what provision will be made for allotments?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, I know that my noble friend is a great supporter of allotments. As I have indicated before, allotments are protected in relation to brownfield sites. We have committed that 90% of brownfield sites will have planning permission by 2020, but I am sure that she will be very pleased that allotments are protected in relation to that policy.

[Lord Campbell-Savours (Lab)]

My Lords, is not the problem the price of land for housing? How can we justify a hectare of land being sold outside London, in the provinces, for £12,000 or £15,000 an acre which when it receives planning permission can be worth £2 million, £3 million, £4 million, £5 million or, in some parts of England, £6 million a hectare? Is that not the real blockage in housing development in the United Kingdom?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Lord is right that one of the issues is supply. That is why we are focusing very much on housebuilding, whether for purchase or for rent. He is also right that one considerable challenge we have is in relation to the price. That is why we have committed £20 billion, as I indicated, and doubled the budget for housing over the length of this Parliament.

[The Lord Bishop of St Albans]

My Lords, while the price of land continues to increase so rapidly, landowners have much less incentive for immediate development, particularly if they are negotiating with local authorities over their desire for more affordable housing requirements. Will Her Majesty’s Government take further steps to tackle land-banking, so that we can get more houses up more quickly?

--- Later in debate ---

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the right reverend Prelate rightly draws attention to land-banking, which I have indicated before is a very real issue. We are looking on a weekly basis at the prices of land, post the Brexit vote. A levelling off of prices is indicated but it is too early to draw many conclusions. One consequence if prices are levelling off is that it will make it easier to tackle the problem of housebuilding.

[The Countess of Mar (CB)]

My Lords, how many of these affordable homes have been allocated to rural villages and hamlets, to enable young people who are either already working in the countryside or would like to do so to afford houses near where they work?

[Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth]

My Lords, the noble Countess draws attention to a particular problem in relation to rural areas. I confirm that the starter home policy is available to rural areas, as is the affordable housing policy. It is open to people in those areas to make use of those and I certainly encourage them to do so.